married men?

[cavedweller]

For the life of me I can not understand why a single woman would want to have an affair and be in a relationship with a married man when there are scores of single guys out there..

 

Why would a woman want all of the problems, drama, bull sheet and excess baggage (that comes with being with a married man) when she has other options?

[carhill]

From my one significant datapoint, someone who cheated repeatedly while married and became an OW after the marriage, I came to understand that her mother did the same thing to her father.

 

Assuming that datapoint is an anomaly, I share your sentiments. Perhaps it's why it was so difficult for me to even *find* a single woman when I was younger. They were chasing the married men (or, edit, accepting the approaches of married men). TBH, when I was married, the only women who even came close to 'chasing' me were married themselves.

 

Are there teeth in the theory that, concurrently, a married man is 'validated' by another member of the woman tribe and a single man enjoys no such validation and he, further, must be 'single for a reason', like he's defective or something?

[Silly_Girl]

Are there teeth in the theory that, concurrently, a married man is 'validated' by another member of the woman tribe and a single man enjoys no such validation and he, further, must be 'single for a reason', like he's defective or something?

 

Maybe. I have wondered that more often recently. Fundamentally I want a husband (my own!), not a casual relationship. I do ignore those I know are looking only for a bit of fun, or are players. There again, I have always (with one exception) spurned men who are attached/married so maybe it doesn't fit after all.

[YellowShark]

From my one significant datapoint, someone who cheated repeatedly while married and became an OW after the marriage, I came to understand that her mother did the same thing to her father.

 

Not dissing you one bit carhill but when I hear this "get out of jail free" excuse it always makes my eyes roll. I don't give a flying **** what happened in your childhood, that isn't a free pass to toss your morality out the window as an adult.

[carhill]

I agree, but always seek to understand the psychology. This became a major component of my *choice* to never pursue a woman with a 'complicated' family background ever again. It's so foreign to me that it's a language I'll never understand. One marriage taught me enough about that.

[YellowShark]

I agree, but always seek to understand the psychology. This became a major component of my *choice* to never pursue a woman with a 'complicated' family background ever again. It's so foreign to me that it's a language I'll never understand. One marriage taught me enough about that.

 

I look at it this way. Mommy cheated on daddy and caused pain and turmoil. Ergo I SHOULD NOT cheat with MM because I see the pain and turmoil it caused.

 

Why some people reverse that equation is a cop out for their amorality.

[BB07]

I agree, but always seek to understand the psychology. This became a major component of my *choice* to never pursue a woman with a 'complicated' family background ever again. It's so foreign to me that it's a language I'll never understand. One marriage taught me enough about that.

 

Do I remember reading that you had a complicated family background of your own?

[carhill]

Nope, pasty white parents married for life, no siblings, no abuse, supportive parents, still take care of my mom until she dies from dementia. You must be thinking of someone else.

 

I loved the datapoint, unhealthily, and my own psychology, irrespective of my role models, caused myself and my marriage pain during my *adult* life. It was a dishonor to my parents. Owned.

[BB07]

I look at it this way. Mommy cheated on daddy and caused pain and turmoil. Ergo I SHOULD NOT cheat with MM because I see the pain and turmoil it caused.

 

Why some people reverse that equation is a cop out for their amorality.

 

Whether you "get it" or not, our childhood experiences have an effect on us good and bad. Often times we fail to realize just how much we tend to try to play out these issues into adulthood. It's not conscious, believe me.

With all that said, don't assume that I'm excusing the wrongs I've done or my poor choices, but yet....I wish you could walk a mile in my shoes, just for a few days. Perhaps if you could, you might realize how difficult it is to live a life of your own self imposed hell because of some dumb moment in time that you didn't say whoa.......this is NOT Good. One moment in time can change everything and if that moment is a bad choice, you start sliding down the mountain.

 

It's nice that things are so black and white to you and you have no weakness or issues in your own life........so here is a salute to you.

[BB07]

Nope, pasty white parents married for life, no siblings, no abuse, supportive parents, still take care of my mom until she dies from dementia. You must be thinking of someone else.

 

I loved the datapoint, unhealthily, and my own psychology, irrespective of my role models, caused myself and my marriage pain during my *adult* life. It was a dishonor to my parents. Owned.

 

Thanks for the reply. I must have had you mixed up with someone else. I'm sorry.

[YellowShark]

Whether you "get it" or not, our childhood experiences have an effect on us good and bad.

 

I never said that childhood experiences do not have an effect. What I am saying is that those experiences are not AN EXCUSE - see: rationalization - to repeat bad behaviour.

 

Often times we fail to realize just how much we tend to try to play out these issues into adulthood. It's not conscious, believe me.

 

I agree with this statement too. But childhood experiences are not AN EXCUSE - see: rationalization - to repeat bad behaviour. And if one finds themselves repeating bad behaviours they need to seek counselling ASAP.

 

With all that said, don't assume that I'm excusing the wrongs I've done or my poor choices, but yet....I wish you could walk a mile in my shoes, just for a few days. Perhaps if you could, you might realize how difficult it is to live a life of your own self imposed hell because of some dumb moment in time that you didn't say whoa.......this is NOT Good. One moment in time can change everything and if that moment is a bad choice, you start sliding down the mountain.

 

It's nice that things are so black and white to you and you have no weakness or issues in your own life........so here is a salute to you.

 

It's not a matter of black and white. It's a matter of RIGHT and WRONG. Is is right to beat your children because mommy or daddy did it? Is it right to be a drug addict because mommy or daddy did it? Is it right to be an alcoholic because mommy or daddy did it?

 

'nuff said.

Edited August 8, 2010 by YellowShark
spelling & grammer

[carhill]

BTW, wrt to 'black and white' thinking, IME, MC was probably the greatest stride forward in terms of melding healthy boundaries with an understanding of the width and breadth of life. IOW, I can erect healthy 'black and white' boundaries for myself and still accept that the paths and boundaries of others are equally valid *for them*. We're all unique individuals on our own life paths. The datapoint I used as an example is a real human who faced a lot, made some poor decisions as well as good ones, learned from them (I hope) and moved on. Perhaps rejecting me was a healthy thing for both of us. In any event, my experiences with her *helped* me with setting boundaries for myself in many arenas. In that vein, I feel it was a positive experience.

 

On LS, typically most threads about infidelity or attraction to married persons is where the man is married and the woman is single. Posts like mine add to the balance. TBH, at that time, the emotional connection, interaction and interpersonal dynamic completely obviated any real concern for marital status. IOW, I didn't care. Sure, that was unhealthy. It was also real, and I think honest disclosure is helpful. Every dynamic is different.

 

In my travels these days, when I happen to encounter a woman with whom I 'connect', I can generally look down and see a wedding band. I'm at peace with that now. Perhaps, someday, an available and unattached woman will exhibit those same intrinsic compatibilities. That's what I say to myself. One more datapoint

[BB07]

I never said that childhood experiences do not have an effect. What I am saying is that those experiences are not AN EXCUSE - see: rationalization - to repeat bad behaviour.

 

 

 

I agree with this statement too. But childhood experiences are not AN EXCUSE - see: rationalization - to repeat bad behaviour. And if one finds themselves repeating bad behaviours they need to seek counselling ASAP.

 

 

 

It's not a matter of black and white. It's a matter of RIGHT and WRONG. Is is right to beat your children because mommy or daddy did it? Is it right to be a drug addict because mommy or daddy did it? Is it right to be an alcoholic because mommy or daddy did it?

 

'nuff said.

 

Look......I realize that you and I are coming from completely different places and it saying that, we all have a tendency to speak from our place of where we are right this minute..........but don't assume I'm rationalizing anything. I own my wrongs...more than you could ever know or understand. I'm trying really hard to understand how I got to the place I'm in, and BTW.....I doubt if you know exactly what place I'm in right now, as it's not the typical mm/ow story, so don't take your own issues out on me......'nuff said.

[BB07]

BTW, wrt to 'black and white' thinking, IME, MC was probably the greatest stride forward in terms of melding healthy boundaries with an understanding of the width and breadth of life. IOW, I can erect healthy 'black and white' boundaries for myself and still accept that the paths and boundaries of others are equally valid *for them*. We're all unique individuals on our own life paths. The datapoint I used as an example is a real human who faced a lot, made some poor decisions as well as good ones, learned from them (I hope) and moved on. Perhaps rejecting me was a healthy thing for both of us. In any event, my experiences with her *helped* me with setting boundaries for myself in many arenas. In that vein, I feel it was a positive experience.

 

On LS, typically most threads about infidelity or attraction to married persons is where the man is married and the woman is single. Posts like mine add to the balance. TBH, at that time, the emotional connection, interaction and interpersonal dynamic completely obviated any real concern for marital status. IOW, I didn't care. Sure, that was unhealthy. It was also real, and I think honest disclosure is helpful. Every dynamic is different.

 

In my travels these days, when I happen to encounter a woman with whom I 'connect', I can generally look down and see a wedding band. I'm at peace with that now. Perhaps, someday, an available and unattached woman will exhibit those same intrinsic compatibilities. That's what I say to myself. One more datapoint

 

Sounds like you are in a good healthy place carhill, I know it's been hard work getting there. I wish you much joy and happiness in the future and most importantly, PEACE of mind.

[carhill]

Another consideration wrt the OP is that, in US society, marriage is considered a positive and rewarded (socially, economically and politically) status and this seemingly 'popular' and 'stable' dynamic is or can be attractive, juxtaposed with the relative uncertainty of clandestine romance with such a married person. It (the attraction to married persons) is an interesting brew of psychological features and impacts. Is the stable, socially prominent married man who 'sneeks' in some time for his 'romance' more attractive than the predictable and often socially relatively unknown single man who asks a woman out on a date? Do the married man's progeny stir the loins of the single female who would like that genetic success in her uterus? Interesting questions.

[Tony]

If this thread doesn't get back on topic real fast, it will get deleted. To find out what the topic is, please see the original post, # 1. Thank you.

[Tony]

The OP is basically wanting to know why single women want to be in relationships with married men when there are so many single men out there to be had. If we can stick to this topic and explore the subject in a critical way, this could be very interesting. If everybody goes off in their own direction, the thread will be deleted.

 

IT'S YOUR CHOICE!!!

[BB07]

Another consideration wrt the OP is that, in US society, marriage is considered a positive and rewarded (socially, economically and politically) status and this seemingly 'popular' and 'stable' dynamic is or can be attractive, juxtaposed with the relative uncertainty of clandestine romance with such a married person. It (the attraction to married persons) is an interesting brew of psychological features and impacts. Is the stable, socially prominent married man who 'sneeks' in some time for his 'romance' more attractive than the predictable and often socially relatively unknown single man who asks a woman out on a date? Do the married man's progeny stir the loins of the single female who would like that genetic success in her uterus? Interesting questions.

 

OMG........carhill, please don't take this the wrong way, but the part of your post that I bolded........cracked me up in your choice of words. :lmao:

 

Now back to the serious part of it.

As I'm in a slightly different situation than some of the OW here, as I didn't realize I was dating a very much MM, I still acknowledge that I took a greater risk than it should have been, had he been really free and single. (I thought he was separated)

 

 

I was drawn to him in ways I can't explain, never happened to me before nor since and I hope it never happens to me again. The draw happened before I knew anything about him. Primal, subconscious....all and more, I guess. Maybe we both sensed the brokenness in each other. I know I won't ever trust those feelings again, I will surely run the other way as fast as I can.

[jennie-jennie]

For the life of me I can not understand why a single woman would want to have an affair and be in a relationship with a married man when there are scores of single guys out there..

 

Why would a woman want all of the problems, drama, bull sheet and excess baggage (that comes with being with a married man) when she has other options?

 

Because the married man is the man she loves. (See my signature.)

[LucreziaBorgia]

I don't know that you have too many women who prowl for married guys. Some do, yes - but a majority of them aren't.

 

So why do they go for the married guy then? Because a married guy has to work twice as hard to convince someone to be with them, has to be sexier, more romantic, more intense than a single guy would. Why?

 

Because a married guy has to find a way to overcome the fact that he is offering an overall rotten deal. The married guy sweeps women off their feet. How many times do you hear stuff like "it was so intense like nothing I've ever felt", or "we had a connection that no man has ever given me" and so on.

 

It has to be that way. A single guy is offering himself. A married guy has to offer himself + a really rotten deal (you get to date me while I stay married to someone else) - so he has to really, really ramp it up to make that rotten deal seem acceptable (with mixed tactics like "I'm unhappy in my marriage", "my wife doesn't understand me", "we never have sex", "we are like roommates", etc paired with "you are my soulmate", "you are the sexiest woman I have ever met", "you make me feel alive again", etc.). The married guy's intensity is fired up even more by the prospect of escape from his perceived marital monotony.

 

It nearly always works, too. You have a married guy who will never leave his family convincing a single woman that their affair is somehow a 'good' relationship (well, for as long as he wants to be in the affair anyway). I guess outside the fact that it will generally never be more than it is - it can be good. It is all in what you accept for yourself, I guess.

 

Would they rather feel intensely in a constricted situation, or feel indifferent in a open one? Some go for the more intense encounters, even at the expense of knowing it can never really be more than it is. Love can cause us to make some choices for ourselves that few others understand.

[BB07]

LucreziaBorgia, great reply!

 

 

I may get in trouble, but I fail to see why we got thumped for OT. :confused:

[califnan]

I have been wondering the same thing. Recently I have also been wondering what kind of lines a MM uses to get said woman. I was on a flight last week where a man sat next to me and we spent the entire time talking about his family, his kids, wife, my boyfriend, jobs, etc. He even showed me pictures of his family and wife. At the end of the flight he asked for my phone number and email address. I was shocked. Here is a man who spent the entire time talking about his family, suddenly asking a strange girl for her contact information. It could have been harmless, but it seemed very weird to me. I didn't give it to him, but it suddenly made things extremely awkward, and ruined what was a nice conversation.

 

----------------------

 

LisaLee, That made me Laugh .. Do you believe these guys .. That is So typical ! oh brother .. ha

[califnan]

LucreziaBorgia, great reply!

 

 

I may get in trouble, but I fail to see why we got thumped for OT. :confused:

 

---------------------

 

I know. It's not an easy question to answer, as some might think .. And for something that does just seem to happen ..

[Silly_Girl]

I don't know that you have too many women who prowl for married guys. Some do, yes - but a majority of them aren't.

 

So why do they go for the married guy then? Because a married guy has to work twice as hard to convince someone to be with them, has to be sexier, more romantic, more intense than a single guy would. Why?

 

Because a married guy has to find a way to overcome the fact that he is offering an overall rotten deal. The married guy sweeps women off their feet. How many times do you hear stuff like "it was so intense like nothing I've ever felt", or "we had a connection that no man has ever given me" and so on.

 

It has to be that way. A single guy is offering himself. A married guy has to offer himself + a really rotten deal (you get to date me while I stay married to someone else) - so he has to really, really ramp it up to make that rotten deal seem acceptable (with mixed tactics like "I'm unhappy in my marriage", "my wife doesn't understand me", "we never have sex", "we are like roommates", etc paired with "you are my soulmate", "you are the sexiest woman I have ever met", "you make me feel alive again", etc.). The married guy's intensity is fired up even more by the prospect of escape from his perceived marital monotony.

 

It nearly always works, too. You have a married guy who will never leave his family convincing a single woman that their affair is somehow a 'good' relationship (well, for as long as he wants to be in the affair anyway). I guess outside the fact that it will generally never be more than it is - it can be good. It is all in what you accept for yourself, I guess.

 

Would they rather feel intensely in a constricted situation, or feel indifferent in a open one? Some go for the more intense encounters, even at the expense of knowing it can never really be more than it is. Love can cause us to make some choices for ourselves that few others understand.

 

This has left me confused a little. In myself. My MM is not especially romantic. Or intense. Or offering me amazing things. If anything it was how very relaxed everything was, how easy, how he would sometimes be gripey about things I would be gripey about. I never felt IN ANY WAY I was being lured or wooed.

 

BUT (here we go ) those other things you say, the second bolded by me. Yes, those things have been said. But they are so few and far between when set against the other stuff... But yes, they are there. And we both denied the 'romance' for a while. Were adamant it was NOT that we were falling in love, indeed we would NEVER meet etc etc.

 

I may have to come back and read this again tomorrow Thanks for the food for thought!

[Butterfly11]

For the life of me I can not understand why a single woman would want to have an affair and be in a relationship with a married man when there are scores of single guys out there..

 

Why would a woman want all of the problems, drama, bull sheet and excess baggage (that comes with being with a married man) when she has other options?

 

My with MM didn't begin under the assumption we were going to have an affair. We had known each other since Jr. high had lost touch over the years and reconnected a year and a half ago. We connected on this emotional level that I'd never had with someone...this being as just friends. I suppose as that connection grew we found ourselves falling into an EA and then later a PA. I felt it was wrong, but yet at the same time I couldn't deny him. I've had my fair share of bad relationships with my exH, exBFs...those being more problematic and bull sheet then my A. For me all the problems, emotions, drama and what not were things I was willing to take because of my love for him. The chance at having a life with him definitely outweighed the negative.