Untouchable_Fire Posted October 25, 2010 Posted October 25, 2010 Yeah, I pretty much agree with MrNate's list. Frankly I'm very jealous of women and I think they have too much power. There is no balance. Women have too much power in your life... because you GIVE UP all of yours. Although the divorce and child support systems royally suck. Too often "child support" is actually spousal support. I accept the social differences and how women have it easy where i get annoyed is when women tell Men who have problems with women to stop whining and that they have no reason to question things or give the cliche its all about CONFIDENCE when they have no idea what Men go through and face. A women filtering out tons of Men to deicde who to go out with doesnt have the same plight as a struggling guy so its obnoxious of her to tell a guy hes dellusional or whatever when she has no idea what its like Are you that scared of rejection? You need to build some callouses. You might think Ah.. it sucks that I have to face rejection... but in reality that means you get to do most of the choosing!! It's like this... would you rather be a hunter and choose your meals... or sit at home waiting for whatever meal others might bring you? Having said that, I do think women today have more sexual power over men than in the past. I can't say that with authority, but given the power of the internet and media, I think it's self evident. Women are a massive commodity in the modern age, and many women know how to exploit this to their advantage. I think the big change is that women have financial power when in a marriage. Marriage is really the big power shifter in our society. I'm glad you see where I'm coming from, Untouchable. My hope is that instead of lashing out, some of us men can internalize this, and focus on bettering ourselves and our situation, day by day. Not gonna happen. If you really want to do something productive work on getting some rights for men passed in legislation. Make child custody intelligent, reform child and spousal support.... give men some kind of reproductive rights... make paternity fraud illegal and punishable. I honestly think most of this stuff would have been accomplished already had the previous generation not been slam packed with wussy men. These guys are mad because everything they were taught growing up about women and love has turned out to be one big lie. Yup! I think a lot of it is denial. And not wanting to admit that men and women are different. The typical pattern I see is something like this: 1. A man asks a question aimed at women. 2. Women answer honestly. 3. Men don't like what the women say, so they start whining "That's not fair!" 4. Gender war ensues, with men screaming "Women should be the way I want them to be!" and women screaming "You have psychological issues!" and 1. A woman asks a question aimed at men. 2. Men answer honestly. 3. Women don't like what the men say, so they start screaming "You're sexist!" 4. Gender war ensues, with women screaming "Men should be the way I want them to be!" and men screaming "Deal with reality!" Umm.... I started a huge fight just by trying to let other guys know that women in other countries are on average better. I didn't even expect much of a debate. I figured the guys would just ask questions and we would discuss politely.
dreamingoftigers Posted October 25, 2010 Posted October 25, 2010 I think this bitterness is from each gender looking at the other like they are withholding something. Each one of us on loveshack has been through some really bitter relationship experiences, that's why we are here for the most part. We are a little lost and looking for stability and how to relate to others to help us meet our own needs. We are a frustrated bunch. The women look at men withholding loyalty and emotional connection (because we won't just give them sex), and the men looking at the women withholding the sex (because they won't just give us emotional connectivity). Perhaps neither gender is giving the other enough of a chance anymore. In the older days they would court each other to see if there was a match before getting to the intimacy parts (emotionally and sexually). No point in diving in head-first. There was a big more of an interest invested to find out about the other person. Now if someone doesn't click by date 2, we chuck them out. Or we get involved in relationships that seem easier with people we don't know well enough to really know if we should be exposing our private selves to and then we get hurt. We may be expecting our partner to be the salve to all of our emotional wounds. We have to solve our own pains instead of dumping them on another person. How many people on here look at their relationship as adding joy to their live instead of sapping their strength? Some people even try to avoid relationships and just get the "good parts" such as sex and a little companionship. This is not a whole relationship, one would need to look at why they think they should not have to invest in another. Is it fear of hurt and rejection, or is it simple entitlement? Not wanting to worry about another's feelings. Not wanting the "headache" of a constant companion To have a good partner you must be a good partner. Becoming a good partner does not happen overnight. You need to deeply, deeply stare at yourself. Will I cheat if my partner does xyz? If you would, then you are not ready, you need to look at why you think you are entitled to engage in any "bad" behaviour no matter what your partner does. You need to have high personal standards and a ton of self-respect in order to be a good partner. If you have a lot to offer and you totally love and respect yourself, bitterness cannot enter. Therefore you wouldn't have resentment towards women for having it easy or for men being insensitive clods.
TheBigQuestion Posted October 25, 2010 Posted October 25, 2010 The source of the endless debate and flame wars on this board has more to do with self-righteous indignation than it does with genuine bitterness. As soon as one makes a thread about one gender that some members of that gender find even remotely offensive, the claws come out. A guy starts a thread about disliking fat women? The skinny women talk about how they've been picked on for being skinny and the fat women call the guy a shallow pig. As soon as someone posts about a hot-button issue, both the men and the women tend to lose their ability to be rational and instead make continuous appeals to emotion. The end stage is usually the mutual shaming of each gender. Even though I usually disagreed with meerkat stew whenever he would post here, he was right about one thing. The women on LS have, just like in real life, a greater tendency than men to internalize any criticism or negative observation about their gender as a personal insult, regardless of any and all limiting qualifiers the guy made have used in his post. The words "some" and "most" do not mean "all." They also have an annoying tendency to point out that whenever someone posts something about women doing something bad, that "men do it too." Thanks, genius, but guess what? We're not talking about men right now.
dreamingoftigers Posted October 25, 2010 Posted October 25, 2010 I see a lot of the "women do this too" threads and it gets kind of old. Yes women have done X and men have done Y. I think it needs to get more behaviour focused. As well, a lot of folks seem to get pretty triggered on here (myself included) because a lot of the stuff people say hits home and is something where they feel like they were almost "caught." I think I may have posted on a fat girl thread early on. Whenever I read disparaging comments about fat girls it has made me sad because I know that I do not measure up appearance-wise to a lot of other girls. It is something that I have periodically focussed on but not given a priority to even though I know I should. I internalize it because it feels like everyone is pointing the finger at you, because you know they are right. I know I look unattractive but I also feel too busy trying to catch up with other things in my life (like my business). I may even be using other things in my life to escape the reality that I am obese and I am ashamed of it, but the second I admit it to myself, the problem doesn't go away, it is just really beginning for me. You must admit that it would feel very uncomfortable to be the only member of the Ku-Klux-Clan at a Civil Rights anniversary meeting. You would feel pretty embarassed, especially if you don't even really believe in burning crosses or whatever, you just liked to go get dressed up in the sheet and go riding around (or whatever the heck they do. I am from Canada, I don't think we have them here.). You would just sit there and think, "You know I just like to ride around with the sheet on my head but if all of these people found out, they would really hate me." (Yes that was the best analogy I could come up with) So in my day to day life I go to the store, clean houses, go out in public after reading a thread like that and think. "Everyone seems nice to me, but really I know that they look at me with disgust and hate me for being what I am, and you know what? I am ashamed of what I am but I feel somewhat powerless to change it right now without completely disassembling my life." I hear things on the news about refusing obese people health care and it scares me, it tells me that I have to work on this. It tells me that we live in a society that has a high prejudice against fat people, but they have no problem making high-calorie foods extremely available and market them flagrantly. They now put cigarettes out of plain view to help people quit smoking. They flash up Wendy's billboards and chocolate billboards at us right in traffic. And guess what? I am a hard-core sugar addict. I wish every fast food restaurant either charged me double or triple or simply refused me service. But that's not the way things will change. I wish there was a recovery center for me like they do for drug and alcohol addicts. But no, there isn't and people will hate on me for something I feel out of control over. It is difficult to reconcile, all I can do is accept it.
stillafool Posted October 25, 2010 Posted October 25, 2010 I've been thinking about this "bitterness" here for sometime. I think alot of people here have loved or are attracted to someone they can't or couldn't have. Let's face it, everyone could have a girlfriend but would it be the girl they really want. It almost seems like a lot of the guys on LS feel that the desireable women are becoming more and more out of reach whether that is due to these females careers, attitudes about dating, or both. Sometimes it feels that they say these mean things to and about women here to get back at the women in their real worlds.
stillafool Posted October 25, 2010 Posted October 25, 2010 I am ashamed of what I am but I feel somewhat powerless to change it right now without completely disassembling my life." Don't you dare! I think you are a marvelous person. We all have things we need to better.
AD1980 Posted October 26, 2010 Posted October 26, 2010 I've been thinking about this "bitterness" here for sometime. I think alot of people here have loved or are attracted to someone they can't or couldn't have. Let's face it, everyone could have a girlfriend but would it be the girl they really want. It almost seems like a lot of the guys on LS feel that the desireable women are becoming more and more out of reach whether that is due to these females careers, attitudes about dating, or both. Sometimes it feels that they say these mean things to and about women here to get back at the women in their real worlds. I think thats a fair point and proably would explain my situation well except i dont think at least in my case and probably others to that things are said to get back at women i think people sometimes vent here right after something happened and the feelings might still be raw and you may say things you really dont mean but your so hurt and angry and have no answers at the moment that you lash out..
LiveWell Posted October 26, 2010 Posted October 26, 2010 How many people on here look at their relationship as adding joy to their live instead of sapping their strength? Me.
D-Jam Posted October 26, 2010 Posted October 26, 2010 I think the bitterness is mostly now from a few points: 1) Guys who aren't getting the girls not being able to let go of the extreme priority they put on getting a girl. 2) Guys who aren't getting the girls still thinking "accept me as I am" somehow is or should be the "ideal", and yet think women don't do that, when women actually do follow that when it comes to men...but they don't accept those men because of who they are and instead look for better alternatives. 3) Women who seemingly think that men are supposed to act and do things a certain way, then get mad when the older they get the more "attractive" males still won't fall into line with how they think men should act. (I'm also trying to say why women get bitter) The reality is that in today's society, neither side wants to budge. Both sides want their opposite gender to "fall into line" and thus make life easier for them. I'll start with men. Many of the men who complain on these boards have a lot of flaws, red flags, and unattractive features. I mentioned in point #2 that "accept me as I am" logic. These men think the women aren't doing that, but women are. They have as much right to REJECT someone as they "are". However, we still believe then women are just shallow and unrealistic, rather than face up and ask "what else can I do to really improve my life?" So these "nice guys" believe women simply love to be treated like crap, when they still keep overlooking the OTHER QUALITIES these women find in the bad boys. Forget that he got drunk and cheated, or that he called her a "c*nt" in an argument, or he lies to her. How about the fact that he's in athletic shape and dresses very well? How about the fact that he carries himself every day with a load of real confidence and thus has loads of women wanting him? How about the fact he works hard to make loads of money to further up his value to women? But no...these guys still think women, especially hot women, should settle for mediocrity. I've stated before that these guys should check out some issues of GQ and Details, hit the gym a bit, try out new fashions, move out of their parents' house, take chances, go to new things and get some new interests other than "guy stuff" that only guys like them like. I also think a lot of these guys need to stop treating "find a girl" as such a massive priority. Live your life. Do things. Be interesting. Stop spending your every free moment wondering about how to get someone. You have better luck when you're not looking. That's what happens to me. Now women aren't innocent in it either. Yes, I'll agree many women, especially American women, tend to carry a lot of unrealistic standards about men. The biggest one is when they seemingly think the hot "alpha male" who bangs women left and right will one day decide to give it all up and commit. Many women I've known who are chronically single aren't chasing bikers and rock band members...but they're pursuing yuppies and confident professional men. However time and time again many times these guys tell half-truths or outright lies, and thus she's burned by another liar. So why not pick the "eh" looking nice guy? We've heard that one to death, but you have to understand these women would rather be alone than settle for a guy they're not attracted to. Think about it. Take the one quality you don't like to see on a woman (for most guys it's obesity). Now if your choices in life were the 400-lb woman, or being alone...what would you pick? So I can't blame women who want to pursue guys whom they feel are in their calibur. I do think many women set the bar higher than they should, but I also notice many women dress and take care of themselves better than guys. I'll never forget when I walk into street fests, and I see loads of guys who are all a mess/slob, many with beer bellies...yet the women are slender, attractive, dolled up, etc. I agree there are women who keep themselves single because they're seeking a guy who will never come. Thus I'll say the one thing women need to change (which they won't) is they need to look at their ACTUAL DATING POOL and realize these are the choices they have. Much like how the nice guy needs to improve on the other things...women need to stop hoping for the bigger/better fish to come swimming into the pond when there are plenty of normal fish in there. Finally, I think the bitterness expressed here by men is mostly because they have no one to talk to. I'm not saying they have no friends, but men will bash on one another if a guy were to dare talk about dating problems. They don't have the luxury of the "group of gals" to drink wine and yack about dating troubles with. I dunno. Unless both genders are willing to change, we won't see things changed. Men need to grow up, improve themselves, strive to be the best person they can be, and balance their lives. Women need to also grow up, put away the romance novels and chick flicks, and see the pool that's in front of them rather than hope for what's not there.
Content Posted October 26, 2010 Posted October 26, 2010 (edited) I think the bitterness is mostly now from a few points: 1) Guys who aren't getting the girls not being able to let go of the extreme priority they put on getting a girl. 2) Guys who aren't getting the girls still thinking "accept me as I am" somehow is or should be the "ideal", and yet think women don't do that, when women actually do follow that when it comes to men...but they don't accept those men because of who they are and instead look for better alternatives. 3) Women who seemingly think that men are supposed to act and do things a certain way, then get mad when the older they get the more "attractive" males still won't fall into line with how they think men should act. (I'm also trying to say why women get bitter) The reality is that in today's society, neither side wants to budge. Both sides want their opposite gender to "fall into line" and thus make life easier for them. I'll start with men. Many of the men who complain on these boards have a lot of flaws, red flags, and unattractive features. I mentioned in point #2 that "accept me as I am" logic. These men think the women aren't doing that, but women are. They have as much right to REJECT someone as they "are". However, we still believe then women are just shallow and unrealistic, rather than face up and ask "what else can I do to really improve my life?" So these "nice guys" believe women simply love to be treated like crap, when they still keep overlooking the OTHER QUALITIES these women find in the bad boys. Forget that he got drunk and cheated, or that he called her a "c*nt" in an argument, or he lies to her. How about the fact that he's in athletic shape and dresses very well? How about the fact that he carries himself every day with a load of real confidence and thus has loads of women wanting him? How about the fact he works hard to make loads of money to further up his value to women? But no...these guys still think women, especially hot women, should settle for mediocrity. I've stated before that these guys should check out some issues of GQ and Details, hit the gym a bit, try out new fashions, move out of their parents' house, take chances, go to new things and get some new interests other than "guy stuff" that only guys like them like. I also think a lot of these guys need to stop treating "find a girl" as such a massive priority. Live your life. Do things. Be interesting. Stop spending your every free moment wondering about how to get someone. You have better luck when you're not looking. That's what happens to me. Now women aren't innocent in it either. Yes, I'll agree many women, especially American women, tend to carry a lot of unrealistic standards about men. The biggest one is when they seemingly think the hot "alpha male" who bangs women left and right will one day decide to give it all up and commit. Many women I've known who are chronically single aren't chasing bikers and rock band members...but they're pursuing yuppies and confident professional men. However time and time again many times these guys tell half-truths or outright lies, and thus she's burned by another liar. So why not pick the "eh" looking nice guy? We've heard that one to death, but you have to understand these women would rather be alone than settle for a guy they're not attracted to. Think about it. Take the one quality you don't like to see on a woman (for most guys it's obesity). Now if your choices in life were the 400-lb woman, or being alone...what would you pick? So I can't blame women who want to pursue guys whom they feel are in their calibur. I do think many women set the bar higher than they should, but I also notice many women dress and take care of themselves better than guys. I'll never forget when I walk into street fests, and I see loads of guys who are all a mess/slob, many with beer bellies...yet the women are slender, attractive, dolled up, etc. I agree there are women who keep themselves single because they're seeking a guy who will never come. Thus I'll say the one thing women need to change (which they won't) is they need to look at their ACTUAL DATING POOL and realize these are the choices they have. Much like how the nice guy needs to improve on the other things...women need to stop hoping for the bigger/better fish to come swimming into the pond when there are plenty of normal fish in there. Finally, I think the bitterness expressed here by men is mostly because they have no one to talk to. I'm not saying they have no friends, but men will bash on one another if a guy were to dare talk about dating problems. They don't have the luxury of the "group of gals" to drink wine and yack about dating troubles with. I dunno. Unless both genders are willing to change, we won't see things changed. Men need to grow up, improve themselves, strive to be the best person they can be, and balance their lives. Women need to also grow up, put away the romance novels and chick flicks, and see the pool that's in front of them rather than hope for what's not there. I think both genders these days value looks way too much I understand there needs to be some level of attraction in a relationship i dont approach women im not physically attracted to at all but ill never understand the people who just want the hottest person they can find You cant put a price tag on piece of mind id easily take a cute ok girl whos sweet over a really hot girl whos a whackjob and full of herself and will make your life a living hell Both genders let people get away with too many things simply becasue theyre "attratcive" and it creates a monster Edited October 26, 2010 by Content
sweetjasmine Posted October 26, 2010 Posted October 26, 2010 I've had 250+ lb women harass me and grab my ass lol. I hate that there are people out there who think that kind of thing is acceptable or cute when it's a woman doing the groping/harassing. It's never funny or cute or sexy to grope someone who doesn't want it, regardless of their gender. Both sides want their opposite gender to "fall into line" and thus make life easier for them. In other words, it's about trying to get people to do things you want them to do. Trying to control people's behaviors and actions. It's much better to just accept the fact that you can't control anyone's actions and you can't make someone do something unless they want to. If they don't want to behave a certain way or be a certain kind of person, then leave them alone. They have no obligation to do anything for you.
Anela Posted October 26, 2010 Posted October 26, 2010 As with just about everything, there are two sides to this. Being treated like a commodity is no f-ing picnic, either. Everyone has their struggles. I could sit here and stew in resentment thinking about how men don't have to worry about being groped, assaulted, and raped, but what's the point? Why bother? Obsessing over the advantages that other people have that you don't isn't going to help you get anywhere. Right. In what the men who love the 18 - 25 year-olds, would consider the prime of my life, I was both scared of, and annoyed by most guys. The attention wasn't flattering, and I was scared of what might happen under certain circumstances (I remember hearing about a lot of date rapes, at the time, so I was just as concerned around the seemingly nicer guys, as I was around the louder ones). There's a difference between being desired in the short-term, and being *loved* and desired by someone you really click with (have the same feelings for).
Anela Posted October 26, 2010 Posted October 26, 2010 I think thast a decent point but i think thats Mens fault.. Men will hit on anything and to me its overly inflated the ego of these average women and the average guy is having a harder time getitng a women near his leve becasue shes holding out for something better becasue of all the times she was hit on.. Who are you guys to decide who is 'average'? Speaking of over-inflated egos, it seems that a lot of average guys hold out for the hotter girls.
AD1980 Posted October 26, 2010 Posted October 26, 2010 Who are you guys to decide who is 'average'? Speaking of over-inflated egos, it seems that a lot of average guys hold out for the hotter girls. WHo are you to decide whos average then if i cant? And wantign a hot girl doesnt necassarily mean over inflated ego it it could means some Men just want to overacheive:D
Anela Posted October 26, 2010 Posted October 26, 2010 That's actually a good point friend. How many women are actually finding this? Should be delude ourselves into thinking most of the women in the world find a man who they feel secure, satisfied and loved by? It's a VAST minority. The things women are getting and what they actually want or two different things. Maybe we shouldn't envy them at all but instead feel sorry for them. Thank you (you and the person who made the original comment). If we were all getting what we wanted, we wouldn't be here venting or commiserating.
Woggle Posted October 26, 2010 Posted October 26, 2010 The problem is that some women want to do the impossible which is make the players they lust after into faithful men and still remain attracted to them. It's not going to happen. Even if one of these players did give a woman what she claimed to want her attraction level to him would plummet.
Anela Posted October 26, 2010 Posted October 26, 2010 WHo are you to decide whos average then if i cant? And wantign a hot girl doesnt necassarily mean over inflated ego it it could means some Men just want to overacheive:D So a girl can't be an overachiever, too? The guys I'm calling average, are those who consider themselves to be so - compared to the ones the hotties actually choose instead of them.
AD1980 Posted October 26, 2010 Posted October 26, 2010 So a girl can't be an overachiever, too? The guys I'm calling average, are those who consider themselves to be so - compared to the ones the hotties actually choose instead of them. Well yeah some people Men and women are dellusional i have no such dellsuions i know im not attractive,just hoping i can overacheive and meet a cute girl with poor vision one day..
dreamingoftigers Posted October 26, 2010 Posted October 26, 2010 How many people on here look at their relationship as adding joy to their live instead of sapping their strength? Me.:D:D:D:D:D Good
Untouchable_Fire Posted October 26, 2010 Posted October 26, 2010 I think I may have posted on a fat girl thread early on. Whenever I read disparaging comments about fat girls it has made me sad because I know that I do not measure up appearance-wise to a lot of other girls. It is something that I have periodically focussed on but not given a priority to even though I know I should. I internalize it because it feels like everyone is pointing the finger at you, because you know they are right. I know I look unattractive but I also feel too busy trying to catch up with other things in my life (like my business). I may even be using other things in my life to escape the reality that I am obese and I am ashamed of it, but the second I admit it to myself, the problem doesn't go away, it is just really beginning for me. No DOT, you are a fantastic woman! There are some guys out there that would not date you because of your weight... those guys are called shallow. There are plenty and I really mean this... plenty of men who will find you more sexy than the skinniest Kate Moss type! I've never shied away from dating a bigger woman that I was attracted to, and I actively avoid women who seem stick skinny. If you lose weight... do it for your health... and for your energy levels. If you want to do it... it's just like you said those things are addictive. Cut them out for a month or so and your brain will seriously readjust.
dreamingoftigers Posted October 26, 2010 Posted October 26, 2010 No DOT, you are a fantastic woman! There are some guys out there that would not date you because of your weight... those guys are called shallow. There are plenty and I really mean this... plenty of men who will find you more sexy than the skinniest Kate Moss type! I've never shied away from dating a bigger woman that I was attracted to, and I actively avoid women who seem stick skinny. If you lose weight... do it for your health... and for your energy levels. If you want to do it... it's just like you said those things are addictive. Cut them out for a month or so and your brain will seriously readjust. LOL I have never had a problem getting a new guy, I find it so funny when people blame their dating luck on their looks. I dated a real variety of guys with a range of looks (from the smoking hot guy who thought we were meant to be together and I turned him down cold because I knew he was not going to be the type for the long haul with me, to the ugliest man in North America who was so thin you could play songs on his ribs). My friends called him Somalia boy and when people saw us out in public I was worried that they would think I ate all of his food. LOL I do want to lose my weight, I am so burnt out day after day from working crazy long hours and can't drag my ass to the gym. Sometimes I use the elliptical we have here. I am hoping the ADD meds will help me focus enough to do it. I also know when I cut out sugar and flour that I lose around 90lbs in 3 months (done it twice). Plus my brain does readjust. I did really well two years ago and I was on a roll (get it? haha) then I got pregnant and my cravings went sideways on me and I have not recovered since. I am not so worried about guys and dating (been married almost 5 years) I am worried about how seriously people take me, and how they think I am only lazy (on the contrary, I lead full, full crazy days, that's why I eat fast food and hit drive thrus). I don't even watch TV, just go on loveshack a little then sleep and do it all over again.
dreamingoftigers Posted October 26, 2010 Posted October 26, 2010 No DOT, you are a fantastic woman! There are some guys out there that would not date you because of your weight... those guys are called shallow. There are plenty and I really mean this... plenty of men who will find you more sexy than the skinniest Kate Moss type! I've never shied away from dating a bigger woman that I was attracted to, and I actively avoid women who seem stick skinny. If you lose weight... do it for your health... and for your energy levels. If you want to do it... it's just like you said those things are addictive. Cut them out for a month or so and your brain will seriously readjust. btw thanks
LiveWell Posted October 26, 2010 Posted October 26, 2010 No DOT, you are a fantastic woman! There are some guys out there that would not date you because of your weight... those guys are called shallow. There are plenty and I really mean this... plenty of men who will find you more sexy than the skinniest Kate Moss type! I've never shied away from dating a bigger woman that I was attracted to, and I actively avoid women who seem stick skinny. If you lose weight... do it for your health... and for your energy levels. If you want to do it... it's just like you said those things are addictive. Cut them out for a month or so and your brain will seriously readjust. Seriously, your avatar (I mean dreaming of tigers NOT untouchable fire = no homo) has a very attractive woman in it (assuming it's a picture of yourself of course), when I read some of your posts sometimes I get the sense that you are just trying to take a position as an advocate for someone else, it's hard for me to connect the picture to the person writing the posts because, just looking at your pic, it would never occur to me that not being physically attractive would even be an issue for you. I guess I'm naive or something.
dreamingoftigers Posted October 26, 2010 Posted October 26, 2010 Seriously, your avatar (I mean dreaming of tigers NOT untouchable fire = no homo) has a very attractive woman in it (assuming it's a picture of yourself of course), when I read some of your posts sometimes I get the sense that you are just trying to take a position as an advocate for someone else, it's hard for me to connect the picture to the person writing the posts because, just looking at your pic, it would never occur to me that not being physically attractive would even be an issue for you. I guess I'm naive or something. Thanks, that is a photo of me from March, and I am quite overweight. I carry most of it around my lower waist/hips/thighs.
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