Confusion

[Star_Bright]

Hello, forum. I'm feeling really down and I need help. I'm going to go talk to someone in real life as soon as my new health insurance starts up. In the meantime I'm hoping that posting here can bring me some clarity.

 

I posted awhile back saying that my MM was saying he was staying for the kids and I understood that. Looking back at our brief but intense affair, what he was saying has changed a lot. When the affair first started (or, turned physical, because from reading on the forums I've realized that we were in an EA long before our PA started), he told me we needed to stop because he had cheated before on his first wife and it could lead to a lot of hurt and drama. He said he was never going to leave his family/second wife so nothing good could come of us. I understood and was fine with that. But then he came back and we continued and I know I should have stopped it then and there. But in the beginning I guess I thought I was just exploring the connection and not thinking straight about where it would all lead. As some people pointed out in my last thread, I wasn't concerned about his wife at that point at all. I didn't actively want him to leave her for me and I didn't know it would go so deep.

 

Then our affair became very intense, an every-single-day EA and PA, and he told me he loves me and wants to be with me but is having a hard time leaving because of the kids. I told him I understood. I said things were getting so intense and I was feeling guilty (his wife had found out) that I couldn't go on in the affair anymore. It wasn't just fun and games, his wife was hurting and if we continued like that then I was going to hurt too, because I had to admit I was in love with him. He said he knows we have to end, but then he said why do we have to end, we could actually be together.

 

Now he says he wants to leave and he's realized there's nothing worth salvaging between him and his wife. He has something with me that he doesn't have with her and wants to be with me and not her. He keeps saying he's leaving FOR me and he would stay, at least until his kids are gone, if it weren't for me. He keeps wanting my reassurance that I will be here for him and not leave him. Yes, I want to be with him, I don't want anyone else. But I feel worried that if he leaves for me there will be unresolved issues that will follow him.

 

It's hard to "look back" while in the midst of all of this. But looking back I wonder if he wanted an exit affair all along. As I stated it has been three months since our affair turned physical but for one of those months, after his wife found out, I was visiting my family and deciding whether to move far away to where they live just to be sure I didn't continue the affair. The attraction and connection is so intense but I don't feel it's right. I'm going against what I believe to be right. How could I have done this? And now what? He says that when I was gone and he was afraid I wasn't coming back, he decided to do whatever it takes to be with me because he loves me and can't let this opportunity pass. But when I think of him leaving his family I feel very guilty. He says he is holding back because he is unsure of my commitment level and whether I can go through with this. He needs to know I will be with him every step of the way before he makes the leap. I told him I don't want to break up a family and I feel bad for even being in an affair. He said this makes him feel like I don't want to be with him, and that him leaving his family is the only way we can be together.

 

I wish I could undo everything. I know I have already hurt his wife. Even I leave him now, she is hurt. He says I need to follow my heart and do what's best for me and us, and not think about his wife. I told him I understand that being with me means leaving his family, but I want him to leave for himself and on his own and I keep saying we need to take a break. He says please don't leave him and he needs my support. I feel like I was there for him in an affair but now I don't want to be with him when he does what it takes to actually be with me.

 

The guilt is just eating at me. The bad feelings are really outweighing the good. I want to just step away and let him do whatever he is going to do or not do on his own. He says he needs me now more than ever. I feel so confused about the right thing to do now that I have done so many wrong things. I feel like I can't see the forest through the trees and I'm hoping that talking about it will help me figure it all out. Thanks, forum.

[Star_Bright]

I just want to add that I do believe he truly loves me with all his heart. I guess our connection and this feeling are what have kept me with him even when I feel like we're doing the wrong thing when it comes to his family. I've never experienced a love like this. So what is my hangup with him leaving his family? I can't figure this part out. Of course he is right that if we are to be together for real he needs to leave his family. Am I just chicken? Do I just want everything- to be with him but not have his family get hurt? I really don't understand myself.

[Owl]

I would give you one caution...

 

He cheated on his FIRST wife.

 

He's cheated on his SECOND wife with you.

 

The odds of a successful, committed, long-term relationship with this man are very, very low.

 

The odds that it happens TO you in the coming months/years are very, very high.

 

Don't convince yourself that "my story is different". You're just setting yourself up for more hurt.

 

Stop, look at what's going on and what's gone on...and think with your brain rather than just feel with your heart. That's why you have both.

 

I'm not picking on you or trying to hurt you...on the contrary, I'd hope that you can see what's coming and take action to protect yourself.

[Star_Bright]

Thanks for the advice, Owl. I do understand what you're saying. He tells me that he married young and was unhappy with his first wife, that he cheated on her several times and moved out several times, until finally he left her for good to be with his second wife. He also tells me that he loved his second wife and then thought she was a good mother and he was faithful to her for the twenty years they've been together, until I came along. I realize he could be lying to me. He seems to be blatantly honest to me about things though.

 

My worry, which I've told him, is that if he starts being unhappy with me, he will cheat on me. He says he is also afraid of me hurting him but we would have to just get over that, that he loves me and would never want to be with anyone else. At this point, yes, he's absolutely gaga over me, I can tell. But I'm sure he was like that with his second wife too and something made that go away.

 

I don't know whether this matters but his past cheating has been with OWs, not just ONS or random hook-ups. He seems to be someone who always needs to be in a relationship and can't leave one relationship until he has another one. He's admitted as much to me.

[Owl]

Thanks for the advice, Owl. I do understand what you're saying. He tells me that he married young and was unhappy with his first wife, that he cheated on her several times and moved out several times, until finally he left her for good to be with his second wife. He also tells me that he loved his second wife and then thought she was a good mother and he was faithful to her for the twenty years they've been together, until I came along. I realize he could be lying to me. He seems to be blatantly honest to me about things though.

 

My worry, which I've told him, is that if he starts being unhappy with me, he will cheat on me. He says he is also afraid of me hurting him but we would have to just get over that, that he loves me and would never want to be with anyone else. At this point, yes, he's absolutely gaga over me, I can tell. But I'm sure he was like that with his second wife too and something made that go away.

 

I don't know whether this matters but his past cheating has been with OWs, not just ONS or random hook-ups. He seems to be someone who always needs to be in a relationship and can't leave one relationship until he has another one. He's admitted as much to me.

 

Sorry...he's just minimizing your fears/doubts.

 

I'm sure that both of his wives have been assured that he'd "never do that to them" as well.

 

If you see these danger signs, you should give them some very serious consideration.

 

I wish you the best of luck, friend.

[Star_Bright]

Thanks, Owl.

[YellowShark]

I realize he could be lying to me. He seems to be blatantly honest to me about things though.

 

My worry, which I've told him, is that if he starts being unhappy with me, he will cheat on me.

 

I only wish you the best but please try to trust his actions and not his words. He cheated on his first wife, he cheated on his second wife, therefore it seems to reason that he will cheat on a "third wife" eventually.

 

It's sad because I read that you are really invested emotionally in this man, and you are hurting, but chances are he will follow his previous patterns.

 

Only you know what is best for you, good luck.

[Star_Bright]

He's a lot older than me and jokes that he won't have time to cheat on me. If our relationship lasts as long as the time period during which he was faithful to his second wife, he'll be in the nursing home. I don't find this very funny but he says he just wants to be happy, which he is with me, and doesn't have the motivation or energy to cheat, even if he wanted to, which he doesn't.

 

I love him but I really think he needs to be happy on his own before he can be happy with anyone else. I know he is happy with me now but I wonder how long that could last. I've told him that I think both of us need to be on our own and figure out why we do the things we do and to become the kind of person we really want to be. I don't want to be the kind of person who engages in an affair and helps destroy a family. Yet, that's exactly what I've been doing. I can't imagine he wants to be the kind of person who hops from woman to woman looking for us to save him from unhappiness or boredom or whatever, when he can only save himself.

 

I think we both have issues and we are rather co-dependent on each other, like we're looking to each other for strength or help. I love him and almost feel like I need him, but I don't want to need him. I want to be happy on my own, and I'm not happy right now, even being with him. It brings me temporary happiness, even a "high," and I think this is how our affair started. We were unhappy with our own lives and would look for excuses to hang out with each other and have fun together. We do always have a lot of fun and I can talk to him about anything and vice versa. I feel like I can be myself around him and he loves me for who I am and that's the kind of love that I want. But once he's gone or even once I know he has to go, I have moments of feeling so very low and awful that I know I need psychological help. It can't be normal. I don't know if it's just the guilt of what we are doing to his family, or fear of him hurting me, because I have never really opened up and trusted someone like this, or what.

 

I really appreciate you listening and helping me Owl. I feel very low all the time and I just want to be happy.

[Star_Bright]

I only wish you the best but please try to trust his actions and not his words. He cheated on his first wife, he cheated on his second wife, therefore it seems to reason that he will cheat on a "third wife" eventually.

 

It's sad because I read that you are really invested emotionally in this man, and you are hurting, but chances are he will follow his previous patterns.

 

Only you know what is best for you, good luck.

 

Thanks, YellowShark. I guess I have been naive. Thinking that even if someone has been unfaithful in the past, if they really love someone else and are happy with them, they won't be unfaithful.

 

I do believe people can change. But I also think that person has to do a lot of work on themselves first to change and that's why it feels to me that he is going about this the wrong way. He can't just leave her for me and expect to stay happy and faithful. I think he has to figure out why he was unhappy and how to stay happy and faithful.

 

And I need to figure out why I let myself do something I think is wrong. And how to be happy on my own as well.

[Star_Bright]

I'm sick of being in this state. My head knows one thing but then when I talk to him or see him I feel another and I don't follow my head.

 

I just told him that we need to take a break and that if leaves his wife of his own volition then he can let me know. If not I understand and will move on.

 

I don't think the biggest issue for me is trust. Maybe it should be. But I feel in my heart that he loves me and I love him in a way that is very rare, and for the time being I'm not worried at all about him cheating on me. I guess we would have to cross that bridge when we came to it.

 

For me the problem is that we are stuck in limbo. He says he wants to leave to be with me yet it's like he wants me to pull him out. Almost like he is waiting for me or his wife to make up his mind for him. That's not what I want. Like any relationship I want to feel like he could be with anyone but he chooses to be with only me. I do understand that involves him hurting his family but it doesn't involve me pulling him away from them which is what it feels like he wants me to do. Well I just can't do that.

 

So now I have to stick by what I told him. This will be the hard part. I don't feel he will get divorced if I'm not there making him do it. So I am ready to move on without him. I just don't want to crash or crumble when he contacts me.

[Owl]

I'd like to give you two suggestions...

 

First...take your own (good!) advice. Be happy within yourself, independent upon him. Find/build that happiness there first...then see what comes with a relationship with someone else. You're feeling dependent upon him for your happiness...which is the same downfall you suggested he fix on his side. Good solid advice, and worth taking yourself.

 

Second, you have every reason to be concerned about crumbling when he contacts you...and he will. That's why you need to take ACTIVE MEASURES to prevent incidental contact. Remove him from your contacts, block his email/text/calls, change your number.

 

Make it so that it's not a simple, easy thing for contact to resume. It takes EFFORT...not something that can just happen at a whim whenver one of you has a weak moment.

 

And keep working on building your own happiness.

[Star_Bright]

Thanks, Owl. That's what I plan to do. I told him that we BOTH need to sort things out on our own and be happy on our own. I recognize that this is a big issue for me, and maybe that's why I latched onto him from the beginning. I tend to be co-dependent. I don't know why. I would like to love myself and be happy on my own but I guess that's easier said than done. At least I'm going to try to do it.

 

As far as changing my phone number. I had told him to let me know if he leaves. I would like to be with him if he's available, but not like this. He does know other ways of contacting me if I were to change my number. But I don't want to give him the impression that I am cutting him out of my life, just that the current situation is not working for me. Honestly I don't feel like he will leave if I'm not there holding his hand, but I also think it would be unfair of me to tell him "let me know if you leave on your own" and then change my number, you know what I mean?

 

I must say that just telling him that makes me feel strong. I feel like I've been waiting around on him to make up his mind and act on it, whereas he's been waiting around for his wife to catch us again and/or kick him out, or for me to say, "leave her right now and this is how to do it." (The funny thing is, he complains that his second wife was too pushy when he left his first wife, like with finding him a place to live and taking over the finances, etc. Maybe she was like that because that's how she had to be or else he would never have left.) I did not like that position at all and I'm glad to be done with it.

[Owl]

I think that you're worried about losing him too much.

 

You SHOULD give him the impression you're cutting him out of your life......until he fulfills the conditions you've set for him to be allowed back into your life.

 

If you look at it as anything less than that, you're already setting the stage for NC to fail, and for the affair to resume.

 

If he knows how to contact you when things HAVE changed...then cut him out of your life until they've changed, and make it so that there's no EASY way for him to contact you.

 

You'll be doing yourself a huge service with this...because you're going to prevent recurrences of contact and give yourself that much more chance to heal.

[Star_Bright]

He asked me if he could still talk to me and I said no. He said, "what if I need advice?" I said I don't know how I could give him advice, this is an issue he needs to resolve on his own.

 

He told me it is coming soon, that his moving out is imminent, that he doesn't know if he has the capacity to repair his relationship with his wife. Then he asked me if it's possible that he wants me too much, that he got swept away. I said yes because I didn't know what else to say.

 

Then he said he wonders if we are too good to be true and if I thought we could really last long-term. I said I think we could last.

 

Then he said he worries about me because I get sad easily, and he wanted to know if I was going to be all right "for the next few days" because something is going to happen "right away." I said yes I will be okay, I just want a resolution.

 

He told me repeatedly that he loved me. And that he will be moving out or making that decision soon.

 

His waffling just annoys me. There's nothing else I can do to help him make up his mind or leave or stay so I have to just focus on myself. You're right, Owl, that I'm too concerned about losing him. When I dig deep I find that it would feel nice to just be on my own and learn to love myself. I guess I was waiting for him to give me an answer one way or the other and now I am giving myself my own answer which is let go and move on.

 

There is still the issue of his belongings which he left at my house last night. His coat, glasses, and money. I don't know how I return them without having contact with him.

 

You're right, Owl, I don't want him unless he's available to actually be with me.

Edited September 13, 2010 by Star_Bright

[Star_Bright]

He hasn't called me again, for which I am grateful. I had told him to please give me the respect of not contacting me while he is still married/ in the house. He said he does respect me and would not contact me. It gives me a strange peace that he has been true to his word on that. I guess it validates my feeling that he does truly love and respect me. He just has issues to deal with on his own that I can't be apart of because it makes me unhappy.

 

I have felt very strong. I miss him and feel a bit lonely but it is nothing like the deep feelings of depression I was experiencing every time he left to go home to his wife. I feel that having no contact is the right thing and gives me clarity. I'm starting to realize that even though he loves me and said he wants to be with me, he was not ready to do what was necessary to really be with me. And as much as I love him, I don't want to be with someone who can't be with me completely and give me their all.

 

Thank you Owl and YellowShark for all your help. Coming to this forum has been like such a salvation for me. I so appreciate your time and support. Please wish me continued strength.

[Brokenlady]

SB,

I think you're probably right that his 2nd wife had to push him to get him to make good on his promise to her which he now apparently resents as pushy). Some people might regard what she did as helpful - finding him a place to live; but its interesting that he characterizes it as pushy now. Does he regret leaving W #1?

 

I can only imagine how his W must feel knowing she is now in the position of W #1. It doesnt seem like he learned much from his first D. Is he in IC? What is he willing to do to resolve his pattern of cheating and relationship-hopping.

 

Personally, I'd be insulted by his statement that he is essentially going to be too old to cheat on you. Heaven forbid he take any real responsibility for his own actions as opposed to leaving it up to physical deterioration.

 

I wonder though - it seems you wanted him to leave and yet now that he's talking about it, you're getting cold feet. Why is that? What were you getting out of being with an unavailable man and/or what is it about him that makes you fear a legit relationship with him? Just some thoughts....

[Owl]

I absolutely wish you the best, Starbright.

 

I'd like to make a few more suggestions, if you don't mind.

 

1. Fill your time and attention with something else.- One of the best things you can do to help yourself "deal with it" is to get your focus onto something else for a while. Wear yourself out with something different. Now might be a good time to hit the gym, take up martial arts, start running. Something that requires a large amount of attention, and potentially physical effort as well. It'll help you deal with him not "being there", it'll help your body deal with the stress, and it let's your mind refocus.

 

2. Use your "support structure".- Make use of family and friends to help fill that time as well. Try to have one person at least that you can talk about this with...but don't spend all your time/energy doing that.

 

Hang in there, friend. And I'm glad that my advice is helping you some...guess maybe there is a little value for us "bitter-old betrayed spouses" hanging out here on the OW board every once in a while after all.

[Confused4Now]

Please stick to it....When I was at NC I saw more movement from my xMW then I went back onto the roller coaster...finally I just had enough. She did get to a point of one step forward 3 steps back and eventually she was right back where she was when I met her. So stay strong.

 

Don't ever settle you deserve so much more.

[Brokenlady]

Please stick to it....When I was at NC I saw more movement from my xMW then I went back onto the roller coaster...finally I just had enough. She did get to a point of one step forward 3 steps back and eventually she was right back where she was when I met her. So stay strong.

 

Don't ever settle you deserve so much more.

 

There is definitely wisdom in waiting to get reinvolved until the whole enchilada is done. It prevents you from having to deal with the flip flopping and it's a good indicator of his motivation and willingness to change.

[2sure]

I am not going to tell you that you need to put his BS first before yourself or that he should stay in a marriage is unhappy . Exit affairs DO happen.

But the flag to me is that he is already on his second marriage and was a WS both times. I would not be surprised to find out that his current wife was his previous OW. That happens just as often as exit affairs.

 

But either way, to me...the biggest red flag is that he is so insistent that he must leave for you, leave with you to go to, that he will not leave the unhappy marriage without you. That tell me that...his marriage either is not that bad or that whether its you or someone like you he isnt leaving until there is somewhere else to go.

 

This man requires a huge amount of VALIDATION. Through my own experience both as a BS and as OW...these type of men are bottomless pits , will never feel satisfied and validated because they constantly require that other people do for them what really...each of us can only do for ourselves.

 

No Chance.

[Star_Bright]

Hi Brokenlady, I appreciate the thought-provoking questions. Since I can't go to IC right now I feel it helps me learn more about myself. So here go my best answers to your questions.

 

SB,

I think you're probably right that his 2nd wife had to push him to get him to make good on his promise to her which he now apparently resents as pushy). Some people might regard what she did as helpful - finding him a place to live; but its interesting that he characterizes it as pushy now.

 

I also find it interesting. He seems to be a guy who lets other people, well, women, decide his fate and then resents them for it! He resents his wife for a lot of things but then when I point out that he hasn't taken action to make changes, and just let things happen the way she wanted, he agrees that it's his fault for not being more proactive.

 

That's why I haven't been pushy at all, I don't want to make him leave and then have him resent me for it later. (I also just didn't feel right asking or demanding that he leave his family.)

 

Does he regret leaving W #1?

 

No. He regrets cheating on her and hurting her but he says he needed to leave her because she wasn't the right person for him and he wasn't happy with her. He says he just went about it the wrong way. He shouldn't have had to wait for another woman to come along to leave her, but he did.

 

They were together since they were teenagers and were each other's firsts. So he says they had a strong bond but as they grew up they weren't right for each other. Basically she didn't want kids and he did. And for some reason he just wasn't happy with her. Wife #2 wanted kids and they started trying shortly after they were married. What makes me sad is that after she mostly raised the kids for him, he is tired of her and complains about her and says maybe they weren't right for each other either, but he was happy she was a good mother and he just focused on the kids and now it's hard to do that since they are older and almost never home. Now he thinks of being alone with her after the kids are gone and it doesn't sound appealing at all. He says he would have left her after the kids were gone anyway, but that he needs to leave sooner now because he met me.

 

Anyway, he said it was very hard to leave Wife # 1, he was depressed and sad and he still thinks of her fondly and occassionally has contact with her, like when her father died, etc.

 

I can only imagine how his W must feel knowing she is now in the position of W #1. It doesnt seem like he learned much from his first D. Is he in IC? What is he willing to do to resolve his pattern of cheating and relationship-hopping.

 

He is not in IC. I think he should be. He was before and he said that the counselor was able to make him be honest with himself and that helped a lot. This was awhile ago when he was having marital problems with Wife # 2 but supposedly not cheating.

 

I don't know what he is willing to do. His answer to me is that he loves me and could never imagine cheating on me. He says he's met his match with me in that he has never felt as equally strong love for someone as they have felt for him and that he could never take me for granted like that. He also says he is tired of cheating and that it's not worth it.

 

Personally, I'd be insulted by his statement that he is essentially going to be too old to cheat on you. Heaven forbid he take any real responsibility for his own actions as opposed to leaving it up to physical deterioration.

 

Agreed. Even though it was a joke it made me feel kinda ewww.

 

I wonder though - it seems you wanted him to leave and yet now that he's talking about it, you're getting cold feet. Why is that? What were you getting out of being with an unavailable man and/or what is it about him that makes you fear a legit relationship with him? Just some thoughts....

 

I've thought about this a lot and I don't know if I know all the answers yet. In the beginning I didn't think he would leave his family and I didn't want him to. It sounds so bad, it is bad, but I just wanted a fling. We had this crazy connection I wanted to explore and it felt like one of those movies where the guy is wrong for you but you can't help yourself. I know this is bad but I'm just trying to be honest. So at the beginning I never thought of him as a partner. In fact I thought he was a player and assumed he regularly cheated on his wife and, again, please don't reach through the screen and strangle me, but I just wanted to see what all of these crazy feelings for him were about.

 

But, as I've stated, the dynamic of our relationship seems to have been that he starts out saying that he won't leave his family no matter what, then starts talking about leaving them even though I never asked him to. At that point we were in deep and I was beginning to realize I had gotten more than I thought I had signed up for. He was telling me he loved me, that I was his everything, that he wanted to leave for me. And it started to make me feel like, well, I can't just have an affair anymore, it is wrong to both me and her. Yeah, nice time to think of the wife, I know. But I began to question how he could be telling me one thing and her the other. So I told him I could no longer do it and that's when he started talking very concretely about leaving her. So now I think maybe part of him wanted to leave her all along and he was wanting me to help him do that? I don't know. It all happened very fast and is very confusing, hence the title of my thread. So then he keeps telling me he's leaving, maybe to get me to stay I guess, but I didn't ever tell him to leave, and I guess that's why he's gotten upset with me, and said I need to accept the reality that being with me means he won't be with them, and I need to help him through it. I felt so frustrated, thinking, I never asked him to leave, but I can see how he took me wanting out as an ultimatum, or pressure, or a challenge, or something, although I really feel like he brought that on internally, because he knew that me leaving meant he couldn't have me, and he had to make a choice, and maybe partly wanted to leave all along anyway. I wonder if I'm making sense? But writing this out is helping me figure it out.

 

I guess another part of my "cold feet" is that I'm afraid of being hurt. It was all "safe" and fun while we were an affair but if we were actually to be a couple I know I would doubt his ability to be faithful. He is also pretty needy and insecure. When I was with my family in another state he kept asking me whether I had been with anyone else and whether I had stayed faithful to him. This frustrated me to no end because he's the only guy I think about sexually or emotionally. I guess I should say here that the sex is off the charts and I know that's a big reason both of us have stayed in it. So it rattled my mind to think he was thinking I would even want to have sex with anyone else when I have told him constantly that no one has done or could match what we have sexually. I worry that if we are together he will always be suspicious and clingy. It seems that because he hates to be alone he has a tendency to get needy and to expect to be the center of his partner's world. Sadly he IS the center of his wife's world but that still isn't good enough for him. That's what scares me about being with him.

 

Finally, a reason I get cold feet is that I don't feel like I'm in the place to be in a serious relationship (or affair, which is why I'm getting out). I think there is something wrong with me that I would do something that goes against what I believe to be right. I don't think I could treat him or anyone else right until I treat myself right and love myself and until I'm happy on my own. I feel co-dependent on him and I want to only be dependent on myself. I want to take a good six months to a year and not date ANYONE, even him. For this reason I would think it ideal if he separated and spent awhile thinking about what he truly wanted, and if he got healthier and divorced on his own accord, we would have a much better shot of making it in the long-run. But I don't think he would do that because he is afraid of being along with himself. So I am going to do what I think I need to do anyway and whatever happens with him, happens. Sometimes I feel like I play the role of his counselor and the funny thing is, I'm too F-ed up right now to be anyone's counselor! I need to take care of myself and I would like him to take care of himself too.

 

What I want is to be in a healthy fulfilling committed relationship with him, but if that isn't possible I want to be alone. In fact I don't think I can truly be in a healthy fulfilling committed relationship with him until I am alone for awhile and in a healthy state myself. But I would be willing to try to work on myself WITH him if he left her of his own accord. I am not willing to drag him away from her or even to sit and listen to him waffle about whether he wants to stay or go. And if I can't be in a healthy fulfilling committed relationship with him then I am going to wait until I find someone with whom I have passion, open conversations, a physical and emotional connection, everything I have with him, except someone with whom I can be in a REAL relationship.

 

Wow, sorry for talking so much! I guess I have a lot to get out. I appreciate your help and please feel free to ask more questions or call me on any BS. I am trying to be honest with myself because I think that's the first step in being happy. First and foremost I just want to be happy and I don't even know how to get there but I'm trying!

[Star_Bright]

I absolutely wish you the best, Starbright.

 

I'd like to make a few more suggestions, if you don't mind.

 

1. Fill your time and attention with something else.- One of the best things you can do to help yourself "deal with it" is to get your focus onto something else for a while. Wear yourself out with something different. Now might be a good time to hit the gym, take up martial arts, start running. Something that requires a large amount of attention, and potentially physical effort as well. It'll help you deal with him not "being there", it'll help your body deal with the stress, and it let's your mind refocus.

 

I started doing this even before I told him we can't talk anymore. I felt all my time and energy was being devoted to him and I needed to get some of myself back. Also, I was in general unhappy/restless with my life, and I think that's part of what made it possible for me to embark on an affair with him in the first place. Like, I looked to him to distract me from my unhappiness with life.

 

I've always wanted to be a writer but was afraid to pursue my dream. So I recently enrolled in a creative writing class (I have an undergrad and post-grad degree, and this is at a community college, so I'm just going to make sure I keep writing and meet other writers, etc.). That was one of the big reasons I came back here instead of moving to be with the rest of my family. (Plus, I have dogs and a house here. But it does get lonely and I sometimes wish I had stayed with them, especially because, if I'm honest with myself, another reason I came back was to see if things could work out between MM and me).

 

So I've been focusing on my writing and I'm also starting a new job tomorrow. It's funny you mentioned running because I like to run with my dogs and I've been trying to do that more often. I've been thinking of making a training plan to make sure I keep up with it.

 

2. Use your "support structure".- Make use of family and friends to help fill that time as well. Try to have one person at least that you can talk about this with...but don't spend all your time/energy doing that.

 

Hang in there, friend. And I'm glad that my advice is helping you some...guess maybe there is a little value for us "bitter-old betrayed spouses" hanging out here on the OW board every once in a while after all.

 

One of my sisters knows every little detail about me and MM. She doesn't live here and didn't think I should have come back here (ha ha) but it's great to be able to call her whenever I need support. I have another friend who I recently told pretty much everything to, and she is supportive of me. These are the only people I feel I can tell, so it's nice to be able to talk to them and post here on this forum.

 

As usual Owl thanks for the help and keep the suggestions coming.

[Star_Bright]

Please stick to it....When I was at NC I saw more movement from my xMW then I went back onto the roller coaster...finally I just had enough. She did get to a point of one step forward 3 steps back and eventually she was right back where she was when I met her. So stay strong.

 

Don't ever settle you deserve so much more.

 

Thanks, Confused4Now.

 

I told him not to contact me until/unless he has moved out. I figure that's a pretty big step to take. He had told me earlier that he was going to look for places this week. But then he had some more confrontations with his wife so I'm not sure if he still even wants to. Either way the decision is his and I feel that if he moves out without me "making" him do it, he is serious about it. I know there is a chance he could go back and that has been one of my biggest fears. But I would take that risk because I know life isn't perfect and this must be hard for him. At least I could say we both gave it our best shot and if it doesn't work, it doesn't work. At this point, with him staying put, I'm not giving it any kind of shot. And I am going to try so hard not to waffle if he does end up contacting me without having moved out. I will remember your advice in that event.

 

I meant to add -- Confused4now, what did your xMW do that showed movement? Did she move out on her own?

Edited September 14, 2010 by Star_Bright
wanted to add something

[Star_Bright]

I am not going to tell you that you need to put his BS first before yourself or that he should stay in a marriage is unhappy . Exit affairs DO happen.

But the flag to me is that he is already on his second marriage and was a WS both times. I would not be surprised to find out that his current wife was his previous OW. That happens just as often as exit affairs.

 

His current wife was his previous OW, yes.

 

He told me he had several affairs on his first wife. They were all "serious" OW relationships, not "flings." He was with one OW for three years and moved out twice to be with her, but then went back to his first wife.

 

He finally moved out for good for his current wife but now says he felt pressure from her and couldn't deal with the grief of leaving his first wife because she was pushing him by finding him a place and setting them a wedding date, etc. So that is why I am not going to touch helping him leave with a ten foot pool. I realize this probably means I won't end up with him, but I would rather have that outcome than have to pull him out now to get him and then later be resented for having done that.

 

But either way, to me...the biggest red flag is that he is so insistent that he must leave for you, leave with you to go to, that he will not leave the unhappy marriage without you. That tell me that...his marriage either is not that bad or that whether its you or someone like you he isnt leaving until there is somewhere else to go.

 

Perhaps a bit of both. Since I've known him he's acted like Mr. Family Man in public, always talking about his beautiful wife (she is beautiful) and kids, but then I would see him flirt with every woman including me. I just didn't get it and I think part of my attraction to him was trying to figure out this enigma.

 

At first he told me his marriage wasn't bad but then as we went on he would have a lot of gripes and resentments. I've read about "re-writing history" and I don't know if it was that or just that he hadn't been allowing himself to admit that there were deep-seated issues that he had failed to address. At the current point he is saying they are so bad together they will never work out even if he doesn't leave. Having never been married but having seen them together and listening to him it seems to me that he wanted things to be great but really they weren't. Even before I was his OW I wondered why they were together because she is so different from him, perhaps that helped me justify what I was doing. I could just tell that he wasn't really happy with her and they weren't really right together. Other people that know both of them have said the same thing. I know this sounds awful but I'm trying to be truthful. Maybe someone can help me deal with this feeling of... entitlement? I guess it's entitlement and ego. I can't understand why he was ever with her in the first place and I guess I felt that excused my helping him cheat on her.

 

This man requires a huge amount of VALIDATION. Through my own experience both as a BS and as OW...these type of men are bottomless pits , will never feel satisfied and validated because they constantly require that other people do for them what really...each of us can only do for ourselves.

 

No Chance.

 

You are right about him needing constant validation. He came from nothing and built himself up to a very powerful and successful man. I guess he still feels like nothing is good enough? He still wants more? He still doesn't believe in himself?

 

I do feel that he is broken, I guess I feel like I am broken too. I can relate to him because I didn't come from much (more than him, but not much) and I have made a lot out of myself (not as much, but then again I'm a lot younger) and still I'm always reaching for the next best thing. I'm working to be content and find balance. I can really relate to him which was part of my draw to him. I want to become healthy and happy and I want him to become healthy and happy. Maybe part of it was us looking to each other to save us from ourselves.

[2sure]

I do feel that he is broken, I guess I feel like I am broken too. I can relate to him because I didn't come from much (more than him, but not much) and I have made a lot out of myself (not as much, but then again I'm a lot younger) and still I'm always reaching for the next best thing. I'm working to be content and find balance. I can really relate to him which was part of my draw to him. I want to become healthy and happy and I want him to become healthy and happy. Maybe part of it was us looking to each other to save us from ourselves.

 

Look, I am over 40 and have been divorced three times. I am a good person, I am fairly accomplished. I have been both OW and BS. All of that is OK because I have learned and embraced all of my life's lessons. If I could reach out and hug you and then slap you, I would. Its hindsight and not worth much to someone who isnt PAST the experience but:

 

Broken people cannot fix each other. Please, please consider this. Working on finding balance and contentment in your life should not include this man.