How do I know when I have done all that I can?

[dreamingoftigers]

I have done countless things to try to save my miserable marriage and I find that there is not much reciprocation except that he "tries" (does not actually do) to take me out for date night every now and then.

 

He is explosive, depressing, depressed and has cheated on me in the past as well a had a sex/porn addiction that he is not addressing. Every time it comes up to attending a meeting he "forgets." I don't feel that he has any respect for me, he has told me how unattractive I am to him etc. and insulted everything I have done in the last year to try and build this business. He embarasses me in front of our staff (he recently told me that he has done this because he feels I "took everything over" with the business and treat him like another employee.) In truth he abandoned our family back in March to go on a bender and I kept the whole thing going and grew it into twice the business we had before. When he finally did come home he went back to work fulltime and then wanted to get rid of my full time girl (who really put tons of sweat into this) when he got fired.

 

Even if I had "taken things over" he could very well have talked with me about it and we could have hammered out something agreeable. He constantly screws up on the job, rude with clients, forgetting keys, losing them. I get a complaint AT LEAST once a week.

 

He says he does not trust me, but I do what I say I am going to, except for leaving him.

 

Our marital counselor even seemed to give up. We haven't been back to therapy in a couple of months. He is miserable to live with. I ask him what he wants to change in order to make things better "I dunno."

We go to Thanksgiving dinner at a friend's place and we are going around the table saying what we are thankful for, he is sitting beside our little daughter and his turn comes up. All he says is "PASS."

 

I just feel like there is a whole lot of life to be lived and I am wasting it chained to someone that does not want to be present in his own life and I am scared as hell to have that role-modelled to my daughter. We are in debt up to our asses and he just keeps spending.

 

I have tried reading with him, meetings, therapy, changing how I live and present myself (I still have a weight problem), problem-solving, making agreements (he has never kept even one).

 

The sex (when we do have it) is awful he can't last past a minute and he does maybe 4-5 minutes of foreplay. Yes he'll make sure I orgasm but it is always in a hurry and no cuddling after. He withholds sex sometimes for months.

 

He is a nice Dad though and I don't want to take that away from my daughter. I just wish I had the nice happy easygoing guy back that he was before I caught him cheating. He said laid out our whole marriage to meet my needs, that's why he seemed so happy before. I actually think he was pretty happy before.

 

He used to listen and now he just explodes whenever I look sad. I delved into my work and now he is back and messing up our business.

 

I don't even know where to try to set boundaries because he steamrolls through every single one. How do I know when I can leave with a good conscience? I don't want my daughter to just up and lose her Dad. I think he will become a deadbeat if I leave. I just hate being here with a cheating, lying, miserable man who is destroying our livelihood.

[PortuguesePrincess80]

Wow..where do I even start with this one? First off your H sounds extremely immature...and really doesnt care for anyone but himself! How do you say he's a good dad? What does he do that gives him credit in that regard?

 

Please don't tell me your staying for your daughter..because everyone knows its better to come from a broken home then live in one.

 

I know your feelings on the whole cheating aspect..as I am a fbs as well. But it doesnt sound like your husband is remorseful at all..and it just seems to be convenient to be with you at this point. Please be more aggressive with this situation...instead of being sad! Get mad...throw him out...let him realize what a turd he's being to you and your daughter...sheesh to EVERYONE!!!!

 

Sometimes people like this really need to hit the bottom to realize they arent the only ones in the world. But it scares me to think that you are sort of enabling him to be this way when your feeling sorry for yourself...and him?

 

Gosh I can only imagine what your friends and family think about him...and you at this point. I seriously feel for you daughter the most though..this relationship just seems impossible!

[Fuzzy Dunlop]

It's time for you to talk to a lawyer. You should not keep yourself and your daughter trapped in a loveless, nightmarish marriage. You have done what you can and it is obvious that your H is not interested in repairing this marriage. Please see an attorney so that you can protect your interest in your shared business. You can work out a fair agreement in regards to custody and visitation. But please don't keep subjecting yourself to this and thinking you have to stay because of your child -- model a healthy relationship for her, okay? Not this one.

 

Good luck.

[amy12344]

This marriage sounds pretty done to me. You don't mention if you love him or how long you've been married.

 

He cheats, he lies, he insults you. He is a "nice" dad? What does that mean. Anyone can be nice. Is is actively involved? Bottles, diapers, walks in the stroller? He can still be a dad if you two are separated.

 

What other reasons are keeping you in this misery?

[dreamingoftigers]

Wow..where do I even start with this one? First off your H sounds extremely immature...and really doesnt care for anyone but himself! How do you say he's a good dad? What does he do that gives him credit in that regard?

 

Please don't tell me your staying for your daughter..because everyone knows its better to come from a broken home then live in one.

 

I know your feelings on the whole cheating aspect..as I am a fbs as well. But it doesnt sound like your husband is remorseful at all..and it just seems to be convenient to be with you at this point. Please be more aggressive with this situation...instead of being sad! Get mad...throw him out...let him realize what a turd he's being to you and your daughter...sheesh to EVERYONE!!!!

 

Sometimes people like this really need to hit the bottom to realize they arent the only ones in the world. But it scares me to think that you are sort of enabling him to be this way when your feeling sorry for yourself...and him?

 

Gosh I can only imagine what your friends and family think about him...and you at this point. I seriously feel for you daughter the most though..this relationship just seems impossible!

 

Yes he has told me that one of the reasons he stays is that he is comfortable with the life we have set up.

 

I find it it hard to get mad at someone if say they pissed you off 100% and now they only piss you off 80%. It just seems weird to dump them now instead of when they were at their worst. I even have massive trouble letting go of unproductive employees, even when they impact our margins.

 

I am sure everyone thinks that I am weak for staying with him, but I find it actually takes a great deal of strength and self-control to not lash out at him day to day, especially when he is lashing out at me.

[dreamingoftigers]

It's time for you to talk to a lawyer. You should not keep yourself and your daughter trapped in a loveless, nightmarish marriage. You have done what you can and it is obvious that your H is not interested in repairing this marriage. Please see an attorney so that you can protect your interest in your shared business. You can work out a fair agreement in regards to custody and visitation. But please don't keep subjecting yourself to this and thinking you have to stay because of your child -- model a healthy relationship for her, okay? Not this one.

 

Good luck.

 

Thank you for your encouragement. I am not interested in finding another relationship... ever. This one has totally put me off of exposing myself in any intimate and trust scenario for good.

[hopesndreams]

I just hate being here with a cheating, lying, miserable man who is destroying our livelihood.

 

Please get out of this sham of a M. It turns my stomach how you and your child are living.

[dreamingoftigers]

This marriage sounds pretty done to me. You don't mention if you love him or how long you've been married.

 

He cheats, he lies, he insults you. He is a "nice" dad? What does that mean. Anyone can be nice. Is is actively involved? Bottles, diapers, walks in the stroller? He can still be a dad if you two are separated.

 

What other reasons are keeping you in this misery?

 

We have been together 5 years, married 4. I loved him so purely and naively for years. I would have followed him anywhere and he has totally thrown that away over and over. I am not sure that I love him anymore. I know when I was writing about our relationship in my journal that I mostly hated him for the way he treated me while I was pregnant.

 

He is an active Dad. He even makes all of her baby food with free range and organic foods. He gets up with her, cuddles her, plays with her and you can tell that they love each other very much. They are very happy together and he really cherishes her. The happiest memories I have are of the two of them. (She looks just like him and it is really precious).

 

I feel like I would be breaking two hearts if he became a "weekend" father.

 

And I always feel that he isn't treating me as terribly as my father (who is a narcissist and I swear possibly some kind of sociopath) treated me so I feel like I can take it and maybe over time things will get better.

 

The sad part is I watched my mother go through the same pattern with my father and he is only just starting to get better after he was caught having an affair and he got scared that she wanted him gone. He acted like he wanted to throw her away, but the price tag was too high and they have been together 35 years and he kept freaking about her ending up with another guy (because he couldn't control her then).

 

But I really don't want to wait 20 years for things to "start to get better"

[SoConfusledandHurt]

OMG woman...do you need to get hit over the head with something to wake up. Sorry if that sounded harsh (Im in a bad mood today lol) but come on girl. He said "pass" at the table...how horrible. Let him go be on his own! Let him make himself miserable! Seriously I puked in my mouth when I read that comment! What a jerk!

[amy12344]

He is an active Dad. He even makes all of her baby food with free range and organic foods. He gets up with her, cuddles her, plays with her and you can tell that they love each other very much.

I feel like I would be breaking two hearts if he became a "weekend" father.

 

And I always feel that he isn't treating me as terribly as my father (who is a narcissist and I swear possibly some kind of sociopath) treated me so I feel like I can take it and maybe over time things will get better.

 

The sad part is I watched my mother go through the same pattern with my father

But I really don't want to wait 20 years for things to "start to get better"

 

 

Ok so he cuddles and feeds the baby. Good. As he should. You say you feel like you would be breaking your daughter and husband's hearts if you separated. WHAT ABOUT YOUR HEART, RIGHT NOW. Does IT not matter???? It's in pieces. And it won't mend in a relationship like this.

 

Your daughter is young. Kids are resiliant, she'll be FINE. And it sounds as if your husband could not care less to be with your or not. Sorry, not trying to be mean, but he treats you like garbage.

 

And forget about any comparisons to your parents - this is YOUR life. Are you prepared to make some tough decisions in order to improve it?

[dreamingoftigers]

I have told my husband today that I will not live in a negative environment like this anymore.

 

I have told him that he has two choices: attend his meeting tomorrow or pack up and leave. He has told me that he will attend his meeting.

 

I also told him that if I don't see some significant recovery effort and a sharp change in his attitude towards me that we will not stay together. I brought up the Thanksgiving thing as well.

 

He told me that he is very uncomfortable in public and that being put on the spot like that + he views the other people at the table to be pretty phony for that occasion + he was in a really bad mood was the reason he said "pass." I think it is just another justification to be negative and withholding of joy.

 

I know that there is a lot of life to live and that I have invested a considerable amount of patience in this relationship.

 

He also told me that I seemed very enthusiastic to tell him to pack his bags and that I am just trying to get rid of him. It actually made me laugh inside. I told him very clearly that if I had just wanted to get rid of him, I already have the grounds to do so and feel no need to seek any further justification. I was giving him the final option to do the right thing by his family and have the chance to repair some of this before he regrets it. It seemed to turn him around a bit.

 

But I am not waiting on his miraculous change to occur, I am making preparations to go into a stable living situation without him because he has not demonstrated that I can trust him.

 

I have been reading about optimism etc. lately and have been exercising my courage, confidence and self-trust muscles lately and i believe the results are starting to pay off in my business. (Better boundaries with clients, I am not willing to lose money on people that are just trying to take advantage of the situation). I am sure that it will pay off in my personal life as well. And with my daughter.

 

I go forward onto my future!!

[dreamingoftigers]

So today he did some recovery work and discovered about himself that he feels everyone around him is "incompetent" or the equivalent of it.

 

He made the realization that it could not simply be that everyone around him was incompetent but that he expected perfection out of them and was disappointed in them when he didn't see it.

 

He also came to the conclusion that he wasn't perfect either. He is very unforgiving of himself as well.

 

Actually I found this funny because often-times he is the weakest member of our team (although everyone has had a turn at that) (he is definitely the least patient).

 

He did go to his meeting and is on his way back.

 

I have drafted what I will consider to be the minimum expectations of what he will need to provide to continue to be part of this relationship. I am willing to match whatever he puts in. If he doesn't want to do it then fine, he doesn't have to be here. I am not his mother (God, am I ever not.) and I will not nag him or coddle him anymore about the adult responsibilities he should be embracing.

[BB07]

Since you two have a business together, you need to go ahead and take steps NOW to protect your interest in it.

[dreamingoftigers]

It doesn't make that much, it's a big headache business and honestly I could rebuild fairly easily with the staff and I know the clients all personally.

 

He can have whatever he can get and maintain out of it. I could use the break LOL

[nycgirl6]

When I knew I wasn't going to have the strength alone to make a decision about whether to leave my marriage or not, I joined a support group. I went in not being sure where it would lead, and it ended up helping me get out of my marriage. That was 10 years ago, and I don't regret the decision I made.

[dreamingoftigers]

I will be headed back to S-Anon this week

[You Go Girl]

I've followed your story (although not all your posts) for the last year, dreamingoftigers.

You do have to draw the boundary lines. When is more of the same different? Never.

[dreamingoftigers]

I have finally gotten really sick of living like this, my kid is starting to talk and I know that she will be picking up on the tone around here and starting to make little neurological connections that will set the tone for the rest of her life. We both need to shape up, or it will be just me shaping up by myself because I don't need a massive drain on my energy.

[Holding-On]

Look, if you still want to leave the door open (not divorce yet) why don't you just separate and let him do the work to get you back (or not and you will have your answer). Simply MOVE on and out and start another business without him. Tell him your conditions prior to getting back together (e.g. 1. be on the wagon x months. 2. have attended x counselling sessions or whatever) and explain that you are done being treated this way and it is up to him to deal with his problems. You have enough to deal with being a mom and a breadwinner.

 

If he is such a concerned father, he WILL make a great deal of effort to hang out with his daughter so she will still see him. It will only be harder later to get your daughter to adjust. Children generally are MORE upset if their parents are fighting than if their parents are mad at them or spending every second with them. Also IF you feel he is a safe parent, and he is underemployed, you do not have to force him to weekends only if your daughter is not in school yet.

 

good luck to you.

A break might be good for everyone. It will certainly be good for you.

[dreamingoftigers]

It's a good idea. Our therapist has suggested a healing seperation in the past. At first I thought that it would kill our relationship, then I warmed to the idea thinking that if we didn't love each other enough to heal then we shouldn't be together anyways. Later my husband turned down the idea because he figured it would be the end of us by my choice. We have bounced the idea back and forth. It isn't practical with the money issues we have been having, but with one of us out of the business, it may be feasable. I am meeting with our marketing fellow to help me start a new business on Wednesday.

 

We usually go through a major down and then an upswing like the last day or so where things calm down and start to look hopeful. But it never stays. I really think if my EMDR therapy continues that I would be much better off and able to make a healthier decision.

[Spark1111]

DOT....

 

Spends money like crazy, has affairs, poor impulse control, porn addiction, blames you for way too much, needless arguments with others, frequent angry outburts =manic

 

Grumpy, hyper-critical of others, sleeps a lot, cannot complete a task, at times, downright mean =depressive.

 

Is your husband undiagnosed manic/depressive which today is called bi-polar?

 

That is a very difficult diagnosis to make, and even more difficult to treat. Regular anti-depressents are not reccommended.

 

In between the two extremes is stasis: Kinder, calmer, almost happy, creative, in control.

 

Is that the man you fell in love with?

 

Cycling between the two poles can be anywhere from minutes, to months to years.

 

Has he ever been checked out for this disorder? Because so much that you describe sounds a lot like someone suffering from the disorder. Usually, they will only seek medical attention when in the depressive phase and docs are quick to throw anti-depressents at them.

 

But that robs them of experiencing stasis, their best self, and they do not stay on them long.

 

Just wondering.....

[dreamingoftigers]

DOT....

 

Spends money like crazy, has affairs, poor impulse control, porn addiction, blames you for way too much, needless arguments with others, frequent angry outburts =manic

 

Grumpy, hyper-critical of others, sleeps a lot, cannot complete a task, at times, downright mean =depressive.

 

Is your husband undiagnosed manic/depressive which today is called bi-polar?

 

That is a very difficult diagnosis to make, and even more difficult to treat. Regular anti-depressents are not reccommended.

 

In between the two extremes is stasis: Kinder, calmer, almost happy, creative, in control.

 

Is that the man you fell in love with?

 

Cycling between the two poles can be anywhere from minutes, to months to years.

 

Has he ever been checked out for this disorder? Because so much that you describe sounds a lot like someone suffering from the disorder. Usually, they will only seek medical attention when in the depressive phase and docs are quick to throw anti-depressents at them.

 

But that robs them of experiencing stasis, their best self, and they do not stay on them long.

 

Just wondering.....

 

No he's not manic from what our therapists have told us. We went to one in Ottawa before we moved, then one regular MC here and then one church counselor before we found someone that deals in sexual addiction.

 

Thanks for the thought.

[kuma]

I have drafted what I will consider to be the minimum expectations of what he will need to provide to continue to be part of this relationship. I am willing to match whatever he puts in.

 

dreaming, he might meet your minimum expectations/needs. BUT you deserve better. You're not weak. You're taking care of your business AND your baby. You should be proud of yourself. It's time to think about your own happiness. ((hugs))

[dreamingoftigers]

I dated an ex who was manic, not the same, he was actually a pretty fun guy, he had a twin brother with the same problem and a couple of times a year they'd both end up in the hospital.

 

Very strange, and then he came out of the closet, then a couple of years after his brother did too.

 

The funny thing was the family helped me convert to Mormonism. One of the bunch just ran for Alderman of our ward during the city election here.

 

Nah, my husband just doesn't show the same traits anyways. He has been told that he has ADD and that is often linked with addiction.

[standingtall]

Is ther anything u even like about this guy still?

 

U can probably trip over a better guy.