Why cheat if one's needs are met?

[Silly_Girl]

I went NC for several weeks, then re-entered the relationship. I expected a certain amount of ticking-off at IC. Not my counsellor judging me, but I was going back on things I had said and I thought she'd remind me. Instead she said 'all the while your needs are being met, you'll stay. The real trick is to identify when that is no longer the case and reacting accordingly'.

 

And also, I have had many conversations with friends (often not pertaining to me/my guy but other couples or life in general) regarding the trigger for infidelity.

 

I lived in the first house I bought for ten years, it became too small for us, no longer met my needs, I moved on. I don't scour Guardian Jobs in my lunch hour when my job gives me what I need, because I'm busy focusing on the job I already HAVE.

 

I have seen 'newness' cited as a reason to stray, does that mean established couples cannot maintain a freshness in their marriage? Asking, not telling.

 

The more I think, the more this 'needs being met' thing stands out. I don't think people cheat for 'no reason'. The argument is whether their reason should be used by them to justify their actions. Generally not I'd say.

 

I've also seen recently a nod by a couple of WS's and BS's regarding the WS being in a bad place and maybe not having received as much (of whatever their own special required recipe is) as they could have had from their spouse.

 

So should the focus for a spouse always be theirs and their partner's needs? Does it become critical and harmful? How is a balance achieved?

 

I know there'll be a couple of The Usual Suspects who'll take this post as a BS-bash, but it's REALLY not that. I'm interested. Some spouses gamble, or drink, others cheat. Do fulfilled, happy people who are at peace do those things? None that I know.

[donnamaybe]

Good questions. One has to keep in mind, though, that in some marriages, one of the parties has a need they have not conveyed to their spouse because they know it won't go over well. A need for variety. There are people who just feel entitled. There's nothing anyone can do about that type of situation.

[Owl]

SG, I'd agree with you that MOST of the time when cheating occurs, there aren't needs being met. For all kinds of reasons.

 

But...there are a good number of times when I think that it's not a matter of needs not being met, but more of a lack within the WS themselves.

 

Not so much a lack within the marriage...but something within the personality of the person who ends up cheating.

 

Several decades ago when I was young, I had a good friend who was a "playah". He was built like an Adonis...tall, blonde haired/blue-eyed, trim and built like a gymnast. He was smoooooooth. Women drooled on the man.

 

He had the sweetest fiancee in the world. Cute, smart as heck, working on her degree, and she ADORED him. She would do ANYTHING for him.

 

He cheated on her more times than a coon dog has ticks.

 

The lack wasn't in her, wasn't in what she brought to the relationship. The lack was within HIM. He simply wasn't capable of being monogamous. Wasn't wired to be that way. I have no idea if they stayed together or not, but I'd bet money that eventually she got tired of his cheating and left him.

 

He's a prime example of what I'm talking about. His needs were being met. He simply cheated because that's who he was.

 

We've seen it here as well. Some people are simply more self-centered, and incapable of being monogamous if the opportunity to cheat presents itself.

 

Now...I'm not saying this is true of all MM/MW...or even most.

 

But I absolutely believe that there's a good mix of those who are in a relationship where their needs aren't being met...and those that just choose to cheat because they can.

[jj33]

I totally agree with you Silly. The unmet needs may be gross or immature in some cases (e.g., the guy who has ONSs while his W is too pregnant to have sex etc) but there are unmet needs regardless of whether they are deemed to be reasonable or not or whether they stem from a sense of entitlement.

 

It all boils down to the same thing. If all needs were met, you dont look elsewhere. Whether the needs were communicated, can ever be fulfilled by anyone etc that is another story.

[20Seconds]

Sometimes I wonder if it is possible - or even sensible - to expect one person to "meet all your needs" in a long term relationship.

 

If someone gets married in their early twenties, and their life expectancy is 80, that's 60 years of being with the same person and either person meeting the needs of the other for the whole of that time?

 

Unrealistic to say the least.

 

The biggest chance you have though, undoubtedly, is communicating those needs, compromising where necessary, and seeking solutions.

 

I see entitlement as another word for "unwilling to compromise"

 

If you settle in a monogamous relationship "for life" i.e. marriage, then you have to accept that there will be times when one of you might desire another person and as a couple you have to acknowledge that and the agreement that you make to be faithful indefinitely is that sometimes it might feel like a compromise.

 

As a couple I think you have to explore this issue rather than deny it, if possible. Where do you draw the line between desiring others and acting on that desire?

[Silly_Girl]

Good questions. One has to keep in mind, though, that in some marriages, one of the parties has a need they have not conveyed to their spouse because they know it won't go over well. A need for variety. There are people who just feel entitled. There's nothing anyone can do about that type of situation.

 

Hhmmm. A need for variety. True. There must be a slim number of those relationships that work out. That's sad. If something like that is entrenched....

[Circular]

A good friend of mine who was in an A once then left his W and went to the MOW, she left her H and my friend married her and now has their first child. He was very open about the situation and he and I over drinks one night had a chat about it.

 

He said that the problem for him was that his first wife seemed to cover 80% of what he wanted in a relationship but that 20% after a few years wound up being very important to him. Something he didn't really realize at first, it was almost like being in the relationship made himself take himself for granted and he became acutely aware of what was important to him to having a satisfying relationship, that a portion of it was the age he was married. He said that his new wife meets about 80% also, but what's important to him is that it's the right 80%.... The point to him is that it would be extremely hard for anyone to meet 100% given that we change and mature and learn different things as we age.

 

I believe there are men that go the 'variety' angle. I know myself that didn't have anything to do with my A, mine started as an EA and met needs that weren't being fulfilled by my W. But, I've also told my W what those needs are many times... matter of fact as I was slipping into the EA I remember having a few very personal conversations with my W about the very issues that were driving me closer to my xAP. In the end, yes I made a selfish and misguided decision, should have pushed the issue much harder and forced us into MC. But, sometimes we 'give up' out of exasperation and the needs my xAP were addressing were very hard for me to turn away from. These weren't physical needs, these were all companion, friendship, compatibility needs.

[donnamaybe]

Hhmmm. A need for variety. True. There must be a slim number of those relationships that work out. That's sad. If something like that is entrenched....

I know a guy like that; have talked about him on here. I wonder if his wife has served the divorce papers yet...

[jj33]

Sometimes I wonder if it is possible - or even sensible - to expect one person to "meet all your needs" in a long term relationship.

 

If someone gets married in their early twenties, and their life expectancy is 80, that's 60 years of being with the same person and either person meeting the needs of the other for the whole of that time?

 

Unrealistic to say the least.

 

The biggest chance you have though, undoubtedly, is communicating those needs, compromising where necessary, and seeking solutions.

 

I see entitlement as another word for "unwilling to compromise"

 

If you settle in a monogamous relationship "for life" i.e. marriage, then you have to accept that there will be times when one of you might desire another person and as a couple you have to acknowledge that and the agreement that you make to be faithful indefinitely is that sometimes it might feel like a compromise.

 

As a couple I think you have to explore this issue rather than deny it, if possible. Where do you draw the line between desiring others and acting on that desire?

 

 

Agreed you agree to compromise certain needs (like the need for sex with someone new) or the need to be adored in that way that a new love looks at you because hopefully being "known" by your spouse will compensate for the excitement of the unfolding of a new love. Its valuing what you have enough not to compromise it for what you dont have. I dont know.

 

But I think that many many people decide that cheating is easier than trading in the old spouse because the same issues may inevitably arise in the new relationship (or different issues) but no relationship is perfect.

[awkward]

If our needs are being met and we are happy, does that stop us from wanting more? Some people want more. They want more money, more sex, more time, more more more. As long as someone is willing to give it to them, they will continue to take it.

 

There are others whose needs aren't being met and they are unhappy. Some of them discuss it with their partner and try to find a resolution. When that doesn't work, many of them choose to divorce their partner.

 

It's the ones who don't discuss/don't divorce and instead choose to find someone else on the side to try and meet their unmet needs that remind me of children. They fib, hide, throw tantrums, and can't keep their hands out of the cookie jar. Somewhere along the way they decided this was an easier route. The fact that it is unfair to the BS and the OP doesn't seem to stop many from continuing as long as they can.

 

Anyways most long term relationships ebb and flow. They are times when things are beyond wonderful and other times when things are harder. We are responsible for our behavior both in the good times and the bad times. I'm responsible for me and my behavior just as you are responsible for yours. Clearly we all decide what is acceptable for one may not be acceptable for another. It might be difficult to understand why a happily married man chooses to cheat but it's just as difficult for some to understand why one would choose to be the person he cheats with.

[Silly_Girl]

If our needs are being met and we are happy, does that stop us from wanting more? Some people want more. They want more money, more sex, more time, more more more. As long as someone is willing to give it to them, they will continue to take it.

 

I'm thinking currently that you either have enough money, or you need more money. You either have enough relationship, or you don't.

 

I guess the pertinent point is if those needs wax and wane, so in some periods of time more is required, and at others the same will easily suffice. So are we under a duty to manage our needs? Is that possible? To teach oneself to need less of something?

[Minnie09]

Sure there are Rs in which people's needs are not met, e.g. if you are married to an abuser, or an addict, or an emotionally cold person, or someone who doesn't respect you, or whatever. Whether or not you're looking for an escape from that by having an affair, is a different question. Is it justifiable to have an A in a situation like that, in order to get from someone else what you're not getting in your M? I don't know, but for sure these unmet needs are a good excuse.

 

However, there are those whose needs are being met by a loving spouse who cares, and they still get involved in As. Serial cheaters. Noone can heal them. They need their ego boosts, their inner void filled, by multiple APs or just one over a long period of time. As long as they don't learn more about THEMSELVES, they will not stop and on top of that find an excuse for their behavior. Unmet needs will be their excuse forever and ever. But what they don't see is that the grass isn't greener and that their inner void is endless. There are rare examples of people who say that they do what they do because they are a-holes. The reason is found outside themselves most of the time.

[fooled once]

I went NC for several weeks, then re-entered the relationship. I expected a certain amount of ticking-off at IC. Not my counsellor judging me, but I was going back on things I had said and I thought she'd remind me. Instead she said 'all the while your needs are being met, you'll stay. The real trick is to identify when that is no longer the case and reacting accordingly'.

 

what if the needs of one person aren't the needs of another? What if the needs of another are in a direct contradiction to the needs of their partner? Does my needs trump his needs?

 

 

I lived in the first house I bought for ten years, it became too small for us, no longer met my needs, I moved on. I don't scour Guardian Jobs in my lunch hour when my job gives me what I need, because I'm busy focusing on the job I already HAVE.

 

A house and a healthy marriage are not the same. Glad you were able to afford a new house, many can't. Many stay in the same house no matter how small because they can't afford to get a bigger place. They try to re-arrange things to make more room, they try to get rid of old things, they try to fix things up. But it is still the same small house.

 

I have seen 'newness' cited as a reason to stray, does that mean established couples cannot maintain a freshness in their marriage? Asking, not telling.

 

Stealing a few hours a week with someone who is all focused on you is not even equal to having a FULLTIME 24/7 relationship. How do you find the 'newness' with a spouse of 20 years? You know them inside and out. You know their history, you know the moods, you know the likes and dislikes. It would take the 'new' person YEARS to even get to equivalent of a 2 year marriage, because the new person is only getting snippets of time. They aren't there every morning and evening. They aren't there all the time.

 

The new person is also NEW sex. The 20 year married couple can only do so much costumes, position changes, etc. They already DID all that during dating and the newlywed years. They have gotten comfortable. The cheating person now has a new person to have sex with, to learn their likes and dislikes and on top of that, they have the constant ego stroking of their new person (how wonderful they are, how handsome they are, how sexy they are, etc).

The more I think, the more this 'needs being met' thing stands out. I don't think people cheat for 'no reason'. The argument is whether their reason should be used by them to justify their actions. Generally not I'd say.

 

People cheat for various reasons and most of those reasons are SELFISH reasons. It is all about ME, MY NEEDS, MY WANTS, MY DESIRES, etc. Has very little to do with anyone else.

 

I've also seen recently a nod by a couple of WS's and BS's regarding the WS being in a bad place and maybe not having received as much (of whatever their own special required recipe is) as they could have had from their spouse.

 

So should the focus for a spouse always be theirs and their partner's needs? Does it become critical and harmful? How is a balance achieved?

 

Balance is achieved by communication. Simple as that. Communication and flexibility and UNSELFISHNESS. Many qualities a cheater doesn't have.

 

I know there'll be a couple of The Usual Suspects who'll take this post as a BS-bash, but it's REALLY not that. I'm interested. Some spouses gamble, or drink, others cheat. Do fulfilled, happy people who are at peace do those things? None that I know.

 

Who are the usual suspects? Is this post only for certain people? Is it only for OW? If so, that is not a good sampling of answers to questions about marriage and a couple's relationship. They are an outsider of the marriage. They only "hear" what the cheating person tells them and seriously, if you don't think that is slanted to make them look good....

[awkward]

I'm thinking currently that you either have enough money, or you need more money. You either have enough relationship, or you don't.

 

Currently I need more money and I am happy with my relationship. When my son was younger, I didn't need more money but I wasn't totally happy with my relationship. Last year I had enough money and was happy with my relationship. Ha I'm hoping that next year will be more like last year.

 

I guess the pertinent point is if those needs wax and wane, so in some periods of time more is required, and at others the same will easily suffice. So are we under a duty to manage our needs? Is that possible? To teach oneself to need less of something?

 

I think as I grew older the level of my needs have changed. I needed more sleep when I was younger than I do now. When my son was younger I needed more alone time with my husband, more "date" nights, more time to feel like a woman instead of just a mommy. Now I have plenty of date nights that are actually more fun than they were way back then and I am mom instead of mommy.

 

I don't think I teach myself to need less of something. It's just that when I need something I work at solving it. Like right now in order to solve the financial issue I'm going back to work full-time. I think that is a healthier way to solve this problem that say robbing a bank. There are times when my marriage is not 100% perfect but even during those times it is where I want to be and it is meeting my needs. If it didn't ever meet my needs I would try resolve the situation. If it didn't meet my husbands needs, I trust that he will extend me the same courtesy.

 

I see OW that are happy and their needs are being met. But still they want more of something. Often that something is more time with the person they love.

 

I also see MM that are happy and their needs are being met. Sometimes though they want more. Often that something is another woman.

[carhill]

Why cheat if one's needs are met?

One potential may be to meet the instinctive desires of an id as limitless as the vastness of space. This, IMO, is the psychology of entitlement. One can be happy, yet simultaneously feel entitled to more; more love, more sex, more money, more attention....more more more. If a healthy ego has not developed to control and constrain the id, elementary unconscious motivations and drives are manifested in actions without conscious thought as to the consequences. The person can literally act without apparent care or concern.

 

I've noted, in people I've known who have life-long issues with such afflictions as infidelity, alcoholism, drug use, certain mental illnesses, etc, that there seems to be a 'switch' missing; they appear to lack something in their psyche which balances reasoned control for positive long-term health/safety with the basic drives to feel pleasure and avoid pain. Is it coincidence? Unknown.

 

I think most people would feel, regardless of morals, that a person would seek to perpetuate that which brings them peace, happiness and prosperity in their lives. Some can have it all and still want more and, often, rain destruction upon themselves for no apparent reason. To a bystander like myself, I just feel because I have the switch, so I don't really understand someone who doesn't.

 

Anyway, I guess the dynamic keeps psychologists and psychiatrists employed....

 

P.S......remember the scifi movie called the 'Terminal Man' based on a book by Michael Crichton? Interesting perspective on the structure and manifestations of the mind....

Edited October 23, 2010 by carhill

[BB07]

Several different dynamics are often at work in the non sociopath. It can be a need for attention because they feel they are taken for granted. A need to feel loved because they don't feel loved in the marriage. It can be that they feel that the person they married was all wrong for them or that time has changed what they want and need out of relationship and the spouse no longer meets those needs. It can be that life's pressures and struggles have them beaten down and they feel numb and they are looking for excitement. It can be simply boredom and they take for granted what they value. The person doing the cheating feels a need they think can be met by another person or they have a need within themselves because something is broken and it has nothing to do with the spouse.

IMO none of the reasons one can give for cheating make it excusable nor is it the best or right way to handle getting your needs met, but I've learned this the hard way.

[on a learning curve]

Sometimes I wonder if it is possible - or even sensible - to expect one person to "meet all your needs" in a long term relationship.

 

If someone gets married in their early twenties, and their life expectancy is 80, that's 60 years of being with the same person and either person meeting the needs of the other for the whole of that time?

 

Unrealistic to say the least.

 

The biggest chance you have though, undoubtedly, is communicating those needs, compromising where necessary, and seeking solutions.

 

I see entitlement as another word for "unwilling to compromise"

 

If you settle in a monogamous relationship "for life" i.e. marriage, then you have to accept that there will be times when one of you might desire another person and as a couple you have to acknowledge that and the agreement that you make to be faithful indefinitely is that sometimes it might feel like a compromise.

 

As a couple I think you have to explore this issue rather than deny it, if possible. Where do you draw the line between desiring others and acting on that desire?

 

I love this post, and I think it is spot on.

 

It is a "meet in the middle" type of situation and you have to trust your partner to be willing to meet you halfway at the least, when faced with obstacles.

[fooled once]

Sometimes I wonder if it is possible - or even sensible - to expect one person to "meet all your needs" in a long term relationship.

 

If someone gets married in their early twenties, and their life expectancy is 80, that's 60 years of being with the same person and either person meeting the needs of the other for the whole of that time?

 

Unrealistic to say the least.

 

The biggest chance you have though, undoubtedly, is communicating those needs, compromising where necessary, and seeking solutions.

 

I see entitlement as another word for "unwilling to compromise"

 

If you settle in a monogamous relationship "for life" i.e. marriage, then you have to accept that there will be times when one of you might desire another person and as a couple you have to acknowledge that and the agreement that you make to be faithful indefinitely is that sometimes it might feel like a compromise.

 

As a couple I think you have to explore this issue rather than deny it, if possible. Where do you draw the line between desiring others and acting on that desire?

 

Great post and honestly, NO ONE PERSON should meet all your NEEDS.

 

I mean, my H can't meet my need to be a mom He can't meet all my needs NOR SHOULD HE. No person should ever be RESPONSIBLE for fulfilling another's NEEDS. That has to come from within.

[xxoo]

I guess the pertinent point is if those needs wax and wane, so in some periods of time more is required, and at others the same will easily suffice. So are we under a duty to manage our needs? Is that possible? To teach oneself to need less of something?

 

Yes it is possible, and often necessary, to manage our own needs. People in healthy, happy, LTRs do it all the time!

 

I think people are sometimes too myopic about what they need, and uncreative about how that need can be fulfilled. Sometimes wants are misinterpreted as needs.

 

For example, one spouse might believe "I need my spouse to have sex with me 5x a week", but what they really need is to feel wanted and attractive--not specifically sex 5x a week. In this case, the spouse possibly could do a number of things to help fulfill the need to feel wanted (even just protecting more time to cuddle and chat, focusing on each other). And, possibly, the spouse might not be able to do ANYTHING that will help fulfill the need to feel attractive, because there is some personal issue preventing them from feeling attractive.

 

But if the individual dwells on the "need" to have sex 5x a week, and the spouse is unwilling to do that, they will conclude that their spouse is at fault for not meeting their needs. And then they might attempt to have that need to be met by another person, who is equally unable to meet all of their rigid "needs". After all, the spouse DOES meet SOME of their needs, and they can not envision those needs being met a different way....and so now they are stuck.

[Silly_Girl]

Great post and honestly, NO ONE PERSON should meet all your NEEDS.

 

I mean, my H can't meet my need to be a mom He can't meet all my needs NOR SHOULD HE. No person should ever be RESPONSIBLE for fulfilling another's NEEDS. That has to come from within.

 

Romantic relationships were what I was referring to.

 

And it's not about others being responsible for my happiness, it's about that relationship providing me with what I personally need from a romantic relationship.

 

I have other needs in other relationships and same goes. I cut a very close friend out of my life earlier this year. Her being unreliable and less than truthful meant I no longer got the basics I needed from a friendship and we are no longer in contact.

[Silly_Girl]

Yes it is possible, and often necessary, to manage our own needs. People in healthy, happy, LTRs do it all the time!

 

I think people are sometimes too myopic about what they need, and uncreative about how that need can be fulfilled. Sometimes wants are misinterpreted as needs.

 

For example, one spouse might believe "I need my spouse to have sex with me 5x a week", but what they really need is to feel wanted and attractive--not specifically sex 5x a week. In this case, the spouse possibly could do a number of things to help fulfill the need to feel wanted (even just protecting more time to cuddle and chat, focusing on each other). And, possibly, the spouse might not be able to do ANYTHING that will help fulfill the need to feel attractive, because there is some personal issue preventing them from feeling attractive.

 

But if the individual dwells on the "need" to have sex 5x a week, and the spouse is unwilling to do that, they will conclude that their spouse is at fault for not meeting their needs. And then they might attempt to have that need to be met by another person, who is equally unable to meet all of their rigid "needs". After all, the spouse DOES meet SOME of their needs, and they can not envision those needs being met a different way....and so now they are stuck.

 

Really like this. Thanks.

[Silly_Girl]

Who are the usual suspects? Is this post only for certain people? Is it only for OW?

 

Absolutely not I'd know better than that. But there are some posters who can read a slant in to something and get their knickers in a twist that something is anti-BS when it isn't. I was concerned that would happen with this thread. But no, am not wanting or expecting to restrict any responses in any way at all.

[BB07]

SG I don't know what the heck I was thinking yesterday with my reply to your post. My reply had nothing to do with your inquiry. Hey I wasn't drinking so that is not an excuse. lol Duh..........sorry about that.

[Silly_Girl]

SG I don't know what the heck I was thinking yesterday with my reply to your post. My reply had nothing to do with your inquiry. Hey I wasn't drinking so that is not an excuse. lol Duh..........sorry about that.

 

Seemed fine to me. We're as crazylady as one another!!!