Hot Carl Posted August 5, 2010 Posted August 5, 2010 Tonight I fail to find any humor in my situation. Whatsoever. I feel like the magician trapped in a big shell of ice. Only in my case I didn't get into it having any idea how to escape. While everyone else frolics in the sun, I'm peering out wondering how I got in here and losing hope it will melt in time. Talking about it doesn't make a difference. Posting about it doesn't make a difference. Hearing people compliment me in whatever ways they might doesn't make a difference. I don't even know what to do about it. I'm just here waiting for my own body heat to melt the shell from the inside. I do every damn thing alone. I run alone. I work alone. I shop alone. I sleep alone. I eat alone. I laugh alone. I've lost every girlfriend, distanced myself from all my friends and family. I open up and be my true self with no one. Ever. And there's nothing any of you can do or say to change it. There's nothing any therapist could ever say. I'm sure the tool I could use to break out is sitting right here in front of me, but I wouldn't know it if someone dropped it on my head. Functioning in life and having professional success and money all seem to be pretty automatic. And I even look happy while I'm at it. For months I'll go on feeling forced contentment, trying to forget I'm always squeezing the same amount of hope into an ever-shrinking future. How do I take the next step and actually live a life that is relevant to someone other than me? I'm broken. I'm dissatisfied. I can't fix me. What did I do to deserve myself? I must leave a reeking trail of bad karma everywhere I go. Is this feeling sorry for myself? I'll probably read all this tomorrow and think "what a drama queen you get to be." But that will be from a position of forced contentment or distant from the mirror I saw myself in again tonight. I always take the first opportunity to forget what I really look like.
oasis Posted August 5, 2010 Posted August 5, 2010 HC, you have all of the trappings to live a really good life. Good health, money and intelligence. Some people are not that lucky. I see these people every single day. They are sad, broke and sick. And with all of those bad breaks, they still have to trudge on. I work in the administrative part of the health care business and I see them every single day. So, sit back and truly count your blessings. Accept your life "as is" - even with its deficiencies, simply because it is the only life that you have. Find a way to make the best of it, because no one gets a fulfilled life. There is always something missing. Mine included. Above all, love and accept yourself for who you are, warts and all. And remember, it could get a lot worse. Cheer up! It is really not so bad.
mickleb Posted August 5, 2010 Posted August 5, 2010 You're a stubborn little critter, ain't ya? I always take the first opportunity to forget what I really look like. You don't really look like this. You look like this sometimes. We all do. This is a bad day. You will have better ones. If you want to build closer relationships with others, you know what to do. On a better day, you can get about doing that. For the moment you can work hard at giving yourself a break and do as many of the things you get the *eensiest* bit of pleasure out of, as you can. Thinking of you - the witty, wry, intelligent, insightful, kind guy that you are. Take care. x
TaraMaiden Posted August 5, 2010 Posted August 5, 2010 Tonight I fail to find any humor in my situation. Whatsoever. (. . .) I always take the first opportunity to forget what I really look like. A man can never look upon the same river, twice.
Author Hot Carl Posted August 5, 2010 Author Posted August 5, 2010 HC, you have all of the trappings to live a really good life. Good health, money and intelligence. Some people are not that lucky. I see these people every single day. They are sad, broke and sick. And with all of those bad breaks, they still have to trudge on. I work in the administrative part of the health care business and I see them every single day. I know. I see them sometimes, too. I do feel fortunate. I almost feel guilty when I think how I didn't do a lot more to earn my good, easy life. There are a lot of little things that might add up, but that doesn't always explain why some really good people have to struggle through life while some not-so-great people get to skate through. So, sit back and truly count your blessings. Accept your life "as is" - even with its deficiencies, simply because it is the only life that you have. Find a way to make the best of it, because no one gets a fulfilled life. There is always something missing. Mine included. Above all, love and accept yourself for who you are, warts and all. And remember, it could get a lot worse. "As is" just bothers me. In spite of all the blessings I can count, I also have my own version of ill-health and constant struggle. Cheer up! It is really not so bad. I generally do live like you describe. Ignoring the problems and feeling good about what's going right. But ignoring the problems is not the same as accepting them or fixing them. It just means living on in spite of them. You're a stubborn little critter, ain't ya? You don't really look like this. You look like this sometimes. We all do. This is a bad day. You will have better ones. If you want to build closer relationships with others, you know what to do. On a better day, you can get about doing that. Thinking of you - the witty, wry, intelligent, insightful, kind guy that you are. Take care. x Thanks, mickelb. I think it really is what I look like. I generally refuse to think about it, or I occupy my mind during the hours between sleep so I don't have to think about it. It's a luxury to have problems I don't have to fix. It affects no one but me, and I know there are people who live entire lives not bothering themselves about it. But not thinking about it doesn't mean it's not true. A man can never look upon the same river, twice. He can if it's dry. My challenge is to change who I am. I have to change how I relate to the world and all the people in it. I need to change my core beliefs. It's ridiculous to have to do this. I should have had this all sorted out by now. But the odds are against me on this. People rarely change. I think I'll slip back into not thinking about it all at some point, because that's the only "solution" that I know I can implement.
mickleb Posted August 6, 2010 Posted August 6, 2010 My challenge is to change who I am. I have to change how I relate to the world and all the people in it. I need to change my core beliefs. It's ridiculous to have to do this. I should have had this all sorted out by now. But the odds are against me on this. People rarely change. I think I'll slip back into not thinking about it all at some point, because that's the only "solution" that I know I can implement. I don't understand this bit, HC. What is it in your life that needs to be changed? In your original post, you state it is about being alone; not having anyone to share your world with. Now you feel you have to go so far as to change your core beliefs. What, specifically, do you want? From what I am aware of, on here, you have the qualities listed in my above post. So, please try not to change those things. Is it that we on LS are the privileged ones, as we see this lovely person but you converse differently with people IRL? Finding the direction we need to take is often the hardest part of life, in my experience. Pursuing our needs and wants can be pretty straightforward, granted acquiring them can take time but, if we know we are headed in the right direction, that usually is enough comfort to fuel our journey. It is when we can't be sure what it is we need to do or when we can't prioritise what to get started on that the melancholy can set in. It can all seem vastly unsatisfying and just too much. Please try to specify what the biggest issue is, then it's time to take apart the path needed to achieve that and set out, at first with baby steps, towards fulfilling your need. Hope you're ok. x
Citizen Erased Posted August 6, 2010 Posted August 6, 2010 From what I am aware of, on here, you have the qualities listed in my above post. So, please try not to change those things. Is it that we on LS are the privileged ones, as we see this lovely person but you converse differently with people IRL? I agree, he doesn't need to change. And he is as great in person as he is on here. His only problem is he is too damn hard on himself. My fear is that you'll give up HC. I can't imagine what it's like to get to the point of not wanting to try and it's awful you're there...or at least you are at times. I find it impossible to believe that out of everyone to find their match, someone like you won't. She's just taken longer to get there than most. If you're not careful I'm going to spend the few months I can't work there bugging the hell out of you to get back out there and try. I will come to your house to do it.
Art_Critic Posted August 6, 2010 Posted August 6, 2010 Hot Carl.... I think I went thru a period of my life where I felt like you and it lasted about 2 years.. All I did was exist but I will tell you that somewhere the light at the end of the tunnel will show up and when it does your whole outlook will change. I just kept doing exactly what you are doing today.. everything I was supposed too..including hobbies, living and dating and one day I rose to the surface and was finally able to breath. Then I got married and had a kid and miss all the time I used to have to myself... By chance are you in a period of introspection in your life or are you all past that ? No advice here.. just a friendly hand shake and to tell you I think you will get past this and I also think your a great guy.. great humor and all the rest..
Author Hot Carl Posted August 6, 2010 Author Posted August 6, 2010 I don't understand this bit, HC. What is it in your life that needs to be changed? In your original post, you state it is about being alone; not having anyone to share your world with. Now you feel you have to go so far as to change your core beliefs. What, specifically, do you want? I think I reject people a lot or keep them at a distance. That's all driven by what I believe about people and how relationships work. Maybe if I improved my relationships with people, this anxiety would go away. From what I am aware of, on here, you have the qualities listed in my above post. So, please try not to change those things. Is it that we on LS are the privileged ones, as we see this lovely person but you converse differently with people IRL? People have more control over how they are perceived online. You get a chance to spend more time thinking about your message. Also, it's all just text. No body language, no physical interaction. So the rest of who you are is left to the imagination. Finding the direction we need to take is often the hardest part of life, in my experience. Pursuing our needs and wants can be pretty straightforward, granted acquiring them can take time but, if we know we are headed in the right direction, that usually is enough comfort to fuel our journey. Sometimes people prefer the security of maintaining an unhappy equilibrium over passing through instability to find a better equilibrium. I think many depressed people prefer to be depressed over being happy, because happiness is unstable. I'm not depressed, but I have been in this unsatisfying equilibrium for a long time. It's where I've been most comfortable. It is when we can't be sure what it is we need to do or when we can't prioritise what to get started on that the melancholy can set in. It can all seem vastly unsatisfying and just too much. That's true. Hope you're ok. I'm ok. But maybe I'm also drifting back to my comfy equilibrium. My challenge is to not do that. My fear is that you'll give up HC. I can't imagine what it's like to get to the point of not wanting to try and it's awful you're there...or at least you are at times. I find it impossible to believe that out of everyone to find their match, someone like you won't. She's just taken longer to get there than most. Well what the hell is taking her so long. I don't move around that much. I'm pretty easy to find. Hot Carl.... I think I went thru a period of my life where I felt like you and it lasted about 2 years.. All I did was exist but I will tell you that somewhere the light at the end of the tunnel will show up and when it does your whole outlook will change. You understand, Art. "Just existing" wears on you. It kind of doesn't matter how much stuff I do to keep myself occupied. If I'm not sharing things I care about with someone I care about, I feel like I'm just existing. Then I got married and had a kid and miss all the time I used to have to myself... ha ha. Well I guess there are always trade-offs. But you are doing more than just existing, and that's important By chance are you in a period of introspection in your life or are you all past that ? No advice here.. just a friendly hand shake and to tell you I think you will get past this and I also think your a great guy.. great humor and all the rest.. Maybe I'm taking another look at myself after avoiding it for a while. But I also have a fragile ego, and it's easy to bruise it. When that happens I turn on myself mercilessly. Thanks, Art. You have a good point of view, and even give me hope this won't be the story of my life.
GrayClouds Posted August 6, 2010 Posted August 6, 2010 This: I also have a fragile ego, and it's easy to bruise it. . Because of this: I think I reject people a lot or keep them at a distance. Some people are wired to be more sensitive then others. As a result it can make life a bit more challenging for them. Though on the flip side they seem to experience the whole spectrum of life, connect of deeper levels, and find unearth beauty where others walk on by. They may not be one who draw, sing or produce perfect pose but they have the joy of experience a true artist's life. Often until they see the strength that comes with this gift, it feels more like a burden, something that needs protection. Though with some effort, time and committed kindness to themselves they discover the joy of being like they are. When they do, they no longer need to protect themselves from others for they now know their strengths are greater then their weakness. You Hot Carl may just be one of these types. And if so the only thing you really need to change is being kind to yourself and understanding the thing that make you feel weak is the things that make you strong. . .
ishmaiel Posted August 6, 2010 Posted August 6, 2010 I empathize. No, wait. I am actually feeling the same thing, which is empathy+. I know enough of this condition to realize that there are no words to make today better, nor tomorrow, nor the next week. This condition is a protracted process, one in which the years teach what the days don't know. I'd be the last one to take comfort in an eventual exit from this malaise, were it not for the very real chance that letting time pass is a necessary component. As they say, time is a great healer (though a lousy beautician). The passage of time is necessary, but not sufficient. That's unfortunate. I strongly suspect some kind of effort will be required, though I cannot say what its type is. Talking about it doesn't make a difference. Posting about it doesn't make a difference. Hearing people compliment me in whatever ways they might doesn't make a difference. I don't even know what to do about it. I'm just here waiting for my own body heat to melt the shell from the inside. It won't make a difference today, but this process will change you. From who you are now into ... a slightly different you. This different you, by virtue of the differences, will have different outlook. One can only hope that these differences will conspire towards a better outlook. I do every damn thing alone. I run alone. I work alone. I shop alone. I sleep alone. I eat alone. I laugh alone. I've lost every girlfriend, distanced myself from all my friends and family. Ultimately, we are all alone. Whereas the company of others can be exhilarating, the space in your head is shared by nobody else. I remind myself of this fact to take the edge of the outward kind of loneliness. Is it helping? Dunno. There's nothing any therapist could ever say. I'm sure the tool I could use to break out is sitting right here in front of me, but I wouldn't know it if someone dropped it on my head. The tool is time. Its application, however, slow and constant. ****ty tool, but one that proves its mettle in the long run. I'm broken. I'm dissatisfied. I can't fix me. I'm sure that you are broken - if you say so. Ditto for the dissatisfaction. However, don't be hasty to look for a fix. This state, albeit torturous, is both natural and common. I am in it, you are in it, the world seems to be steeping in it. I've been told to ride it out, and experience the feelings profoundly. Pay attention to them, listen to them (even though they are intolerable banshees at the moment) and (I'm told) this process will quiet them. Is this feeling sorry for myself? I'll probably read all this tomorrow and think "what a drama queen you get to be." You are feeling sorry for yourself. And you should - there is no sunshine in your situation. Ultimately, there are two directions of travel from this point: towards a better state, and towards a worse one. You'll have to trust yourself that eventually you'll seek the former. Bleargh... all this "advice" sounds so hollow at the moment.
melodymatters Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 Buy at least ten acres and start working on a house. Adopt a bunch of animals. Find the kindest woman you can and decide that she is it, and then have a few kids. this existentialist crap weighs people down only in modern times and only when they have too much money too much free time and TOO MANY options. Stop thinking, analyzing and waiting, start LIVING.
alphamale Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 you should see a psychiatrist (not a therapist) and be screened for depression HC
oasis Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 I think I reject people a lot or keep them at a distance. It is almost impossible to forge any kind of close relationships by distancing yourself from people. But on one hand, I do understand the distancing. It is a way to avoid pain. Some people use it as a defense mechanism, because it keeps them locked away in a cocoon, nice safe and protected....from the world. But we cannot exist in cocoons. We have to go to work and interact with people. We have to go shopping and to the gym. Hence the exposure to people and the chances of getting our feelings hurt. Same as in relationships. If you get close to someone new, then you also run the risk of getting hurt. But doesn't it makes more sense to take that chance than to just exist in misery? Chances are, you might even find love and friendship, but you will never find this out, if you keep yourself locked away. There is nothing to fear, but fear it self. Take the shackles off your mind and start living. Now.
Jilly Bean Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 Johan would know what to say right about now...
oasis Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 Johan would know what to say right about now... Johan who? LOL.
mickleb Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 I think I reject people a lot or keep them at a distance. That's all driven by what I believe about people and how relationships work. Maybe if I improved my relationships with people, this anxiety would go away. Sometimes people prefer the security of maintaining an unhappy equilibrium over passing through instability to find a better equilibrium. I think many depressed people prefer to be depressed over being happy, because happiness is unstable. I'm not depressed, but I have been in this unsatisfying equilibrium for a long time. It's where I've been most comfortable. I'm ok. But maybe I'm also drifting back to my comfy equilibrium. My challenge is to not do that. Most of what you've said so far makes me think about passive commitment phobia. I think it's a lot more common nowadays than people are aware. (It took me a long time to realise that I had a good bit of that going on in my life, that it was dictating a fair few of my choices. Now I get to make more conscious decisions, not unconcious ones. It's the latter that make it seem that life just 'happens' to us and make us feel unsatisfied.) You could read 'He's Scared, She's Scared' and see how that works out for you. Can't do any harm, eh? There's a nice Erich Fromm quote that sounds in my ears, also. (And here it is, just as an added reminder that you are, most certainly, not alone in your thinking.) “To spare oneself from grief at all cost can be achieved only at the price of total detachment, which excludes the ability to experience happiness” From a thread a few months ago: When people say "you should see a therapist", they fantasize that breakthroughs will occur because the therapist will collect the right information and be able to synthesize it into the right conclusion about what is going on. What I've seen is that people who go into therapy just get into an expensive cycle of chasing a series of problems but never making any real improvements in their lives or relationships. I would gladly sign up if the fantasy could be turned into reality. Now, on this point, I completely disagree. This illustrates your passivity quite nicely - not that you don't admit you are very passive but you do admit that your challenge is not to be so. If you think therapy is about someone else fixing your problems, you won't get very far. It's about you figuring it all out and that takes effort. The therapist generally provides the right environment and then reflects who you are back to you, until you can hide no more and start taking action. I'm presuming from the statement about that you've haven't actually tried (or, perhaps, stuck with) professional help? I think it's time you did. My comments are not about wanting to, lazily, discard your predicament but you understand that this forum is not going to help you to really get to the bottom of all this. In fact, these forums can, quite successfully, enable people to hide from themselves, quite often. You have illustrated that you don't want to put the hard work in. If you've found a way to get through life not thinking about what's wrong, then you never have to solve any problems. It reminds me of the scene from Ghostbusters where the seething mass of evil is flowing by just under the surface. But you only find out about it if you allow yourself to go wander around in the sewers. And then once you see it, how do you not simply panic and run back up to the surface? The only other option is to keep pretending eveything's ok whilst really feeling like this. It's up to you. x
Author Hot Carl Posted August 7, 2010 Author Posted August 7, 2010 Johan would know what to say right about now... He'd just make some smart-ass remark and not be helpful at all. Most of what you've said so far makes me think about passive commitment phobia. I think it's a lot more common nowadays than people are aware. “To spare oneself from grief at all cost can be achieved only at the price of total detachment, which excludes the ability to experience happiness” There's probably something to that. As far as friends go, I'm not very generous with my time. All the close friends I've had so far have turned out to be pretty irritating for me. I can only take so much of someone. I sort of learned it's better to keep people at a distance from the start, as opposed to imposing distance and changing the rules later on. All pretty true, except when it comes to girlfriends. I've always really liked having them around. From a thread a few months ago: Now, on this point, I completely disagree. This illustrates your passivity quite nicely - not that you don't admit you are very passive but you do admit that your challenge is not to be so. If you think therapy is about someone else fixing your problems, you won't get very far. It's about you figuring it all out and that takes effort. The therapist generally provides the right environment and then reflects who you are back to you, until you can hide no more and start taking action. That might be how it works sometimes. It just seems to me that it's a lot of expense even to get to the point where you start working on something. It's hard to know whether you've found a good one; they seem pretty elusive. I think it's an interesting process though, from an academic perspective. The only other option is to keep pretending eveything's ok You're right. Somehow things need to change. While feeling depressed and restless isn't great, I also don't want to replace those feelings with contentment with the status quo. My life isn't miserable. It's just kind of empty.
2sunny Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 i can tell you from experience that if YOU do contrary action - things will change. DO all the things you don't want to do. see what actually works for YOU. after trying lots of things you can settle into a routine of things you find that you enjoy - but never even realized that you MIGHT enjoy. by doing these things that we automatically had previously ruled out - you gain insight into the POSSIBILITY that you may enjoy things you thought you didn't. are you WILLING to at least try?
Kamille Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 I think many depressed people prefer to be depressed over being happy, because happiness is unstable. Happiness is unstable. So what ? So is depression. They're both feelings, not core realities. Why would you expect to always feel the same thing?
sugarmomma Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 The pain of being alone with yourself could be the most enlightening experience if you embrace it. Loneliness vs Solitude. Gratitude also turns whatever you have into enough. Get outside yourself and help others and your life will never be the same. Homeless shelters, cancer wards, the elderly, children with disabilities. Self pity is not a character building trait.
Author Hot Carl Posted August 7, 2010 Author Posted August 7, 2010 Happiness is unstable. So what ? So is depression. They're both feelings, not core realities. Why would you expect to always feel the same thing? Well, true. I mean things change. Someday the Earth will go away, too. Depressed people do enjoy life occasionally. I think the idea is that it's easier to "settle" in to a low mood. In some ways I think negative attitudes actually are core realities. It seems like most people have to constantly make an effort to seek happiness, to prove they are good, to believe in themselves, to fight self-doubt. Medications were invented to help. The energy investment is always to seek the good and avoid the bad. What, for example, does a phrase like "fake it till you make it" imply, particularly when that becomes a life philosophy of life for some people? If people didn't battle that way and just gave in, then what would their general reality be? "Don't fake it. Don't try." The happiest people I know still carry around a lot of insecurities which reveal how they really feel about themselves. I think it's true that your life is mostly determined by the mixture of insecurities you have and the good and bad luck you have along the way. Insecurities are just reflections of what your true beliefs about the world are (women don't like short men, being fat is bad, college educated people are better, etc.) The only way to fix insecurities is to change your beliefs about the world. That requires knowing what those beliefs are, which can be surprisingly difficult. And then rationalizing them away or taking action that challenges them. I'm not sure what the beliefs are that cause me to choose to live like I do. Not the easy ones like "people are annoying and take my time", which may be true, but are really more excuses than anything. The annoyance and time commitments can be handled. So what is it that makes me decide that avoiding that annoyance is so beneficial that it's worth forgoing the other benefits of getting to know someone? What's the real issue? I'm not sure. Except for brief periods in my life, it's how I've always been.
Kamille Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 Depression is emotionally taxing and exhausting. At least that's been my experience with serious depression. Striving for happiness, on the other hand, is generally rewarding. Feeling good feels good. Simple as that. The happiest people I know still carry around a lot of insecurities which reveal how they really feel about themselves. Is there a reason to believe that insecurities reveal more truths about people than the moments when they feel great about themselves? I'm insecure about a lot of things. I think those insecurities indicate my fears and my hang ups, not the person I "truly" am inside.
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