Tractor Posted August 12, 2010 Posted August 12, 2010 This is long but I want advice from an informed point of view. 6 year LTR, raising child together, not mine,but the only dad child has. Bio father wants nothing to do with child. No contact in more years than I have been around. Child dosent really know bio father, and dosent care. Me one marriage and one other LTR. Her two marriages. Living as married,some of our friends didnt know we wernt, not witheld, just not an issue. If we were asked we told them. The lead in: 6-7 months ago we were having some problems and became detached from one another. I had an affair. Had sex with OW a few times. I realized what I stood to lose.(not money or things) My family. So I ended it and we began working on us. She still dosent know about affair at this point. Guess what? She finds out about 5 months later. Dont really know how, that really dosent matter. She confronts me. I tell the truth. She says she was laying in bed this morning thinking how lucky she is(found out later in day) but she is still moving out. Adult child from first marriage comes here to console mom,help pack and move. Adult child has high power career and is used to being in charge and making decisions. Made some for mom that in hindsight adult child regrets. In past now,nothing can be done. I have not been in contact with adult child. I dont think I owe them an apology. I think they owe me one. If I dont get it,it will be ok. Adult child was just doing what they thought best for mom at the time.I still love adult child and hold no ill will. Mom is not real happy with adult child at this point, but they will be ok. Younger child is somewhat angry with step sibling,and defends dad(me) Where we are now: SO lives 500 miles away, near adult child. We have been talking about repairing our realitionship.I know some here would say go NC with her. But we dont belive that is a solution to our problems.We have talked about that, it just isint what we want. Recently I went to visit her. A month after breakup. We hung out,talked,went to park as family, out to eat,helped child with homework. A good time was had by all. She agrees with this. There is a physical contact issue, but we held hands while together, and embraced upon arrival and departure. I know that issue stems from the affair. I accept my failure in this. While she was looking for a place to live there, she would see houses either near or on the way to look at rentals that would be perfect fo "us" She says she dosent think she can live here,because this house is where "IT" happened. If the tables were turned I belive I would feel the same. So I wont argue that point. Child has said to her and to me-Why cant dad just live around here somewhere(not exact words but exact feelings) I told her while I was there didnt want her back just for the childs sake, but would be willing to start there. Our shared commitment to the child could bring us closer. She agrees with this also. Info to help with question: I own a house outright where we used to live. I own a house with a mortgage where we lived until breakup. I currently live here. A good bit of equity here. I own my own business, and can live pretty much where I want to and my income wont change much. In fact it might be better where she is living. I support her and the child willingly. I am not rich but do ok and can afford to do this. If I sold both houses and moved there we would have a better chance of working it out. IMO. She agrees with this. I know this would take some time,she is aware of this as well. In the meantim we will continue to visit and work on us. Me going there,them to other house(where "IT" didnt happen) school schedule permitting. Some meeting in the middle for mini family vacations. The other house is not close enough to be an option either,about 400 miles from where she is. When we talked last night, we talked about her and child having some input on house choice. Because of school districs, and if we are able to work it out that will be our family home for a long period of time. The question: I know we could make all this effort,and it still not work. I am not blind to reality. I know what I want to do. Can afford to do it. And think its worth the risk. I love her and that child. Am I completely crazy? what do you think?
Don Ho Posted August 12, 2010 Posted August 12, 2010 Yes you are crazy. Before you rush and do all that, I think you better visit her often and see how it goes. You need to make sure she is going to forgive you and move past it. Apparently you have the means, so you could fly down every weekend or fly her up and see how it goes. Take it slow. That's the best I can tell you.
Author Tractor Posted August 12, 2010 Author Posted August 12, 2010 I did say I knew it would take time. I am considering at least 9 months to a year before I would move. School just started.If we were making real progress I would want to do it before next school session started. Continuing visits till then.
spriggig Posted August 12, 2010 Posted August 12, 2010 You have to be honest with yourself here. Is she an extraordinary woman? Not to you, but more objectively, can she do this? Generally speaking, does she hold grudges, or does she truly forgive and forget EASILY? Trust. That is what can kill every effort you make. She won't be able to trust you. It will be a constant strain on your relationship for years to come and she may never get over it completely. It will never be as it was before. It also depends on how much she blames you versus the other woman. If she can frame it as you and her against a common enemy--if she believes you were seduced--you'll have a better chance. If she resents primarily you, then just let this go.
Author Tractor Posted August 12, 2010 Author Posted August 12, 2010 Spriggig I laid awake last night thinking about your post. I dont sleep so well anyway so it wasnt you keeping me up. Is she extraordinary? Yes she is, in matters that concern me or her children. Grudges-sometimes,Forgive-yes, forget-no. Trust, sometimes it seems that she trust me more now than she ever has. We have laid it all out to each other in the last month or so. We have no reason to lie to each other at this point. The us aginst a common enemy. We have always had a very strong faith. Not too much religon,but have always had the feeling, and talked about many times in the past, "Its us aginst a world of crumbling moral decay". How this applies specificly to OW im not sure. She called this morning, conversation started with homework issues she wants me to address with child. In the past she handled most home work issues. I handled math,science, and band/music. We each helped where we could be the most help. She steered the talk to how we complimented each other in life. She brought up how she was trying figure out how to forgive me. I said fogiveness is like writing a check,if the balance is low,and the check has to be big, you cant write it. I told her if she would keep the bank open, I would keep making deposits. I also said I knew I couldnt make just one big deposit. She liked that analogy and laughed. She is a very strong woman,affair aside, she had to be to deal with me. I hurt her pride as well as her feelings, not over and over, just the one time. I know she misses me, she tells me so. I know she wants me in the childs life. I also know her better than any person on this earth. She puts a lot of value on this, our knowledge of each other,and strength we found in each other.
Ronni_W Posted August 14, 2010 Posted August 14, 2010 Random thoughts (not necessarily in order of your post.) As a caution, I'm not planning to sugar-coat. [so] If you suffer from 'thin skin syndrome' and/or struggle with being easily offended...probably wise to just stop reading right here. Living as married, some of our friends didnt know we wernt, not witheld, just not an issue. *IF* things don't work out and the split proves permanent, are you going to co-parent the younger child as if your own? Financially, emotionally, spiritually? Be an active presence in the child's life until s/he is past grown up? No matter what? Because, if so, then, yes...just go and get settled in the child's town. The sooner the better only because there's no reason to wait. That is what a caring parent with the means to do so would do, or should do. But, no. I would not give "mom" any input into my housing situation UNLESS she is my committed partner. Ex-spouses don't get any say in where/how the other lives. You might be harbouring hopes that playing "nice" a doormat will give you leverage or score you brownie points, but it's an illusion that spinelessness will be seen as anything but what it is. Long-term, you'll only be scoring for yourself a label of "weak". Believe me. Stay tough on this one: She doesn't get any say in YOUR housing arrangements until she has total clarity about what she does and does not want with you for the foreseeable rest of her life. 6-7 months ago we were having some problems and became detached from one another. I had an affair. I get that you've apologized for having the affair. Have you also apologized for the incredibly lame and immature way you handled the "problems" and detachment in your relationship? Have you made an effort to learn more effective coping skills? Does she know how you're gonna be doing things the next time there are problems and detachment issues? Do YOU know what you're gonna do when the going gets tough again, instead of having another affair? That is, what have you REALLY done to help her forgive you and work towards trusting you again? What ACTUAL EFFORTS have you made; actions not just words? I have not been in contact with adult child. I dont think I owe them an apology. I think they owe me one. I doubt it. At very least, there would be mutual apologies forthcoming. But you are the older adult, and you screwed around on their mom. So, if there is only one apology owed, my gut says it is owed BY you, not to you. No matter the specifics of how it all went down, I strongly doubt that you are the only one to whom an apology is "owed". In any case, the children (minor and adult) should not have been dragged into this -- I get that it probably wasn't you who initiated that. Mom made her own decisions, even if that was only to go along with whatever adult child was suggesting/requesting/demanding. In my opinion, you and/or mom need to be helping younger child cope with anger towards step-sibling; and you need to be telling younger child not to worry about anything and that it's not her/his job to be defending dad...only job is to be a kid, without worrying about the follies of all the surrounding adults. If I sold both houses and moved there we would have a better chance of working it out. IMO. She agrees with this. The other house is not close enough to be an option either,about 400 miles from where she is. I can't make out if there are 2 or 3 houses. You need to talk with your accountant, financial planner and real estate person. But my gut is to at least sell the house in which the affair happened. Depending on the market, you could rent out the other house(s), or sell one and rent out the other (if there are a total of 3.) I know we could make all this effort,and it still not work. I am not blind to reality. I know what I want to do. Can afford to do it. And think its worth the risk. I love her and that child. Am I completely crazy? what do you think? I don't think you're crazy. Maybe, as a temporary arrangement, you could consider keeping the "not affair house" and just renting in the area in which your ex and child live? Say for a year -- should give you and your ex more than enough time to either make-up or break-up. In the meantime. I'd also urge you to consider counseling for the younger child, as well as relationship counseling for both of you, plus -- and you will forgive me, please -- you can stand a bit of individual therapy. --- Is she extraordinary? Yes she is, in matters that concern me or her children. Grudges-sometimes, Forgive-yes, forget-no. Forgiving and forgetting are as related as apples and oranges. Forgetting is a sign of malfunctioning in the brain; not generally desired or desirable. [so] Don't be at all worried if your ex has not displayed any tendencies towards forgetting We have always ... had the feeling ... "Its us aginst a world of crumbling moral decay". How this applies specificly to OW im not sure. Yes, of course you are sure! If your ex did not feel that there was something "morally wrong" with having an affair then she would not have left you over it. Of course you know that! (Pretending that you don't know what you actually do know is not going to help you make any "deposits" in your "forgiveness bank account".) So, you also need to find a way to express your remorse at having messed with this part of your prior relationship -- the thing that she had expressed HER FAITH in...and you hit her right there. Don't back away from this point. Help her to see that you really, really get what you did not just to her, but to her FAITH in you and her TRUST in you. Those are foundational...you crumbled her foundation. You gotta tell her that you know that you did it, and that you are deeply, deeply remorseful that you did it. This is NOT about, "I screwed another woman, and I'm sorry." It's about, "I was a part of your rock and I crumbled and now your rock is crumbled, and I am deeply ashamed and I don't ever want to do that to you again." She brought up how she was trying figure out how to forgive me. You can also share with her how you have been able to forgive yourself -- was it easy; is it difficult? What do you do when you backslide? What, if anything, does she need from you to help her? That is, make "forgiveness" an opportunity for mutual learning and growth. You could also check out the infidelity section at MarriageBuilders.com, and read 'Forgive for Love' by Fred Luskin. (And gift her a copy of the book, and send her a link to the website. The book's on sale for U$5 + shipping at BookCloseOuts.com) I hurt her pride as well as her feelings, not over and over, just the one time. You did MUCH worse than just hurt her pride and feelings, Tractor. And "just the one time" was MORE THAN enough times. If you want to make significant deposits into your forgiveness bank account, then you will have to get "down and dirty" with yourself about all of it. That is, quit denying and minimizing and making excuses -- those will not help your bank account balance I do wish you the best. You've got lots of work to do, but my intuition is telling me that you are up to the challenge.
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