Confusion

[Star_Bright]

[/u]

 

Look, I am over 40 and have been divorced three times. I am a good person, I am fairly accomplished. I have been both OW and BS. All of that is OK because I have learned and embraced all of my life's lessons. If I could reach out and hug you and then slap you, I would. Its hindsight and not worth much to someone who isnt PAST the experience but:

 

Broken people cannot fix each other. Please, please consider this. Working on finding balance and contentment in your life should not include this man.

 

Thank you for sharing your experience with me, it really helps. Except that maybe you could slap me and THEN hug me?

 

I guess what you're saying is that even if he does leave, I shouldn't be with him right now. I often think that too but it's a hard pill to swallow and I had told him that if he leaves I will be here for him. Part of me thinks he isn't going to leave anyway so why worry about it. Part of me thinks I should let him know I need time to myself no matter WHAT he decides to do. But that would involve making contact. So what do you advise? Just wait and see what he does and if he DOES leave and contact me, tell him actually I'm still not ready to see him?

[2sure]

You are such a sweet, intelligent, self reflecting, and articulate woman. I can see that your integrity, your empathy, loyalty and kindness are big factors in your decision making process. As they should be.

 

That was your hug. Here is your slap:

 

STOP making him a priority when to him...you are simply another option.

[2sure]

HIS priority is simply to have OPTIONS.

[Star_Bright]

You are such a sweet, intelligent, self reflecting, and articulate woman. I can see that your integrity, your empathy, loyalty and kindness are big factors in your decision making process. As they should be.

 

That was your hug. Here is your slap:

 

STOP making him a priority when to him...you are simply another option.

 

Your kind words make me feel so much better.

 

Maybe he is just mad that I'm taking away one of his options. Maybe he just wanted to cheat or he wanted someone to help him leave his marriage. I can't figure out what his intentions were/are.

 

He had started to tell his friends about us and take me out with them. This weekend he said one of his friends knew he was seeing someone else but didn't know it was me (I had met this friend of his quite a few times before in a business context, not the OW context). He told me his friend thinks his affair is with a woman that MM went to lunch with about a month ago while I was out of state visiting my family (after MM's wife found out about us). The woman is a former colleague of MM's that MM has told me he had worked very closely with, had the chance to have an affair with, and everyone thought he may be having an affair with her, but he wasn't. He hadn't told me he had gone to lunch with her until this weekend.

 

When I became upset he said I have nothing to worry about, it was nine years ago and it was just a coincidence that he ran into her again. He also added that at the time we were "broken up" because his wife had found out about me and I was with my family trying to figure out what to do. Call me paranoid but I feel like he was trying to start up something again with this woman to keep his options open. At the very least it was dishonest of him not to have told me about having lunch with her for a month, and when I called him out on it he admitted he wouldn't like it if I had done the same, but then claimed she was just a friend like his male friends so he didn't think it was worth mentioning.

[Star_Bright]

He just called me. I didn't answer. He didn't leave a voicemail.

 

This is really hard.

[2sure]

The right thing to do for YOURSELF is always hard . In my experience.

[Star_Bright]

The right thing to do for YOURSELF is always hard . In my experience.

 

Yeah. I just wonder how he is doing. I do care about him as F-ed up as it is and I don't want him to feel like I don't.

[Confused4Now]

I meant to add -- Confused4now, what did your xMW do that showed movement? Did she move out on her own?

Well let me see....she actually developed her own self. She had a H who was very controlling(abusive) in every way you can imagine. She started being to have friends and go out and do the stuff she was never able to have. So I did see a personal growth in her. She did get him to move out for 6 months and she let her family know. He does know of me since we did have a D-day. However last year she had surgery which H ended up working his way back home and has been there ever since. She's asked him to leave and he says he won't. I told her she only had two options....move out herself and file the papers. That has not happened.

 

She's been with this man since she was 16 and been with him for 26 years....I do understand he is all she knows.....so its hard for her. I on the other hand have now realized it might take years for her to get where she needs to be. Which is why I'm living my life.

[Star_Bright]

Well let me see....she actually developed her own self. She had a H who was very controlling(abusive) in every way you can imagine. She started being to have friends and go out and do the stuff she was never able to have. So I did see a personal growth in her. She did get him to move out for 6 months and she let her family know. He does know of me since we did have a D-day. However last year she had surgery which H ended up working his way back home and has been there ever since. She's asked him to leave and he says he won't. I told her she only had two options....move out herself and file the papers. That has not happened.

 

She's been with this man since she was 16 and been with him for 26 years....I do understand he is all she knows.....so its hard for her. I on the other hand have now realized it might take years for her to get where she needs to be. Which is why I'm living my life.

 

It sounds like a very hard situation. Good for you for being strong. Sounds like she is not ready to leave him and in the meantime you do have to live your own life. Maybe in the process she will do what she needs to do or maybe you will find someone right for you and healthy.

[Star_Bright]

I was feeling so strong and now that he called I just feel sad. I miss him and don't want him to think I don't care. But I don't want to go back on what I said, that I don't want to talk to him unless he's moved out. I do have some of his belongings but he hasn't asked for them, just called and left no message.

 

I'm arranging my books right now which makes me feel happy. A quick distraction until I start work tomorrow.

[Confused4Now]

It sounds like a very hard situation. Good for you for being strong. Sounds like she is not ready to leave him and in the meantime you do have to live your own life. Maybe in the process she will do what she needs to do or maybe you will find someone right for you and healthy.

Well let me put it this way.....I was with her for 2 years while I was still in my marriage. It's been almost 3 years since I moved out. A total of 5 years. I would have never thought I would have been OM longer than a MM by the time she got her act together...it just never happened. 5 years is a long time to waste on someone who still on step #1 or even haven't started step #1. All I know is I'm in the minority. Most women are the ones who filed their divorce papers. I filed mine....she can't even be in the majority so that told me something.

[2sure]

[QUOTE=Star_Bright;2996749]IBut I don't want to go back on what I said, that I don't want to talk to him unless he's moved out.

 

Thats right. You dont want to go back on that because regardless of how you feel or what you want...you KNOW that that is the right and normal response. Actions like that are what make up a successful happy life with solid relationships. Thats what you want. Thats who you want to be.

[Star_Bright]

Well let me put it this way.....I was with her for 2 years while I was still in my marriage. It's been almost 3 years since I moved out. A total of 5 years. I would have never thought I would have been OM longer than a MM by the time she got her act together...it just never happened. 5 years is a long time to waste on someone who still on step #1 or even haven't started step #1. All I know is I'm in the minority. Most women are the ones who filed their divorce papers. I filed mine....she can't even be in the majority so that told me something.

 

It sounds like you were good to her and just want her to be happy. It also sounds like you're pretty happy. Good for you. If she never gets there, it's not your fault. You did what you could but maybe she is just stuck.

[Star_Bright]

[QUOTE=Star_Bright;2996749]IBut I don't want to go back on what I said, that I don't want to talk to him unless he's moved out.

 

Thats right. You dont want to go back on that because regardless of how you feel or what you want...you KNOW that that is the right and normal response. Actions like that are what make up a successful happy life with solid relationships. Thats what you want. Thats who you want to be.

 

I guess it's really not that hard for him to understand. I've told him that I want to be with him but only if he is really mine. Maybe I've sounded inconsistent because I do have fears. But I'm looking over the messages we exchanged yesterday late morning. He said he thinks he has to do something soon because his wife is upset. He said he would talk to her that night "if she would talk to him." It sounded like he was putting the ball in her or my court and I could tell he was really struggling with what to do.

 

I said I think the whole situation is hard for everyone and everyone would like him to do something one way or the other, even him. He said yes, "even me." I said it seems to me like we need to take a break so he can figure out what he really wants and how to do it, either way. I told him I loved him and just wanted whatever would make him happy, and that it would also help me gain my own perspective and feel stronger on my own.

 

Now I'm looking at the actual BBMs to see what I actually said and what he actually said.

 

He said: "You have a say in this of course. What do you want? I'm not putting you on the spot. I'm just letting you know that."

 

Thinking about what I really wanted made a lightbulb go on for me. Also I had been posting my thread in this forum and thinking about what I really wanted.

 

I said: "I feel like you feel you are being forced to make a decision by both me and her. What I want is for the decision to be totally yours. I get confused thinking back through our relationship. At first you were like, I'm not leaving my family ever. Then you were like, it would be hard to leave because of the kids. Now you say you want to leave, yet you haven't. So I just don't know. I don't want to feel like I'm dragging you out. I don't want to pressure you. Yet I don't want to be with you if you aren't sure and you don't take action. I also don't want it to be because she throws you out. I want it to be like any other relationship, where I think, he could be with anyone else yet he wants to be with only me. I understand why it's a hard decision because of your family. In the meantime, I feel tortured. So what I want is for us to be apart unless/until you leave."

 

He said: "She won't throw me out. She will tell me to leave if I don't want to be with her."

 

I said: "that's not much different though... why does SHE have to tell you that? Why can't you do it on your own? Do you see what I mean? I would want it to be of your own volition, not because she's telling you what to do."

 

He said: "Yes. I understand. I don't 'like' it. But I see your points. I can't argue with what you are saying."

 

I said: "Okay. Well that's a first LOL."

 

He said: "Like I've said. I hate it when you are right. I love you Star_Bright."

 

I said: "I love you too MM. I just want you to be happy and me to be happy."

 

He said: "I want the same. I truly want the same."

 

I said: "I know. So let's just take a break and you can sort stuff out. If you leave on your own accord just let me know and we will go on a date and I will be very happy. And if not then I will understand and move on. And I will be grateful that you respect me enough to let me move on since you are married. :)"

 

He said: "I do respect you. So we need to 'move on' as a real couple or you and I 'move on.' :)"

 

I said: "Yes, that's exactly what I want."

 

He said: "I expected you to respond 'deal'. ;)"

 

I said: "Ha ha. Ok deal."

 

He said: "Seriously, my love, it's now the 'right' way to handle something that makes us both feel 'wrong.'"

 

I said: "I agree."

 

And that was it, and then he called me asking if he could still talk to me on the phone, which I posted about yesterday, and I said no.

 

I think I made myself very clear and he knows where I stand. Didn't I?

[Star_Bright]

Oh my. I'm sorry to be posting so many posts but I'm not sure how to deal with this.

 

He just sent me a bbm message saying "I have a question. Or does that violate the terms of your mandated armistice? And can I have another question? Because that's not my question."

 

Armistice? Isn't that a break in fighting to discuss peace terms? That's not exactly what I was mandating.

[Snowflower]

Oh my. I'm sorry to be posting so many posts but I'm not sure how to deal with this.

 

He just sent me a bbm message saying "I have a question. Or does that violate the terms of your mandated armistice? And can I have another question? Because that's not my question."

 

Armistice? Isn't that a break in fighting to discuss peace terms? That's not exactly what I was mandating.

 

Star bright, I've enjoyed reading your thread. I can relate to so much of what you wrote even though my situation is completely different. (PM me if you wish).

 

But to answer your question above. IMO, NO! you should not answer his innocent question. It is a ruse to see if you will respond to him. He is testing the strength of your NC "mandate." You are doing something different... by not responding to him and he is noticing.

 

Just stay away and continue to concentrate on YOU! I know it's hard...I'm doing the same thing myself. It hurts-it's lonely-but in the long run, it's for the best.

[Confused4Now]

Oh my. I'm sorry to be posting so many posts but I'm not sure how to deal with this.

 

He just sent me a bbm message saying "I have a question. Or does that violate the terms of your mandated armistice? And can I have another question? Because that's not my question."

 

Armistice? Isn't that a break in fighting to discuss peace terms? That's not exactly what I was mandating.

He just wants to continue a dialog with you so he can have his fix....

[Owl]

He just called me. I didn't answer. He didn't leave a voicemail.

 

This is really hard.

 

My friend, this is EXACTLY why I suggested that you take active measures to block him from your life for now.

 

If its easy for him to attempt casual contact, then there's no reason why he will stick to NC.

 

Block his number/email/texts, etc...

 

Or this WILL continue, I can promise you...

[Star_Bright]

Star bright, I've enjoyed reading your thread. I can relate to so much of what you wrote even though my situation is completely different. (PM me if you wish).

 

But to answer your question above. IMO, NO! you should not answer his innocent question. It is a ruse to see if you will respond to him. He is testing the strength of your NC "mandate." You are doing something different... by not responding to him and he is noticing.

 

Just stay away and continue to concentrate on YOU! I know it's hard...I'm doing the same thing myself. It hurts-it's lonely-but in the long run, it's for the best.

 

Thanks, Snowflower.

 

I guess I start to feel like he must be hurting and sad and I want to help him. But really he hasn't done what I stated he needs to do before I want to hear from him- move out, which is what he kept saying he was going to do.

[Star_Bright]

He called again and left me a voicemail saying he is going to see a counselor tomorrow and he is right now looking at places to rent. He said his question is that, on BBM, when I said when he leaves to call me and we can go on a date, does that mean we have to start over and see how it goes or does that mean we can pick it back up like it is and I will be there for him?

 

[Star_Bright]

My friend, this is EXACTLY why I suggested that you take active measures to block him from your life for now.

 

If its easy for him to attempt casual contact, then there's no reason why he will stick to NC.

 

Block his number/email/texts, etc...

 

Or this WILL continue, I can promise you...

 

So I just looked it up online and with Sprint I can block his texts but not his phone calls. We don't text, we use BBM (harder for his wife to find...) and that goes by our Blackberry's pin number, so I don't think it matters if I change my number. ? I could still get his bbm messages.

 

I think I am going to just have to be strong and not answer him.

[WowReally]

I guess it's really not that hard for him to understand. I've told him that I want to be with him but only if he is really mine. Maybe I've sounded inconsistent because I do have fears. But I'm looking over the messages we exchanged yesterday late morning. He said he thinks he has to do something soon because his wife is upset. He said he would talk to her that night "if she would talk to him." It sounded like he was putting the ball in her or my court and I could tell he was really struggling with what to do.

 

I said I think the whole situation is hard for everyone and everyone would like him to do something one way or the other, even him. He said yes, "even me." I said it seems to me like we need to take a break so he can figure out what he really wants and how to do it, either way. I told him I loved him and just wanted whatever would make him happy, and that it would also help me gain my own perspective and feel stronger on my own.

 

Now I'm looking at the actual BBMs to see what I actually said and what he actually said.

 

He said: "You have a say in this of course. What do you want? I'm not putting you on the spot. I'm just letting you know that."

 

Thinking about what I really wanted made a lightbulb go on for me. Also I had been posting my thread in this forum and thinking about what I really wanted.

 

I said: "I feel like you feel you are being forced to make a decision by both me and her. What I want is for the decision to be totally yours. I get confused thinking back through our relationship. At first you were like, I'm not leaving my family ever. Then you were like, it would be hard to leave because of the kids. Now you say you want to leave, yet you haven't. So I just don't know. I don't want to feel like I'm dragging you out. I don't want to pressure you. Yet I don't want to be with you if you aren't sure and you don't take action. I also don't want it to be because she throws you out. I want it to be like any other relationship, where I think, he could be with anyone else yet he wants to be with only me. I understand why it's a hard decision because of your family. In the meantime, I feel tortured. So what I want is for us to be apart unless/until you leave."

 

He said: "She won't throw me out. She will tell me to leave if I don't want to be with her."

 

I said: "that's not much different though... why does SHE have to tell you that? Why can't you do it on your own? Do you see what I mean? I would want it to be of your own volition, not because she's telling you what to do."

 

He said: "Yes. I understand. I don't 'like' it. But I see your points. I can't argue with what you are saying."

 

I said: "Okay. Well that's a first LOL."

 

He said: "Like I've said. I hate it when you are right. I love you Star_Bright."

 

I said: "I love you too MM. I just want you to be happy and me to be happy."

 

He said: "I want the same. I truly want the same."

 

I said: "I know. So let's just take a break and you can sort stuff out. If you leave on your own accord just let me know and we will go on a date and I will be very happy. And if not then I will understand and move on. And I will be grateful that you respect me enough to let me move on since you are married. :)"

 

He said: "I do respect you. So we need to 'move on' as a real couple or you and I 'move on.' :)"

 

I said: "Yes, that's exactly what I want."

 

He said: "I expected you to respond 'deal'. ;)"

 

I said: "Ha ha. Ok deal."

 

He said: "Seriously, my love, it's now the 'right' way to handle something that makes us both feel 'wrong.'"

 

I said: "I agree."

 

And that was it, and then he called me asking if he could still talk to me on the phone, which I posted about yesterday, and I said no.

 

I think I made myself very clear and he knows where I stand. Didn't I?

 

Wow - so similar to conversations I've had with my xMM...amazingly close

[Star_Bright]

Wow - so similar to conversations I've had with my xMM...amazingly close

 

I guess there are a lot of similarities in these OW/MM relationships. Sometimes I read something so strikingly similar that I wonder if that OW is dating my MM too. But I guess it's just human nature. I'm really trying to understand why this happens. Why do they say they love us and want to be with us and stay there? Why do we fall for it?

[Owl]

Going by your own strength is likely going to be far harder than you expect...and far more likely to cause recurrences like today.

 

Rather than that...go to your Sprint store, request a phone number change, and see what it would take to do a phone upgrade. Nix on the Blackberry...the EVO is the shizzz if you're in 4G market. :)

[TinaniT]

(((Starbright)))

 

stay strong for what you need.