P1xie Posted March 1, 2004 Posted March 1, 2004 I've been reading post about guys and Porns. I too and a woman that does believes that if a man is thinking of another women when he masterbates that he is cheating on her with his heart. I am not against porn I just feel that there is a time and place for it. If you love and care for someone and see that it is ripping her apart do you continue doing it? Is that love? I have been with my boyfriend for three years and have battled with him with porn (Not masterbation). He promises and promises that he will not have porn but I recently caught him again. I do believe in compromises and understand that men are visual creature so I agreed to allow him to videotape us. I have given him naked pictures of myself for when he felt the urge and I wasn't around. Not to get into details our of our sex life but as prudish as I am with Porn he says that I do everything except the lesbian scenes. I also have more of issue with Playboy (example) because he is looking at one girl and getting off on her as with a porno flick I feel it's more of the act that is getting him off. Right I hurt more of the fact that he lied and broke his promise than catching him watching a porn. He says he wants to be my friend and I asked him would you break your a promise to your friend or lie to them. Why am I different? I don't understand, I'm hurting so bad right now. I don't know if I should leave him or give him yet another chance. I love him but is he really showing me love? I told him if I found it again that would be it...if I don't keep to my word will this just worsen because he knows I'm weak? Please someone HELP
faux Posted March 1, 2004 Posted March 1, 2004 I think it's absolutely ridiculous for women to have a problem with this. There are numerous threads on this topic and they all seem the same to me. What if your SO caught you reading a romance novel and he freaked out on you? How might you feel if he demanded you stop? It's just as ridiculous. You cannot cheat on someone with pornography. And you want to end your relationship with this man because he does what any normal man does? He looks at porn and he masturbates. I don't know where your insecurities came from, or how you can possibly feel betrayed by such a thing, but I really think you are taking this far too far. Try to accept that this is just something most if not all men do. Again, he cannot cheat on you with a photograph or recorded image of another woman. And if you were wondering, no one woman, however amazing she is, will prevent a man from fantasizing or viewing pornographic material. The man is not going to forget how wonderful you are because of that however.
UCFKevin Posted March 1, 2004 Posted March 1, 2004 What if your SO caught you reading a romance novel and he freaked out on you? How might you feel if he demanded you stop? HOLY CRAP. Why the hell didn't I think of that?! Well done.
Errol Posted March 1, 2004 Posted March 1, 2004 welcome back - still have the same problems huh? As I've said before, its not cheating HOWEVER - while I don't pretend to understand women I also do not devalue their feelings about things just because I don't happen to feel the same way. Having said that I will say that porn bothered my spouse for a long time and out of respect and love I stopped looking. Until recently when my spouse introduced a little bit of porn and some 'toys' into our relationship to spice things up a bit. It's been 20+ years since I've looked at porn myself. If I had a problem with spouse reading romance novels I expect that they would leave the house, not to return out of spouses love and respect for me. Masturbation is an entirely different matter. I do still have my imagination and my memories. I certainly do not need porn to live or to be happy and could not care less if I never saw any porn again.
HiDDeN PiGLeT Posted March 1, 2004 Posted March 1, 2004 i can understand where you're coming from but i say let him have his porn. b/c if he didnt want to be with you he wouldnt be with you. as a female i gotta admit to watching porn at times as well. as long as he doesnt call you by someone else's name or cheat on you i think its fine. i'm sure once in a while you see a guy on the streets you go oh wow he's cute or something. i lay down the ground rules of what i consider as cheating and my b/f feels the same things are cheating as i did so it works for you. you can look but dont touch and if someone plain out ask if you want to have sex or to kiss them or anything physical of that nature is consider cheating in both of our books and as long as he makes it clear that he has a girl when someone is coming onto him then we're ok. set up some ground rules that you can both agree on and talk things out with him. you'd be surprise. i'm sure he doesnt always tell that he has a girl and that he flirts, but thats only human. i've told him at any time that i've caught him cheating on me or breaking the rules i will destroy anything he holds dear to him so we have an understanding. dont f me over and i wouldnt f you over. rules are at anytime that he feels like he needs to be with someone else other than me he's free to go just dont cheat on me and dont expect me to take him back.
Author P1xie Posted March 1, 2004 Author Posted March 1, 2004 Well considering I've never read a romance novel or seen a porn your argument is invalid. I am willing to please him in any way I can even making our own porn. I did not demand that he stopped. He seen it upset me the first time he was caught and I told him that we had different lifestyles and I did not believe trying to change people and we should go our own ways. HE MADE THE DECISION TO PROMISE TO STOP THEN LIED!!! I live with this guy he can get anytime he wants. I gave him stuff to beat off and try to fulfill his every fantasy. I think he is addicted to it. I'm tired of guys with the attitude that Boys will be Boys. Is it a boy will boys to hurt the girl you supposedly love so you can get your gratification?
Arabess Posted March 1, 2004 Posted March 1, 2004 If you can't live with the porn, and that's certainly your choice, then perhaps this guy isn't the right one for you. One person really can't control someone else....nor should they try. But again, if it is something you can't live with....maybe you'll find that 1 in a 1000 guys who don't at least check out porn once in awhile. ......no, that is NOT a scientific proven percentage.....I'm just GUESSING!!!!.........
moimeme Posted March 1, 2004 Posted March 1, 2004 Having seen far more of these threads than I ever hoped to, I figure the first question any person should ask any other person before dating is 'what is your view on porn'. If the person disagrees with your view, move on. Do not date, speak to, or marry anybody who does not agree with you 100 per cent.
Author P1xie Posted March 1, 2004 Author Posted March 1, 2004 Thank you Errol. I was begining to believe that no man out here understood the concept of "respect and love" I'm not looking for someone who has never looked at porn I'm looking for someone to love and respect me enough to make a small sacrifice if they know it hurts me. I would of sacrificed a lot more than looking at naked girls for him. I guess that's his loss...
guest Posted March 2, 2004 Posted March 2, 2004 Originally posted by UCFKevin HOLY CRAP. Why the hell didn't I think of that?! Well done. sorry, but its not the same.....book has no pictures. porn and playboy=tons of pics
Darkangelism Posted March 2, 2004 Posted March 2, 2004 Porn is a habit, masturbation can be done without it. Habits are not easy to break. There is also no more attachment to porn then most women to shoes. What if he told you that it bothers him that you have too many pairs of shoes and you can only have one pair, could you get rid of all your other shoes and not buy any more shoes, not even go shopping for them? It would be hard, it is the same way with guys and porn. The only surefire way to not have any porn in your life is to leave him go to SF and marry another women.
jenny Posted March 2, 2004 Posted March 2, 2004 guest: how does that disqualify the analogy? make your case.
Darkangelism Posted March 2, 2004 Posted March 2, 2004 Originally posted by guest sorry, but its not the same.....book has no pictures. porn and playboy=tons of pics Pictures don't mean anything. Men are visual creatures. Women are less so and so reading a romance novel does offer similar satisfaction for a women as a picture would for a guy.
Author P1xie Posted March 2, 2004 Author Posted March 2, 2004 I don't think becoming a lesbian is the answer considering there are plenty of women that are into porn and I would not accept either way. I feel that porn can be a great get you by when you don't have someone else or it could be good for a couple who both enjoy it but not when it hurts the other. I never said that I'm anti porn. To each their own but I don't need nor do I want it in my life. I also don't need a man who is willing to sacrifice our whole relationship just for a few moments of pleasure. We could of had a life time of real pleasure, with trust, understanding and love but he chose to have a brief fantasy.
Arabess Posted March 2, 2004 Posted March 2, 2004 I'm not against porn, but I do understand what you are saying P1xie. You want it to be part of your 'shared' relationship.....and I think that's totally fair. Men seem to enjoy their 'little time alone' though. I have no idea why they do. I just know it to be true. I work on a military base and I've YET to see a sailor or contractor locker without pinups!!!! It just seems to make them happy. I really don't think they mean anything negative by it.
guest Posted March 2, 2004 Posted March 2, 2004 Originally posted by jenny guest: how does that disqualify the analogy? make your case. lets say a guy masterbates to porn: he is masterbating to pictures that everyone else can see, can cause jealousy, etc. a girl masterbates to novel: she creates the pictures in her head. no one can see these pictures, ever. she may not even masterbate to a novel- who does that, maybe someone does, but its not as common as porn masterbation. and please no one, dont try to challenge me on that. point being: pictures on paper are set in stone. they hurt way more than pics in the mind. you cant compare pics in the head to pics in playboy, its impossible visually.
UCFKevin Posted March 2, 2004 Posted March 2, 2004 I'd say a woman reading a romance novel would be more emotionally invested, more considered cheating, as if "I want this. THIS is what I want," is what the whole basis of reading it is.
Darkangelism Posted March 2, 2004 Posted March 2, 2004 A picture uses less imagination then a novel. A picture leaves less room for fantasy then a novel.
guest Posted March 2, 2004 Posted March 2, 2004 from my perspective froma girl, i suppose i would rather my bf read a novel and masterbate to that then have some makeup, airbrushed broad be jacked off over by my lover
Darkangelism Posted March 2, 2004 Posted March 2, 2004 He will develop more attachment to the book then to the picture, i have tried reading stories and jacking off, and well the stories have never been erased from my computer but pics come and go.
dyermaker Posted March 2, 2004 Posted March 2, 2004 Some people are looking to be proved right, others are looking to be proved wrong. You're the first, I won't even bother. I deserve a pat on the head.
faux Posted March 2, 2004 Posted March 2, 2004 Originally posted by P1xie Well considering I've never read a romance novel or seen a porn your argument is invalid. I am willing to please him in any way I can even making our own porn. I did not demand that he stopped. He seen it upset me the first time he was caught and I told him that we had different lifestyles and I did not believe trying to change people and we should go our own ways. HE MADE THE DECISION TO PROMISE TO STOP THEN LIED!!! I live with this guy he can get anytime he wants. I gave him stuff to beat off and try to fulfill his every fantasy. I think he is addicted to it. I'm tired of guys with the attitude that Boys will be Boys. Is it a boy will boys to hurt the girl you supposedly love so you can get your gratification? I'm just saying that you are thinking of ending your relationship with this man over the fact that he views pornography. That to me seems completely ridiculous. Even though you say you don't watch pornography, or read romance novels... That isn't the point. My point is that you are trying to change this man. Viewing pornographic images is a very natural thing for a man. Men are stimulated more visually, while women have a greater capacity to weave intricate fantasies in their minds. Additionally, you may not THINK you are demanding him to stop, but you are thinking of ending your relationship over this. You are informing him how horrible his actions make you feel. In every sense you are attempting to force a change in him. Viewing pornographic images is his own private life. This is not something you need to concern yourself with. I say you ought to forget about it. And you have given me further information to prove me correct — You agreed to make pornographic movies with this man, and allowed him to take nude photographs of yourself. You are attempting to control him. You believe that he must look at you and only you. It does not seem that you did this in an attempt to understand why he enjoys what he does. It seems more to me that you did this to attempt to control him and get your way. I really do not see why you would be so upset over this at all. Again, he cannot cheat on you with pornographic images. And it is a fact that no matter what you do on film with this man he is always going to look at other images that don't include you. This doesn't mean he isn't happy with you. He just has an active fantasy life. If he hasn't been unfaithful to you you needn't concern yourself with this at all. Now I can understand if he is watching pornography when you get home from work, leaving his movies and magazines all over the house and making it very obvious. It doesn't seem this way however. When you say "addicted" I read it as "he watches pornographic movies once in a while. I somehow know about this. I do not want him watching them EVER so he is addicted." You cannot always get your way. Let him have his fantasies. He is with you. This really, really isn't something you need to be getting worked up about. I'm thinking there are far deeper issues involving self esteem here. This sounds just like something I went through with a girlfriend of mine last year. She offered to make movies with me, and freaked out that they weren't “good enough” as I still looked at other models on film or print. The important thing to remember here is that nearly ALL men do this. If it is an obsession you must let a licensed professional make that evaluation. I just think you're over-reacting completely here. I put it this way before... When men look at porn they are seeking quick, meaningless physical sexual relief. Would you rather him put the porn away, and come to you at random intervals to say “Honey. Give me oral sex or let me get off on you real quick so I can go back to mowing the grass.”? Masturbating to pornographic images is just physical sexual relief. You mean much more to him than just that. Remember that. Again, he is WITH YOU and NOT with the women in the movies/photographs. I highly recommend seeking counseling to determine if this man really does have a problem, and to come to terms together with what you see as a “problem”.
Author P1xie Posted March 3, 2004 Author Posted March 3, 2004 I am think of ending the relationship due to his dishonesty! If it is so normal then why don’t you have it sitting on your living room table? "Viewing pornographic images is a very natural thing for a man. Men are stimulated more visually" --> Like I said the "Boys will be boys" mentality. Just like if a woman is raped she’s the one on trial for her past sexual relationships and how she was dressed. He couldn’t help it she was wearing too tight of a blouse and too short of a skirt. She was asking for it because a man in incapable of thinking with anything but his **nis I did not demand he stopped. We all make choices I have a right not to want it in my life. He has a right to have it in his life, but sometimes you can’t have your cake and eat it too you have to think of other persons feelings. As for viewing pornographic images in his private life it’s kind of hard when you live together. It’s hard to forget about it when it effects you emotionally. He has a sexual problem when it comes to climaxing. If he fulfills himself with porn then he can not satisfy himself with me the next day which leaves me to feel inadequate. There is more to this than just occasionally looking at porn. As for allowing him to tape me he begged me for 2 years before I agreed to do it using that he needed something to get off with since he knew how I felt about porn. I don’t think that is control I think that is trying to please the person I love. As always it’s the girls fault because she has low self esteem...Ok say I have low self esteem let’s make it even better by making someone feel inadequate about themselves by getting off to other girls. I do not have low self esteem. I just believe that it is cheating if your are thinking, looking and doing the deed whether a photo or in person. What would you do if that person came to life right at the moment would you stop and say no thanks it was just a fantasy I will finish myself off.
jenny Posted March 3, 2004 Posted March 3, 2004 hold on, i think you could have a point, but getting mad will not help. this is a false analogy: "Viewing pornographic images is a very natural thing for a man. Men are stimulated more visually" --> Like I said the "Boys will be boys" mentality. Just like if a woman is raped she’s the one on trial for her past sexual relationships and how she was dressed. rape and viewing pornography are not similar comparisons at all, and as someone who has worked with rape victims, i find this to be a rather alarming analogy. rape, is of, course, a crime with a non-consensual victim whereas pornography features the consensual photographing of persons and the consensual viewing of the consumer. you may see it as criminal, but the law does not, and this kind of hyperbolized thinking weakens your argument. let me suggest something else: it is perfectly legitimate to say: i, pixie, do not want porn in my life. i am prepared to remove anyone in my life who does not believe as i believe. decide this at the onset, and inform all your potentially serious bfs about your decision. be prepared to be rejected, often, but if that's what you believe, then go for it. you will certainly have a lot of people who beleive as you do,; maybe you can find a mate among them. i would be interested to know why you feel so strongly about it, on a personal, biographical, level; you are free to share or not share. i feel that way about privacy, myself. i would not liken invasions of privacy to murder, but they upset me a great deal, and i'm prepared for the consequences of taking a hard line about it. you must be similarly prepared to lose boyfriends about this issue. move on if you cannot change and neither can he. it's a big sea out there, with many different fish with different views on fish pornography.
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