Separated: legally vs emotionally/physically

[Silly_Girl]

Perhaps I'm feeling a little controversial today...

 

I read this morning on LS something about 'separated' being crap and that it only counts if there are papers to prove it.

 

It's this black and white versus shades of grey, for me, again.

 

I was living with my best friend (my husband), we had separated and slept in separate rooms. He had somewhere to move to, only when a situation changed in another household (not a romantic thing, but something else). So we knew we would be living apart, and it pretty much felt as though we were. We co-parented well and had done so for a long time... both worked full-time, plus I was studying but we worked opposing hours so apart from some meals or the odd evening together we were either at work, alone with our son, or asleep.

 

I met someone. I told my the man I met immediately of my situation. i.e. first proper date. I told my husband after about 2 weeks as it seemed I would be seeing more and more of the new man.

 

I introduced them a couple of weeks later as my H and I had happened to be invited to the same birthday drinks of a really old friend. I continued to date the new guy and house-share with my H. Bf trusted me with my H. I would speak to my H on the phone in front of bf, if we needed a conversation about childcare, or something practical. My bf could pick up my phone and read a text out to me, if my hands were full, for example. I had NOTHING to hide at all.

 

My H tried many times to rekindle something (if he'd been out with the lads and come back tipsy!) and he did say to me he realised that I would feel I had betrayed bf were anything to happen. I'm monogamous and yes, I would have felt I was being unfaithful if I had had sex with my H.

 

I stayed married for years. I bought H out of the house, but we didn't use a solicitor. H wanted a divorce, I wanted him to not subsequently claim from the proceeds of the house. I think it was 4.5 years we stayed married, until I moved out of the place we'd co-owned, him having a child with someone else in that time.

 

Not one person connected to the situation had any issue with the fact we were formally married, but separated. Yes, people do lie about these things, it's been evidenced here. But not everyone does.

[Ellin]

Perhaps I'm feeling a little controversial today...

 

I read this morning on LS something about 'separated' being crap and that it only counts if there are papers to prove it.

 

It's this black and white versus shades of grey, for me, again.

 

I was living with my best friend (my husband), we had separated and slept in separate rooms. He had somewhere to move to, only when a situation changed in another household (not a romantic thing, but something else). So we knew we would be living apart, and it pretty much felt as though we were. We co-parented well and had done so for a long time... both worked full-time, plus I was studying but we worked opposing hours so apart from some meals or the odd evening together we were either at work, alone with our son, or asleep.

 

I met someone. I told my the man I met immediately of my situation. i.e. first proper date. I told my husband after about 2 weeks as it seemed I would be seeing more and more of the new man.

 

I introduced them a couple of weeks later as my H and I had happened to be invited to the same birthday drinks of a really old friend. I continued to date the new guy and house-share with my H. Bf trusted me with my H. I would speak to my H on the phone in front of bf, if we needed a conversation about childcare, or something practical. My bf could pick up my phone and read a text out to me, if my hands were full, for example. I had NOTHING to hide at all.

 

My H tried many times to rekindle something (if he'd been out with the lads and come back tipsy!) and he did say to me he realised that I would feel I had betrayed bf were anything to happen. I'm monogamous and yes, I would have felt I was being unfaithful if I had had sex with my H.

 

I stayed married for years. I bought H out of the house, but we didn't use a solicitor. H wanted a divorce, I wanted him to not subsequently claim from the proceeds of the house. I think it was 4.5 years we stayed married, until I moved out of the place we'd co-owned, him having a child with someone else in that time.

 

Not one person connected to the situation had any issue with the fact we were formally married, but separated. Yes, people do lie about these things, it's been evidenced here. But not everyone does.

Of course. It is perfectly possible to be separated and available for R with someone else. It happens all the time.

 

It's just that when someone is getting involved with someone separated they need to be extra cautious because there is a possibility of the separated person going back into M.

 

But it's not reasonable to say that any R with a separated person is doomed. Every case needs to be judged on its merits.

 

Although after reading LS one might come to the conclusion that every such R is going to end badly. That is because those who have successful R with a separated person do not come in despair to OM/OW forum..

[Silly_Girl]

Of course. It is perfectly possible to be separated and available for R with someone else. It happens all the time.

 

It's just that when someone is getting involved with someone separated they need to be extra cautious because there is a possibility of the separated person going back into M.

 

But it's not reasonable to say that any R with a separated person is doomed. Every case needs to be judged on its merits.

 

Although after reading LS one might come to the conclusion that every such R is going to end badly. That is because those who have successful R with a separated person do not come in despair to OM/OW forum..

 

'Zactly...

[In_Repair]

Even without reading LS, it seems like most people have this opinion regarding a separated man or woman. While I understand the concern involved, some of the women I have dated made a much bigger issue of it than it really was.

 

I won't put up with it more than once or twice. When my children aren't with me, I call every night to check on them and tell them good night. My wife and I are also still going through equitable distribution. I'm not going to ignore my children and I'm not going to just walk away from the assets that I have worked for the past 12 years. If I'm dating a woman who can't understand that, then we don't date very long.

[jwi71]

Most "separated persons" here have a nasty habit of NOT allowing the H/W to speak, see, or even know of the gf/bf's existence....and you can see all the covoluted gyrations they put everyone through to make that so.

 

I typically ask for them to call the H or W...consider the unusual circumstances presented that call is not unwarranted nor would it be ill received.

 

You can guess how many times that call gets made.

[Spark1111]

SG, it seems your separation was mutually wanted by both you and your H; respectful and transparent to your bf, or any other partner.

 

So many are not.

 

Maybe they were arguing a lot, or it was a mid-life crisis meltdown, or one of any other million reasons that a couple may separate.

 

One may think it's temporary, but the other does not.

 

One may think it gives them free license to date as if they were single, while the other does not.

 

And that is just drama and heartache for the person dating them, or becoming emotionally and physically involved with a seperated partner.

 

At least, if it is legal, BOTH parties have agreed to the terms and conditions and are more than likely en route to divorce.

 

Less drama....less heartache for the single man or woman trying to decide if it is worthwhile to invest their emotions into the relationship.

[carhill]

I don't know the OP's age, but, at my age, my requirements for dating a 'separated' lady would be that she lives independently and either spouse has formally filed for divorce. Other men are less discriminating, to be sure. Most women are as discriminating.

 

OP, let's say the man you met was living with his wife (his best friend) and was married but 'separated'. His wife (estranged) is a great lady and treats you well. They sleep in separate bedrooms. Sounds like a perfect roommate situation. She goes off to bed while you and he snuggle on the couch eating popcorn, watching a late movie and making out.

 

Sounds great, right?

 

I'm separated, the divorce (yes, *filed*) is nearly finished and we've lived in separate *homes* for over a year. The one singular thread I began on LS concerned dating as a separated man and most respondents said, knowing the kind of poster and person I am here, that they would *not* date me. Perhaps the 'rules' differ by gender. Stbx has had *two* boyfriends in that same time period.

 

Good luck!

[Silly_Girl]

I don't know the OP's age, but, at my age, my requirements for dating a 'separated' lady would be that she lives independently and either spouse has formally filed for divorce. Other men are less discriminating, to be sure. Most women are as discriminating.

 

OP, let's say the man you met was living with his wife (his best friend) and was married but 'separated'. His wife (estranged) is a great lady and treats you well. They sleep in separate bedrooms. Sounds like a perfect roommate situation. She goes off to bed while you and he snuggle on the couch eating popcorn, watching a late movie and making out.

 

Sounds great, right?

 

I'm separated, the divorce (yes, *filed*) is nearly finished and we've lived in separate *homes* for over a year. The one singular thread I began on LS concerned dating as a separated man and most respondents said, knowing the kind of poster and person I am here, that they would *not* date me. Perhaps the 'rules' differ by gender. Stbx has had *two* boyfriends in that same time period.

 

Good luck!

 

I was in my twenties then. And I knew that I was not at all a 'catch' in being in that position. And didn't care because I wasn't at all on the look out to hook up with someone. And it's exactly the reason I made it clear immediately. Because not everyone could cope with that scenario.

 

And I wouldn't cope if it were a permanent state. My situation was temporary, without question.

 

As for the situation you describe, I guess I am not at all discriminating because what you metion is a far better situation than I am currently living with!

 

I don't recall your thread Carhill, but I'm certainly not suggesting anybody is wrong to refuse to accept a scenario they themselves are not comfortable with, but I am not the only person I know to have been in that type of situation.

[carhill]

Here's the thread if you'd like to read it. Only 52 responses, IIRC all from women. Perhaps your take-away might differ from my own. I heard from some posters whose opinions I respect and did end up dating a couple ladies.

 

IMO, based on long reading of LS, is that the perception is, essentially, unless the man is living alone, as I am now, he's always going to be after that which is nearest to him, even if 'separated'. Men, respectfully, are dogs. It's the same perception which permeates dating threads, where men are pursuers and women are the gatekeepers. *Most* men, if their *wife* is in the next room, even if they're *separated* technically, would still want to bang her, and would, if they could get away with it. This social perception, long ingrained into women, drives their perspective regarding separation, especially cohabiting separations. They know the sweet talk, banging and oxytocin dynamic can resume at any time.

 

FTR, I'm actually on your 'side'. I think this isn't black and white and should be *extremely* situational. Every marriage, separation and divorce is *different*. That said, as my own situation has proven out, I have no control over the perception of others. I accept it and move on with my life as I see fit. That happens to be a choice not to date anyone in any serious way (and no sex) until the divorce is final. It matches with *my* psychology. YMMV

[Mimolicious]

Of course. It is perfectly possible to be separated and available for R with someone else. It happens all the time.

 

It's just that when someone is getting involved with someone separated they need to be extra cautious because there is a possibility of the separated person going back into M.

 

But it's not reasonable to say that any R with a separated person is doomed. Every case needs to be judged on its merits.

 

Although after reading LS one might come to the conclusion that every such R is going to end badly. That is because those who have successful R with a separated person do not come in despair to OM/OW forum..

 

Co-dign E on this one.

 

SG doesn't sound like your M crumbled due to infidelity and one of you was leading your life with the AP, yet still living at the marital residence.

(I may be wrong)

 

I personally, can't say never but if I met a man that is still legally married, living in the same house with his W and Kids as "roommate", chances are that I wouldn't date him. It is a sign that his life is not in order and to be honest, I am not in the position to deal with such a situation, but that is my prerogative, of course. I guess it comes down to what you are willing to accept from a person.

[BB07]

Just that word, separated makes me cringe, well actually makes me almost want to throw up in my mouth. I wonder why!

 

Anyway......because of my own recent experience, there is no way in hell I'd ever chance it again unless they are clearly free. I would want to see the legal papers of separation/divorce. If a man comes along that wants to date me, he is gonna have a tough road to hoe. It will be very difficult for me to trust.

[Silly_Girl]

Absolutely BB!! In your shoes I'd want to check for tattoos, other distinguishing marks and check the land registry for multiple residences!!!

 

I didn't mean to be insensitive, but I was thinking of the Mombots and others among us.

 

My situation was absolutely NOT ideal and not something I'd ever encourage a friend to roll with....

[Ellin]

Even without reading LS, it seems like most people have this opinion regarding a separated man or woman. While I understand the concern involved, some of the women I have dated made a much bigger issue of it than it really was.

 

I won't put up with it more than once or twice. When my children aren't with me, I call every night to check on them and tell them good night. My wife and I are also still going through equitable distribution. I'm not going to ignore my children and I'm not going to just walk away from the assets that I have worked for the past 12 years. If I'm dating a woman who can't understand that, then we don't date very long.

It's good that you have presented your perspective here.

 

I can completely understand that when we're not 20 any more the potential partners we meet will most likely already have responsibilities towards other people and it is neither reasonable nor right IMO to expect they will drop all that for a new partner and that only then they can prove the love is real and not a lie.

[pureinheart]

Perhaps I'm feeling a little controversial today...

 

I read this morning on LS something about 'separated' being crap and that it only counts if there are papers to prove it.

 

It's this black and white versus shades of grey, for me, again.

 

I was living with my best friend (my husband), we had separated and slept in separate rooms. He had somewhere to move to, only when a situation changed in another household (not a romantic thing, but something else). So we knew we would be living apart, and it pretty much felt as though we were. We co-parented well and had done so for a long time... both worked full-time, plus I was studying but we worked opposing hours so apart from some meals or the odd evening together we were either at work, alone with our son, or asleep.

 

I met someone. I told my the man I met immediately of my situation. i.e. first proper date. I told my husband after about 2 weeks as it seemed I would be seeing more and more of the new man.

 

I introduced them a couple of weeks later as my H and I had happened to be invited to the same birthday drinks of a really old friend. I continued to date the new guy and house-share with my H. Bf trusted me with my H. I would speak to my H on the phone in front of bf, if we needed a conversation about childcare, or something practical. My bf could pick up my phone and read a text out to me, if my hands were full, for example. I had NOTHING to hide at all.

 

My H tried many times to rekindle something (if he'd been out with the lads and come back tipsy!) and he did say to me he realised that I would feel I had betrayed bf were anything to happen. I'm monogamous and yes, I would have felt I was being unfaithful if I had had sex with my H.

 

I stayed married for years. I bought H out of the house, but we didn't use a solicitor. H wanted a divorce, I wanted him to not subsequently claim from the proceeds of the house. I think it was 4.5 years we stayed married, until I moved out of the place we'd co-owned, him having a child with someone else in that time.

 

Not one person connected to the situation had any issue with the fact we were formally married, but separated. Yes, people do lie about these things, it's been evidenced here. But not everyone does.

 

 

I remember that post and at the risk of going into the spiritual/technical aspects of this matter, will stick with the heart.

 

I take people at their word, if they say they are getting a D, I expect that to go down, if they say they are separated, then I would dig deeper to see how separated they are.

 

Personally, I need for the D to be final due to my last R.

 

I say be cautious, as it is best to give yourself some time (the separated person) and only that person knows how much time is needed...shoot, it could be a day of being separared and that is enough time. I think it depends on the person and their past situation.

 

Many factors are involved here, to generalize is being unrealistic as we are all individuals...this is not taking away from guidelines and suggestions, although we are individuals accountable for the truth we know.

[Confused4Now]

I think that back in the day when divorce wasn't so common....people thought long and hard before acting on things. I think Divorce is so common place that you really can't trust people to do the necessary work to be healthy when going through divorce.

 

I think I would feel more comfortable when someone has completely finalized everything in their marriage before moving onto something else. The paper work tells me alot or at least assures me something. Granted there are people who have checked out years ago and the paper work is just a formality. but how often do you see that?

[Mimolicious]

It's good that you have presented your perspective here.

 

I can completely understand that when we're not 20 any more the potential partners we meet will most likely already have responsibilities towards other people and it is neither reasonable nor right IMO to expect they will drop all that for a new partner and that only then they can prove the love is real and not a lie.

 

Ain't THAT the truth! Jeez... If only I can be 18 again!

 

In Repair- you actually have a strong stance in your situation and you are working towards achieving stability, eventually. There are men/women out there who dont. You come full force with disclosures under your arm. THAT I can respect and actually understand. I was standing on that same spot once before. But to go through with it with someone while the flakes settle, and they are basically draggin a$$, can be a bit too much (been there too).

[Spark1111]

Here's the thread if you'd like to read it. Only 52 responses, IIRC all from women. Perhaps your take-away might differ from my own. I heard from some posters whose opinions I respect and did end up dating a couple ladies.

 

IMO, based on long reading of LS, is that the perception is, essentially, unless the man is living alone, as I am now, he's always going to be after that which is nearest to him, even if 'separated'. Men, respectfully, are dogs. It's the same perception which permeates dating threads, where men are pursuers and women are the gatekeepers. *Most* men, if their *wife* is in the next room, even if they're *separated* technically, would still want to bang her, and would, if they could get away with it. This social perception, long ingrained into women, drives their perspective regarding separation, especially cohabiting separations. They know the sweet talk, banging and oxytocin dynamic can resume at any time.

 

FTR, I'm actually on your 'side'. I think this isn't black and white and should be *extremely* situational. Every marriage, separation and divorce is *different*. That said, as my own situation has proven out, I have no control over the perception of others. I accept it and move on with my life as I see fit. That happens to be a choice not to date anyone in any serious way (and no sex) until the divorce is final. It matches with *my* psychology. YMMV

 

Well, it also matches the perception of the single women I know too!

 

They do not want to date a separated man. Too much baggage. Yet, they COULD have all the action they wanted if they so choose to.

 

Maybe men are dogs?

 

But, one separated man (it is now amicable) recently approached his spouse for a divorce.

 

Why?

 

Few women will date him.:rolleyes:

[pureinheart]

Just that word, separated makes me cringe, well actually makes me almost want to throw up in my mouth. I wonder why!

 

Anyway......because of my own recent experience, there is no way in hell I'd ever chance it again unless they are clearly free. I would want to see the legal papers of separation/divorce. If a man comes along that wants to date me, he is gonna have a tough road to hoe. It will be very difficult for me to trust.

 

It is because of my personal sitch that changed the way I do business, or have gone back to the way I used to do business.

 

Think about it though...this could happen to anyone at anytime in any situation, meaning...a person could be D'ed and still go back...I guess it's a day by day thing...to me the only absolute is God/Jesus/Holy Spirit (Ghost).

 

At this point, I will take the shoes;)

[pureinheart]

I think that back in the day when divorce wasn't so common....people thought long and hard before acting on things. I think Divorce is so common place that you really can't trust people to do the necessary work to be healthy when going through divorce.

 

I think I would feel more comfortable when someone has completely finalized everything in their marriage before moving onto something else. The paper work tells me alot or at least assures me something. Granted there are people who have checked out years ago and the paper work is just a formality. but how often do you see that?

 

Hi CNM,

 

I don't think there are many that take committment very seriously anymore...once my partner doesnot take the committment seriously, repeated abuse of this, then I don't either...piece of paper or not...it's over. In my mind it's over and I'm single...wrong or not, that is what happens to me.

 

This should be a topic of discussion for my IC councelling.

[carhill]

I'd be curious to know, from the ladies who are divorced or divorcing, have you run into similar resistance from single men? I ask because my one datapoint, stbx, shows that, apparently in line with most other aspects of male-female relations, the men really don't concern themselves with marital status, absent a clear and present husband, and pursue separated women with the same zeal as they would any woman.

 

This, of course, can create issues for a more selective man, much in the same vein of being sure a lady is unattached before pursuing a relationship with her. The less selective men in this competetive environment succeed simply because they care less, in that it doesn't matter to them if the lady is involved, whether explicitly, generally or situationally so long as she accepts his advances. It'll be interesting to see, in the 50+ age group, how this historical pattern I've seen for decades plays out, similar or different, and how my newfound people-picking skills affect those dynamics.

[pureinheart]

I'd be curious to know, from the ladies who are divorced or divorcing, have you run into similar resistance from single men? I ask because my one datapoint, stbx, shows that, apparently in line with most other aspects of male-female relations, the men really don't concern themselves with marital status, absent a clear and present husband, and pursue separated women with the same zeal as they would any woman.

 

This, of course, can create issues for a more selective man, much in the same vein of being sure a lady is unattached before pursuing a relationship with her. The less selective men in this competetive environment succeed simply because they care less, in that it doesn't matter to them if the lady is involved, whether explicitly, generally or situationally so long as she accepts his advances. It'll be interesting to see, in the 50+ age group, how this historical pattern I've seen for decades plays out, similar or different, and how my newfound people-picking skills affect those dynamics.

 

 

In bold...having been in a considerable amount of R's...I have never met resistance...ever...good point CH

[pureinheart]

I'd be curious to know, from the ladies who are divorced or divorcing, have you run into similar resistance from single men? I ask because my one datapoint, stbx, shows that, apparently in line with most other aspects of male-female relations, the men really don't concern themselves with marital status, absent a clear and present husband, and pursue separated women with the same zeal as they would any woman.

 

This, of course, can create issues for a more selective man, much in the same vein of being sure a lady is unattached before pursuing a relationship with her. The less selective men in this competetive environment succeed simply because they care less, in that it doesn't matter to them if the lady is involved, whether explicitly, generally or situationally so long as she accepts his advances. It'll be interesting to see, in the 50+ age group, how this historical pattern I've seen for decades plays out, similar or different, and how my newfound people-picking skills affect those dynamics.

 

 

To add CH, these were extremely selective men, strictly looking for life long R's

[Ellin]

In bold...having been in a considerable amount of R's...I have never met resistance...ever...good point CH

I second that. There was no resistance from men I met when I was going through D.

[carhill]

My inference was the men were less selective wrt one's legal/social marital status, as opposed to the quality of/ interest in the respective parties.

 

I'm going to experiment with this dynamic soon and I might have a relevant datapoint. I'll report back with the results. My main inhibition from asking this person out has been our respective marital statuses, but perhaps that is an inhibition which is baseless in form and content. Thanks for the perspectives