Stung Posted September 21, 2010 Posted September 21, 2010 I think a lot depends on the circumstances of the cheating. Serious gaslighting, serial cheating, playing the BS for a fool, IMO these are unforgivable. However, in a situation where there is genuine feeling still in the marriage, and genuine remorse, and genuine commitment to repair? The marriage might be recoverable, might even emerge with stronger patterns of communication after counseling etc. My father cheated on my mother, and knew it and she left him; later they went to marriage counseling and reconciled, and have since had another thirty years of reasonably happy, contented marriage together. They are both retired, they pursue both joint and separate hobbies, they travel the world together, they still have sex and are very affectionate with each other. Their lives are beautifully intertwined, and they are growing old by each other's sides just as they planned to on the day they married. The affair, while major pain and upheaval at the time, in the end? A blip on the radar.
WowReally Posted September 21, 2010 Posted September 21, 2010 I was taught by a very wise therapist to NEVER make a life-altering decision in the heat of the moment of an emotional crises or trauma. Absolutely! The rule of thumb is one year: Whether you live with them, separate from them, decide to reconcile with them, or to divorce them. That way, your decision is made from a position of strength, not vulnerability. Then, there can be no regrets, no matter what you decide. Good points!
WowReally Posted September 21, 2010 Posted September 21, 2010 I have the utmost respect for those willing to try to repair/rebuild their relationships. It takes great strength and courage to look inward and deal with the things that helped to contribute to the demise of the marriage. I especially like hearing the stories of those making it work. But I can't discount the strength and courage it takes to walk away when you know you have met your limit, whether they are remorseful or not. Forgiving doesn't mean you have to stay. And staying doesn't make you weak or a doormat. good points!
PegNosePete Posted September 21, 2010 Posted September 21, 2010 The rule of thumb is one year: Whether you live with them, separate from them, decide to reconcile with them, or to divorce them. In the UK at least, you can't use adultery as grounds for divorce more than 6 months after you discover it. After 6 months you are deemed to have "accepted" it.
bohogirl Posted September 21, 2010 Posted September 21, 2010 In the UK at least, you can't use adultery as grounds for divorce more than 6 months after you discover it. After 6 months you are deemed to have "accepted" it. Which is why a canny unrepentant cheater will make sure that for at least 6 months after DDay he is demonstrably full of remorse and soul searching. If a WS is capable of blindsiding you about an affair he can damn well fool you on his "returning to the fold". When the danger has passed he reverts back to type. It is very difficult to prove adultery unless it is admitted or you have third party evidence. Suspicions are not enough. So it is in MM best interests to play for time. A BS with a serial cheater for a spouse knows the deadline too. If it reaches 6 months and BS has not filed for divorce. Things are OK again.
greengoddess Posted September 21, 2010 Posted September 21, 2010 In the UK at least, you can't use adultery as grounds for divorce more than 6 months after you discover it. After 6 months you are deemed to have "accepted" it. Is it an advantage to claim adultery though or is it still no fault? Most cases claiming adultery does nothing for you. Many people just say irreconcilable differences rather then get into the whole adultery thing.
PegNosePete Posted September 21, 2010 Posted September 21, 2010 The only advantage to claiming adultery is that it makes wording the form simple. It makes no difference to the financial settlement. And yeah there's not much point claiming adultery if you STBX won't confess it, it's not worth the hassle of trying to get proof. There's no such claim as "irreconcilable differences" though. The most commonly used one is "unreasonable behaviour". It only has to be behaviour that is unreasonable to the petitioner... which can be very subjective!
greengoddess Posted September 21, 2010 Posted September 21, 2010 The only advantage to claiming adultery is that it makes wording the form simple. It makes no difference to the financial settlement. And yeah there's not much point claiming adultery if you STBX won't confess it, it's not worth the hassle of trying to get proof. There's no such claim as "irreconcilable differences" though. The most commonly used one is "unreasonable behaviour". It only has to be behaviour that is unreasonable to the petitioner... which can be very subjective! So basically there is no reason for the married person to play the game that bohogirl suggests? No advantage at all. Which is why a canny unrepentant cheater will make sure that for at least 6 months after DDay he is demonstrably full of remorse and soul searching. If a WS is capable of blindsiding you about an affair he can damn well fool you on his "returning to the fold". When the danger has passed he reverts back to type. It is very difficult to prove adultery unless it is admitted or you have third party evidence. Suspicions are not enough. So it is in MM best interests to play for time. A BS with a serial cheater for a spouse knows the deadline too. If it reaches 6 months and BS has not filed for divorce. Things are OK again. Boho this scenario may be more for the benefit of the ow. He tells the ow that he just has to stay with his wife 6 more months so she can not claim adultery and then she keeps hanging in there. After the 6 months she is back again to being use to the status quo of him going home to his wife at night. I will never understand why a miserable married man would not just cut and run after dday instead keeping the marriage. He's caught with his pants down. it is time to declare your love for the ow and leave your marriage. The wife is literally throwing him out the door. The perfect oppurtunity to end the marriage.
Owl Posted September 21, 2010 Posted September 21, 2010 Which is why a canny unrepentant cheater will make sure that for at least 6 months after DDay he is demonstrably full of remorse and soul searching. If a WS is capable of blindsiding you about an affair he can damn well fool you on his "returning to the fold". When the danger has passed he reverts back to type. It is very difficult to prove adultery unless it is admitted or you have third party evidence. Suspicions are not enough. So it is in MM best interests to play for time. A BS with a serial cheater for a spouse knows the deadline too. If it reaches 6 months and BS has not filed for divorce. Things are OK again. This is possible. I'm sure this happens in some occasions. It's also possible that the WS actually DOES regret getting involved in an affair, ends the affair, and actually does work long term to rebuild/repair the marriage while maintaining NC with the previous affair partner. In my situation, I know that it took about a month to get NC established after d-day, but once the choice was REALLY made to reconcile with me, it has remained in place. I'd add that my wife hasn't cheated before or since, so the term 'serial cheater' doesn't apply in my case.
bentnotbroken Posted September 21, 2010 Posted September 21, 2010 The only advantage to claiming adultery is that it makes wording the form simple. It makes no difference to the financial settlement. And yeah there's not much point claiming adultery if you STBX won't confess it, it's not worth the hassle of trying to get proof. There's no such claim as "irreconcilable differences" though. The most commonly used one is "unreasonable behaviour". It only has to be behaviour that is unreasonable to the petitioner... which can be very subjective! Did for me. His rep was more important than his finances.
Lizzie60 Posted September 21, 2010 Posted September 21, 2010 For f**** sake why can't you people leave your partners as soon as you know they are cheating .... What's the point in saving a relationship with a cheater?...Once you lose trust you can never build it.....? It is not always easy... sometimes children are involved.. so people can't just throw their lives up in the air.. and start all over again.. Each situation is different.
Dexter Morgan Posted September 21, 2010 Posted September 21, 2010 Great post. Dex, you and I don't agree on the idea of reconciliation after an affair so you really put it well here. You weren't all "kick 'em to the curb" on d-day either. no, I wasn't. but after the fog cleared and I now have experienced betrayal, there won't be any doubt on what I'd do if it ever happens again. It WILL be kick 'em to the curb on d-day. The desensitization process is complete. So, even though the knee-jerk reaction is to "kicking their cheating butt to the curb" and I said the same thing years before it happened, I'm glad I waited to be sure. won't be a knee-jerk reaction for me if it happens again, already been through it to know what I want now.....and it aint a cheater.
Snowflower Posted September 21, 2010 Posted September 21, 2010 no, I wasn't. but after the fog cleared and I now have experienced betrayal, there won't be any doubt on what I'd do if it ever happens again. It WILL be kick 'em to the curb on d-day. The desensitization process is complete. won't be a knee-jerk reaction for me if it happens again, already been through it to know what I want now.....and it aint a cheater. Oh, I know what you mean. I'm the same way! There won't be a learning curve for me if it were to ever happen again...I hope I'm never in that situation again. But, I think it's something each person has to experience for themselves to know what is right for them. It's why I get so frustrated with the "dump their cheating a**" responses. It's an unhelpful and to "pat" a response to a confused, hurting, BS. Each BS has to figure out their own truth and answers.
Dexter Morgan Posted September 21, 2010 Posted September 21, 2010 It's why I get so frustrated with the "dump their cheating a**" responses. It's an unhelpful and to "pat" a response to a confused, hurting, BS. Each BS has to figure out their own truth and answers. well the other side of the coin is to tell them to take their time and try to work things out, only to later realize they wasted years off their life they will never get back. too many times I see people that supposedly "worked it out", but then are here telling the tale of how they can't shake the thoughts they have of their spouse screwing someone else. oh they will say things are just great and their relationship is fantastic, but they have these triggers and from time to time have a feeling of despair. I simply say to hell with that. If someone choses to live with that kind of inner hell, thats their choice. I will always try to get them to spare themselves that. there are usually simply 2 sides of the coin. work things out....or dump them. some people will represent one side, some the other....its up to the BS to decide what they want, what they are willing to put up with, and what they think is best for them.
Author wicar1 Posted September 21, 2010 Author Posted September 21, 2010 A vast number of people who stay do so for the same reason you don't junk your car when you get a flat tire. For them, a relationship is an investment worth working to keep and rebuild. Well...people dont dump the car when they get a flat a tire but in this case the car becomes a taxi and carries other men or women....
seren Posted September 21, 2010 Posted September 21, 2010 I chose to stay because we had 22 years of a very happy marriage, despite an additional 2 years of crap when H went to Iraq and came back a different man and 8 months of a godawful time when the A took place - This has been followed by almost 3 years of a different sort of marriage, it feels more balanced and I wouldn't change where I am now for anything. I stayed, not because I had to, our son has grown and left home, I could support myself very comfortably, so materially I didn't need to stay. But I stayed because I loved and love my husband, he has shown remorse, I trust him, it will never be the same as it was and I am glad because what we have feels better. I hate the A, not the man, I understand why, I could have made a new life without him, but, even knowing all there was to know, I made the choice to stay and try to begin a new relationship with him. Up to now, it works very, very well. It would have been harder to leave as I would have missed him and us.
Author wicar1 Posted September 21, 2010 Author Posted September 21, 2010 If you are not married and you are cheated on or newly married RUN but many times people have been married ten plus years with so many binds that tie them. I agree with Bobby too. You spend half a lifetime with your spouse knowing what a really great person they are. Knowing the kind of father they are, friend and husband. What a good heart they have. A couple of months of really bad behavior does not cancel out half a lifetime of good behavior. You know that the person they were in the affair was not the real them. The real person has proven himself daily to you for ten plus years. After dday, you see that real person again. The kind loving one you have built so much with. You see their remorse and their love for you and you know they have made the biggest mistake in their life and will do everything they can to fix it. Wicar what is your story? Curious because all you have ever posted is one line DIVORCE the slut type of stuff. I don't find it odd that husbands and wives who have shared so much from buying a first home, job promotion celebrations, anniversaries, the wonders of preganancy and the beauty of childbith together. I find it odd that the other man or woman wants to stay with the married person even after a dday. You don't have years of memories tied into them. You don't know the man or woman before they become this creature who has learned to lie so skillfully and cheat with you. You know the wicked, lying person not the person the betrayed husband or wife built a lifetime around. There's one ow who spent ten years going back and forth with a married man. That is just insane behavior to me on all three of their parts. The husband, the wife and the ow but most especially the ow because she has nothing to tie her to him. I swear om/ow give these people a free pass on bad behavior because they are married. You would never allow a boyfriend or girlfriend to treat you the way a married person does. I can't even imagine not being able to pick up the phone and call my boyfriend because he as on a date with his wife. That is nuts. Isn't trust the major issue here?? ... Once you have been cheated, is it possible for you to wake up next to this cheater and look at his/her face? Isn’t it disgusting? Once you ve been cheated, the next time you see your w/h talking to some other man/woman won't you get the feeling...."is there something building up there...?? " O.K let's say once he/she got caught and confessed... say that they have been involved in this affair for 3 months....one year whatever.... how the hell can you believe them?...what if he/she was banging this ow/om from the first day you dated... ? How can you believe a story told by cheater??? The main Ingredient TRUST is missing. What about the risk of STD.....??? your partner's EA might give you STD....they put your life at risk together with hers/his... isn't that enough reason to get away from them....like run for your lives P.S >> guys who have kids....if you find out your partner is cheating on you ...do a DNA test and make sure the kid is yours
Owl Posted September 21, 2010 Posted September 21, 2010 Isn't trust the major issue here?? ... In the first months after d-day of course it is. But trust can be rebuilt the same way it was built originally. By repeatedly demonstrating trustworthy behavior afterwards. By demonstrating true remorse and regret, and demonstrating positive changes to prevent yourself from doing that same untrustworthy action again. Once you have been cheated, is it possible for you to wake up next to this cheater and look at his/her face? Isn’t it disgusting? Once you ve been cheated, the next time you see your w/h talking to some other man/woman won't you get the feeling...."is there something building up there...?? Yes, once the marriage heals, the trust restores, and the love is rebuilt. The cheating doesn't remain the central issue in your life anymore if it's no longer relevent. That's what reconciliation is...rebuilding the marriage, restoring the trust, repairing the damage caused. I'm not worried about my wife talking with someone else...she's learned as painful a lesson as I have. We've taken some pretty active measures to protect our marriage going forward. " O.K let's say once he/she got caught and confessed... say that they have been involved in this affair for 3 months....one year whatever.... how the hell can you believe them?...what if he/she was banging this ow/om from the first day you dated... ? How can you believe a story told by cheater??? The main Ingredient TRUST is missing. As I said...trust can be rebuilt by demonstration of change, of trustworthy behavior going forward. It takes a lot of work on both sides...it's not for the weak of heart, or the people who aren't committed to doing it. But I've been through it, and can tell you that it DOES heal over time and with that effort. What about the risk of STD.....??? your partner's EA might give you STD....they put your life at risk together with hers/his... isn't that enough reason to get away from them....like run for your lives P.S >> guys who have kids....if you find out your partner is cheating on you ...do a DNA test and make sure the kid is yours I'd agree with STD and paternity tests for anyone who's got reason to need them. Good advice in these last couple of sentences.
greengoddess Posted September 21, 2010 Posted September 21, 2010 Hi wicar. You forgot this part of my comment. I washoping you would tell us a little about why you are here. Wicar what is your story? Curious because all you have ever posted is one line DIVORCE the slut type of stuff.
What_Next Posted September 21, 2010 Posted September 21, 2010 From my perspective I do agree about making life changing decisions etc in a moment of extreme emotional distress. That is definitely the case on D-day. In my case I knew the second my thoughts were comfirmed about her affair. I think I already knew but my brain would not allow my heart to accept it. I knew I'd leave her and divorce her. For me that decision was almost an out of body experience. I have not waivered from it even one single bit. I fully intended on first moving out into my own place and second divorcing her. The minute I came home from my business trip (yes I was away on business on d-day) I told her point blank I was moving and our marriage was over. That is still the case. Now what I have reserved a decision on is whether or not I'll reconcile in the longer term. That right now is up to her. It is up to her how she acts and how much self reflection etc she does. If we do end up back together then we continue on our life and a couple never again as man and wife. Now in the meantime I am continuing with my life. That even means from a relationship standpoint. I am NOT rushing into anything at all, but I'll not put my life on hold any longer while she pulls her own headspace back into line. It is up to her to show me it is even worth it to try, if she chooses not to then so be it. I'll not make that decision, it is hers.
Author wicar1 Posted September 21, 2010 Author Posted September 21, 2010 (edited) Wicar what is your story? Curious because all you have ever posted is one line DIVORCE the slut type of stuff. I loved this girl for 3 years and was married for two years..It was great....loved her so much... I changed my job home etc etc everything and moved to a different city.. I did whatever pleased her.... one day came early from work only to find out she was with another guy on my bed.... they didn't know I was there.... I was so hurt...that the love of my life was backstabbing me.... I was f**** angry and so hurt...I left the place, went to a motel...I thought of committing suicide first because ... I thought she was everything to me... but then I thought about the loving family and great friends I had....I gave up my plan....besides why should I suffer for her.... then gave a thought with a calm head.... I knew I wanted a divorce I called my home... recoded a message saying I was on an urgent business trip and would be away for a week...probably she was banging him at that time....lucky I had a good friend who was a private detective....asked his help to know more stuff about her affair...because I was never gonna trust her from that point onwards...informed my lawyer....in five days or so...he gave me a report....seems she had this EA going for a month.... OM was not married, was her co-worker's brother. Saw a few disgusting pics of them together...my friend said he also had them on video...anyway went home didn’t want to look at her face....she seemed so happy... probably that I am home...wtf??? I was so hurt seeing her...not just because she cheated....but also because...I was going to leave her....love of my life....I controlled my self...sat on the couch...and said..."I know about your affair....and I want to divorce......" I threw the pics taken by my friend on the floor...she cannot deny can she....she started to cry ...she cried so much...of course I still loved her and was even more hurt than her.... she said so many sorries...she tried to explain but I did not want any explanations from her.... I told her that I just wanted a divorce....peacefully or things can get disgusting.... and left...she called me so many times and said sorry....and asked one chance for her to explain....but the damage was done already ...I didn’t want anything else.... I heard from one of our mutual friends that she started the affair cause she felt I was not spending much time with her...I don't see any truth in that...coz I was there for her always...and sacrificed many things for...still if she thought it was not good enough it is no excuse to bang another guy....whatever her reasons I don't give a **** after what I saw. She tried to talk to me on many occasions...but whenever I see her I exit the scene...it's so much of pain... Still love her...Anyway we got divorced...it's been a year. I went back to my old city...started a new life...still my friends tell me that she wants to talk to me...seems she is taking counseling... Anyway the truth is even though I took a divorce...I still love her...I hope time will heal... Even though living without her seems really painful it does not even come closer to the pain I had when I saw her with him, the moment the trust broke. I am far better now... That's my story greengoddess Edited September 21, 2010 by wicar1
greengoddess Posted September 21, 2010 Posted September 21, 2010 I'm sorry wicar. That must have been heartwrenching. They never even heard you. How did you hold it together and just leave without saying a thing?
YellowShark Posted September 21, 2010 Posted September 21, 2010 I loved this girl for 3 years and was married for two years..It was great....loved her so much... I changed my job home etc etc everything and moved to a different city.. I did whatever pleased her.... one day came early from work only to find out she was with another guy on my bed.... they didn't know I was there.... I was so hurt...that the love of my life was backstabbing me.... I was f**** angry and so hurt...I left the place, went to a motel...I thought of committing suicide first because ... I thought she was everything to me... So sorry to hear that to wicar. I can sooo relate. I woke up late one night to get a drink in the kitchen and found "her" with one of my best MARRIED friends on my own deck. My son - (her stepson) - and I were sleeping inside at the time. The pain was indescribable. She was everything to me as well. To this day she is unrepentant. And I am gone now. That was three short months ago. All my best to you, and we'll both make it, we're better off than before... I really believe that, even with all the pain. Best of luck.
bentnotbroken Posted September 21, 2010 Posted September 21, 2010 WOW, Wicar. I don't think I have your self control. I almost caught Mr. Messy and ow. Just the thought made me want to rip things apart that should remain attached for bathroom purposes.
Recommended Posts