pandagirl Posted October 15, 2010 Posted October 15, 2010 I just hung out with a guy I dated a couple of summers ago. Nice guy, but completely NOT boyfriend material. We were talking about our love lives, and he hasn't had a real relationship in three years. However, he has a very active dating life. He will date women anywhere from 5-9 months with absolutely no label on the relationship. Because I dated him, I know he goes through all the motions of being a boyfriend: presents, being sweet, cooking dinner, weekend trips. But he is never emotionally invested in any of these relationships, which is pretty mind boggling for me. He says he likes these women, but never saw a future with any of them, yet was happy to just date them for the time being. I find this incredibly odd. Wouldn't most people jump ship after a few months of dating if there wasn't anything more developing? But this goes in line with what a lot of guys have told me: dating girls for a good amount of time (anywhere from one to five years), without any intentions of moving towards a more serious relationship.
TouchedByViolet Posted October 15, 2010 Posted October 15, 2010 Well these guys you speak of care called players. The reason they do what they do is because it WORKS. Women let these guys play them.
eerie_reverie Posted October 15, 2010 Posted October 15, 2010 In my experience, guys can be completely comfortable with this scenario, while most women want the relationship to progress. Many guys I know have dumped girls they would have been happy to continue to date in leiu of proposing, without so much as an afterthought. It boggles my mind, too.
djhall Posted October 15, 2010 Posted October 15, 2010 How long can you go? Lets see.... nine, going on ten years.
eerie_reverie Posted October 15, 2010 Posted October 15, 2010 Well these guys you speak of care called players. The reason they do what they do is because it WORKS. Women let these guys play them. I don't think thats the right interpretation. The guys I have in mind can happily commit to being monogamous, spending weekends together, even living together. But they are not emotionally invested, and they don't commit to making it work. To me player implies a level of deception as well as a desire to use women for sex. I don't think these elements necessarily come into play in the type of relationship panda and I are talking about.
Author pandagirl Posted October 15, 2010 Author Posted October 15, 2010 In my experience, guys can be completely comfortable with this scenario, while most women want the relationship to progress. Many guys I know have dumped girls they would have been happy to continue to date in leiu of proposing, without so much as an afterthought. It boggles my mind, too. I know! My friend broke up with her boyfriend of FIVE years who she lived with, because she started to ask questions about the future, and he admitted he had no intention of marrying her, but yet still wanted to be with her. So, she was basically forced to breakup with him. He said he was just taking the relationship "day by day." ?????
eerie_reverie Posted October 15, 2010 Posted October 15, 2010 I know! My friend broke up with her boyfriend of FIVE years who she lived with, because she started to ask questions about the future, and he admitted he had no intention of marrying her, but yet still wanted to be with her. So, she was basically forced to breakup with him. He said he was just taking the relationship "day by day." ????? Yup. One of my close male friends played the bf in this exact scenario a couple of weeks ago. He began casually sleeping with another girl the next night. I was like... wtf???? I must admit that I've played the casual gf role without intending to, a couple of times as well. Those questions (where do you see this going) can be very difficult to ask. Sometime's it's tempting to just go with the flow, interpreting boyfriendly actions as a desire for a relationship, when you know in your gut something's off.
Author pandagirl Posted October 15, 2010 Author Posted October 15, 2010 How long can you go? Lets see.... nine, going on ten years. Really?? You've dated your girlfriend for nine years, and you don't know if you want to marry her?
Author pandagirl Posted October 15, 2010 Author Posted October 15, 2010 I must admit that I've played the casual gf role without intending to, a couple of times as well. Those questions (where do you see this going) can be very difficult to ask. Sometime's it's tempting to just go with the flow, interpreting boyfriendly actions as a desire for a relationship, when you know in your gut something's off. Fair enough, but how long can you really date someone in this situation? I can see 6-12 months, but any longer and I would start to feel really uncomfortable.
djhall Posted October 15, 2010 Posted October 15, 2010 Really?? You've dated your girlfriend for nine years, and you don't know if you want to marry her? No, at the time we started dating she knew I didn't want to marry and she wasn't looking for a marriage partner either. I know that has changed somewhat for her in the past few years... I think we went from being on the same page to being one of those couples you are describing.
TouchedByViolet Posted October 15, 2010 Posted October 15, 2010 I don't think thats the right interpretation. The guys I have in mind can happily commit to being monogamous, spending weekends together, even living together. But they are not emotionally invested, and they don't commit to making it work. To me player implies a level of deception as well as a desire to use women for sex. I don't think these elements necessarily come into play in the type of relationship panda and I are talking about. Yeah, I think you are actually more right with your definition. However, I still think the women let this happen to them. The guys I have seen behave in this way showed no emotional commitment to their gf's and usually thought about finding someone else. I know a guy like this at work, and I guess he stays in it for the sex and companionship is all. He has no plans of marrying the girl and in his eyes she doesn't bring anything to the relationship he wants other than someone to bang and talk to on occasion.
Author pandagirl Posted October 15, 2010 Author Posted October 15, 2010 Yeah, I think you are actually more right with your definition. However, I still think the women let this happen to them. The guys I have seen behave in this way showed no emotional commitment to their gf's and usually thought about finding someone else. I know a guy like this at work, and I guess he stays in it for the sex and companionship is all. He has no plans of marrying the girl and in his eyes she doesn't bring anything to the relationship he wants other than someone to bang and talk to on occasion. How old is he, and how long have they been dating? I ask because I think when you are younger, these sort of relationships are more excusable because you never really think about the future THAT much when you're in your early 20s or so. But into your late 20 and early 30s, I would assume people would start viewing relationships as a more long-term commitment.
yah Posted October 15, 2010 Posted October 15, 2010 Not very long. Why get myself attached to someone without knowing if he has the same intentions? With my SO now, after 3 weeks I didn't want to wait any longer to establish exclusivity. So I asked him. He looked at me like I was crazy. He thought we were already BF/GF after the few first dates.
Katherineos123 Posted October 15, 2010 Posted October 15, 2010 Im currently seeing a guy that Ive been dating since March, 6 + months, and I dont declare him my boyfriend. I believe generally speaking, you're right Eerie, that it is more often than not, the women who are the ones wanting something more committed/meaningful. But I do find it amusing that this whole thread, not one person has brought up the idea of both participants being on the same page... Or even rarer, the man being the one hoping for the relationship to progress. In my current situation, there is a hurdle of proximal distance that keeps us (mostly me) emotionally distant... He's the one who would like things to be a little more serious. Or perhaps, assuming that at the very least, exclusivity has been established, the couple is on the same page when it comes to marriage and/or labeling... That if it looks like a boyfriend, acts like a boyfriend, smells like a boyfriend... Its a boyfriend.
TouchedByViolet Posted October 15, 2010 Posted October 15, 2010 How old is he, and how long have they been dating? I ask because I think when you are younger, these sort of relationships are more excusable because you never really think about the future THAT much when you're in your early 20s or so. But into your late 20 and early 30s, I would assume people would start viewing relationships as a more long-term commitment. I am 23 and I personally think of the future quite a bit. This guy is in his late 50s and has been with his gf for about 2 years. His gf wants to get married and he tells her she can go find a guy to get married but it isn't going to be him. He doesn't plan on ever getting married again after 2 divorces. He says all he wants in life is to take care of his mom's house, work on his garden/yard and play with his dog. It's hard to generalize this behavior but as a rule of thumb if someone doesn't show emotional investment in a relationship after a month or so of dating that should be a huge indication of how they view the relationship.
SilentVoice Posted October 15, 2010 Posted October 15, 2010 At the stage I am in life. The longer we go with out labels the better.Then again I think I have commitment phoebe. I don't mean I will go out and cheat on a guy, I have no intention of sleeping with more than one guy at a time. But I rather the labels stay to a minimum. That is just me though
carhill Posted October 15, 2010 Posted October 15, 2010 To me, such circumstances and/or conflicts apparently result from 'go with the flow' communication and intimacy styles. People either aren't communicating clearly or aren't acting on what they say and hear. Personally, women have tended to ask me early on in the dating process what my perspective on relationships is. I tell them, word for word, 'I liked being married'. It doesn't get more clear than that. That doesn't mean that I would consider marrying them; it means that I have progressed a LTR to marriage, enjoyed and valued the dynamic, even if my ex and I turned out to be incompatible, and look forward to progressing a LTR there again. It's intent, clearly communicated. If they are only looking for a casual dating dynamic, they know it won't be with me. I can't imagine dating, falling in love and emotionally investing in someone with no clear roadmap, or as the OP put it, 'label'. Good on those folks who can. Hope my ex becomes one of them. After three marriages, and complaining about all of them, I think she needs to hang it up and just stay casual and uncommitted. I hear the market for that is big these days. Good luck BTW, I think it's perfectly reasonable for someone to change their mind, like wanting casual at the beginning and then later wanting more committment, or the reverse. At that moment, when feelings change, is when the relationship should be renegotiated by clear communication. If no joy, move on, without prejudice.
Mellisa Posted October 15, 2010 Posted October 15, 2010 I just hung out with a guy I dated a couple of summers ago. Nice guy, but completely NOT boyfriend material. We were talking about our love lives, and he hasn't had a real relationship in three years. However, he has a very active dating life. He will date women anywhere from 5-9 months with absolutely no label on the relationship. Because I dated him, I know he goes through all the motions of being a boyfriend: presents, being sweet, cooking dinner, weekend trips. But he is never emotionally invested in any of these relationships, which is pretty mind boggling for me. He says he likes these women, but never saw a future with any of them, yet was happy to just date them for the time being. I find this incredibly odd. Wouldn't most people jump ship after a few months of dating if there wasn't anything more developing? But this goes in line with what a lot of guys have told me: dating girls for a good amount of time (anywhere from one to five years), without any intentions of moving towards a more serious relationship. Well, he dosent sound like a bad dating material hehe...I think it all depends on what you want. Do you want a serious future or just have fun and enjoy the time being? You have to be honest with yourself on that first.Are you seeing other guys as well?If it really bothers you, should maybe tactfully probe a few questions casually and get the signs.But be careful not to get too attached in this case...
eerie_reverie Posted October 15, 2010 Posted October 15, 2010 Fair enough, but how long can you really date someone in this situation? I can see 6-12 months, but any longer and I would start to feel really uncomfortable. For me, it was about 9-10 months. I was never that emotionally invested either, probably because in my gut I knew he was just playing a role. I liked him tho, loved spending time with him, saw potential there as far as both our feelings went, so I kept giving it time. The breaking point came when on top of the lack of emotional availability, he stopped spending time with me. At that point he wasn't bringing anything to the table at all and I ended it.
Allisha Posted October 15, 2010 Posted October 15, 2010 I think it really depends on what someone is looking for. If a man/woman is actively looking for marriage material and nothing else, I can't see them going for more than a few months without a label or the "where are we?" talk. If it's a bit more casual and laid back, then it can go on for much longer if both parties aren't looking for something serious as they probably don't care.
Author pandagirl Posted October 15, 2010 Author Posted October 15, 2010 I can't imagine dating, falling in love and emotionally investing in someone with no clear roadmap, or as the OP put it, 'label'. Good on those folks who can. Hope my ex becomes one of them. After three marriages, and complaining about all of them, I think she needs to hang it up and just stay casual and uncommitted. I hear the market for that is big these days. Good luck Isn't it weird how people who obviously don't seem cut out for marriage or a long-term commitment still keep on getting into relationships? I wonder why that is... Well, he dosent sound like a bad dating material hehe...I think it all depends on what you want. Do you want a serious future or just have fun and enjoy the time being? You have to be honest with yourself on that first.Are you seeing other guys as well?If it really bothers you, should maybe tactfully probe a few questions casually and get the signs.But be careful not to get too attached in this case... I just got out of a serious relationship, and I already dated this guy I'm talking about. So, I'm going to have take a PASS. For me, it was about 9-10 months. I was never that emotionally invested either, probably because in my gut I knew he was just playing a role. I liked him tho, loved spending time with him, saw potential there as far as both our feelings went, so I kept giving it time. The breaking point came when on top of the lack of emotional availability, he stopped spending time with me. At that point he wasn't bringing anything to the table at all and I ended it. How much time were you spending with him? Like once a week, or were you seeing each other most every day?
carhill Posted October 15, 2010 Posted October 15, 2010 Isn't it weird how people who obviously don't seem cut out for marriage or a long-term commitment still keep on getting into relationships? I wonder why that is... When you analyze it, entering relationships and remaining detached is a really pragmatic methodology of success. Care little, give little, receive more. This is not to say that such perspectives are global; such people can care and can give, just not within an intimate relationship, where caring and giving carry substantial risk. Also, being emotionally detached allows a person to think more clearly and make better, more rational decisions in their own self-interest. One only needs to read LS to watch that dynamic in action. It's easy to identify those who have the ability and experience to care less. To me, this has been a positive and informative experience, better identifying such people in real life and limiting investment in them. The cold pragmatists do have their place and path and beneficial effect on the world. On some days, I envy them. I had a taste of that detachment during my affair and saw the power of caring less to the detriment of another. I also saw the negative effects of such power. It's not my cup of tea. I'll stick to relationships that are labeled positive and loving and unapologetically so.
Untouchable_Fire Posted October 15, 2010 Posted October 15, 2010 I just hung out with a guy I dated a couple of summers ago. Nice guy, but completely NOT boyfriend material. We were talking about our love lives, and he hasn't had a real relationship in three years. However, he has a very active dating life. He will date women anywhere from 5-9 months with absolutely no label on the relationship. Because I dated him, I know he goes through all the motions of being a boyfriend: presents, being sweet, cooking dinner, weekend trips. But he is never emotionally invested in any of these relationships, which is pretty mind boggling for me. He says he likes these women, but never saw a future with any of them, yet was happy to just date them for the time being. I find this incredibly odd. Wouldn't most people jump ship after a few months of dating if there wasn't anything more developing? But this goes in line with what a lot of guys have told me: dating girls for a good amount of time (anywhere from one to five years), without any intentions of moving towards a more serious relationship. I typically control the relationship pacing. I think the longest I've gone on dating someone without making it official is 4 months. That relationship was not very physical at the start, so it moved really slowly. Exclusive means BF/GF in my book, and I always make sure we both know the relationship is exclusive. I've often thought that this might have caused the demise for 2 of my last 3 relationships. I think perhaps the fact that I brought up exclusivity and asked her to be my GF without prompting made her feel like I pushed it. I think the feeling of commitment might make most women want to cheat. It sounds reasonable since it often gives men the wandering eye too.
Insanitylater Posted October 15, 2010 Posted October 15, 2010 Well these guys you speak of care called players. The reason they do what they do is because it WORKS. Women let these guys play them. And of course women keep choosing these guys, regardless of the red flags they give off. What women want in a relationship NOW = attention, gifts, social activities, limelight What women hope for in a relationship = monogamy, trust, longevity, maturity Most women will settle and keep settling as long as the guy knows how to mask his lack of commitment and shower her with a fabricated VIP status.
In The Green Posted October 15, 2010 Posted October 15, 2010 I suppose a marriage minded gal would want to move at a quicker pace and always know the status of the relationship because she has that end goal of marriage. Personally I'm not totally sold on marriage these days but I would want a committed guy. I would be able to tell if hes not emotionally invested and I would leave him, but then again I am someone who can enjoy being alone.
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