MM on the Fence...and the drama continues

[BurriedAlive]

Well the last few days have been quite eventful.

 

I hadn't heard from MM for a week after he told me he was going back to W for the kids. I didn't text him or call him and just made an attempt to move on in spite of the fact I knew that it wouldn't work.

 

Yesterday, W started calling me and texting me saying she wanted to speak to me. She claims that MM is "begging her to take him back." I didn't answer her calls or text messages. I forwarded them to MM. Of course, this prompted an immediate phone call from him. He told me that he told her we were together when they had broken up and she is freaking out. I told him I wanted absolutely nothing to do with talking to her. He was to handle his own mess. As far as I was concerned, they were broken up when we were together and I did not owe her anything. Luckily she has not contacted me since.

 

MM called me back last night and we talked for over an hour. He said that he missed me so much and that even when he was home for 4 days, he kept thinking of me. He also didn't know what do about W. He doesn't love her but wants to be able to see the kids and feels that if he doesn't stay with her, she will make that very difficult.

 

Well since last night, I think they have broken up 3 times and gotten back together 2. She is all over the board. He keeps texting me. He even showed up at work today! He works for a related company and was picking something up (conveniently). I didn't talk to him as I only walked by him and smiled. Right now he is "talking" to her. He is going to call me tonight. He says that he can't stop talking to me.

 

So I have made it CRYSTAL clear to him that I will not be his OW. I will be his friend and if we meet it will be in public places as long as he is still with W. We haven't discussed him being single although should that happen (and is more than likely), I want some time to pass before we jump back into anything.

 

He doesn't seem to know what he wants though. It seems to be up to W. He can't seem to take a stand with her and keeps playing into her "ups and downs." God only knows what will happen tonight.

 

Is this common for them to be on the fence like this? Am I doing the right thing? I know BSs are going to say that I need to go away and leave him alone. I don't really want to do that. I have told him that all he needs to do is say the words and I will never contact him again. He said he can't. He enjoys my company far too much.

 

Thanks

[Brokenlady]

Is this common for them to be on the fence like this? Am I doing the right thing? Thanks

 

Yes, unfortunately, I think it is. My xDM would tell me ever other week after he moved out that he HAD to go back to his W because of the kids. He usually saw what a bad idea this was before actually doing anything about it. He continued to flip flop after the divorce, and now 1.5 years later, she still wants him back and he's still struggling to let go of the idea of the happy married family. Holding his hand through all of that nearly killed me emotionally.

 

One minute he'd take me away for a nice weekend at the beach and the next he'd be begging me to leave his house because hus xW was coming over to get something and he didn't want her to see me and freak out. I had to be quiet when he was the phone with her so she wouldn't know I was there, and other times we'd out in public without a care of who saw us.

 

What your guy is telling you know is that he doesn't want to let go of his M yet and wants you to hold his hand. He wants you to do all this and doesn't care how much it hurts you because HE enjoys your company. Is this really what you want?

 

I spent years with this man - who let his xW lead the whole process and so I never felt like he "chose" me. And he may never really let go of the M even though I don't think he will ever go back to her.

 

Bottom line - screw what he wants, needs, and enjoys right now. What do you need? What will be healthy for you emotionally?

[BurriedAlive]

Yes, unfortunately, I think it is. My xDM would tell me ever other week after he moved out that he HAD to go back to his W because of the kids. He usually saw what a bad idea this was before actually doing anything about it. He continued to flip flop after the divorce, and now 1.5 years later, she still wants him back and he's still struggling to let go of the idea of the happy married family. Holding his hand through all of that nearly killed me emotionally.

 

One minute he'd take me away for a nice weekend at the beach and the next he'd be begging me to leave his house because hus xW was coming over to get something and he didn't want her to see me and freak out. I had to be quiet when he was the phone with her so she wouldn't know I was there, and other times we'd out in public without a care of who saw us.

 

What your guy is telling you know is that he doesn't want to let go of his M yet and wants you to hold his hand. He wants you to do all this and doesn't care how much it hurts you because HE enjoys your company. Is this really what you want?

 

I spent years with this man - who let his xW lead the whole process and so I never felt like he "chose" me. And he may never really let go of the M even though I don't think he will ever go back to her.

 

Bottom line - screw what he wants, needs, and enjoys right now. What do you need? What will be healthy for you emotionally?

 

 

Very interesting... Thank you. What do I want? I think that is the question, isn't it? Well I really enjoy his company and I am so attracted to him. He makes me feel really good. On the other hand though, I honestly don't think I would be hurt if he told me that he couldn't speak to me ever again. I would really just move on. I don't think I have a whole lot to loose at this point to stick around and hold his hand. I guess if my feelings start to change that I will cut bait... I don't think in this case he is holding on to the happy "M" dream. She is just holding the kids over his head and he loves them. I don't think he loves her though. Oh well, it's entertainment if nothing else.

[fooled once]

Well the last few days have been quite eventful.

 

I hadn't heard from MM for a week after he told me he was going back to W for the kids. I didn't text him or call him and just made an attempt to move on in spite of the fact I knew that it wouldn't work.

 

Yesterday, W started calling me and texting me saying she wanted to speak to me. She claims that MM is "begging her to take him back." I didn't answer her calls or text messages. I forwarded them to MM. Of course, this prompted an immediate phone call from him. He told me that he told her we were together when they had broken up and she is freaking out. I told him I wanted absolutely nothing to do with talking to her. He was to handle his own mess. As far as I was concerned, they were broken up when we were together and I did not owe her anything. Luckily she has not contacted me since.

 

MM called me back last night and we talked for over an hour. He said that he missed me so much and that even when he was home for 4 days, he kept thinking of me. He also didn't know what do about W. He doesn't love her but wants to be able to see the kids and feels that if he doesn't stay with her, she will make that very difficult.

 

Well since last night, I think they have broken up 3 times and gotten back together 2. She is all over the board. He keeps texting me. He even showed up at work today! He works for a related company and was picking something up (conveniently). I didn't talk to him as I only walked by him and smiled. Right now he is "talking" to her. He is going to call me tonight. He says that he can't stop talking to me.

 

So I have made it CRYSTAL clear to him that I will not be his OW. I will be his friend and if we meet it will be in public places as long as he is still with W. We haven't discussed him being single although should that happen (and is more than likely), I want some time to pass before we jump back into anything.

 

He doesn't seem to know what he wants though. It seems to be up to W. He can't seem to take a stand with her and keeps playing into her "ups and downs." God only knows what will happen tonight.

 

Is this common for them to be on the fence like this? Am I doing the right thing? I know BSs are going to say that I need to go away and leave him alone. I don't really want to do that. I have told him that all he needs to do is say the words and I will never contact him again. He said he can't. He enjoys my company far too much.

 

Thanks

 

I am not a BS and I am going to say leave him be and let him make his own decision. Stop being his sounding board, stop being his pal, stop being his soft landing. Make him stand up for himself and make him make his own decision, without you there to 'pick him up'.

 

I don't understand why these guys can't end their marriage if they are so unhappy and please, please do not tell me "because of the kids". If it was because of the kids, then they wouldn't be betraying the mother of these kids. If they really had their kids best interest, they would NOT be spending that time they could be with their kids with the OW. They would be doing everything in their power to show their kids what a good, honest, upstanding, decent role model they are. They would not show them cowardice, dishonesty, betrayal and lies. They would be proud of how they conduct themselves in a tough situation. I highly doubt any of these cheaters (male or female) are proud of their behavior. They didn't 'make a mistake'. They used malicious intent. It wasn't a drunken 'oops'. It was planned, calculated and devious behavior that continued. That isn't a mistake. That is intentional and it isn't very model like behavior I think anyone would want their kids to learn.

[Gfkr2]

I gather your MM's change of heart has more to do with his current financial situation than anything else. Sounds like he figured out between alimony, child support and college education the right thing to do was a full retreat.

 

The size of a man's wallet great influences his decision whether or not to divorce his W and move on with the OW. I can tell you from personal experience the MM more often than not returns to his W and kids, so you situation is common. That the MM still wants his cake on the side is typical of the breed:rolleyes:

 

You are wise to tell him about not wanting to be the OW while he is with his W.

[2sure]

He cant stay away from you and he is leaving it to his wife to decide what to do...but his wife cant make major life decisions because she has no idea what the truth is.

 

Its a good idea not to be OW until his wife makes a decision. I would not want to leave decisions about my relationships and life to a woman who is not only a BS but being influenced and manipulated by someone not telling the truth.

 

I dont see how it would be possible for her to prevent his seeing the his children....50% of people with kids are divorced and most are able to see their kids whether the ex wants them to or not. More likely he is concerned he cannot afford a divorce and child support...and thats reasonable...but why doesnt he just put his cards on the table?

 

Like I said, you of course are doing the right thing by telling him you will not be OW. But really, by being friends...other than not having sex...whats the difference?

[sadintexas]

I don't really think it's sitting on the fence per se. I think as long as they're home, they're planted in their own yard. I think it's more fantasy and wishful thinking than anything else.

 

What struck me though is that you don't seem to really be invested in this man and could go either way about having a future with him. It is probably that very attitude that is causing him to be attracted to you even that much more. The thing is, breaking up a marriage/family is a major change that isn't easy. Why would you continue to participate in anything that might encourage him to do so when you don't really care if you're with him in the long run?

 

I think if he's truly unhappy he should leave. People divorce and survive every day. But if it's such a hard decision for him, if I were in your shoes, I'd totally back off (even the friendship thing) and let him work this out on his own. Any continued contact with you is going to encourage him to not be fully invested in his marriage. He may not be anyway, but with your involvement, it's a guarantee.

[2sunny]

i would suggest staying away from ANY communication with him until his divorce is final.

 

staying involved on ANY level will take you on an emotional roller coaster. is that what you want?

 

he is comfortable as long as you communicate on some level. stop providing his comfort zone = no contact.

 

IF he intends to be with you - he will find a way... but staying connected isn't going to make that happen - it tends to make it easier for him to stay right where he's at.

[BurriedAlive]

Thanks guys for the advice. Sadintexas, what do you mean about the fact that I am disconnected could be the reason why he is attracted to me? This is interesting... I am not a dramatic person and he has said on more than one occassion that he loves how stable and even I am. You could be on to something there!

 

Well things are progressing very quickly. The marriage is definitively over. He told her yesterday and papers are in the works. They have actually been in the works for a few months but he has them in hand and is taking them to his lawyer to be reviewed. Things have gotten very nasty between them. She is making all kinds of threats and calls and screams at him and sends him very nasty texts. I feel very bad for him. It really sucks to get going through what he is.

 

I really don't think I have anything to do with his ending his marriage. Honestly, I am not even sure what his feelings are for me. We get together and have a great time laughing, and just hanging out. I know he is very attracted to me and said to me that he isn't telling anyone in his life about us right now. This is completely understandable as people will just tell him it is too soon to be seeing someone else. With the exception of a few of my friends, no one knows on my side either. He told me this yesterday and I said that was completely fine. God only knows where this will go or not go and we need to keep it very simple. He agreed that it was most definitively simple.

 

Last night he came over for a couple of hours before he had to work. Right before he got to my house the nastiness had started again. He really looked beat up and really wasn't himself. I wish I could make him feel better. I do care about him even if I know there is probably no long-term potential here. This is going to be one messy divorce. How unfortunate that people have to go through this.

[2sunny]

Thanks guys for the advice. Sadintexas, what do you mean about the fact that I am disconnected could be the reason why he is attracted to me? This is interesting... I am not a dramatic person and he has said on more than one occassion that he loves how stable and even I am. You could be on to something there!

 

Well things are progressing very quickly. The marriage is definitively over. He told her yesterday and papers are in the works. They have actually been in the works for a few months but he has them in hand and is taking them to his lawyer to be reviewed. Things have gotten very nasty between them. She is making all kinds of threats and calls and screams at him and sends him very nasty texts. I feel very bad for him. It really sucks to get going through what he is.

 

I really don't think I have anything to do with his ending his marriage. Honestly, I am not even sure what his feelings are for me. We get together and have a great time laughing, and just hanging out. I know he is very attracted to me and said to me that he isn't telling anyone in his life about us right now. This is completely understandable as people will just tell him it is too soon to be seeing someone else. With the exception of a few of my friends, no one knows on my side either. He told me this yesterday and I said that was completely fine. God only knows where this will go or not go and we need to keep it very simple. He agreed that it was most definitively simple.

 

Last night he came over for a couple of hours before he had to work. Right before he got to my house the nastiness had started again. He really looked beat up and really wasn't himself. I wish I could make him feel better. I do care about him even if I know there is probably no long-term potential here. This is going to be one messy divorce. How unfortunate that people have to go through this.

 

well, things are bound to be bad for a long while. expect him to have and need time to process mentally and emotionally - the end of his M.

 

he isn't divorced yet. i'd wait until it's final. you are going to step into a mess - and it will be a bummer to listen to his chaos.

 

besides - YOU are his SECRET! why be that? aren't you valued more than being a secret? IF he is getting divorced why does his intend to hide you?

 

maybe he doesn't actually intend to get divorced? why not step away and see EXACTLY what his ACTIONS show you - that way - no secret - no chaos - just waiting for the dust to settle and start fresh when everything is finalized and he is available to present you without being embarrassed or sneaky. none of those qualities make for a loving relationship.

 

he's asking you to be silent, quiet, and invisible! is that what love looks like? i hardly think it's a healthy way to start. it's not loving behavior.

 

if it were me - i'd tell him to take a flying leap. why should YOU be quiet and invisible IF he is getting divorced. i'd say - come back when you're a free man and don't have the need to "hide" me.

 

divorce papers FINAL = no need to lie and be sneaky and mean. if you participate - YOU sign up to be treated this way. he's only giving you the warning of what to expect - but you don't have to accept it.

[datura_noir]

From June 2007:Time heals Everything? Posted by Burried Alive:

 

 

I have never in my entire life been involved with something that was so wrong. I have never as much as stolen a pack of gum. Sometimes people get themselves into bad situations which doesn't say they are bad people but that they made bad choices. I am not a serial OW and I will NEVER be an OW again. I just want to put some closure to this mess so I can move on.

 

Is this the same MM???:confused:

[White Flower]

Thanks guys for the advice. Sadintexas, what do you mean about the fact that I am disconnected could be the reason why he is attracted to me? This is interesting... I am not a dramatic person and he has said on more than one occassion that he loves how stable and even I am. You could be on to something there!

 

I think I could start a spinoff thread on this subject.

 

I think it is a trend for most MM. They like the W to be needy and they like the OW to be strong. That way, they can always convince themselves that the OW can take the bus accident on D-day whereas the W would simply fall apart (in his mind of course).

 

As long as we are 'strong' they don't have to feel so guilty about throwing us under the bus should a D-day occur.

[Silly_Girl]

I think I could start a spinoff thread on this subject.

 

I think it is a trend for most MM. They like the W to be needy and they like the OW to be strong. That way, they can always convince themselves that the OW can take the bus accident on D-day whereas the W would simply fall apart (in his mind of course).

 

As long as we are 'strong' they don't have to feel so guilty about throwing us under the bus should a D-day occur.

 

Sadly, I see truth in this.

[White Flower]

Sadly, I see truth in this.

So should we pretend to be a damsel-in-distress? Just a thought.

 

Either way we're doomed to stereo-types. If I'm strong I'm a cold-heart b****, tough as nails, who can handle anything. Further, I'm so almighty powerful, that like a tornado I can manage to destroy a M all on my own.

 

Conversely, If I am weak and needy I play on MM's need to be the knight in shining armor, using that tactic to ruin his M.

 

Sorry, guess I went off-topic. Back to MM being on the fence...

[Pink_orchid]

So should we pretend to be a damsel-in-distress? Just a thought.

 

Either way we're doomed to stereo-types. If I'm strong I'm a cold-heart b****, tough as nails, who can handle anything. Further, I'm so almighty powerful, that like a tornado I can manage to destroy a M all on my own.

 

Conversely, If I am weak and needy I play on MM's need to be the knight in shining armor, using that tactic to ruin his M.

 

Sorry, guess I went off-topic. Back to MM being on the fence...

 

Too right, you can't win. And I think it's true that the MM will use the 'But you are a strong person' tactic, 'cos I even got those very words from his mouth. He was trying to dodge the guilt about how he'd hurt me I guess.

[Silly_Girl]

So should we pretend to be a damsel-in-distress? Just a thought.

 

Either way we're doomed to stereo-types. If I'm strong I'm a cold-heart b****, tough as nails, who can handle anything. Further, I'm so almighty powerful, that like a tornado I can manage to destroy a M all on my own.

 

Conversely, If I am weak and needy I play on MM's need to be the knight in shining armor, using that tactic to ruin his M.

 

Sorry, guess I went off-topic. Back to MM being on the fence...

 

I've thought that WF. thought that if I NEEDED more, instead of being SuperWoman (his phrase) maybe I might be on (something closer to) equal footing with the other woman in his life. I know there's guilt there and I'd idly wondered whether it would level the playing field. But I know I could never allow myself to have a hold over him as she does. Perhaps I'm doomed to fail

[White Flower]

I've thought that WF. thought that if I NEEDED more, instead of being SuperWoman (his phrase) maybe I might be on (something closer to) equal footing with the other woman in his life. I know there's guilt there and I'd idly wondered whether it would level the playing field. But I know I could never allow myself to have a hold over him as she does. Perhaps I'm doomed to fail

The thing is sincerity isn't it?

 

We sincerely wish for MM's true happiness, even at the cost of losing him. It is the higher road, but sadly the one he allows us to take oftentimes.

[White Flower]

Too right, you can't win. And I think it's true that the MM will use the 'But you are a strong person' tactic, 'cos I even got those very words from his mouth. He was trying to dodge the guilt about how he'd hurt me I guess.

I suppose it's easier to decide to jump off the fence where a life needs saving than it is to jump on the other side where one doesn't.

[2sunny]

my exH really gets his high from a damsel in distress... he LOVES to rescue!

 

i was never a gal that needed to be rescued. hence - he always found "others" he could "help".

[datura_noir]

And I ask the OP again...

 

Is this the same MM or another??

 

It seems my post was ignored...

[whichwayisup]

So I have made it CRYSTAL clear to him that I will not be his OW. I will be his friend and if we meet it will be in public places as long as he is still with W.

 

No, you'll still be the OW. I know you don't see it that way. You two CANNOT BE FRIENDS.

 

Either you go back to the affair and be the OW or walk away. End it completely. If/when he decides to leave/divorce his wife and it's finalized (FINALIZED, nothing short of that) THEN consider "dating" him. Until then, cut him out of your life.

 

Right now it's ALL about him.

 

Take a step back and take time for yourself.

[SidLyon]

And I ask the OP again...

 

Is this the same MM or another??

 

It seems my post was ignored...

 

I think this is yet another MM. See http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t241890/

 

Apparently only been going a few weeks.

[2sunny]

He doesn't seem to know what he wants though. It seems to be up to W. He can't seem to take a stand with her and keeps playing into her "ups and downs." God only knows what will happen tonight.

 

he can't make a decision - it's up to his W - who has no idea about his truth...

 

then make the decision FOR him - step away. problem solved! you are free to date anyone!

 

Is this common for them to be on the fence like this? Am I doing the right thing? I know BSs are going to say that I need to go away and leave him alone. I don't really want to do that. I have told him that all he needs to do is say the words and I will never contact him again. He said he can't. He enjoys my company far too much.

 

yes, it's common when they want it all!

 

the right thing? you wouldn't be here asking if you knew you were already doing the right thing.

 

now try the opposite - see hat results that brings... it should make everything much better in the end.

[BurriedAlive]

From June 2007:Time heals Everything? Posted by Burried Alive:

 

 

I have never in my entire life been involved with something that was so wrong. I have never as much as stolen a pack of gum. Sometimes people get themselves into bad situations which doesn't say they are bad people but that they made bad choices. I am not a serial OW and I will NEVER be an OW again. I just want to put some closure to this mess so I can move on.

 

Is this the same MM???:confused:

 

No it isn't. And I am not an OW again either.

[BurriedAlive]

I think I could start a spinoff thread on this subject.

 

I think it is a trend for most MM. They like the W to be needy and they like the OW to be strong. That way, they can always convince themselves that the OW can take the bus accident on D-day whereas the W would simply fall apart (in his mind of course).

 

As long as we are 'strong' they don't have to feel so guilty about throwing us under the bus should a D-day occur.

 

 

Oh White Flower.... LMAO.. the bus accident! I think this is very very true. I think when a MM's affair "goes bad" is when he realizes that his OW isn't going to go away because he asks her to. He suddenly realizes that she is human and not as "strong" as he thought.