Girls are complicated..

[Dr Confused]

It's long so please bear with me...

 

I met this girl at a party and we really had a great time. Despite being intoxicated, I did not try anything with her, we just hung out and talked on the couch. She told me that she was really "confused", but I payed no attention to it. Our night turned into venturing back to the dorms, but then we decided to lay on the quad. We stayed there until about 5:30am cuddling on the quad. So eventually, I took her back to the dorm, hand in hand, and really thought that I could form a relationship with her. Since she was not the type who would just hook up (and neither am I).

 

The next day, I called her and she seemed really excited to see me again, so we met up to study together in the library. I could not study..at all. She was so beautiful I could not concentrate, or do my work. But, she seemed so interested in what I was doing on my laptop and literally watched me do chemistry homework for a couple minutes, commenting on how smart I was. She just seemed so interested in anything I was doing.

 

So after that, we went to dinner, holding hands and everything, and it went perfect. It seemed like nothing else was happening except our conversation..I literally had tunnel vision in the dining hall with her(which has never happened to me before). We even shared some Italian ice. I also discovered that we have so much in common, and I really enjoyed being with her.

 

We went back to the library, this time doing work. After, we went back to my dorm and watched TV, cuddling on my futon, till about 2:30 when I said I have to get up at 8. I felt like we could of stayed up all night, but I took her back to her room. She dropped her stuff inside, walked back out and closed the door looking at me. So I took the hint, and kissed her in the suite hallway. Then smiled and walked away.

 

Here's where it gets depressing...The next few days were complete torture. I texted her to see what she was doing, and I never got a response until four hours later saying that she was busy. So I just blew it off, but then it consistently happened for 3 days when eventually I just straight up asked her what is wrong? She didn't really say much, so texted her "We need to talk". She said yes I know we do. So we met in person the next night.

 

So...she tells me that she is very confused. She said that she has liked some other guy at her work for a long time. But then she met me, and started liking me a lot too. She said that this guy at her work just asked her out (the day after our kiss) and she said yes to him since shes known him longer. She said that she really wants to be friends still, and for me not to be mad at her. I feel like our conversation could of went better, but I basically told her I did not want to be stuck in the friend zone, or be her backup. But we eventually went on a tangent and started talking about other things.

 

I don't know what to do. I really like her, we practically don't know that much about each other since we only spent 2 days together, but I feel like this other guy won. He doesn't even go to our school, and is 4 years older than her. I've started to talk to her again, and she still wants to study together and go out to dinner and stuff. We're even partying together again this weekend. I still don't know what to do though, and it's not like I can ask her to choose...she has me in the palm of her hand..which sucks.

 

Any advice is appreciated.

[carhill]

So, high school, right?

 

Ask someone else out..... on a *date*. Young girls are confused. Sometimes they focus for a few weeks, maybe even a whole semester. That's a 'relationship'. A normal young man can expect many of those in his first decade beyond nocturnal emissions upon discovering he 'likes' girls. Enjoy

[daphne]

It's a good thing you talked to her and found out what's going on instead of wondering weeks down the road. I don't think it's that complicated. She had liked this guy for a while and wnats to pursue it.

 

I think the only thing you can do at this point is to be friendly but don't hang out with her all of the time. You will end up in the friend zone that way. you're going to have to try to put her out of your mind for now, since she's interested in someone else. Not easy since you started to feel a connection. But it is what it is. She knows where you are if it doesn't work out with the other guy. Don't make yourself too available. Don't be mean though or play games.

[Surrealist]

Quick go kill him!

 

 

 

 

 

 

No, don't do that, just joking.

 

Seriously if you don't want to be stuck in the friend zone then take control of that situation! Let her know that you do not want to be friends and by your actions, don't allow it. That is, don't take her to dinners, movies or study together. That's the other guy's job now not yours. No need to be nasty or mean, just hold your ground. If she wants to pursue you again in a romantic sense, then sure, those activities can resume. You may like to make this clear to her as well. If you get friend zoned, she may still want to do all or some of those other activities but you will be the one who has to sit there and listen to her bf relationship developments or troubles. Sure you do not want that.

[Rashad]

It's a good thing you talked to her and found out what's going on instead of wondering weeks down the road. I don't think it's that complicated. She had liked this guy for a while and wnats to pursue it.

 

I think the only thing you can do at this point is to be friendly but don't hang out with her all of the time. You will end up in the friend zone that way. you're going to have to try to put her out of your mind for now, since she's interested in someone else. Not easy since you started to feel a connection. But it is what it is. She knows where you are if it doesn't work out with the other guy. Don't make yourself too available. Don't be mean though or play games.

It don't get simpler than this!

[Sabali]

Game over.

 

You had your chance to play now let the other guy play and get the "high score."

 

Attraction is like a delicate bubble in the infant stage. It must be handled right. Many times during dating or the courting stage, people overthink things and they overanalyze. That is most of the time. On the other hand, some things just has to be a part of your programming to the point that it doesn't take much analyzing to maintain.

 

First, your attitude has to be that if you are laying down with someone that you are interested in, you can't just cuddle with them. Things has to be a lot more spicy than cuddling. If a woman is laying down with you in the bed, escalate intimacy. Yes, you can be rejected. It's the name of the game.

 

After that first time of being all cute just cuddling, you are now working your way to looking more like a girlfriend. You have to escalate things while you are laying flat on that futon. If you get turned down at any point, stop. At least you are attempting to progress.

 

Ok, so you screwed up a bit but she still had some interest in you, fine. Then you get her back to your dorm and then you freakin cuddle again for hours with no action.

 

You are now Mr. Snuggles.

 

On top of that, you sent her home at 2:30am because you had to get up at 8. Ok, man, she is at your place at 2:30am. You just assumed she was not the type to "hook up" even though you never even tested that claim and you sent her home without testing the claim (or was it your assumption?) and was unwilling to sacrifice sleep for a woman laying on your futon. You seem young so I would learn to sacrifice sleep for a good dating life. It's so the thing to do for a long time. I still do allnighters and I am in my 30s with a demanding career. A lot of opportunities present themselves late night even though you have obligations the next morning.

 

I don't think this woman was hanging out late at night at your place to just cuddle with you. She was waiting for you to make a noncuddling move and you didn't. You started to look awfully friendly to her. Another guy comes along and speaks up on her, and now we will just have to see if he is a major cuddler who does not take initiative to escalate intimacy and progress things.

 

You told her that you didn't want to be stuck in the friend zone and that was a bad move. You showed her that you were insecure enough to even think that you could be. You know that it was a good possibility that you were in the zone, which is definite in my eyes, but she doesn't need to hear you say things like that. A good thing to remember is to say less. if you can't think of anything to say then don't say a damn thing. It is your better alternative most of the time.

 

 

She had some interest in you initially, man, but you didn't try to fan those flames so they burned out. Now you are in the friendzone. There is no escape. Sure you are going to read about friendzone escape stories and friends with benefits. This is the exception rather than the rule. If you spend your time trying to beat those odds it will drive you insane so accept your dating pergutory here.

 

It's ok. You'll win the next one. She is going to become pregnant just by looking at your futon!

Edited October 12, 2010 by Sabali

[PhillyDude]

I agree, cuddling is supposed to be after sex-lol

[Surrealist]

LOL the hard truth but truth nontheless.

[Dr Confused]

Thanks for the input. I left out the fact that she is a virgin, so that was a huge factor why I didn't do much, and later in our talk she even specifically told me I was moving too fast. And by the looks of the comments here, I was going too slow. So idk here.

[PhillyDude]

Thanks for the input. I left out the fact that she is a virgin, so that was a huge factor why I didn't do much, and later in our talk she even specifically told me I was moving too fast. And by the looks of the comments here, I was going too slow. So idk here.

 

You could have still kissed, cuddling is boring

[Sabali]

Thanks for the input. I left out the fact that she is a virgin, so that was a huge factor why I didn't do much, and later in our talk she even specifically told me I was moving too fast. And by the looks of the comments here, I was going too slow. So idk here.

 

 

Great. Sucker punched by crucial information that is left out of an already lengthy original post. I would never understand why people write a really long post but leaves out a couple of sentences of crucial stuff like this.

 

I don't know either at this point. Something tells me you have more important info that has yet to be revealed.

 

Anyway, cuddle with your sex partner. When you lay down with a woman you are interested in, escalate intimacy or don't lay down. There is no business in just laying there cuddling.

 

She will lose her virginity to that other guy.

[PhillyDude]

Great. Sucker punched by crucial information that is left out of an already lengthy original post. I would never understand why people write a really long post but leaves out a couple of sentences of crucial stuff like this.

 

I don't know either at this point. Something tells me you have more important info that has yet to be revealed.

 

Anyway, cuddle with your sex partner. When you lay down with a woman you are interested in, escalate intimacy or don't lay down. There is no business in just laying there cuddling.

 

She will lose her virginity to that other guy.

 

 

She probably already did which is why he was the CHOSEN ONE-lol

[sagetalk]

Thanks for the input. I left out the fact that she is a virgin, so that was a huge factor why I didn't do much, and later in our talk she even specifically told me I was moving too fast. And by the looks of the comments here, I was going too slow. So idk here.

 

The advice these guys are giving works on "more experienced :D" women definitely, but it will not work on all girls. I would recommend going very slowly (especially if she is a virgin). You can still do physical things without sex, hand holding is a great start and work your way from there. If she rejects your hand, there is no question she would reject something way more embarrassing to try.

[dispatch3d]

Great. Sucker punched by crucial information that is left out of an already lengthy original post. I would never understand why people write a really long post but leaves out a couple of sentences of crucial stuff like this.

 

I don't know either at this point. Something tells me you have more important info that has yet to be revealed.

 

Anyway, cuddle with your sex partner. When you lay down with a woman you are interested in, escalate intimacy or don't lay down. There is no business in just laying there cuddling.

 

She will lose her virginity to that other guy.

 

I agree. She's attracted to you. You need to go see her, "cuddle", escalate and close this. That simple. Her reasoning is kinda retarded anyways. It's hard to say what that other guy is. She said she was confused at the party which was before when she first said she was confused. So she obviously isn't being that honest about what's going on.

 

Anyways, my vote is to just escalate things when you do see her (if she choses to cuddle/has to be "organic"....hard to explain. It's like not going for the boobs immediately after you start making out. Make sense?) and... wow that was a long bracket... don't be too available. I wouldn't be open to this "friend' thing either. Screw downgrading. In my case I have a lot of friends anyways.

[sagetalk]

The advice these guys are giving works on "more experienced :D" women definitely, but it will not work on all girls. I would recommend going very slowly (especially if she is a virgin). You can still do physical things without sex, hand holding is a great start and work your way from there. If she rejects your hand, there is no question she would reject something way more embarrassing to try.

 

I just read this whole post, this girl sounds really lame. Are you trying to start a LTR with her, and she's this weird after hanging out a few days?

[Sabali]

Anyways, my vote is to just escalate things when you do see her (if she choses to cuddle/has to be "organic"....hard to explain. It's like not going for the boobs immediately after you start making out. Make sense?) .

 

 

See, I didn't want to say it because this is a family site but I was thinking it and dispatched said it so now it's out there.

 

I personally think going for the boob is a fantastic way to escalate from the kiss. Deep kiss...rubbing and touching...boob...ongoing deep kiss and rubbing...move south (either side would be good). If you are stopped, stop your actions immediately and behave as if nothing has happened. Go get a drink of water and talk about sunshine on your shoulder and how it makes you happy. Try again next time. Feel free to mix it up but I wouldn't start out in the south or on the boobs.

 

Less experienced women become more experienced this way and so do less experienced men.

 

Hate me if you want.

Edited October 12, 2010 by Sabali

[that girl]

She is more into the other guy. It is as simple as that.

 

I really don't think the cuddling counted as points against you. A girl who is interested isn't going to lose interest because you didn't kiss her.

 

I think you need to move on. Not completely shut her out of your life since you have mutual friends, but take her off your romantic radar as best you can. If things don't work out with this other guy, she might start flirting and then you can put her back on the radar.

 

I think all of the escalation advice is just going to drive you crazy with this girl. If someone isn't interested, it is better to move on than to try and manipulate your way into their arms.

[Surrealist]

Could be a situation of 'first in, first served'.

[Mike B.]

Clearly the advice isn't for the girl he wrote about in this post. He is in the friendzone so not much is going to happen with her. Not making a move on a woman you like is clearly a bad move. Men know the friendzone all too well and how we get slipped into after years of evaluating our success versus our failure with women and actually talking to women. No one knows it like us. You simply can't convince an experienced dater that a woman won't lose interest in you if you don't make a move.

 

OP, I generally echo the above advice about making a move. I think I have lived long enough to have seen enough guys, even myself, be in your position only to see another dude come along and swoop up and eventually lay the girl that you wanted. The next thing you know, she is cheesing from ear to ear and you wish you had been the one to give her that smile. Like dispatche said, it has to be organic but make a move. This girl is probably lost to you for good but make a move next time.

[that girl]

Men know the friendzone all too well and how we get slipped into after years of evaluating our success versus our failure with women and actually talking to women.

Being a woman and talking to lots of other women when guys aren't around I can tell you that guys don't really end up in the friendzone because they didn't make a move fast enough.

 

Most of the time with friendzone, the guy never had a chance at more. He's non-sexual hanging out is a mistake because he gets in deeper and deeper while she's just thinking of him as a friend. If he made a move, he likely would have been rejected and they both could have moved on.

 

But just cuddling on your first time alone with a girl isn't going to put you in the friendzone with an interested girl.

[Ruby Slippers]

Being a woman and talking to lots of other women when guys aren't around I can tell you that guys don't really end up in the friendzone because they didn't make a move fast enough.

 

Most of the time with friendzone, the guy never had a chance at more. He's non-sexual hanging out is a mistake because he gets in deeper and deeper while she's just thinking of him as a friend. If he made a move, he likely would have been rejected and they both could have moved on.

 

But just cuddling on your first time alone with a girl isn't going to put you in the friendzone with an interested girl.

I agree with this. But I think the guy usually wants to find out ASAP whether she's into him. A clear move of some kind is the foolproof way to get the answer.

[Mike B.]

We know men don't just end up in the friendzone for not making a move fast enough. There are many reasons and being nonsexual is one of them and a good way to be nonsexual is to be just that. Nonsexual. The OP was doing just that. Like I say, men know the friendzone too well. After dating long enough, you see how it works and it doesn't take being a fly on the wall of a girl's only conversation to figure it out. Men have female friends, sisters, and female family members too. This stuff is not shrouded in mystery at all.

 

There really is no need to try to convince otherwise. It well established to men in general when it comes to dating. It was a mystery maybe in the caveman days but not now. Back then men were believing that all they need to do is cuddle and bring flowers and they knew nothing of friendzone dynamics. It's not that way these days. Of course, many times men don't have a chance but if you are laying in a bed with someone and they are cuddling with you, that is indeed a chance.

Edited October 12, 2010 by Mike B.

[dispatch3d]

Being a woman and talking to lots of other women when guys aren't around I can tell you that guys don't really end up in the friendzone because they didn't make a move fast enough.

 

Most of the time with friendzone, the guy never had a chance at more. He's non-sexual hanging out is a mistake because he gets in deeper and deeper while she's just thinking of him as a friend. If he made a move, he likely would have been rejected and they both could have moved on.

 

But just cuddling on your first time alone with a girl isn't going to put you in the friendzone with an interested girl.

 

Yeah but continuing to just cuddle will eventually put you in the friendzone.

 

I agree with everything else though. Most guys are friendzoned not because they didn't go for the kiss, but because they ****ed up enough times (ie. nonsexual, whatever) that they killed the attraction.

 

It's up to the guy to get them interested, get them touchy feely, then escalate in an appropriate place (ie bedroom, in a room where noone is, whatever) where you can go far enough to get the girl invested.

 

I'm not surprised you were offended by my first post. Sure it seems "manipulative" to try to escalate things when she starts cuddling. But I mean, it's not like he's somehow tricking her into doing anything. If she likes him she'll allow it, if she doesn't she won't.

 

The girl just has to be receptive to his advances for something to happen. Often that's all she is (receptive). The guys are the other part of the deal. They have to escalate. Both people can't be just receptive.

[Sabali]

The bottom line is that there are ways about going at things when dating or pursuing a woman that have many men getting the women they are interested in and many who will always be left with their hands empty asking "what just happened?" If you don't make those moves, your hands will be a lot more empty at any given time than they are full. Deny it to the end of time but once you begin to take those initiatives, you will be sold on the concept. Put something in those hands!

[Tim The Enchanter]

Let this be a lesson to you - if someone takes an interest in you, don't fart around trying to be her "friend" for days on end. Ask her out on a date, or be damned.

 

Having said that, she admitted to liking this other cat before you met her. She doesn't sound like girlfriend material to me. She knows she's getting attention from someone else and she likes him, yet she continued to string you along for a few days, getting your hopes up.