Revenge? Who Has the right?

[HappyAtLast]

HAL, did you take proactive steps did you take to repair your marriage before you made the choice to cheat?

 

Was your wife aware that her lack of participation in repairing the relationship could/would possible cause you to have an affair?

 

Just curious....

 

Oh Lord, yes. Long and boring story, my ex-wife had an affair early in our marriage. I stayed, needed to raise my children. Tried many many times over the years until I finally gave up.

 

I met my current wife several months prior to my last child leaving home. My ex-wife was well aware of the problems in our marriage, well aware of my intent to leave. Yet, chose to do nothing and then was surprised when I left.

 

In my case specifically, she was not innocent. But, I will say that no one in a marriage, even a good one, is innocent of marital "crimes", including myself.

[xxoo]

Interesting that you compare it to an emotional minefield. I was so hurt and emotionally damaged when my MM and I reconnected, that he compared it to him standing in a minefield unable to move, not knowing where to put his foot down next so as not to trigger a mine. Slowly I learnt to trust him, as he willingly stayed put in my emotional mine field.

 

Our relationship has been about disarming my mines more than anything else. It has overall been healing to me emotionally.

 

It sounds like your previously relationship was extremely unhealthy, to the point of abusive. Moving into a relationship as an OW can be an emotional improvement from that situation, and still fall short of healthy.

 

Jennie, my hope for you is that you heal so much in this relationship that you are ready to leave it behind and get to the next level--a partner who puts you before any other woman, always

 

Generally it is the MM who decides to stay married, against the wishes of the OW, thereby setting the parameters of their relationship. Thus the revengeful thoughts towards him.

 

What I'm saying is, the OW decides to be with the MM.

 

But I can ultimately understand revengeful thoughts toward the MM, esp if he misled the OW. What really bothers me is the revengeful thoughts toward his BS, when she has been nothing but crapped upon by all parties. The way I see it--she "won" the cheater. Some prize

[jennie-jennie]

It sounds like your previously relationship was extremely unhealthy, to the point of abusive. Moving into a relationship as an OW can be an emotional improvement from that situation, and still fall short of healthy.

 

Jennie, my hope for you is that you heal so much in this relationship that you are ready to leave it behind and get to the next level--a partner who puts you before any other woman, always

 

Thanks. Although my wish is that my MM leaves his marriage behind, so I can stay in this relationship forever.

What I'm saying is, the OW decides to be with the MM.

 

There are many OW though who like me thought the MM would make a choice. I made clear from the beginning that I wanted a man of my own and that I expected him to choose. I never expected to become a long term OW.

 

But I can ultimately understand revengeful thoughts toward the MM, esp if he misled the OW. What really bothers me is the revengeful thoughts toward his BS, when she has been nothing but crapped upon by all parties. The way I see it--she "won" the cheater. Some prize

 

Are there really that many OW who harbor revengeful thoughts towards BSs? Is it not just revenge by proxy like Ellin stated?

[xxoo]

There are many OW though who like me thought the MM would make a choice. I made clear from the beginning that I wanted a man of my own and that I expected him to choose. I never expected to become a long term OW.

 

This makes no sense to me.

 

Your words said that you wanted a man of your own, but your actions showed that you would accept him married. That isn't making things clear at all.

[bentnotbroken]

Of course, on a deep level we are the authors of our life stories, but it's not as simple as that. Humans are driven by emotions which come from the subconscious, and inside it are things that have been handed to us in the early part of out lives, when we had no control.

 

It is a very difficult and long process to change that later in life. So it's not all about free will and choice at all. Although it is powerful and important to gain insight and knowledge about it.

 

On a more mundane level, MM/MW often give promises which later turn out to be empty, but as OW/OM feel intense love, they believe it and have hopes, then get very painful disappointments. They live in a sort of suspensions that erodes their strengths day after day. Every minute is a rollercoaster and it is difficult to gain closure in the end. Much have been written about it on the forum. To say that OW/OM should have known is a great over-simplification.

 

 

Some of US are driven by emotions.......others not so much. I know when I stick my hand in a hornets nest, I will probably be stung. Doesn't make the sting less painful, but it does let me know that I had a choice about whether to deal with that pain. If I hadn't stuck my hand into that nest, I wouldn't have a hand the size of a baseball mitt and pain shooting up to my elbow. That was a lesson I didn't have to learn from experience...I'd watch it happen to my brother, yet I thought my outcome would be different...why? I would wager a guess it was because I used the maturity level of an 8 year old and the emotion of trying to do something my brother couldn't do(bragging rights you know;)) instead of rational thought and common sense. But I do realize that not all people learn lessons the same way and some grow up with different standards to living life.

 

It just seems to me when people use phrases like "driven by emotions", those emotions should be the driving force in all aspects of your life instead of just ones dealing with romantic relationships. If you can access the use of rational thought in some aspects of your life, one should be able to access that same thought process in all other aspects.

[Ellin]

Some of US are driven by emotions.......others not so much. I know when I stick my hand in a hornets nest, I will probably be stung. Doesn't make the sting less painful, but it does let me know that I had a choice about whether to deal with that pain. If I hadn't stuck my hand into that nest, I wouldn't have a hand the size of a baseball mitt and pain shooting up to my elbow. That was a lesson I didn't have to learn from experience...I'd watch it happen to my brother, yet I thought my outcome would be different...why? I would wager a guess it was because I used the maturity level of an 8 year old and the emotion of trying to do something my brother couldn't do(bragging rights you know;)) instead of rational thought and common sense. But I do realize that not all people learn lessons the same way and some grow up with different standards to living life.

 

It just seems to me when people use phrases like "driven by emotions", those emotions should be the driving force in all aspects of your life instead of just ones dealing with romantic relationships. If you can access the use of rational thought in some aspects of your life, one should be able to access that same thought process in all other aspects.

Good for you for being so rational and "healthy". You must have had a good life with very few incidents with scarring potential in your life, especially childhood. That would explain your apparent lack of understanding of complex emotional problems, as illustrated by you comparing emotions involved in a romantic R to a ridiculous and very simple act of sticking one's hand in a hornet nest.

[Ellin]

But I can ultimately understand revengeful thoughts toward the MM, esp if he misled the OW. What really bothers me is the revengeful thoughts toward his BS, when she has been nothing but crapped upon by all parties. The way I see it--she "won" the cheater. Some prize

In a case like this MM and his W appear in OW's mind as a package. The BS is the one that has got what OW wants so much, that causes resentment. She might have been upset but in the end she's the lucky one, the one w will be with this man for years to come, while OW is left in despair and questioning her worth.

 

And it is the perceived happiness of the two together that scratches the wounds of a devastated OW.

 

I'm not saying these are nice feelings, but I believe they are natural. I'm just trying to present OW's point of view.

 

It only becomes disturbing if OW actually act on them.

[bentnotbroken]

Good for you for being so rational and "healthy". You must have had a good life with very few incidents with scarring potential in your life, especially childhood. That would explain your apparent lack of understanding of complex emotional problems, as illustrated by you comparing emotions involved in a romantic R to a ridiculous and very simple act of sticking one's hand in a hornet nest.

 

 

I never said I had a healthy life. By the grace of God I get through and learn from others not so smart moves, my own dumb moves and mature as I age. I compared the thought process of "humans", isn't that what we are speaking of? I not only understand simple and complex, I can even deal with humans who seem to appear to want to remain stupid. Rational thought can be applied to "ALL" aspects of life, no matter the age or situation.

[Ellin]

I never said I had a healthy life. By the grace of God I get through and learn from others not so smart moves, my own dumb moves and mature as I age. I compared the thought process of "humans", isn't that what we are speaking of? I not only understand simple and complex, I can even deal with humans who seem to appear to want to remain stupid. Rational thought can be applied to "ALL" aspects of life, no matter the age or situation.

Of course it can and I'm not saying that humans don't apply logic at all and are driven by emotions only. But emotions play huge part in human behavior, and emotions involved in interactions between man and women, especially when "love" is concerned, belong to the strongest of all, at times too strong to fully control.

[NoIDidn't]

Good for you for being so rational and "healthy". You must have had a good life with very few incidents with scarring potential in your life, especially childhood. That would explain your apparent lack of understanding of complex emotional problems, as illustrated by you comparing emotions involved in a romantic R to a ridiculous and very simple act of sticking one's hand in a hornet nest.

 

I do believe the "hornet's nest" bit was a metaphor for basically doing something stupid to yourself and thinking that you could do it better than someone else.

 

Basically the "doing the same thing over and expecting different results" kind of thing.

 

Why a poster has to be ridiculed for having learned from other people's stupidity and saying so is a mystery to me.

[bentnotbroken]

I do believe the "hornet's nest" bit was a metaphor for basically doing something stupid to yourself and thinking that you could do it better than someone else.

 

Basically the "doing the same thing over and expecting different results" kind of thing.

 

Why a poster has to be ridiculed for having learned from other people's stupidity and saying so is a mystery to me.

 

 

NID, let it roll off your back like a duck does water. I get the nature of the beast. It isn't worth it. Thanks though.

[turnstone]

In my case specifically, she was not innocent. But, I will say that no one in a marriage, even a good one, is innocent of marital "crimes", including myself.

 

What exactly do you think she wasn't innocent of? Your choice to have an affair?

[Ellin]

I do believe the "hornet's nest" bit was a metaphor for basically doing something stupid to yourself and thinking that you could do it better than someone else.

 

Basically the "doing the same thing over and expecting different results" kind of thing.

 

Why a poster has to be ridiculed for having learned from other people's stupidity and saying so is a mystery to me.

That's quite obvious NID, but I still think it is somewhat infantile to equal this to a much more complex and substantially different process of getting involved in an A.

 

And really, I don't know why you mention ridiculing someone for learning etc. as I did not do anything like that.

[Bitterman24/7]

That's quite obvious NID, but I still think it is somewhat infantile to equal this to a much more complex and substantially different process of getting involved in an A.

 

And really, I don't know why you mention ridiculing someone for learning etc. as I did not do anything like that.

 

How the hell is the process of getting into an A complex?

[Ellin]

How the hell is the process of getting into an A complex?

I'd explain it to you if it was a genuine question from someone willing to listen with open mind, not a dig.

[Spark1111]

"Her child was unaffected." When the mother of a child goes through heart break, no child will be unaffected.

 

And if indeed, the relationship has been a secret, where will the OW get support, who will comfort her and listen to her, who will help her get through the pain? Must she not indeed put on a happy face to conceal her feelings since no one knows?

 

But didn't she KNOW the relationship would have to be secret going in?

 

It would not be an affair otherwise.

 

As for her child, what will they regret? Mommy's boyfriend is not around anymore and mommy is very sad?

 

I do not want to quantify anyone's pain here, but I do not believe you can equate that to my father had an affair that devasted my mother and us.

 

It redefines your personal family history forever.

 

These boards are filled with adults who are still healing from a parent's affair discovered in childhood.

 

I'm sorry Jennie. It is not the same as mommy was sad when she lost her boyfriend.

[Spark1111]

I have no place nor any right to go anywhere with the anger. It's fleeting anyway, cos of who I am.

 

I agree with how you see it. I still feel a fool.

 

Thank you for frankly bothering to care, when I am in effect an OW, and you a BS.

 

I wonder if all this talk of revenge, is really a need for closure? It's not that we want to hurt the other, but that we need our own hurt recognised and resolved. Wherever we are in the 'triangle'?

 

Because even when I feel my negative thoughts, I wish BS and xMOM well. I just wish me well too.

 

This is an excellent point WW!

 

Is revenge a need to have our pain validated? And by being validated, find closure?

 

Inversely, is the need for revenge because our pain has not been validated? Or we haven't found closure? Or are in a position where our need for validation is thwarted?

[Bitterman24/7]

I'd explain it to you if it was a genuine question from someone willing to listen with open mind, not a dig.

:lmao:

 

That's because there is no answer and its just another bull**** excuse to for WSs to sleep outside their marriage. No matter how much a person is :love:"in the moment,":love: they can still think with their brain and not with their private parts.

[Tony]

If any member would like to start a thread a keep it ON TOPIC, I would certainly be open to that. Meanwhile, I am offering a REWARD to all persons who can explain why this and so many other threads just roll off into orbit...usually after the tenth post...but often sooner.

 

There is no good reason to keep this thread open since nobody wants to discuss its topic. Thanks!