Author Too Much Posted November 6, 2010 Author Posted November 6, 2010 OMG! This is so not dead and over unless you let it be. My husband and I had this conversation so many times. (different circumstances, I did not have an EA) I truly wish that you could take a step back from this and see the forest instead of the stupid fantasy-journal trees! When my marriage has sucked (and oh has it sucked!) somehow instinctually I develop a minor attraction to whatever male is close in proximity (not proud of this, but thought this may help). This past year during times of high duress I developed attractions for: the 19 year old that lived in the basement who has a stutter and could never pay his utility bill, the brother-in-law that lived in my next door neighbours basement who has eyebrows like a neanderthal and could never hold down a job and quit drinking, the Hoarder whose house we cleaned out who ended up moving to Australia. There was mutual attraction on that last one. Now NONE OF THESE DID I EVER ACT ON. They were ridiculous, every single one of them! In fact the last one I made damn sure that I limited my contact with him. As well, it was so obvious that my husband actually noticed it (very embarassing) asked me about it, and we discussed it. I have always been dedicated to fixing our relationship but when it got too rough, instinct kicked in looking for the way out. That doesn't mean I was EVER going to follow it. EVER. It sounds like your wife was trying to articulate the feelings she has and wants to have in a relationship. Since your relationship appears to be a source of pain for her, she outsourced it. Not directly. Not through EA (I'll bet you a lifetime supply of Snicker's bars that the idiot ex doesn't even know she has those feeling for him) and PA, but through journalling it, which is actually probably stinking healthy given the circumstances. I also started to miss my ex, a lot in fact. Until.... I realized that he wasn't what I was looking for either, I did feel like we really knew each other etc. but what I was missing was the feeling of connectedness that came when he and I were in a strong relationship. That died because I was emotionally screwed-up and he was a conflict-avoidant liar. It wasn't lasting or real. Do you really think your wife's high school ex has anything that can stack up against your 18 years of history? I know it hurts, like hell in fact. I know what that is like seeing your partner write to others what you have always wanted to hear. But that does not mean game over. It means you are out in the woods without a compass. Why should you take responsibility for getting the damn marriage back on track? Because you've got kids and a family. Marriage is not a protection against stupid. Stupid of her to go toying around with those feelings, but if the relationship was pretty cloudy then it would have been the next-door neighbour or the box boy at Walmart. We see it here on loveshack all the time. Chances are that if the high-school ex heard about her wanting his mind, body and soul that he would be like "wtf, I am married, just had a baby and I haven't seen u in 20 years, you are a psycho! If he has half of a brain anyways. So why you? Because you are the only one there that has enough of a brain to figure out that it is temporary bs compared to 18 years of marriage. It is like having one spouse leave the milk out on the counter and the other one say "why should I have to put it away?" Well no you shouldn't, but it is just going to go bad and spoil and stink up the whole damn house if you don't. Imagine what one container of milk left out will be like compared with the breakup of a marriage. And yes, your kids will have issues over it, I am floored when people act like everything is fine after. My niece went through hell over her parents divorce and they were about as amicable as possible about it. Spend the 6 months to a year making your home a happy one, spend that time making yourself a happy, emotionally healthy husband. I stayed at first for my daughter and I don't regret it for one second. I would point-blank say to this woman: "You know what, I know that you have these feelings, it sucks to hear that. But I know that I am going to be a happy healthy partner in the next six months to a year and that we have one hell of a history. I am going to do "x," "y" and "z." (One of these should be independent and/or marital counseling). And you know what, I am going to screw up, I am going to forget sometimes, but I am going to get x, y & z done so that we can have a happy marriage. If you don't want that, that is fine, but I am going to do x, y and z anyways. If you want to go, you can go. But I am going to stay and make this as happy as possible. You can help if you want." Say that your boundary is no more contact with the ex. If she wants to keep contacting him, she has to leave the marital home. That's it, that's all. She wants to be happy, why would anyone leave a happy home? you don't trust her, I get that, trust can be rebuilt though. Usually when these things happen both partners don't trust each other. Usually the one looking towards the outside does not trust that the other one will even make an attempt to meet their emotional needs. Sounds like she could use some time off from the family business. You lay out the terms and describe what you are going to do to help things, if you need some help figuring out what it is you should be doing, go to a counselor. Take it from someone who has been through hell and high-water to save their marriage, you can recover it, and it can feel pretty damn good, even if you married an idiot. Yes there was infidelity in my marriage and not on my part. Take pride in your marriage and be able to say if it fails that when the going got rough you didn't just let it fall to pieces: You grabbed some balls and made damn sure this thing was finished before you walked away. Good luck friend. You got a raw deal but this looks far from over. If she wants the marriage over, let it be her damn problem. Wow...talk about an eye opener!! I can't thank you enough for this post Dreamingoftigers. How do you reconcile your message with her statement she doesn't want to work things out, that it is too late and she wants the divorce? She refuses to talk about it and is talking to her counselor.
dreamingoftigers Posted November 6, 2010 Posted November 6, 2010 Wow...talk about an eye opener!! I can't thank you enough for this post Dreamingoftigers. How do you reconcile your message with her statement she doesn't want to work things out, that it is too late and she wants the divorce? She refuses to talk about it and is talking to her counselor. The marriage as it is... no she doesn't want that. I am sure you don't either. So make a new environment and don't give up on it even when she does. Worst case scenario, she divorces you anyways and you have a happier environment for you kids and any potential partner in the future. You have nothing to lose at this point anyways. I do some marketing and you can sit and do nothing (same product and service) or you can offer the new and improved product and service (not everyone will buy but those that do will probably be more satisfied). Jeez that was the worst LS analogy I have ever come up with. She may say she wants a divorce, and that is big. But what she seems to say is "it looks like we are headed for a divorce and that is sad." It is sad. She also isn't polarized or has enough strength to set down the divorce yet. It also seems like you guys are still pretty emotionally tied in, just feeling defeated. Somewhere in there, you have got to dig up some energy to build something for yourself, even if she doesn't want to come along. Most of the time though people are attracted to positive energy and you have a lot of years of history to reach from. You know where she likes to be rubbed on her back, you remember your children being born. Btw do you have family pics up around the house? Let her make her choices, but she isn't entirely committed to the divorce and if you commit to the marriage, you might have a chance to pull it out of the gutter.
tojaz Posted November 6, 2010 Posted November 6, 2010 omg! This is so not dead and over unless you let it be. My husband and i had this conversation so many times. (different circumstances, i did not have an ea) i truly wish that you could take a step back from this and see the forest instead of the stupid fantasy-journal trees! when my marriage has sucked (and oh has it sucked!) somehow instinctually i develop a minor attraction to whatever male is close in proximity (not proud of this, but thought this may help). This past year during times of high duress i developed attractions for: The 19 year old that lived in the basement who has a stutter and could never pay his utility bill, the brother-in-law that lived in my next door neighbours basement who has eyebrows like a neanderthal and could never hold down a job and quit drinking, the hoarder whose house we cleaned out who ended up moving to australia. There was mutual attraction on that last one. Now none of these did i ever act on. they were ridiculous, every single one of them! In fact the last one i made damn sure that i limited my contact with him. As well, it was so obvious that my husband actually noticed it (very embarassing) asked me about it, and we discussed it. I have always been dedicated to fixing our relationship but when it got too rough, instinct kicked in looking for the way out. That doesn't mean i was ever going to follow it. Ever. It sounds like your wife was trying to articulate the feelings she has and wants to have in a relationship. Since your relationship appears to be a source of pain for her, she outsourced it. Not directly. Not through ea (i'll bet you a lifetime supply of snicker's bars that the idiot ex doesn't even know she has those feeling for him) and pa, but through journalling it, which is actually probably stinking healthy given the circumstances. I also started to miss my ex, a lot in fact. Until.... I realized that he wasn't what i was looking for either, i did feel like we really knew each other etc. But what i was missing was the feeling of connectedness that came when he and i were in a strong relationship. that died because i was emotionally screwed-up and he was a conflict-avoidant liar. It wasn't lasting or real. do you really think your wife's high school ex has anything that can stack up against your 18 years of history? i know it hurts, like hell in fact. i know what that is like seeing your partner write to others what you have always wanted to hear. But that does not mean game over. It means you are out in the woods without a compass. Why should you take responsibility for getting the damn marriage back on track? Because you've got kids and a family. Marriage is not a protection against stupid. Stupid of her to go toying around with those feelings, but if the relationship was pretty cloudy then it would have been the next-door neighbour or the box boy at walmart. We see it here on loveshack all the time. chances are that if the high-school ex heard about her wanting his mind, body and soul that he would be like "wtf, i am married, just had a baby and i haven't seen u in 20 years, you are a psycho! if he has half of a brain anyways. So why you? Because you are the only one there that has enough of a brain to figure out that it is temporary bs compared to 18 years of marriage. It is like having one spouse leave the milk out on the counter and the other one say "why should i have to put it away?" well no you shouldn't, but it is just going to go bad and spoil and stink up the whole damn house if you don't. Imagine what one container of milk left out will be like compared with the breakup of a marriage. and yes, your kids will have issues over it, i am floored when people act like everything is fine after. My niece went through hell over her parents divorce and they were about as amicable as possible about it. Spend the 6 months to a year making your home a happy one, spend that time making yourself a happy, emotionally healthy husband. I stayed at first for my daughter and i don't regret it for one second. I would point-blank say to this woman: "you know what, i know that you have these feelings, it sucks to hear that. But i know that i am going to be a happy healthy partner in the next six months to a year and that we have one hell of a history. I am going to do "x," "y" and "z." (one of these should be independent and/or marital counseling). And you know what, i am going to screw up, i am going to forget sometimes, but i am going to get x, y & z done so that we can have a happy marriage. If you don't want that, that is fine, but i am going to do x, y and z anyways. If you want to go, you can go. But i am going to stay and make this as happy as possible. You can help if you want." say that your boundary is no more contact with the ex. If she wants to keep contacting him, she has to leave the marital home. That's it, that's all. She wants to be happy, why would anyone leave a happy home? You don't trust her, i get that, trust can be rebuilt though. Usually when these things happen both partners don't trust each other. Usually the one looking towards the outside does not trust that the other one will even make an attempt to meet their emotional needs. Sounds like she could use some time off from the family business. You lay out the terms and describe what you are going to do to help things, if you need some help figuring out what it is you should be doing, go to a counselor. Take it from someone who has been through hell and high-water to save their marriage, you can recover it, and it can feel pretty damn good, even if you married an idiot. yes there was infidelity in my marriage and not on my part. take pride in your marriage and be able to say if it fails that when the going got rough you didn't just let it fall to pieces: you grabbed some balls and made damn sure this thing was finished before you walked away. good luck friend. You got a raw deal but this looks far from over. If she wants the marriage over, let it be her damn problem. bravo!!!!!!!! D.o.t
You Go Girl Posted November 6, 2010 Posted November 6, 2010 (edited) Any woman who is so far gone that she's romanticizing some 20 year old relationship ex that just had a baby with his wife is in no condition to be contemplating divorce. Way left field. Which means there's plenty of room for hope that she will come to her senses too. Or..she's lost it and needs to be institutionalized. Sorry if that sounds crass, but you get what I mean. It's just so unrealistic! Her head's in the clouds. Armed with that info, how can you pull her back to reality, toomuch? Edited November 6, 2010 by You Go Girl
dreamingoftigers Posted November 9, 2010 Posted November 9, 2010 So how is it going? Foound that extra energy yet?
trippi1432 Posted November 9, 2010 Posted November 9, 2010 DOT!! You Rock!! :) Too Much - any updates?
trippi1432 Posted November 9, 2010 Posted November 9, 2010 Hmm, not sure...you should be able to. Have you tried before?
Author Too Much Posted November 9, 2010 Author Posted November 9, 2010 DOT!! You Rock!! :) Too Much - any updates? Trippi, at this time, we have been continuing LC (conversations only related to kids and business). This has been ongoing since the beginning of this thread. I want to talk to her, but I'm afraid she will respond just as she did the last time we talked, saying we should proceed to divorce and how she has been unahppy in the marriage the whole time (one month before all of this happened, she told me she connected with one of her old H.S. friends, found out her friend was divorced and realized how fortunate she was to be married) Her big gripe in the marriage is that she feels by working in the business with me, she has lost her sense of freedom to do what she wants for her career. She also has said the flame of our relationship has gone out in her heart. She is seeing a counselor. Her mother will be moving in with us next week to "help" her, as she looks for a new job and move in the direction of divorce. I am really lost. These past several days have been difficult though I am thankful for all of the wonderful insights given by others. I just don't know how to get to a point of having a discussion with her about our issues since it seems we tried that the last time and it didn't go too well. I'm in limbo.
trippi1432 Posted November 9, 2010 Posted November 9, 2010 Too Much - this is what you report each time...complacency is limbo. Aside from talking to her, what have you accomplished?
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