U1987 Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 To be honest, I really don't understand why girls reject guys for dates, either in the form of a straight, flat rejection, or in the case of her giving him her number, but ghosting when he tries to reach her. It really doesn't make much sense to me. I've always heard that women are attracted more to a guy's personality than his looks. The whole point of a date for the guy is to get to show his personality to her. Before the first date, she doesn't know a thing about him; he hasn't shown his personality to her. So what could she possibly be basing a rejection on if she knows nothing about the guy?
Star Gazer Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 If she knows absolutely nothing about his personality, then she's basing her decision on physical attraction only. But the girl who inspired this thread does know you...
tami-chan Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 So what could she possibly be basing a rejection on if she knows nothing about the guy? Obvious reasons: looks, money (evidence of the lack of it)...shallow, I know, but you asked.
L3stat Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 Lol the above post was funny. People go of looks, we all do it we talk or try talking to people who we think are beautiful. If we think there not attractive then we really don't bother or give them a chance. Not everyone goes off looks but most do. Sorry you got rejected lol.
SteveC80 Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 lol you must be a young guy, women value looks as much if not more then men unless you have money and power If u are an unattratcive man well good luck because it wont be easy
jamesum Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 I dont know why a lot of men are so desperate for a 'chance'. Personally I dont wanna be given a 'chance'. I prefer someone who desires me as much as I desire her. Maybe when you are younger you are obsessed with scoring with the hottest chicks. But when you get a bit older you will pass that "Esteem" stage where everything you do is motivated by how others see you and move toward the "Self-Actualization" phase where everything you do is influenced by your internal personal desires only.
USMCHokie Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 I've always heard that women are attracted more to a guy's personality than his looks. The whole point of a date for the guy is to get to show his personality to her. Before the first date, she doesn't know a thing about him; he hasn't shown his personality to her. You're right, women are often more attracted to a man's personality, BUT, "looks are what get you in the door...personality is what keeps you in the house..." Realistically, you have to exhibit some modicum of physical attractiveness to the girl you're asking out. And sorry, but no girl is obligated to date you...and you aren't entitled to get a date from every girl you ask out... So what could she possibly be basing a rejection on if she knows nothing about the guy? Let's flip your question around a bit... "So what could she possibly be basing an acceptance on if she knows nothing about the guy?"
gypsy_nicky Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 If she knows absolutely nothing about his personality, then she's basing her decision on physical attraction only. But the girl who inspired this thread does know you... you'd have to be extremely attractive (rare) as a guy for a girl to not reject you if she is going by looks alone. Otherwise if she barely knows you its because your a stranger that's it, i.e cold approaching.
meerkat stew Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 Women are every bit as into looks as men are, young women even moreso into looks than young men. This is so because young men seek young women for the potential of sex, young women seek young men as defining of her social value. The best genes, not just good ones, are one of the indicia of social value. This also explains in the "single" world why 5-10% of the men have most of the sex with little effort. The best male genes are always welcome by females. It also explains to an extent why girls reject guys for dates. Take two equally physically attractive, intelligent people. The girl will say "no" as often as not. Why? Social value. They are both "average" but he is not "the best." But there is a back door in the biology for ensuring that the genes stay diverse. That is infatuation, a much more random phenomenon than pure selection. And this is why musicians and hyper-emotional men, PUAs, etc. who make relationships their raison d etre exist. They have learned to short-circuit the hard, cold social value selection process. They may or may not have social value, and this answers another question, "why do women tend to end up with what people call 'jerks?'" Those guys, regardless of their quality, have learned how to break the code through the backdoor of the female selection process, or at least one female's process. It is easy to find someone who is sexually attractive, lots qualify, much harder to compete for the quarterback, as there is only one of him. "Quarterback" is symbolic for those who didn't instantly know upon reading it, not suggesting all women are into jocks. Since few of us are quarterback caliber, ringers in the genetic social value world, we must focus on the back door to successfully mate. So if you are seeking success with women at large, it is best to strive to improve the presentation of your genes to the extent possible while also learning how to unlock the gate to the back door. Armed with as much of both of those, your "no" rate should go down and your "yes" rate up. This "two way path" is not the only way. Some people grow up eventually into cognizant rational human beings, most never do, and it has nothing to do with age, but of character, self-understanding, and the big brain conquering the lizard brain. A grown person, male or female, has matured past the two-fold type of selection described above and selects on more advanced characteristics. Many mimic lip service to these advanced human characteristics, but it's just lip service. Most young people today don't grow up nearly as fast as in the past, and are pure lizard in human skin. Lots stay lizard their whole lives. The best unions are between two "big brains." All this is about large numbers and bell curves, not about any single poster's preferences or quirks. Despite that people fall all over the bell curve, though, there is definitely a fat of the distribution and narrow tails.
somedude81 Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 The stupidest thing is when a girl who is single and hasn't dated anybody in a while rejects you. Makes one wonder if they are really that poor quality of a guy or if she's waiting for her freaking prince charming. Too bad for her, prince charming is busy sleeping with hotter women.
carhill Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 So what could she possibly be basing a rejection on if she knows nothing about the guy? How she feels. It's as simple and as complex as that. Fugetabout ever understanding it. Do what *you* want and, if she feels good about it, she'll come along for the ride. If not, oh well. You're alone when you die anyway. Enjoy the ride
counterman Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 Simply because they can. If she is interested enough, she'll go on the date. If not, she won't. How do you meet a "big brain", meerkat? Because it seems the social group I am in, everyone has this misconception about dating and the stay in this world of immaturity which I struggle to thrive in. I am more comfortable with more level-headed people. Is it just a random occurrence that happens when you continue to ask girls out? Some girls, as somedude said, do reject guys even if they have never dated before. I have heard it first hand a few times that "looking for prince charming" is a real reason that some girls do reject guys. If you happen to be a guy that she rejects, then smile and move on. It has happened to me but has never, ever got to me. Because some lucky, and smart girl is going to have me, whilst she is still waiting for something that will never happen. She's going to have to settle for someone sooner or later. Just be glad it isn't you.
gypsy_nicky Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 But there is a back door in the biology for ensuring that the genes stay diverse. That is infatuation, a much more random phenomenon than pure selection. And this is why musicians and hyper-emotional men, PUAs, etc. who make relationships their raison d etre exist. They have learned to short-circuit the hard, cold social value selection process. T So if you are seeking success with women at large, it is best to strive to improve the presentation of your genes to the extent possible while also learning how to unlock the gate to the back door. Armed with as much of both of those, your "no" rate should go down and your "yes" rate up. these backdoor people you're talking of are not a product of biology alone, they mostly learn these things socially. They eventually find out about the proper social dynamics going on between man and woman in a dating context. WTH is with this lizard brain crap?!
Stung Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 How she feels. It's as simple and as complex as that. Fugetabout ever understanding it. Do what *you* want and, if she feels good about it, she'll come along for the ride. If not, oh well. You're alone when you die anyway. Enjoy the ride That's a good point. I personally have turned down dates because I found somebody physically unattractive, sure--also because I found their demeanor and carriage unattractive, or just didn't like their style or thought their hygiene was bad--and sometimes just because I wasn't looking for a date at that time, I wasn't in the mood to be approached, I was seeing somebody else already, I didn't feel up to chit-chat with a stranger, I was focused on some other life event, I had PMS, and for many other reasons. It didn't always reflect so awfully on them, as much as it might have reflected poor timing in a greater sense, or my own poor mood. Those were 'cold calls' from strangers. Usually though I have had some idea of the person beyond their looks, as a large percentage of the men who have asked me out or hit on me were either known by me in some capacity already (work, school, friends of friends, etc) or had an online profile and persona I could read/look into. I have also turned down dates with very attractive-looking men who read as simple-minded or shallow douchebags in their profiles, or who had horrible grammar, or who didn't seem to have much to talk about, had no wit. The majority of guys I wasn't interested didn't seem like awful guys, they just seemed kind of boring. It is what it is.
carhill Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 OP, to boil down another 'reason', which Stung described well, *timing* is completely nebulous but a critical factor in both how the woman *feels* as well as whether accepting your kind invitation is *convenient* for her. You will never have any concept of when the timing is right, so it's one more thing to accept and fuggetabout. When everything objectively seems 'wrong' and yet this woman is looking you in the eye like she wants to devour you, then you'll summarily not care one whit about this thread. This I hope for you.
that girl Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 I've always heard that women are attracted more to a guy's personality than his looks. This really isn't true. While it is possible for a woman to think a guy is so-so and later become attracted to him, physical attraction is important and a woman can know she would never be into a guy at a glance. But it isn't about being the hottest guy in the world. I and most of my female friends have felt immediate physical attraction to guys who are not crazy good looking. There are all kinds of personal preferences and phermones. The stupidest thing is when a girl who is single and hasn't dated anybody in a while rejects you. Makes one wonder if they are really that poor quality of a guy or if she's waiting for her freaking prince charming. Too bad for her, prince charming is busy sleeping with hotter women. Do you really want girls who are not attracted to you to go out with you? OP, to boil down another 'reason', which Stung described well, *timing* is completely nebulous but a critical factor in both how the woman *feels* as well as whether accepting your kind invitation is *convenient* for her. You will never have any concept of when the timing is right, so it's one more thing to accept and fuggetabout. This is completely true. Too often guys assume that girls must be receptive to dates at all times, but you don't know what is going on her life. She could have just been dumped, she could be grieving the loss of someone close to her, she could be crazy busy at work/school. In some cases, she might overlook these things for a guy who really knocks her socks off, but sometimes it just isn't going to happen no matter who you are.
meerkat stew Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 WTH is with this lizard brain crap?! A vogueish explanation of our brains in the 60s, triune brain theory, now discredited, split our brains into lizard brain (involuntary), early mammal (limbic), and later mammal (cerebral cortex). Despite that it is discredited in a strict neurophysiological sense, I think it is very useful in understanding some generalities of our mating and dating behavior. "Primitive" brain is a substitute if you find "lizard brain" offensive or undignified.
carhill Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 IMO, having owned some big lizards, that moniker seems quite appropriate. They simply eat, poop, and make little lizards. Pretty basic cold-blooded reptile stuff. If the female doesn't like him, he gets a tail in the face or a nice 'love' bite. OP, if you want to learn more about rejection, watch lizards
gypsy_nicky Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 IMO, having owned some big lizards, that moniker seems quite appropriate. They simply eat, poop, and make little lizards. Pretty basic cold-blooded reptile stuff. If the female doesn't like him, he gets a tail in the face or a nice 'love' bite. OP, if you want to learn more about rejection, watch lizards nice analogy from a nice guy.
gypsy_nicky Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 A vogueish explanation of our brains in the 60s, triune brain theory, now discredited, split our brains into lizard brain (involuntary), early mammal (limbic), and later mammal (cerebral cortex). Despite that it is discredited in a strict neurophysiological sense, I think it is very useful in understanding some generalities of our mating and dating behavior. "Primitive" brain is a substitute if you find "lizard brain" offensive or undignified. those terms are not offensive and they are outdated 'pop' culture terms. No need for them.
Chicago_Guy Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 The stupidest thing is when a girl who is single and hasn't dated anybody in a while rejects you. Makes one wonder if they are really that poor quality of a guy or if she's waiting for her freaking prince charming. Too bad for her, prince charming is busy sleeping with hotter women. I don't see a problem with this. We all have dating criteria. Have you ever had an unattractive girl chase after you? I have and it can be awkward for me. I am sure it is awkward for women when a guy to whom they are not attracted chases after them.
Eeyore79 Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 It's rare that I know nothing about a guy apart from how he looks. Even if we just met, a brief conversation can tell me how he behaves, whether he's confident and funny, polite and courteous, smart and intellectual, maybe what he does for a living, what he's interested in, whether he has kids... these are all criteria which I'll use to decide whether I'm interested in dating him. Even without speaking to him at all, I can tell a lot from his style of dress and the quality of his clothes, the way he carries himself and interacts with other people, etc. This is why pickup artists are successful - they purposely dress and act in a way which women find attractive, and give signals of being high value and therefore worth dating. There have been occasions where I wasn't attracted to a guy when I first met him because I didn't recognise his value - maybe he didn't immediately jump out at me as being good looking, confident, etc. But after I've gotten to know him, I've observed that he is actually a high value male (funny, smart, confident, talented, good job, decent person, etc) and I've therefore become attracted to him. Whether a girl wants to date you is all about whether she recognises your value (or indeed, whether you actually have any).
loverofloveandstuff Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 (edited) To be honest, I really don't understand why girls reject guys for dates, either in the form of a straight, flat rejection, or in the case of her giving him her number, but ghosting when he tries to reach her. It really doesn't make much sense to me. I've always heard that women are attracted more to a guy's personality than his looks. The whole point of a date for the guy is to get to show his personality to her. Before the first date, she doesn't know a thing about him; he hasn't shown his personality to her. So what could she possibly be basing a rejection on if she knows nothing about the guy? I don't mean to be rude (maybe I do ), but guys like you really give me the ****s. Judging by your other thread, you really don't know how to take a hint and you definitely don't know how to take rejection. Persistence does not work when a girl is not interested. It's just irritating and smothering. As for said girl giving you her number. You've put her in a pretty difficult position to say no. I would feel obliged to give my lab partner my number if he asked for it. You've basically cornered her. I would then feel very uncomfortable if he then began asking me out. She ignored you because she wasn't interested. Maybe you thought she was playing hard to get or something, but usually that's a clear sign she just doesn't want to go there. BIG fail when you kept pushing it. Hey, don't make it her fault. It's not. Quite frankly, I feel sorry for her. You have to see eachother every week, I would think she feels more embarassed than you. And this thread? By your misguided logic women don't have the right to reject a date? Please. Edited September 10, 2010 by loverofloveandstuff
meerkat stew Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 those terms are not offensive and they are outdated 'pop' culture terms. No need for them. Like or dislike the term, the concept "lizard brain" is neither "outdated," nor "pop." The physiological theory is not in favor, but that has no bearing on the term's usefulness in psychological understanding.
irc333 Posted September 10, 2010 Posted September 10, 2010 Very good post....however, now I'm noticing even overweight women or just women who aren't that much to look at, are wanting these very same men though. That's what's got me scratching my head. Women are every bit as into looks as men are, young women even moreso into looks than young men. This is so because young men seek young women for the potential of sex, young women seek young men as defining of her social value. The best genes, not just good ones, are one of the indicia of social value. This also explains in the "single" world why 5-10% of the men have most of the sex with little effort. The best male genes are always welcome by females. It also explains to an extent why girls reject guys for dates. Take two equally physically attractive, intelligent people. The girl will say "no" as often as not. Why? Social value. They are both "average" but he is not "the best." But there is a back door in the biology for ensuring that the genes stay diverse. That is infatuation, a much more random phenomenon than pure selection. And this is why musicians and hyper-emotional men, PUAs, etc. who make relationships their raison d etre exist. They have learned to short-circuit the hard, cold social value selection process. They may or may not have social value, and this answers another question, "why do women tend to end up with what people call 'jerks?'" Those guys, regardless of their quality, have learned how to break the code through the backdoor of the female selection process, or at least one female's process. It is easy to find someone who is sexually attractive, lots qualify, much harder to compete for the quarterback, as there is only one of him. "Quarterback" is symbolic for those who didn't instantly know upon reading it, not suggesting all women are into jocks. Since few of us are quarterback caliber, ringers in the genetic social value world, we must focus on the back door to successfully mate. So if you are seeking success with women at large, it is best to strive to improve the presentation of your genes to the extent possible while also learning how to unlock the gate to the back door. Armed with as much of both of those, your "no" rate should go down and your "yes" rate up. This "two way path" is not the only way. Some people grow up eventually into cognizant rational human beings, most never do, and it has nothing to do with age, but of character, self-understanding, and the big brain conquering the lizard brain. A grown person, male or female, has matured past the two-fold type of selection described above and selects on more advanced characteristics. Many mimic lip service to these advanced human characteristics, but it's just lip service. Most young people today don't grow up nearly as fast as in the past, and are pure lizard in human skin. Lots stay lizard their whole lives. The best unions are between two "big brains." All this is about large numbers and bell curves, not about any single poster's preferences or quirks. Despite that people fall all over the bell curve, though, there is definitely a fat of the distribution and narrow tails.
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