LittleTiger Posted October 22, 2010 Posted October 22, 2010 Wouldnt a 6 or 7 still be considered above average and attractive:confused: Well that's the thing about leagues - it's all relative!
John018 Posted October 22, 2010 Posted October 22, 2010 Yea...in reading this thread I have been completely confused as to why these guys keep saying what women go for then when we correct them they say we are lying:confused:. Maybe this has something to do with it?... ...studies have found that men’s stated preferences are more likely to line up with their behavior than women’s. Here is an excerpt from Urbaniak, G. C., & Kilmann, P. R. (2006). Niceness and dating success: A further test of the nice guy stereotype. Sex Roles, 55, 209-224. (emphases mine): Weiderman and Dubois (1998) used behavioral measures to assess women’s preferences for a mate and found a discrepancy between self-perceptions and behavior, particularly among women. For both men and women, the physical attractiveness manipulation was the most important factor in predicting ratings of desirability. Men accurately indicated that the physical attractiveness of the targets was the most important characteristic that influenced their desirability ratings, whereas women inaccurately indicated that desired level of relationship commitment was their most important factor, when, in fact, it was one of the least important factors behaviorally. Sprecher (1989) found similar results, in that women inaccurately assessed the role of physical attractiveness in their own ratings of a target man. The women in Sprecher ’s study reported that expressiveness was the most important factor in their choice, although it was the least important factor behaviorally. Physical attractiveness was the most important factor that actually influenced their ratings. The results of these two studies suggest that women’s self-reported preferences may not match their actual choices. Because it is still considered shallow and inappropriate for women to say that physical attractiveness is very important in their choices, those women may have engaged in impression management. -------------- here's the link: http://www.feministcritics.org/blog/2008/04/26/do-women-know-what-they-want/
SteveC80 Posted October 22, 2010 Posted October 22, 2010 Well that's the thing about leagues - it's all relative! Do you agree with my post though that there has to be some hint of physical attraction for it to grow? You cant think a guys ugly or unattratcive physically and all of a sudden hsi personality makes him attractive to you
SteveC80 Posted October 22, 2010 Posted October 22, 2010 Maybe this has something to do with it?... ...studies have found that men’s stated preferences are more likely to line up with their behavior than women’s. Here is an excerpt from Urbaniak, G. C., & Kilmann, P. R. (2006). Niceness and dating success: A further test of the nice guy stereotype. Sex Roles, 55, 209-224. (emphases mine): Weiderman and Dubois (1998) used behavioral measures to assess women’s preferences for a mate and found a discrepancy between self-perceptions and behavior, particularly among women. For both men and women, the physical attractiveness manipulation was the most important factor in predicting ratings of desirability. Men accurately indicated that the physical attractiveness of the targets was the most important characteristic that influenced their desirability ratings, whereas women inaccurately indicated that desired level of relationship commitment was their most important factor, when, in fact, it was one of the least important factors behaviorally. Sprecher (1989) found similar results, in that women inaccurately assessed the role of physical attractiveness in their own ratings of a target man. The women in Sprecher ’s study reported that expressiveness was the most important factor in their choice, although it was the least important factor behaviorally. Physical attractiveness was the most important factor that actually influenced their ratings. The results of these two studies suggest that women’s self-reported preferences may not match their actual choices. Because it is still considered shallow and inappropriate for women to say that physical attractiveness is very important in their choices, those women may have engaged in impression management. -------------- here's the link: http://www.feministcritics.org/blog/2008/04/26/do-women-know-what-they-want/ I do think women try to not come off as shallow and try to downplay how important looks are to them Most people you see are near level of attratcivness so imo Men and women hold looks just as importantly Men just admit looks are important to them Its not like you constantly see ugly or average guys with hot women unless money or fame is involved
porter218 Posted October 22, 2010 Posted October 22, 2010 (edited) Wouldnt a 6 or 7 still be considered above average and attractive:confused: That was only one example of the guys I have been with. The latest one I am into is 5'7" and maybe a 5. It honestly ranges anywhere from a 4-9 with the guys I have been with. And the looks aren't important to me. If my xH didn't have the humor and common interests and the confidence that he has then he would never have been my H. And now that I think about it maybe my judgement of him being a 6-7 is higher then others think because very often at work and other places I always got comments on "why are you with him? He isn't close to your league. He isn't anywhere close to as good looking as you. " These are comments from men....they don't get it when a girl is pretty but with an average guy. Women don't think that way. Not usually at least. This thought plagues my xH because later it turned out the fact that he wasn't a 'pretty boy' worried him. He always thought I would wake up one day and leave when I noticed he wasn't as good looking as me. He never could understand that it didn't matter to me. Edited October 22, 2010 by porter218
LittleTiger Posted October 22, 2010 Posted October 22, 2010 Do you agree with my post though that there has to be some hint of physical attraction for it to grow? You cant think a guys ugly or unattratcive physically and all of a sudden hsi personality makes him attractive to you Yes, there has to be some hint of physical attraction but physical attraction for women isn't based on looks alone. That's what I'm trying to say. I met a guy when I was 25 (that's quite a few years ago). He was very overweight and certainly couldn't be described as 'good looking' although I liked his chubby face. He was one of the funniest, warmest, most intelligent and quick witted people I have ever met and I was physically attracted to him within minutes of meeting him. I really, really liked him. I would even go as far as to say I had a crush on him. Given the chance I'd probably have fallen head over heels in love. We worked together for a while and although we both had partners, we had a great time flirting with each other. I've never forgotten him. I admit to liking fit, healthy men. Chubby guys aren't my usual type. Nor are skinny men. Yet the one guy (besides my current man) who I genuinely couldn't resist was thin enough to hide behind a drain pipe. I lusted after him literally the instant I set on eyes on him. Damn he was sexy. My current man does it for me in a way nobody else ever has. I adored him before I even met him. He's not conventionally good looking either but the first time I set eyes on him I wanted him on the spot and my desire for him has grown every day that I've known him. If I saw somebody I considered 'ugly' I wouldn't be attracted to them because by definition ugly to me means repulsive in some way. I'm unlikely to find someone repulsive on first meeting and then change my mind later because being repulsed is also about more than looks. The only way you can determine attraction based on looks alone is from photographs - otherwise there are automatically other factors coming into play, such as pheromones, movement, general demeanor, presence etc. To add further proof to my argument about 'looks' being more important to men than women - how many women do you know who masturbate over photographs of hot looking guys?
SteveC80 Posted October 22, 2010 Posted October 22, 2010 That was only one example of the guys I have been with. The latest one I am into is 5'7" and maybe a 5. It honestly ranges anywhere from a 4-9 with the guys I have been with. And the looks aren't important to me. If my xH didn't have the humor and common interests and the confidence that he has then he would never have been my H. And now that I think about it maybe my judgement of him being a 6-7 is higher then others think because very often at work and other places I always got comments on "why are you with him? He isn't close to your league. He isn't anywhere close to as good looking as you. " These are comments from men....they don't get it when a girl is pretty but with an average guy. Women don't think that way. Not usually at least. This thought plagues my xH because later it turned out the fact that he wasn't a 'pretty boy' worried him. He always thought I would wake up one day and leave when I noticed he wasn't as good looking as me. He never could understand that it didn't matter to me. I hang out with women whove said the Man theyre friend is with isnt good looking enough for her Youre going by your own experience i know plenty of women where looks are extremely important to them and they judge men off of
sweetjasmine Posted October 22, 2010 Posted October 22, 2010 The laws of attraction are very different for men and women. I don't know if they are. But there's definitely a lot of individual variation. And people change significantly over time. What you find attractive at 16 is likely to be different than what you find attractive at 25, at 35, at 55.
LittleTiger Posted October 23, 2010 Posted October 23, 2010 Yeah, I think Jack kinda He's supposed to be playing a dork in this, but funnily enough I can still see that je ne sais quoi even then. The lift of his eyebrow and the way he laughs - yes, he grew into it but it's there already.
porter218 Posted October 23, 2010 Posted October 23, 2010 I do think women try to not come off as shallow and try to downplay how important looks are to them Most people you see are near level of attratcivness so imo Men and women hold looks just as importantly Men just admit looks are important to them Its not like you constantly see ugly or average guys with hot women unless money or fame is involved Well then maybe I'm just weird... I am a model(and also the marketing director for a very large nationwide company) yet I married an average guy with an average income while I was the one making 3 times the income that he did. So on that note...I must be the only one
LittleTiger Posted October 23, 2010 Posted October 23, 2010 Well then maybe I'm just weird... I am a model(and also the marketing director for a very large nationwide company) yet I married an average guy with an average income while I was the one making 3 times the income that he did. So on that note...I must be the only one Nope, me too (although I don't have a lot of money ). I'm not a model either (too little) but apparently I come very high up in the league tables and I too married an average looking guy. Would I have preferred it if he'd been drop dead gorgeous? Maybe - but then it wouldn't have been him.
somedude81 Posted October 23, 2010 Posted October 23, 2010 But there's definitely a lot of individual variation. And people change significantly over time. What you find attractive at 16 is likely to be different than what you find attractive at 25, at 35, at 55. That's the problem The men posting about their problems with women are young guys who are into young girls. Those young girls are the ones who are very picky about a guy's looks. All the women posting about how they married an average guy are most likely 30+. Guys don't want till they are in their 30's to finally get some female attention.
SteveC80 Posted October 23, 2010 Posted October 23, 2010 Well just agree to disagree i think men and women hold looks pretty high Look at all the height threads and women refusing to date guys under a certain height
LittleTiger Posted October 23, 2010 Posted October 23, 2010 Well just agree to disagree i think men and women hold looks pretty high Look at all the height threads and women refusing to date guys under a certain height They do, nobody is arguing that we don't all like good looking people. All we're saying is that there is more to physical attraction than just looks - a lot more. Just wait until you fall in love (not in lust - totally different thing). Looks, physique, body type, height, even weight will matter far less than you think.
sweetjasmine Posted October 23, 2010 Posted October 23, 2010 Those young girls are the ones who are very picky about a guy's looks. All the women posting about how they married an average guy are most likely 30+. Guys don't want till they are in their 30's to finally get some female attention. Possible, but that doesn't explain everything. I'm younger than you are.
porter218 Posted October 23, 2010 Posted October 23, 2010 Well just agree to disagree i think men and women hold looks pretty high Look at all the height threads and women refusing to date guys under a certain height Well, I think the women who usually have this hangup on looks aren't exactly gf/W material most often. If they are this way then steer clear because they are the superficial minority. And I've seen the threads on men hungup on dating women size zero and smaller...does that mean most men think this way.. No. I more often notice the guys I associate with prefer size 4-6. Also those guys who claim they adore only women of that size are not bf/H material. Even though I am a size zero(a healthy one) I wouldn't date a man who thinks that way. It's not cute.
porter218 Posted October 23, 2010 Posted October 23, 2010 Those young girls are the ones who are very picky about a guy's looks. All the women posting about how they married an average guy are most likely 30+. Guys don't want till they are in their 30's to finally get some female attention. yea...I am in my 31 now..I Divorced before 30 though. But I married at 23. and I hold the same opinions and views at 18 that I do now. All of the women I know feel the same way about looks in a man that I do...with the exception of 1. And that one, well, she just gets around and isn't into Rs.
Titania22 Posted October 23, 2010 Posted October 23, 2010 I don't know if they are. But there's definitely a lot of individual variation. And people change significantly over time. What you find attractive at 16 is likely to be different than what you find attractive at 25, at 35, at 55. That is so true!
Titania22 Posted October 23, 2010 Posted October 23, 2010 I want to put something out here. In regards to looks being important. I am coming from the perspective of I don't need a relationship for money, procreation, security and I don't even have a lack of non-sexual intimacy in my life. I have lots of plutonic male friend (also female friends), who are intelligent, intellectually stimulating, have similar belief patterns, funny, etc. So the only thing I could possibly need a man for is the sex thing. And since I can easily take care of my simplest sexual needs myself. The only thing I need consider when deciding if a man is someone I want to be more then friends with, is the nature of the sexual experience. So yes I want to choose a man who I can't wait to touch all over, and with a virility that is going to last the distance. In regards to not needing a man for any other reason, I am fully prepared to hold out for a man will give me the experience I am looking for. This doesn't mean that all the other qualities are not important. It just means without the physical attraction, it's just friendship.
porter218 Posted October 23, 2010 Posted October 23, 2010 Guys don't want till they are in their 30's to finally get some female attention. Didn't you say you were 29? like 1yr from 30.... No real point to that..just sayin...
lso802 Posted October 23, 2010 Posted October 23, 2010 One of my professors is really attractive to me. I wouldn't necessarily date her, since she's not my type personality wise. She's married to a 5'10" dude who's about 200+ pounds, and she's very much in love.
LittleTiger Posted October 23, 2010 Posted October 23, 2010 So the only thing I could possibly need a man for is the sex thing. And since I can easily take care of my simplest sexual needs myself. The only thing I need consider when deciding if a man is someone I want to be more then friends with, is the nature of the sexual experience. So yes I want to choose a man who I can't wait to touch all over, and with a virility that is going to last the distance. In regards to not needing a man for any other reason, I am fully prepared to hold out for a man will give me the experience I am looking for. This doesn't mean that all the other qualities are not important. It just means without the physical attraction, it's just friendship. Of course it's just friendship if you don't have physical attraction. My argument is that a guy doesn't have to be good looking to be physcially attractive. The average looking guys I fell for were sexy as h*ll to me but their sexiness wasn't based entirely on how they looked. I did want to touch these men all over - it didn't matter that they were less than perfect in the looks department because they had so much going for them in other ways. Also, if it's a great sexual experience you're after, then looks definitely aren't an indicator of how much fun you'll have between the sheets.
Titania22 Posted October 23, 2010 Posted October 23, 2010 Of course it's just friendship if you don't have physical attraction. My argument is that a guy doesn't have to be good looking to be physcially attractive. The average looking guys I fell for were sexy as h*ll to me but their sexiness wasn't based entirely on how they looked. I did want to touch these men all over - it didn't matter that they were less than perfect in the looks department because they had so much going for them in other ways. Also, if it's a great sexual experience you're after, then looks definitely aren't an indicator of how much fun you'll have between the sheets. I agree, as physical attractive itself is in the eye of the beholder. I don't personally know a single woman who is attracted to the guys I am, and I don't seem to be attracted to the guys any of them are either. I also agree, because just talking looks, doesn't account for body language and overall vibe the man is giving off. And I find people always look slightly more attractive when I like them, and less attractive if I don't. I think that is ultimately the advantage of the guy I feel are borderline in physical attractiveness, because if I get to know them and I like them, suddenly I think they are superhot, and the only thing that changed was my perception. Likewise I could see a guy that fits the criteria I outlined I another thread, and not be the slightest bit interested, for no apparently reason I am conscious of.
Surrealist Posted October 23, 2010 Posted October 23, 2010 Do any of you ladies think Gene Simmons is attractive or sexy?
porter218 Posted October 23, 2010 Posted October 23, 2010 (edited) Do any of you ladies think Gene Simmons is attractive or sexy? He does have a bit of that je ne sais quoi. When I watch his show I wonder where I can find a younger version of him. LOL With he exception of his views on M. Edited October 23, 2010 by porter218
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