Ladies, is this really true?

[marksaysay]

I'm really getting into this book Divorce Busting. It has a lot of useful information for me if I have any chance at stopping this divorce. I tried one last attempt tonight just talking about how all this was affecting our daughter. Her reply was, "she'll get over it.". I plan on finishing this book in the next couple of days so them it's on to implementation. I like the part about doing what worked in the past. Not concentrating so much on the problems, but doing what you know works. Her main reason for wanting this divorce was she said I was no longer the person she'd fell in love with. She said if I didn't over the past few years, I couldn't change in a matter of weeks. To me, while she believes that it's impossible, I sense that she still wants proof. I still bowl with her every Friday and we still go to the same church, so those are my opportunities to prove myself, in addition to the change in my interaction with our daughter. I still may be drawing at straws but what do inane to lose.

[dreamingoftigers]

Good luck to you, she seems pretty pissed with you though. Sounds like she has had enough of your bs. But if you aren't going to really tell her how you care, how do you ever expect her to know?

 

Hopefully the Divorce Busters works for you.

 

Bringing her daughter into it probably made her feel like you were trying to manipulate her.

[You Go Girl]

To Marksaysay's wife (if she comes back):

 

I get that his online activities has pretty much destroyed the love/trust/respect you once had for him...totally understandable.

 

I understand that after years of dealing with this, you're done and ready to divorce....again...makes sense to me.

 

Where I struggle is how you reconcile all of that into making your going onto dating sites (which most people equate to mental porn) while still married as in any way acceptable???

 

If you're done, you're done. But you're not yet divorced, and he claims to be making an effort here...which makes your actions here much more...'suspect'.

 

Last I looked...two wrongs were still two wrongs.

 

Two wrongs don't make a right.

But I will tell you firsthand, after dealing with lies for better part of 7 years, that a woman will snap.

I think many don't understand that. It is like the guy has been cheating during all the lying period. Just like an affair, there is secrecy, lies, sneakiness, covering their tracks, hiding their tracks, lying right to your face when you know they did this that very day, and pretending they can't remember the last time, or that it was a long time ago, placating, pacification, and the list goes on of intelligence insults and marital betrayal.

The anger that fuels from being lied to your face, no matter what the subject, for years on end, is blinding and furious.

[marksaysay]

She is pissed but i have told her how much I care. I have told her. She didn't really get this pissed until I confronted her about her activity online. I also found out that she's now getting text messages sent from this website. I dont know if this is actually the way she feels or if it is the "fog" talking. I think it may be a little if both. But I would never accept myself knowing that o didn't try everything I could. I have literally tried to do all I can, so now I'll let god do the rest. While I understand the Divorce Bustering ideas are meant to try to salvage a marriage, I think it will do wonders for me regardless of this outcome. I'm done trying to appeal or plead or beg or any of that stuff. Now it's time to fix me, either fir her or for somebody else.

Edited October 26, 2010 by marksaysay

[marksaysay]

Update: I know it's probably pretty much over now. I called my wife after daughter was put to bed and the second night in a row wife did not call prior to this event, asking if something was wrong. She had just chewed me out because she said this same thing about me and that it made her mad that I did it. I said something wasn't right about her not calling her daughter. I told her despite the fact that we are in a divorce process, that she was still my wife and that she could do whatever she wanted after everything was finalized. Then I probably shouldn't have but I told her about the recent discovery that she was no longer strictly talking to men on this dating website, but also texting with them now. I wasn't actually snooping but concerned knowing that we had limited # of texts on our plan and I wanted to know where we stood, since at this time we are still married. She'd been doing and excessive amount so I wanted to know. The number came up on our phone bill 000000XXXX. She said it was her friends on facebook, but that's a different number because I did the whole facebook phone messages before she did. Nothing crazy. Just notifications of updates and messages, so I knew what that number looked like. She denied, denied, denied that this activity was from this website and got really pissed. I know it's from this website. They range in time from early afternoon to 4 am and there were 252 either sent or received from or to this number from 10/18 to 10/25. That's not facebook. I doubt, after my discovery, she would ever be willing to reconcile now. Oh well.

Edited October 26, 2010 by marksaysay

[dreamingoftigers]

Update: I know it's probably pretty much over now. I called my wife after daughter was put to bed and the second night in a row wife did not call prior to this event, asking if something was wrong. She had just chewed me out because she said this same thing about me and that it made her mad that I did it. I said something wasn't right about her not calling her daughter. I told her despite the fact that we are in a divorce process, that she was still my wife and that she could do whatever she wanted after everything was finalized. Then I probably shouldn't have but I told her about the recent discovery that she was no longer strictly talking to men on this dating website, but also texting with them now. I wasn't actually snooping but concerned knowing that we had limited # of texts on our plan and I wanted to know where we stood, since at this time we are still married. She'd been doing and excessive amount so I wanted to know. The number came up on our phone bill 000000XXXX. She said it was her friends on facebook, but that's a different number because I did the whole facebook phone messages before she did. Nothing crazy. Just notifications of updates and messages, so I knew what that number looked like. She denied, denied, denied that this activity was from this website and got really pissed. I know it's from this website. They range in time from early afternoon to 4 am and there were 252 either sent or received from or to this number from 10/18 to 10/25. That's not facebook. I doubt, after my discovery, she would ever be willing to reconcile now. Oh well.

 

She thinks that she is entitled to it and has become fixated on it. I wouldn't even try talking to her about this or confronting her on it, it simply won't get you anywhere but fighting.

 

Change for you, the rest will follow, seriously avoid being reactive to her and her behaviour right now, even just for your daughter. Don't look at it as being over until everything is finalized, just keep working on you.

[dreamingoftigers]

She thinks that she is entitled to it and has become fixated on it. I wouldn't even try talking to her about this or confronting her on it, it simply won't get you anywhere but fighting.

 

Change for you, the rest will follow, seriously avoid being reactive to her and her behaviour right now, even just for your daughter. Don't look at it as being over until everything is finalized, just keep working on you.

 

The fact that she is denying and pissed off at you shows that she is still emotionally involved at some level. You could even tell her that you kind of get what she went through now (even just at a lower intensity).

[Owl]

Two wrongs don't make a right.

But I will tell you firsthand, after dealing with lies for better part of 7 years, that a woman will snap.

I think many don't understand that. It is like the guy has been cheating during all the lying period. Just like an affair, there is secrecy, lies, sneakiness, covering their tracks, hiding their tracks, lying right to your face when you know they did this that very day, and pretending they can't remember the last time, or that it was a long time ago, placating, pacification, and the list goes on of intelligence insults and marital betrayal.

The anger that fuels from being lied to your face, no matter what the subject, for years on end, is blinding and furious.

 

Don't take me wrong...I get how hurt she is. I think her anger and hurt are justified based on his actions.

 

However...her turning to the dating site at this point totally NEGATES any kind of self-righteous fury she wants to try to throw around, IMHO.

 

She's doing the same darned thing he was...enjoying herself in the same manner she despised for so long.

 

Sorry...I don't buy into that mindset.

 

She's being a hypocrite, plain and simple.

[marksaysay]

The fact that she is denying and pissed off at you shows that she is still emotionally involved at some level. You could even tell her that you kind of get what she went through now (even just at a lower intensity).

 

Do you mean emotional involvement with me or the other? She just keeps coming up with more ways to be clever. Today she separated the cell phone accounts. She got very defensive saying she was an adult and could do what she wanted. I know she's doing something. She may not be exclusive with one guy but I've seen too much.

 

Also, today she seemed so into helping me find a place that would work for me. It may be she just wants me out or she still cares. Whatever the case, I can't wait to finish this book possibly tonight and start with the Divorce Busting.

Edited October 26, 2010 by marksaysay

[Owl]

Here's my suggestion...if she wants to be seperated, let her be seperated from you...COMPLETELY.

 

Why just seperate cell phone accounts? Time to seperate the checking accounts too...and need for all those credit cards that she has on the joint account either...cancel those suckers out.

 

If she wants to be an adult and no longer live as a married woman...time for her to move the heck out.

 

Let her find out what life is like COMPLETELY seperated from you.

 

She seperated the phone accounts because she doesn't like the fact that you're calling her out on her own bad behavior. Don't sweat it...but use it to start moving things forward.

 

Forcing her to live "on her own" will have one of two effects. Either she'll realize what she's doing and change (which is a positive), or it'll prepare the both of you for truly being apart (which given what I've seen of the situation, its also a postive).

[marksaysay]

I too thought her defensiveness was due to being called out. I may not have called it correctly but I called it. I'm ready to just get finished with this book, implement it's approach and see what happens. I may not be able to save the marriage but I'll give it my best.

[dreamingoftigers]

She is trying to hurt you and get a rise out of you, don't sacrifice your dignity over this. Don't get into a push-and-pull either. It isn't helping either one of you.

[marksaysay]

Just finished the 180 section of the Divorce Busting book. Will start using it today. Gonna get through the make yousel happy section today and start doing that as well. If I don't win her back, I'll atleast no I can be happy without her. Loved the part about changes have to be something she notices. If it works, good. If it doesnt, that's good, too.

[dreamingoftigers]

Yes the changes you make will have to be for something other then just getting her back because if you do end up getting her back and you weren't serious about them, you will just revert to your old ways.

[You Go Girl]

I too thought her defensiveness was due to being called out. I may not have called it correctly but I called it. I'm ready to just get finished with this book, implement it's approach and see what happens. I may not be able to save the marriage but I'll give it my best.

 

No, it was more of a "you did what you wanted to do regardless of my feelings, and now I'm going to show you just who's in charge of my life." and that's what that was all about.

[You Go Girl]

Don't take me wrong...I get how hurt she is. I think her anger and hurt are justified based on his actions.

 

However...her turning to the dating site at this point totally NEGATES any kind of self-righteous fury she wants to try to throw around, IMHO.

 

She's doing the same darned thing he was...enjoying herself in the same manner she despised for so long.

 

Sorry...I don't buy into that mindset.

 

She's being a hypocrite, plain and simple.

 

Not sure she is throwing around any self-righteous fury anymore. She did respond to this thread, claiming that he is still lying. Which, true or not, if she believes he is still lying, it only confirms her belief that her choice was right to end it.

[marksaysay]

Not sure she is throwing around any self-righteous fury anymore. She did respond to this thread, claiming that he is still lying. Which, true or not, if she believes he is still lying, it only confirms her belief that her choice was right to end it.

 

She is very much so a person who has an issue with accepting responsibility. She's always told me that I need to fix our relationship as if she had no part in our issues. She even bought a relationship book and never even opened it. I'm not saying that I've done nothing wrong. I actually openly confess that I did many wrongs in our relationship, but no matter what i did, she always pointed the finger at me. Just a couple of days ago, she got mad at me about not calling our daughter before she went to bed, even though I'd seen her just a little while before. Then, when I brought up the fact that she'd done it also two days in arrow while our daughter was staying with me, it was ok because she missed her and couldn't stand to hear her without being with her. My only problem is that she's been somewhat hypocritical about many things.

 

She stated in her post that I was lying, which I wasn't. The things she said were true but I didn't feel it was necessary to post every single thing I've done. The main things I felt were brought out in the open, my porn addiction and the neglect. I never denied those. I don't understand what I could have lied about by making those confessions.

[You Go Girl]

She's in anger mode.

You know which things she has a right to be angry with, and which are ridiculous, as you seem to be honest with yourself these days!

Respond accordingly. Not calling the child--her responsibility.

[marksaysay]

Im not so sure now that marriage is over. She told me that she has actually been thinking about taking the divorce off the table, but she became furious that I caught her meeting up with some guy tonight. That made her mad. She said he was a stranger but I know otherwise. Some have told me when a woman is in this mode of seeking fulfillment outside of marriage, you can't believe most of what they say. Her head is clouded by her "addiction" to this emotional affair that started prior to her filing. The only reason she filed was because I confronted her. I know that she's been lying about what's going on because I can prove it. I'm beginning to believe that I should continue to fight for my marriage.

[Owl]

I'm beginning to believe that I should continue to fight for my marriage

 

OK...what's your plan? What's going to be different than what you've done up to this point?

[marksaysay]

OK...what's your plan? What's going to be different than what you've done up to this point?

 

What I should've done all along, continue on my path of the 180. I noticed that she's gotten bothered by my going out the other day. She got bothered by my making plans for the weekend. If I stay on this course, I believe at some point she will break out of this "fog" and realize that the stuff that she's doing isn't worth breaking up her family over. Since all this has started, she's changed her reason for wanting the divorce several times. I think if I move on with my life and work on me, then everything will work itself out. Atleast, that's what i hope. Only time will tell.

[beachbum84]

Just thought I'd say your story is inspiring. I wish I had the strength to do more than say I'm tired of it, but to be able to act in a way that will stop it. How did you get to the point that you weren't scared to act? I'm torn between wanting to and actually doing. There's those what ifs that get me, like what if taking control of my life and bettering myself actually just pushes him out, instead of making him "see the light". Where do you find the strength to continue?

[marksaysay]

Just thought I'd say your story is inspiring. I wish I had the strength to do more than say I'm tired of it, but to be able to act in a way that will stop it. How did you get to the point that you weren't scared to act? I'm torn between wanting to and actually doing. There's those what ifs that get me, like what if taking control of my life and bettering myself actually just pushes him out, instead of making him "see the light". Where do you find the strength to continue?

 

It's been said that anything worth having is worth fighting for. I'm a fighter at heart. I never take anything lying down. I'm convinced in my heart and through some of her actions that she still loves me. While she may be infatuated with the attention of another guy, I know she still loves me. I believe that we were meant to be together. I believe that this is a phase. I believe that if and when we make it through this, our relationship will be stronger than ever. My wife, and more importantly, my family are worth fighting for. In the end, my efforts may turn out to be futile, but I would never be able to look myself in the eye if I had not tried everything. If my efforts come up short, they just come up short, but I'm not gonna accept that this is the end until it is the end. I continue to pray for strength and fortitude to endure this.

[marksaysay]

Update: Wife just called asking for me to take her cell phone off of my account because she found out that that's how I figured out what she was doing. I don't think I'm gonna do it. If she wants to play, she's got to pay. I know she's gonna be mad about it, so I'll just have to prepare myself for the explosion that will happen when I tell her.

[carhill]

It'll take her, what, ten minutes at the local cell store to get her own account and phone? IMO, don't bother playing these games. Still haven't filed a response yet? The clock is ticking. Don't let this go to default. She doesn't sound like the amicable sort.