When they try to reconcile...

[White Flower]

 

 

I do not believe in the sanctity of marriage, I do, however, believe in love and the making of a life based on a shared understanding of what is acceptable and what is not. Because I believe in love, I can understand 2 people falling in love and them wanting to be together. If that is outside a marriage, then end the marriage, terminate the contract and let the other begin a new start too. I think some, possibly most, MM would be very hard pushed to imagine their BS with someone else, it is often a wake up call, it sees them stop seeing the BS as a W, but as a woman with wants, needs and possibilities. It is the breaking of the shared understanding and trust that is so hard to take on board, especially when you have been gaslighted up the ying yang.

 

Reconciling usually takes the one who breaks the trust to work to regain trust, and is, IMO, so very hard, but achievable. The work to rebuild the relationship is, again IMO, very different from rebuilding a marriage. Trusting someone to 'have your back' involves an enormous amount of giving of self, the hard part is realising that when you (general you) were busy watching their backs, keeping it all together, they were off sharing time with another. Telling truth is hard, it takes guts and is never easy, but is is right and it is fair. Reconciling is like finding yourself in a familiar place, but with the street signs all moved around, very confusing, but also very rewarding. It can mean that the marriage is stronger, but only if problems are addressed all round.

 

Thanks WF, but how did I miss the B for bold button?? doh!

 

Very good post, and an excellent example of how (and why) to rebuild the M. You had love on both parts and it was a successful Reconcilation.

 

I admire your H for being so honest AND so remorseful. I'm not so sure my MM is that remorseful. He DOES have an exaggerated guilt complex but that goes back to another issue and it doesn't prevent him from cheating. Your H, OTOH, has learned so much and was able to truly restore a happy M.

 

LOL on the bolded part.

[Snowflower]

Reconciling usually takes the one who breaks the trust to work to regain trust, and is, IMO, so very hard, but achievable. The work to rebuild the relationship is, again IMO, very different from rebuilding a marriage. Trusting someone to 'have your back' involves an enormous amount of giving of self, the hard part is realising that when you (general you) were busy watching their backs, keeping it all together, they were off sharing time with another. Telling truth is hard, it takes guts and is never easy, but is is right and it is fair. Reconciling is like finding yourself in a familiar place, but with the street signs all moved around, very confusing, but also very rewarding. It can mean that the marriage is stronger, but only if problems are addressed all round.

 

 

Well said, seren. I would have never been able to work it as well as you did.

 

There was a statement put forth here by another poster that a BS will try to save a dead marriage. But the marriage isn't always dead, IMO.

 

My H and I are reconciling well. The A was over by the time we reconciled and he has tried very hard, like Seren's H, to regain integrity and show remorse. He worked on himself to figure out why he did what he did.

 

My H could have just stopped the A, recommitted to being faithful and been by all appearances a good husband and our marriage could have continued in a diminished way. But like seren mentioned, to truly reconcile, all the broken trust takes a long time to rebuild. I have often told my husband that while I do trust him (I don't stress out that he is conducting the affair or a new one behind my back--I can take him at his word), my faith in him was severely shaken. This is where the hardest work in my reconciliation is at the moment. Like seren says, "does he have my back?" So far, yes. But it is a process, and not an easy one.

[BB07]

MM has severe guilt issues. He has also said that his W is a good person. Had she been mean or done destructive things like my ex did he would do the cost/benefit analysis and say ok, I have a reason to leave now but to leave just because he no longer loves her makes him the bad guy...which plays right into his already huge guilt issues. If she left because of lost love he could live with it, but if it's his fault (again) he can't. It's pathetic, but it happens all the time.

 

I so get this.....you left out cowardly and pathetic, WF.

 

Funny how a perfectly respectable man who see's himself as a good man, gives himself permission to get into an affair, but yet can't see that an affair is actually worse and more selfish than just leaving the marriage would have been uh. They get so hung up on what others would think, if they just up and left, but yet somehow give themselves permission to think an affair is somewhat not as bad.

[Mimolicious]

It's obvious that someone here is posting under a different name. Where's the link for the "golddigger" forum?

[White Flower]

It's obvious that someone here is posting under a different name. Where's the link for the "golddigger" forum?

Before I jump to conclusions, would you care to clarify what you're saying and who you're saying it to?

[SidLyon]

Before I jump to conclusions, would you care to clarify what you're saying and who you're saying it to?

 

Could it be a cryptic reference to "the site that must not be named" - aka Mme Bovary's village?

[OWoman]

If people don't believe in marriage, they shouldn't do it in the first place.

 

Sure, in an ideal world.

 

In the real world, though, many states put extreme pressure on people to M, because the state (as the third party to a M) is invested in M.

 

My H got M the first time (to his xW) for tax reasons (they'd been living together for years previously; they had no intention of M but if they wanted to afford a house, the tax savings of being M was necessary). His xW was no fan of M either - she'd cheated on her 1st H and made it clear she wasn't interested in a second M - but was keen on buying a house, so they did it (with fingers metaphorically crossed behind their backs).

 

I don't "believe" in M either - yet my H and I got M as soon as his D came through, because it was the only way we could be together. Because we are citizens of different countries, he would need a spousal visa to gain permanent residence in my country, as I would for his.

 

If states did not have these legal requirements, there would be fewer Ms. Even now, the UK is at risk of the Tory govt imposing a "M tax break" scheme which would privilege M couples over cohabiting couples - in a very clear and unashamed attempt to drive couples towards M, which the Tories see as some kind of "pillar" of society.

 

It's the same in many places wrt access to medical aid benefits, insurance, pension, etc - these are extended to a spouse and to proven offspring, but not not to cohabiting partners.

 

There are multiple requirements and incentives to M. Very few people make the decision in complete isolation of a social context pressurising them to "make the vows".

[Silly_Girl]

OWoman I don't disagree with anything you say, I felt pressured to get married. And I understand your post.

 

But in the context of a BS/OW fighting for the relationship I think that saying we don't believe in the sanctity of marriage (the existing original relationship) but we believe in true love (the affair) is over-simplifying and I do believe the marriage should be the priority, because of the decisions taken by the spouses way back when, and only once it is considered irreparable should the next relationship become the priority and primary one.

 

I just feel as though there are some who do not give any credence or respect to the original relationship (the marriage) or the BS.

 

This is not at you, OWoman, just trying to explain the context of my comments. Not sure I've succeeded!!!!

[OWoman]

I also kinda wonder how a OW knows what goes on in the home of the cheater and the BS.... are they 'guessing' at what goes on, are they believing the stories the cheater tells them, etc.

 

I knew from what I saw with my own eyes, what I heard from his colleagues, from his friends, and from his family. "The Cheater" wasn't my source of information - though, when pressed, he would admit to whatever it was I wanted clarity on. I'm sure most OWs triangulate all their sources of information, rather than just rely on the word of one interested party - and their are many sources of information out there. Things that are consistent with their observations are more likely to be believed, and those that are contrary to their evidence more likely to be rejected. Even courtrooms work that way!

 

No one knows except the 2 people IN the marriage - not the outside party looking in, hoping to get the leftovers.

 

I don't know of any OWs who "hoped to get the leftovers". From a fOW that just strikes me as such a self-hating statement - did you really have such low self-esteem at the time that you HOPED to get LEFTOVERS??? Wow! Or is that just the spin you put on it now, from the comfortable distance of time, dissing the self you were then in order to reaffirm the self you are now? Either way, I feel really sorry for you, or anyone else, who genuinely views themselves in this way.

 

So before suggesting that all the BS does is play detective and how the cheater is so miserable and unhappy, how about looking at why the cheater stays. Let's try to figure out why this terribly unhappy guy, who has the love of his life on the side, doesn't leave the wife and run happily into the arms of the woman who has been waiting in the wings for him

 

You know, I was told a lot of this stuff too, back during the A. As in, "you're just his side-dish. He doesn't really love you. He loves her - she's the one he's with. If he loved you, he'd move mountains..."

 

And, guess what happened...

 

Why does he keep going home, to the wife, begging forgiveness, begging for a second chance, etc. Why doesn't he sever the ties and just be happy with that woman he cheated on his wife with??? :confused:'

 

I see - spot the contradiction here! Since "no one knows except the 2 people IN the marriage", how could anyone possibly know that he goes home TO THE W (and not to the kids), or that he "begs forgiveness", etc? I'm presuming that this refers to DDay - since why else would he be asking his unknowing BS for forgiveness - in which case we're talking in most cases of a single incident in the course of a long R which could last anywhere between weeks and decades, in which he ONCE asks his BW for forgiveness (before dissing her again by returning to the A) while he MANY TIMES asks the OW for forgiveness for having shopped her because he was simply not ready at the point of DDay to stand up and be counted, so opted for the line of least resistance?

 

Let's not discuss the wife's self respect unless we are willing to examine the OW's self respect, okay? All those that throw stones at the wife, the one who he married, the one he possibly had children with, the one HE won't leave....examine why you are okay being the hidden secret, not introduced to his kids, not invited to Thanksgiving dinner with his family; ask why he continues to keep you as a secret, the back up plan and doesn't instead make you a priority, the main course. Why do you accept so little when it is the whole enchilada that you want

 

Again - I was told all of that stuff. Even though much of it was wrong I was no hidden secret (just the BW didn't know), I was the one invited to family events, not her; I was the one he made a priority, not her, etc - even so, I was told, he's with her. She's the one he loves. You're nothing, etc etc. So I guess the fact that he chose to be with me makes her nothing, but that twisted logic?

 

I'm certainly not claiming that every MM will leave, or that every OW will end up happily ever after with her MM. But to paint such an extreme, universalising picture ("The MM only ever loves the BW, and the OW is only ever a piece of flesh for him to toy with on the side") based on one's only unhappy experience is both sad and naive (at best ) or spiteful, at worst, wishing to plant the seeds of destruction in the minds of those OWs whose Rs have a good chance of working out for them, if left to themselves without the malicious interference of others.

 

Contrary to prevailiing opinion on LS, As are not all the same. Each R has its own unique nature based upon the dynamic interplay of the unique personalities involved in it. Those who believe As are all the same are just admitting that their own personalities are bought wholesale at Wal-Mart and that they can't conceive of others being any different.

[Ellin]

 

I'm certainly not claiming that every MM will leave, or that every OW will end up happily ever after with her MM. But to paint such an extreme, universalising picture ("The MM only ever loves the BW, and the OW is only ever a piece of flesh for him to toy with on the side") based on one's only unhappy experience is both sad and naive (at best ) or spiteful, at worst, wishing to plant the seeds of destruction in the minds of those OWs whose Rs have a good chance of working out for them, if left to themselves without the malicious interference of others.

 

Ditto!! Thanks for writing this, as such posts on this forum sink in the sea of what you have described above and this is supposed to be OM/OW support forum.

[White Flower]

OWoman I don't disagree with anything you say, I felt pressured to get married. And I understand your post.

 

But in the context of a BS/OW fighting for the relationship I think that saying we don't believe in the sanctity of marriage (the existing original relationship) but we believe in true love (the affair) is over-simplifying and I do believe the marriage should be the priority, because of the decisions taken by the spouses way back when, and only once it is considered irreparable should the next relationship become the priority and primary one.

 

I just feel as though there are some who do not give any credence or respect to the original relationship (the marriage) or the BS.

 

This is not at you, OWoman, just trying to explain the context of my comments. Not sure I've succeeded!!!!

Hi Silly,

 

You may be talking about me here, and that's ok. I usually make statements such as this (in bold) and when I do, please keep in mind I was married for over a quarter of a century!

 

I completely and totally understand making a promise and keeping it. I also understand that we both made those promises at a very young age and we broke them thousands of times over, not by cheating with another partner, but cheating in silly little things before ever thinking of infidelity such as hiding money, giving money to an EA partner before going PA, by putting parents or nephews over you spouse's importance, etc., etc., etc., the list goes on and on until there are so many little things that grew into a mountain that is unfixable if both partners aren't up to the task. I know I was, but he wasn't. Once all measures are exhausted, one realizes what is really important, and keeping a promise to someone who is not even the same person is just ridiculous.

 

Life is so so short. Take care of the ones you love now and say goodbye to the ones you don't want to hurt anymore.

 

we don't believe in the sanctity of marriage (the existing original relationship) but we believe in true love (the affair)

 

If you replace the first parenthesis with (the no-longer valued relationship) and the second with (the valued relationship) it makes a whole lot more sense. I think you are adding value to the word Marriage and you are diminishing the word Affair. When you look at both as just love relationships I think it it's easier to make better value judgments.

 

If the WS decides after IC or even during the midst of the A that he/she values the M afterall, then he should return to it and cut ties with the AP. I'm all for staying/going for the most valued love R, promises from long ago or not.

[White Flower]

I'm sure most OWs triangulate all their sources of information, rather than just rely on the word of one interested party - and their are many sources of information out there. Things that are consistent with their observations are more likely to be believed, and those that are contrary to their evidence more likely to be rejected. Even courtrooms work that way!

 

 

Exactly.

 

Ya know, I didn't even know one of MM's friends or family members to figure out all on my own how to triangulate. There are other methods of triangulation without using human sources.

 

 

I don't know of any OWs who "hoped to get the leftovers".

If he left for me I would not be getting leftovers. When I do have him, and I hope this doesn't sound cruel, but someone else gets what's left of him.

 

I see - spot the contradiction here! Since "no one knows except the 2 people IN the marriage", how could anyone possibly know that he goes home TO THE W (and not to the kids), or that he "begs forgiveness", etc? I'm presuming that this refers to DDay - since why else would he be asking his unknowing BS for forgiveness - in which case we're talking in most cases of a single incident in the course of a long R which could last anywhere between weeks and decades, in which he ONCE asks his BW for forgiveness (before dissing her again by returning to the A) while he MANY TIMES asks the OW for forgiveness for having shopped her because he was simply not ready at the point of DDay to stand up and be counted, so opted for the line of least resistance?

Not even the two at home know what is really going on. Only one does. The other may suspect, but never really knows.

 

I don't take pride in making that statement. I don't know everything that goes on in his head either. None of us ever know what goes on in the head of others, even those we live with.

 

 

 

I'm certainly not claiming that every MM will leave, or that every OW will end up happily ever after with her MM. But to paint such an extreme, universalising picture ("The MM only ever loves the BW, and the OW is only ever a piece of flesh for him to toy with on the side") based on one's only unhappy experience is both sad and naive (at best ) or spiteful, at worst, wishing to plant the seeds of destruction in the minds of those OWs whose Rs have a good chance of working out for them, if left to themselves without the malicious interference of others.

I'd become a member at SI if I needed reinforcement on those beliefs.

 

Contrary to prevailiing opinion on LS, As are not all the same. Each R has its own unique nature based upon the dynamic interplay of the unique personalities involved in it. Those who believe As are all the same are just admitting that their own personalities are bought wholesale at Wal-Mart and that they can't conceive of others being any different.

Amen.

[September]

OW and White Flower. I love your responses, they are brilliant!

 

Regarding SI, that is one interesting forum... The bitterness on there is palpable. If a lot of the posters put more effort into their relationships rather than spend so much time on there spewing vitriolic remarks about their WS and OW they may just find that they can salvage their relationships! The problem is they all encourage each other with their loathing. I understand they are looking for some guidance but I am afraid, it's not a great place to learn how to heal...

[bentnotbroken]

OW and White Flower. I love your responses, they are brilliant!

 

Regarding SI, that is one interesting forum... The bitterness on there is palpable. If a lot of the posters put more effort into their relationships rather than spend so much time on there spewing vitriolic remarks about their WS and OW they may just find that they can salvage their relationships! The problem is they all encourage each other with their loathing. I understand they are looking for some guidance but I am afraid, it's not a great place to learn how to heal...

 

 

Did it ever occur to anyone that spewing on an anonymous forum about the WS and OW are as healing to the BS as it is to be on here spewing about MM/MW for AP. It is called getting it out. And salvaging what...exactly? :sick:You either build a new relationship or you don't. There is nothing to salvage.

 

Just as you see encouraging others with loathing, I see folks encouraging others here to "seize love at all costs". Not all but quite a few. Maybe if that wasn't the case, a relationship with someone unattached might be possible....doesn't sound to good coming from me does it?

[September]

Did it ever occur to anyone that spewing on an anonymous forum about the WS and OW are as healing to the BS as it is to be on here spewing about MM/MW for AP. It is called getting it out. And salvaging what...exactly? :sick:You either build a new relationship or you don't. There is nothing to salvage.

 

Just as you see encouraging others with loathing, I see folks encouraging others here to "seize love at all costs". Not all but quite a few. Maybe if that wasn't the case, a relationship with someone unattached might be possible....doesn't sound to good coming from me does it?

 

 

There is nothing wrong with anyone wanting to vent on a forum but when there are a lot of very angry people that just want revenge, that isn't healthy. I have read on 2 separate posts where xOW had died (one from a car accident and another from cancer) and all of these people cheered it on and were really happy for the poster that they had died. It was actually really awful to see people behaving that way.

 

The difference I find here is, it is more constructive critcism or assistance rather than what is on offer over there. Two completely different forums.

[bentnotbroken]

There is nothing wrong with anyone wanting to vent on a forum but when there are a lot of very angry people that just want revenge, that isn't healthy. I have read on 2 separate posts where xOW had died (one from a car accident and another from cancer) and all of these people cheered it on and were really happy for the poster that they had died. It was actually really awful to see people behaving that way.

 

The difference I find here is, it is more constructive critcism or assistance rather than what is on offer over there. Two completely different forums.

 

 

According to some here it is just the same. A group of bitter BS high fiving each other for being BS. I won't say that I would cheer with the death of ow, but unless you know what someone has had to deal with concerning ow...you have no idea. Were they really happy or were they relieved? I imagine it is pretty awful for the BS to see people walking into their lives(behaving that way)and helping with the destruction. Again, what lens we view life through determines what we see.

[fooled once]

You make those vows, WF. You make them, then not only break them but give someone else the love and commitment you vowed to another. If people don't believe in marriage, they shouldn't do it in the first place.

 

It's accepted that after making those vows effort will be required.

 

I agree with you Silly.

 

OK, I'm in a weird place with MM right now so I'm going to post 'in general'.

 

The OW simply can't know everything that goes on in the M. She can either choose to believe what she's told, or sift out the B***S*** and believe the educated guess about the rest. For some of us, it doesn't really matter as long as we're getting our needs fulfilled.

 

All good questions but the simple answer, and you know this, is that it is easier to stay. That is why I stayed M for so long, it was just easier.

 

Sorry WF, but I don't believe it is easier to stay. If someone claims they are so miserable and they do, what I feel to be such a completely disrespectful act to step out on their marriage, why stay? Come on. You (not you - a cheating person) can only play the 'victim' role for so long. Poor me, mean spouse at home, needs not met, boo hoo. If someone is that unhappy - LEAVE. No one is holding a gun to their head. I don't buy this "bad guy" stuff for leaving. I never, ever felt like a 'bad guy' for ending my marriage. I felt RELIEF. It would have been worse for me to stay, to continue to be so miserable and so unhappy. Divorce isn't THAT hard. Heck, even with a contested divorce, while the process gets dragged out, it can STILL be accomplished. I just have a really hard time with cheating. I think it is cruel, it borders on abusive and it is just cowardly. That is just MY view on it and I don't expect anyone to agree with it. It is just how I feel.

 

I totally get what you're saying. With regard to the BS getting belittled for their efforts, I do not blame them at all for trying to save a M as I totally relate and tried to save a dead M myself. I'm the queen of fixing broken things, trust me! (Just check my garage;))

 

What I have a problem with is when it all boils down to the 'sanctity' of M. I do not view M as a sacrament. I do, however, take vows very seriously and if you find yourself in love with another you should end the BS misery and end the M to be fair to all.

 

I believe in being honest and open and respectful to the person you married. I get falling out of love. I get drifting apart. What I don't get is cheating. I don't get how that is fair to the BS OR the Other Person.

 

 

In the real world, though, many states put extreme pressure on people to M, because the state (as the third party to a M) is invested in M.

 

?? what? How does a state pressure someone to get married?

 

My H got M the first time (to his xW) for tax reasons (they'd been living together for years previously; they had no intention of M but if they wanted to afford a house, the tax savings of being M was necessary). His xW was no fan of M either - she'd cheated on her 1st H and made it clear she wasn't interested in a second M - but was keen on buying a house, so they did it (with fingers metaphorically crossed behind their backs).

I don't agree with anyone cheating and I don't agree with "well, she/he cheated first". That is absurd and childish to me.

 

I knew from what I saw with my own eyes, what I heard from his colleagues, from his friends, and from his family. "The Cheater" wasn't my source of information - though, when pressed, he would admit to whatever it was I wanted clarity on. I'm sure most OWs triangulate all their sources of information, rather than just rely on the word of one interested party - and their are many sources of information out there. Things that are consistent with their observations are more likely to be believed, and those that are contrary to their evidence more likely to be rejected. Even courtrooms work that way!

This goes back to believing what you are told. Sorry, but why would I think someone who has a history of lying (as in lying to the spouse about loving them, being happy in the marriage, not having an affair, etc) would be honest when presented with possibly a question? We see on here almost daily about OW (and OM) who have been lied to by their affair partner. Or we see an OW/OM who do believe them and then bam, they find out it was lies. I am glad in YOUR situation you got the clarity, but in many affairs, no one knows that the spouse is cheating so who does the OW/OM go to for answers? The OW/OM are the hidden secret. It isn't like many can go ask the couple's friends, family members, etc. That is how so many OW/OM are controlled by the cheating spouse because they don't have someone to go to to talk to about what they are being told.

 

I don't know of any OWs who "hoped to get the leftovers". From a fOW that just strikes me as such a self-hating statement - did you really have such low self-esteem at the time that you HOPED to get LEFTOVERS??? Wow! Or is that just the spin you put on it now, from the comfortable distance of time, dissing the self you were then in order to reaffirm the self you are now? Either way, I feel really sorry for you, or anyone else, who genuinely views themselves in this way.

 

No need to feel sorry for me. I am incredibly happy in my marriage. When I was in the affair, I was younger, naive, and after coming out of my abusive marriage, probably suffering from self esteem issues and guillable.

 

You know as well as I do that many OW aren't a priority, are getting scraps and don't feel like they are getting from the MM what they want. That is why they come here to post, why they suffer, why they wait, why they hurt. You are just trying to make it seem like most OW get all they want which is not true at all. It is really sad how you constantly try to twist things to make posters look bad.

You know, I was told a lot of this stuff too, back during the A. As in, "you're just his side-dish. He doesn't really love you. He loves her - she's the one he's with. If he loved you, he'd move mountains..."

 

And, guess what happened...

If I understand correctly from what you wrote, you married someone for a green card -- you don't believe in marriage and from what you have posted, you really don't believe in monogamy. But you are married...for now as you have said repeatedly here that if you find someone else who you are interested in, you will pursue that.

 

I see - spot the contradiction here! Since "no one knows except the 2 people IN the marriage", how could anyone possibly know that he goes home TO THE W (and not to the kids), or that he "begs forgiveness", etc? I'm presuming that this refers to DDay - since why else would he be asking his unknowing BS for forgiveness - in which case we're talking in most cases of a single incident in the course of a long R which could last anywhere between weeks and decades, in which he ONCE asks his BW for forgiveness (before dissing her again by returning to the A) while he MANY TIMES asks the OW for forgiveness for having shopped her because he was simply not ready at the point of DDay to stand up and be counted, so opted for the line of least resistance?

My point exactly - no one knows. So while people love to proclaim they know all about the marriage and what goes on, I posted another view. I never said it was accurate or what happens, it is just another view. I believe there are a couple posters here who are / were involved with serial cheaters and were asking for forgiveness several times. And of course, you had to say "dissing her again by returning to the affair". Once again, you had to put in a dig to the BS. Why do you hold such hatred for the BS? You got the guy. Why so much anger for those BS who believe the lies that come out of the MM's mouth, since as you put it, he disses the wife by returning to the mistress?

 

Why isn't he ready at DDay since he has claimed to love the OW so much?

 

Again - I was told all of that stuff. Even though much of it was wrong I was no hidden secret (just the BW didn't know), I was the one invited to family events, not her; I was the one he made a priority, not her, etc - even so, I was told, he's with her. She's the one he loves. You're nothing, etc etc. So I guess the fact that he chose to be with me makes her nothing, but that twisted logic?

 

Great for you! Glad it worked out for you. But, from reading LS, that isn't how it happens for many of the OW here. They aren't introduced to family, they don't know his children <in fact, I don't know of a single case here where the children know of the OW...there may infact be cases here, but from my memory, there are no cases where the kids know>, they don't know co-workers, etc. I am happy for you that it worked out where you are with the guy.

 

I'm certainly not claiming that every MM will leave, or that every OW will end up happily ever after with her MM. But to paint such an extreme, universalising picture ("The MM only ever loves the BW, and the OW is only ever a piece of flesh for him to toy with on the side") based on one's only unhappy experience is both sad and naive (at best ) or spiteful, at worst, wishing to plant the seeds of destruction in the minds of those OWs whose Rs have a good chance of working out for them, if left to themselves without the malicious interference of others.

 

I haven't read a single post here where posters are claiming that the MM ONLY loves the BW. Can you point that post out to me?

 

I do agree - that it is sad and spiteful to plant seeds of destruction - on both sides of the triangle (BW and OW). It is really nasty to see when certain posters take digs at the women hurting on the infidelity forum about how they aren't the one the MM loves, he only stays with her because of ..... fill in the excuse of the moment.

 

I do believe in marriage. I do believe in sharing your life with ONE person. I do believe in monogamy. I have never asked or demanded that anyone share my belief. I post my views and my thoughts. I am entitled to them, just as you are entitled to yours. To try to make it sound like those of us who do believe in marriage and monogamy and honoring vows (doesn't mean you can't divorce, it means DON'T CHEAT) are some 3 headed, 6 eyed alien's is judgmental at the very least.

 

I would think we all would agree that cheating isn't right. Neither is abuse, theft, murder, rape, etc. But it happens. Doesn't mean I accept it or will applaud it.

 

I also think we all can agree that women should be happy and fulfilled in their relationship. They should feel honored, cherish, adored and most of all respected. I feel it is disrespectful to be married and having an affair. I feel it is disrespectful to both women - the spouse and the OW.

 

If someone is unhappy in a relationship, I don't understand (and never will) why the easy answer is to cheat. Because no matter how you slice it, cheating is cowardly - at least in MY view.

[September]

According to some here it is just the same. A group of bitter BS high fiving each other for being BS. I won't say that I would cheer with the death of ow, but unless you know what someone has had to deal with concerning ow...you have no idea. Were they really happy or were they relieved? I imagine it is pretty awful for the BS to see people walking into their lives(behaving that way)and helping with the destruction. Again, what lens we view life through determines what we see.

 

 

What I have personally noticed on LS, is that most BS's and OW generally try to understand what each other is going or has gone through. Yes, you will get many differing opinions but it is nowhere near as scathing at the other.

 

From what I read, the majority of responders weren't relieved, they were actually really happy for the 2 poster's that these women that had died! Some were inserting "clappy hands". It really was unnecessary and I was actually surprised that the Mod's allowed it.

 

Yes, OW have been the catalyst for marriage breakdowns and problems, but these people behaving that way is disturbing. These OW are also daughter's, sister's, mother's and friends.

[bentnotbroken]

What I have personally noticed on LS, is that most BS's and OW generally try to understand what each other is going or has gone through. Yes, you will get many differing opinions but it is nowhere near as scathing at the other.

 

From what I read, the majority of responders weren't relieved, they were actually really happy for the 2 poster's that these women that had died! Some were inserting "clappy hands". It really was unnecessary and I was actually surprised that the Mod's allowed it.

 

Yes, OW have been the catalyst for marriage breakdowns and problems, but these people behaving that way is disturbing. These OW are also daughter's, sister's, mother's and friends.

 

 

Again the view to what is disturbing is subjective I guess. But the people who you were speaking of being happy..did not see these women as anything other than the image that the ow herself presented to them. It is kind of hard to put a human face on someone who help to turn your world upside down.

[pureinheart]

There is nothing wrong with anyone wanting to vent on a forum but when there are a lot of very angry people that just want revenge, that isn't healthy. I have read on 2 separate posts where xOW had died (one from a car accident and another from cancer) and all of these people cheered it on and were really happy for the poster that they had died. It was actually really awful to see people behaving that way.

 

The difference I find here is, it is more constructive critcism or assistance rather than what is on offer over there. Two completely different forums.

 

That is disgusting...

[pureinheart]

Again the view to what is disturbing is subjective I guess. But the people who you were speaking of being happy..did not see these women as anything other than the image that the ow herself presented to them. It is kind of hard to put a human face on someone who help to turn your world upside down.

 

Some of the BS's on LS, after years of posting are still angry and bitter, does the hatred ever subside? In some cases it's gone beyond unhealthy, of which I have no word to describe it.

 

My last exH went through massive amounts of money, so I began to check into where the money was going. I was shocked to find that all that money was going to strippers...OMG I was pissed. We had only been M'ed a month (he was stationed elsewhere). He also had a couple of gf's and one he thought was pregnant ....and....the daughter of his CO.

 

I began to become extremely insecure and hated strippers and the clubs...I mean a deep hatred. He ended up getting thrown in jail and wanted me to bail him out...nope.

 

Ok, I move out where he was hoping to reconcile after him getting out of jail...he promised those incidents would never happen again....well they did just in a different way. Me and my daughter get home to discover he's on the pc (my radar is up as I believed him to be addicted to sex of any kind)...well my daughter tells me that she wasn't sure but she thought it might be child porn....HOME GIRL LOOSES IT...he freaks out because it is not a pretty sight when I loose it ...lol....he leaves (he ends up going UA from the USMC)...I call the cops to have the pc checked ....I hate calling the cops, BUT child abuse is intolerable in my book...

 

He goes UA (unauthorised absense) and 9/11 takes place three days later...basket case doesn't even begin to describe it. My daughter was in school at the time and we were 10/15 min away from the Pentagon. I have been emotionally paralised ever since.

 

This is just a tiny segment, and haven't even thought of this till now to give as a description of the MANY things I have to be angry about...and mine are nothing in comparison to POW's and the injustice they endure.

 

I don't like to give any of these things that have happened to me power over my emotions...in fact I rather like this exH, we don't talk, but it would be friendly and he would help me or my daughter if we ever needed it...I don't hate him or his strippers, nothing anymore...

 

It is my hope that the BS's will reconcile with their greatest hatreds/fears, if that be OW or whatever.

Edited August 18, 2010 by pureinheart

[September]

Some of the BS's on LS, after years of posting are still angry and bitter, does the hatred ever subside? In some cases it's gone beyond unhealthy, of which I have no word to describe it.

 

My last exH went through massive amounts of money, so I began to check into where the money was going. I was shocked to find that all that money was going to strippers...OMG I was pissed. We had only been M'ed a month (he was stationed elsewhere). He also had a couple of gf's and one he thought was pregnant ....and....the daughter of his CO.

 

I began to become extremely insecure and hated strippers and the clubs...I mean a deep hatred. He ended up getting thrown in jail and wanted me to bail him out...nope.

 

Ok, I move out where he was hoping to reconcile after him getting out of jail...he promised those incidents would never happen again....well they did just in a different way. Me and my daughter get home to discover he's on the pc (my radar is up as I believed him to be addicted to sex of any kind)...well my daughter tells me that she wasn't sure but she thought it might be child porn....HOME GIRL LOOSES IT...he freaks out because it is not a pretty sight when I loose it ...lol....he leaves (he ends up going UA from the USMC)...I call the cops to have the pc checked ....I hate calling the cops, BUT child abuse is intolerable in my book...

 

He goes UA (unauthorised absense) and 9/11 takes place three days later...basket case doesn't even begin to describe it. My daughter was in school at the time and we were 10/15 min away from the Pentagon. I have been emotionally paralised ever since.

 

This is just a tiny segment, and haven't even thought of this till now to give as a description of the MANY things I have to be angry about...and mine are nothing in comparison to POW's and the injustice they endure.

 

I don't like to give any of these things that have happened to me power over my emotions...in fact I rather like this exH, we don't talk, but it would be friendly and he would help me or my daughter if we ever needed it...I don't hate him or his strippers, nothing anymore...

 

It is my hope that the BS's will reconcile with their greatest hatreds/fears, if that be OW or whatever.

 

Great post and I agree with you! You have been wonderful to try and get on with your life without your past constantly dragging you down.

 

We all have a story to tell. Some of these are tragic, some not as much as others but all relevant to that person dealing with it and some can deal with things better than others.

 

BUT there comes a time in life when we have to stop dwelling on certain situation's and start to move forward. What concerns me, when I read some forums (mostly on another site!) is the massive amount of hatred and bitterness. When you get a collection of others feeling the same way, all it does is fuel the situation and make it hard for a person to move on.

[Ms. Red]

Great post and I agree with you! You have been wonderful to try and get on with your life without your past constantly dragging you down.

 

We all have a story to tell. Some of these are tragic, some not as much as others but all relevant to that person dealing with it and some can deal with things better than others.

 

BUT there comes a time in life when we have to stop dwelling on certain situation's and start to move forward. What concerns me, when I read some forums (mostly on another site!) is the massive amount of hatred and bitterness. When you get a collection of others feeling the same way, all it does is fuel the situation and make it hard for a person to move on.

 

 

I had this exact thought as I was reading some previous posts.

[OWoman]

There is nothing wrong with anyone wanting to vent on a forum but when there are a lot of very angry people that just want revenge, that isn't healthy. I have read on 2 separate posts where xOW had died (one from a car accident and another from cancer) and all of these people cheered it on and were really happy for the poster that they had died. It was actually really awful to see people behaving that way.

 

The difference I find here is, it is more constructive critcism or assistance rather than what is on offer over there. Two completely different forums.

 

According to some here it is just the same. A group of bitter BS high fiving each other for being BS. I won't say that I would cheer with the death of ow, but unless you know what someone has had to deal with concerning ow...you have no idea. Were they really happy or were they relieved? I imagine it is pretty awful for the BS to see people walking into their lives(behaving that way)and helping with the destruction. Again, what lens we view life through determines what we see.

 

From what I read, the majority of responders weren't relieved, they were actually really happy for the 2 poster's that these women that had died! Some were inserting "clappy hands". It really was unnecessary and I was actually surprised that the Mod's allowed it.

 

As an analogous situation - were my H's xW to die (from whatever cause) and I were to post about it on LS, I would certainly not expect the news to be greeted with clappy hands... That seriously is just :sick::sick::sick::sick: Would you really want to be M to someone like that????

[flying]

There is nothing wrong with anyone wanting to vent on a forum but when there are a lot of very angry people that just want revenge, that isn't healthy. I have read on 2 separate posts where xOW had died (one from a car accident and another from cancer) and all of these people cheered it on and were really happy for the poster that they had died. It was actually really awful to see people behaving that way.

 

The difference I find here is, it is more constructive critcism or assistance rather than what is on offer over there. Two completely different forums.

 

This is true...but I would venture to say that the difference comes from the fact that LS is populated by many BS and OP. So in comparing LS with SI, you're comparing apples and oranges. When left alone in the room/forum, BS are hardly the only members of the triangle capable of being full of hate and destructiveness. Oh, no. If you want to compare the gleefulness of people in a similar situation egging each other on with other apples, then I'd suggest you compare these people on SI with the people on that other site that is dedicated to OW...that would be a much more fair comparison. I have read things on that site that send my eyebrows way up into my hairline. The OW there are often more than eager to wish harm upon the BS.

 

People in any situation can be cruel and say terrible things; the useful thing about LS is that since both BS and OP are here and interact more, there is more opportunity to see each other as people. As BnB pointed out, that's the most important part. Despite the animosity that happens here from time to time, I think that's a real positive thing.