Revenge is sweet.......or is it?

[Fight4Me]

Fight4me, I would be very wary about involving the almighty in this equation. After wasn't he the one advocated, "an eye for an eye"? Perhaps the old testament God would be a little more lenient about revenge sex.

 

I'm not wary in the least. The reference of "an eye for an eye" is a concept of reciprocity, not revenge, Biblically speaking. Essentially, it was a rule of law that in the spirit of it meant to make the offended party whole again. As much as I could elaborate using proper hermeneutics, and how God said, "Vengeance is Mine..." and that Jesus elaborated on both, I know that's not what you meant this thread to turn into.

 

I was simply answering your questions and to give some reasoning behind why I believe the way I believe. Hope that helps clear things up.

 

Interesting thread, btw.

[Owl]

My example was if the BS has no intention of reconciling, and only wants to hurt the WS as bad as they themselves have been hurt. I do believe in forgiveness, but only after the bill has been paid in full.

 

Hmmm...but this raises a tangent question for me...

 

OM was a "friend" of mine. So not only did my wife betray me in the affair, but so did he.

 

So would this have justified me taking action against him in some fashion as well? Since I don't like affairs, say I'd have chosen some other means to have him..."pay the bill". Granted most of the things that come to mind are illegal in some fashion or another...but given your context, wouldn't that also mean that any revenge I'd have considered against him should be 'acceptable' as well? Say slipping information about the affair (and money he spent to support it) to his ex-wife to use against him in the upcoming child-custody hearing?

 

Why not? It's just justifiable revenge against someone who hurt me, right?

 

I will admit I absolutely considered a huge variety of things to do to him...from annoyances to things far more....permanent.

 

But in the end, I decided that revenge of any kind was counter-productive. No value in it.

[JustJoe]

Owl, I really don't think we disagree, I'm just playing "devil's advocate", here. I find the subject interesting, from a moral and philosophical perspective. Plus, sometimes I feel that some people seek the moral high ground for no other reason than it puts them above everybody else. Sanctimonious hypocrisy is as un-appealing as infidelity.

[Fight4Me]

I hope you don't believe that my disagreement with revenge affairs means that I consider myself above anyone. Goodness knows I thought of revenge on both fWH and xOW in the short days/weeks after he told me (although, it didn't involve me having a revenge affair). I actually have the means to destroy her, but long ago made peace with her (literally and figuratively). I could have done worse to fWH, too.

 

Something just came to mind, though. I remember my fWH being very concerned that I wanted to have a revenge affair, and I was perplexed as to where that thought kept coming from. I wonder if, statistically, men are more inclined to consider it than women?

[JustJoe]

Fight 4me, that is another good question. Does being male or female have anything to do with this issue?

[Owl]

I don't think gender has any bearing on whether or not someone would CONSIDER a revenge affair.

 

I think that men are more likely to do it and then BRAG about it than women are. But I'd suspect that there's little difference between genders as far as who actually does it or not. I've known men and women who've engaged in them.

[Dexter Morgan]

When talking about EMA'S, sometimes the BS has a "revenge affair", and is almost universally execrated for it. Why? Without resorting to cliche's (two wrongs don't make a right), etc, what is wrong with a revenge affair?

 

because a cheater is a cheater.

 

 

It punishes the WS, restores some of the self-esteem lost by the BS, and puts everybody on the same page relationshipwise. Please give me your opinions, pro and con. Please also, be respectful.

 

lets put it this way, if I knew someone had revenge cheated in their marriage, I wouldn't date them if they got divorced. it shows a level of vindictiveness I wouldn't want in a partner.

 

Also, calling it revenge is just an excuse. someone who "revenge" cheats would have liked to have cheated all along in my opinon, just refrained from doing so.

[Dexter Morgan]

BL, I suspect that a great many other posters, if they were really honest with themselves, would jump at the chance for a little tit-for-tat.

 

if I were to cheat in revenge, I'd now have something about me that would be undesirable to a good woman.

If I cheated, I wouldn't expect a good woman i am dating in the future to be ok with it, revenge or not. I'd be damaged goods.

[silktricks]

When talking about EMA'S, sometimes the BS has a "revenge affair", and is almost universally execrated for it. Why? Without resorting to cliche's (two wrongs don't make a right), etc, what is wrong with a revenge affair? It punishes the WS, restores some of the self-esteem lost by the BS, and puts everybody on the same page relationshipwise. Please give me your opinions, pro and con. Please also, be respectful.

 

I haven't read any of this thread, yet... I'm saying that just so if I repeat something everyone else has said, you'll know....

 

I am against revenge affairs - heartily against them - because usually the person most punished is the person who is already hurting - the former BS turned WS. Though it may on one level restore some of the BS' self-esteem (feeling wanted, sexually excited and exciting, etc..) it also has the capacity to badly damage self-esteem if they go against their own basic moral code in having the revenge affair.

 

It took me well over a decade to even begin to forgive myself for having the affair I indulged in. It's not something I would suggest to anyone at any time.

 

As for punishing the WS. Why bother with a revenge affair? If you need to feel that kind of revenge, just leave him and get on with your life. Obviously the marriage is not going to be recoverable, not with both of you playing the field.

 

And lastly, the BS is at this point at an extremely vulnerable spot. The possibility/probability of falling deeply in love with your AP is pretty high. Accordingly to most (I don't know if true or not, but lets say it is...) the probability of the affair working out long term appears to not be good. You are setting yourself up for more pain.

 

After your spouse has cheated on you, if you've no desire to recover the marriage - get out of it. Move on with your life. If you've a desire to recover the marriage, then work at resolving the problem in the marriage. A revenge affair does nothing positive for you in either situation.

 

JMO

[redtail]

Fair enough, Redtail. I also wonder if the possibility of reconciliation might inhibit the desire for revenge? If you already know that you're not going to take the WS back, it might influence your , very human, want/need to punish them.

 

I think that's a good point, and may apply whether or not you intend to stay. But if you leave, is that really an affair or just an early start to your new single life?

[wheelwright]

I have a M friend who was cheated on years ago, just before her M.

 

She has harboured fantasies of an EMR ever since, (13 years). Because her STBH's betrayal ruined her perception of M and love in terms of fidelity, but also opened her up to the idea of someone else.

 

And she had a brief EA, but still wants PA with someone.

 

A revenge A is pointless if just for revenge - who will you really hurt? But you may be left with the need to explore yourself, knowing your partner has, depending on who you are.

 

And really, I don't see why not. I have told my H (I am a WW) he is free to explore in this way should he wish. Wouldn't it be hypocritical of me to say otherwise?

[2long]

BL, I suspect that a great many other posters, if they were really honest with themselves, would jump at the chance for a little tit-for-tat.

 

...if you'll pardon the expression:D

 

-ol' 2long

[Snowflower]

I don't believe me having a revenge affair is true revenge. It may even the playing field, so much so that my fWH would be absolved of guilt, of doing any hard work on himself, of having to look around at his family (particularly me), and say, "my God, what have I done? I almost lost them!"

 

Why would I want to let him off so easy?

 

Why would I want to usurp the process of healing in both myself AND him?

 

Why would I go against everything I teach my children, ultimately sabotaging any credibility I have with them?

 

Why would I want to carry around the shame of some disgusting memory for the rest of my life?

 

My wedding vows were first and foremost to God Himself, so why would I break my promise to Him when He wasn't responsible for my fWH's actions? That's a position I'd rather not be in, and tremble at the thought.

 

IMO, this is the best post out of a thread that has all really thought-provoking posts.

 

I really liked the bolded part and wanted to reiterate it. My H and I are currently separated, each of us working out our own issues. But, we did reconcile well partly because we each took responsibility for the our part in our marriage going wrong.

 

I think if I had had a revenge affair, it would have put us so far back in our recovery that I don't think it would have ever been possible to rebuild. My H wouldn't have had to do any introspection, feel any remorse, or examine his own actions (to have an A) because an RA by me would have negated the need. Not to mention all the additional pain that it would have caused.

 

As another poster said, it seems especially cruel to inflict the same pain that you have received on some else...no matter how much they may "deserve" it. As a BS, you know how badly it hurts. A WS might be able to be given the benefit of the doubt since they weren't on the receiving end of the betrayal--they don't know exactly how it feels.

[Snowflower]

if I were to cheat in revenge, I'd now have something about me that would be undesirable to a good woman.

If I cheated, I wouldn't expect a good woman i am dating in the future to be ok with it, revenge or not. I'd be damaged goods.

 

Interesting perspective--I like that it is more specific than "two wrongs don't make a right." I know I didn't want to return the favor to my H (by having a RA) because it would have resulted in the loss in my own integrity. I had already lost so much.

[wheelwright]

IMO, this is the best post out of a thread that has all really thought-provoking posts.

 

I really liked the bolded part and wanted to reiterate it. My H and I are currently separated, each of us working out our own issues. But, we did reconcile well partly because we each took responsibility for the our part in our marriage going wrong.

 

I think if I had had a revenge affair, it would have put us so far back in our recovery that I don't think it would have ever been possible to rebuild. My H wouldn't have had to do any introspection, feel any remorse, or examine his own actions (to have an A) because an RA by me would have negated the need. Not to mention all the additional pain that it would have caused.

 

As another poster said, it seems especially cruel to inflict the same pain that you have received on some else...no matter how much they may "deserve" it. As a BS, you know how badly it hurts. A WS might be able to be given the benefit of the doubt since they weren't on the receiving end of the betrayal--they don't know exactly how it feels.

 

Perhaps some of us want to ?

[bentnotbroken]

Perhaps some of us want to ?

 

 

You don't know what you are saying. Why would you want to experience the death of something you will never get back?

[wheelwright]

You don't know what you are saying. Why would you want to experience the death of something you will never get back?

 

No disrespect here, I have learnt to respect you.

 

But the thought is, the fidelity part of the contract is already dead. Or at least worth a lot less.

 

But I understand what you say. For many years I felt in my R that sex was a special place only me and my partner went. When it was broken, I didn't feel the same.

 

Then what?

[bentnotbroken]

No disrespect here, I have learnt to respect you.

 

But the thought is, the fidelity part of the contract is already dead. Or at least worth a lot less.

 

But I understand what you say. For many years I felt in my R that sex was a special place only me and my partner went. When it was broken, I didn't feel the same.

 

Then what?

 

 

Life is for living and learning. If what you did before didn't work try somthing new...like loving you first.

[kis]

No disrespect here, I have learnt to respect you.

 

But the thought is, the fidelity part of the contract is already dead. Or at least worth a lot less.

 

But I understand what you say. For many years I felt in my R that sex was a special place only me and my partner went. When it was broken, I didn't feel the same.

 

Then what?

 

totally get what you are saying. The marriage vows are already broken.

[JustJoe]

My opinion is that once the marriage vows are broken by the WS, the BS owes the WS no consideration whatsoever, unless it is the desire of the BS, that reconciliation take place. While I personally don't think a full blown revenge affair is a good idea ( hurting an innocent person) a ONS or FWB might be good for the BS'S ego, as long as the OP is aware of the situation. How about that idea?

[bentnotbroken]

My opinion is that once the marriage vows are broken by the WS, the BS owes the WS no consideration whatsoever, unless it is the desire of the BS, that reconciliation take place. While I personally don't think a full blown revenge affair is a good idea ( hurting an innocent person) a ONS or FWB might be good for the BS'S ego, as long as the OP is aware of the situation. How about that idea?

 

 

Nope. Still smells like crap. You can dress a pig up in pearls and a wig...it's still a pig.

[Owl]

Again, two wrongs don't make it right.

 

Just because the other person showed poor judgement/etc... first, it's still never an excuse for you to engage in that same behavior.

 

It's not about "owing". It's about what YOU choose, rather than what you owe the other person.

 

I don't think I can add much more to this conversation. Pretty much said all I can say.

[thinkfast444]

I don't believe me having a revenge affair is true revenge. It may even the playing field, so much so that my fWH would be absolved of guilt, of doing any hard work on himself, of having to look around at his family (particularly me), and say, "my God, what have I done? I almost lost them!"

 

Why would I want to let him off so easy?

 

Why would I want to usurp the process of healing in both myself AND him?

 

Why would I go against everything I teach my children, ultimately sabotaging any credibility I have with them?

 

Why would I want to carry around the shame of some disgusting memory for the rest of my life?

 

My wedding vows were first and foremost to God Himself, so why would I break my promise to Him when He wasn't responsible for my fWH's actions? That's a position I'd rather not be in, and tremble at the thought.

 

I've been through a hell of a time. I walked in on my W three months ago and it knocked me for a loop. I'm still trying to figure out who I am and have been searching around for an RA to call my own. I do love my W and want to remain with her till I grow old, but I'm not sure I can go on without restoring the balance somehow. At least that's what I've told myself.

 

Every day I look for an AP and look in every situation. I think it is now dominating my life. The objective me knows it's wrong and hurtful to me but the emotional me just wants to be an idiot.

 

I still haven't found counseling and this would be a good idea.

 

TF

[Owl]

So just how is this going to restore the balance?

 

What other methods/outlets are the two of you using to try to recover your marriage?

 

I'd seriously suggest counseling before a revenge affair....at least if you intend to try to reconcile your marriage.

[2sure]

Morals aside then, I still think a revenge affair is a horrible idea for BS.

Having been in those shoes I completely understand what the motivation might be. Revenge, sure but more than that its probably an attempt to get some validation, to feel attractive, recoup some self esteem or even to try to get some understanding of what your WS got out of it.

 

But it doesnt work that way. What happens is that afterward you feel cheap and desperate. Like you stooped too low. Having almost done it myself...I felt as though it was just another blow to myself. It made me feel even worse about myself, personally. Who needs that at such a time?

 

And...since the affair is had for revenge or out of insecurity - the results will be unsatisfying and will only hightlight to a BS that their WS tossed them aside for not much more than a cheap thrill or an ego feed.

 

Plus, having an affair yourself kind of takes away the righteous indignity that sometimes carries you through parts of the crisis.

 

Nope, a bad idea.