Untouchable_Fire Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 I'm very sorry you experienced that, no child should ever have to experience abusive treatment like that. Abuse can happen anywhere though. From my time at home, and not in daycare, I have a scar on my forehead, back problems that won't go away from being pushed down the stairs so many times, and I still have nightmares of being raped. So home isn't a safe haven for everyone either. This is not to dismiss anything anyone reading this has been through. There are flaws with every system. Which is why at the end of the day we all need law enforcement that actually takes us seriously instead of laughing in our faces and/or telling us we're being spoiled brats. It's terrible you had to go through that as well. Believe me when I say I was not trying to compare. It's exponentially worse when a parent is the culprit. I had great parents... and so did my family members. They would not have issues if not for daycare. That's really the issue I have. Bad parents will be bad parents, but why expose your kids to abuse when you don't have to?
counterman Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 1. Hands-on, proactive, able to take initiative 2. Slightly cocky 3. Self-deprecating 4. Likes to smile 5. Doesn't care what others think
Sphere Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 Zengirl are you in a relationship at the moment or are you single?
zengirl Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 Zengirl are you in a relationship at the moment or are you single? At the moment? Single. Broke up with the Korean boy a month ago because I realized we could never work it out long-term since my life is better led on a different continent, and his family needs him here. I've been planning a move back to the States, at the end of the summer, so it's fairly pointless to date at present. Most of why I have time to be on here.
SassyKitten Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 UntouchableFire - If you were my child, and you had told me what they had done to you in daycare, let's just say they had better pray that the cops get to them before I do. If anything, my childhood will make me a much more protective parent to my children, as well as empathetic. And then I would find you another daycare where that did not happen, and screen the candidates even harder that time. One thing that I do know from my history class that I took for my degree this summer is that back when we were children, daycare was extremely new, extremely unregulated, and extremely archaic. However, your story reminds of the importance to screen any and all candidates for daycare so that these things do not happen to our children. Also, in my parents' divorce, my mother was the poor housewife and my father was the millionaire working man. And she actually got crumbs from the divorce, when she could have easily gotten good alimony, because she was the classic case of someone who was raised to be the passive female and then grew bitter about it and took it out on me. Sphere - I for one would be perfectly capable of taking what you do and going across the world to use it! I don't know what your field is, but mine is accounting, which is extremely demanding, and I travelled to South Africa alone when I was 22 so not much phases me there! And there is no reason why any woman can't do anything any man can do. I think you need to work on learning how to share my friend. Zengirl - I completely agree, things are much better nowadays. Besides everything you mentioned, women also have to develop a strong work ethic to survive unless they're an absolute gold-digger, and this sets a great example to our daughters, and our sons for that matter, that no one is exempt from working hard and developing their brainpower to the fullest.
Sphere Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 At the moment? Single. Broke up with the Korean boy a month ago because I realized we could never work it out long-term since my life is better led on a different continent, and his family needs him here. I've been planning a move back to the States, at the end of the summer, so it's fairly pointless to date at present. Most of why I have time to be on here. That says everything to me.
Sphere Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 Sphere - I for one would be perfectly capable of taking what you do and going across the world to use it! I don't know what your field is, but mine is accounting, which is extremely demanding, and I travelled to South Africa alone when I was 22 so not much phases me there! And there is no reason why any woman can't do anything any man can do. I think you need to work on learning how to share my friend. So you could go out to places like Iraq then?
Untouchable_Fire Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 So, I think when someone says "a woman who is acting like a woman" is attractive, it belies some archaic core beliefs. I said the idea of labeling certainly behavior "womanly" or "manly" is archaic. What's that got to do with DNA or attraction? Also. . . the links between DNA and attraction, or even sexuality, are uncertain. I tend to believe there is some link, but I don't even understand your point here. I'm saying that there are certain traits that I am genetically predisposed to find attractive in a female. Not just physical traits either. As this thread originally was meant to portray, there are some emotional and personality traits, and actions, which I am genetically predisposed to be attracted to. I don't think that qualifies as archaic. Therefore there is some clearly definable traits/actions that I can call feminine, or masculine. That is what I was intending to say. I also agree that there is no absolute proof linking sexuality/attraction to our genetic material. However, there is enough overall evidence to say there is a good chance it works this way.
SassyKitten Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 So you could go out to places like Iraq then? Iraq and South Africa are 2 completely different places considering Iraq is still pretty much in a state of war and South Africa isn't! And also, I think I speak for Zengirl and myself when I say that we are happier being single than feeling like we have to sell out to this degrading, dehumanizing, misogynistic doctrine in order to survive! Also, women in those days stayed in miserable marriages and stayed quiet because it was necessary in order for them to not starve to death. Nowadays, we don't have to be concubines to feed ourselves unless we choose to, and that feels great!
zengirl Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 That says everything to me. Eh, I'm not unhappy being single. I recognize you can't fill a cup up again if it's full of old, dirty water, and I'm not one to swing on vines. I could be with the Korean boy still till the very moment I left, but it would be emotionally dishonest to keep him thinking there was hope of something serious, as he wants. It's much better to let him find a girl he can live happily ever after with, as he deserves. I'm on excellent terms with every ex, and men I've dated count me as someone who's been a positive force, even when things didn't work out. Can you say the same about the women in your life?
Untouchable_Fire Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 At the moment? Single. Broke up with the Korean boy a month ago because I realized we could never work it out long-term since my life is better led on a different continent, and his family needs him here. I've been planning a move back to the States, at the end of the summer, so it's fairly pointless to date at present. Most of why I have time to be on here. I thought he was going to ask you out for a second. I'm using this site... again... because of my recent split as well. I always leave this site swearing never to return when I feel better.... then a relationship goes south and I come crawling back.
Sphere Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 Iraq and South Africa are 2 completely different places considering Iraq is still pretty much in a state of war and South Africa isn't! I wasn't comparing those two and what do you think I was doing in Iraq? I wasn't on holiday there nor was I teaching. As for Zengirl - I cut my exes off from my life, I do not need them as friends or anything else. When our journey together ends, so does my involvement in my life. They are surplus to requirements and not at all needed.
Sphere Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 I thought he was going to ask you out for a second. You must be joking. Never, ever will I date an American woman. Never!
zengirl Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 I'm saying that there are certain traits that I am genetically predisposed to find attractive in a female. Not just physical traits either. As this thread originally was meant to portray, there are some emotional and personality traits, and actions, which I am genetically predisposed to be attracted to. I don't think that qualifies as archaic. Therefore there is some clearly definable traits/actions that I can call feminine, or masculine. That is what I was intending to say. I also agree that there is no absolute proof linking sexuality/attraction to our genetic material. However, there is enough overall evidence to say there is a good chance it works this way. You, as an individual? I think there are probably some genetic predispositions, sure, but what does that have to do with the archaic social idea of womanhood? I think the genetic predispositions are likely extremely variable and certainly more based on appearance and pheromones than social or lifestyle factors, which are more socialized. That's what research seems to support, at least, limited as it is. Your ideas are only archaic when you apply them to society as a whole. You being attracted to particular things, as I stated, isn't odd or archaic, it's just when you call it "acting like a woman" that it becomes so. "Acting like the kind of woman I'm predisposed, socially and genetically, to like" has nothing to do with anything but you. That's totally reasonable. I think calling a trait feminine or masculine, besides a vagina or a penis, or some other physical difference, is silly. These are mostly socialized things. They are entirely subject to change. And they have. And will again. Why not actually name the traits for what they are instead of saying something silly like "acting like a woman" if it's about what you find attractive? Why hinge it on some out-dated societal norm that the trends are against? As for Zengirl - I cut my exes off from my life, I do not need them as friends or anything else. When our journey together ends, so does my involvement in my life. They are surplus to requirements and not at all needed. And that says everything to me. While I don't think everyone has to stay in perfect touch with their exes (actually, I'm not actively in touch with quite a few of mine, in terms of speaking to them or seeing them with any regularity), I think this is an unhealthy attitude. People aren't things to be used for a time and then discarded.
SassyKitten Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 I wasn't comparing those two and what do you think I was doing in Iraq? I wasn't on holiday there nor was I teaching. As for Zengirl - I cut my exes off from my life, I do not need them as friends or anything else. When our journey together ends, so does my involvement in my life. They are surplus to requirements and not at all needed. Well if I was deployed to Iraq, I probably would have gone. Though the only thing that stopped me from thinking about the military was the fact that Bush was president at the time, and I knew enough about him to figure out that I probably would have been a sacrificial lamb had I enlisted. I wish I could say that I was on frienndly terms with at least one of my exes, at least Zengirl can view them as humans, not as "men". And don't think that any one nationality of women is any more subserviant than any of the others. I have known loads of Asian woman who laugh about their experiences of Western men who date them thinking they'll get the stereotypical Asian female and then be in for a rude awakening, just to give an example!
Untouchable_Fire Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 UntouchableFire - If you were my child, and you had told me what they had done to you in daycare, let's just say they had better pray that the cops get to them before I do. If anything, my childhood will make me a much more protective parent to my children, as well as empathetic. And then I would find you another daycare where that did not happen, and screen the candidates even harder that time. One thing that I do know from my history class that I took for my degree this summer is that back when we were children, daycare was extremely new, extremely unregulated, and extremely archaic. However, your story reminds of the importance to screen any and all candidates for daycare so that these things do not happen to our children. Sassy... just keep in mind that IF you choose to put your children into daycare... it doesn't matter how well you check up on it... there is a significant risk involved. They could just as easily be molested by an older child sharing daycare. I used to fight with the other kids all the time. Remember, no kid wants to be dumped into a situation with a bunch of strangers. It sucks. It feels like your parents have abandoned you. The kids around you feel the same, and most of them are from broken homes. The daycare workers get paid next to nothing and are typically burned out. It's really terrible. It's like a mini version of the foster system.
Sphere Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 You're full of hot air SassyKitten. Just enjoy your travelling and step back from the whole relationship/dating game. You are clearly damaged goods and no mentally stable man will go near you with a barge pole at the moment. You have lot of hidden daemons that you need to slew before you can even begin to be worthy of a mans time and effort.
SassyKitten Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 Sassy... just keep in mind that IF you choose to put your children into daycare... it doesn't matter how well you check up on it... there is a significant risk involved. They could just as easily be molested by an older child sharing daycare. I used to fight with the other kids all the time. Remember, no kid wants to be dumped into a situation with a bunch of strangers. It sucks. It feels like your parents have abandoned you. The kids around you feel the same, and most of them are from broken homes. The daycare workers get paid next to nothing and are typically burned out. It's really terrible. It's like a mini version of the foster system. Noted, and I'll be extra-extra-careful about that. I do know a lot of people who have had good experiences, however it's always good to hear stories like your's as a warning.
SassyKitten Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 You're full of hot air SassyKitten. Just enjoy your travelling and step back from the whole relationship/dating game. You are clearly damaged goods and no mentally stable man will go near you with a barge pole at the moment. You have lot of hidden daemons that you need to slew before you can even begin to be worthy of a mans time and effort. Well you're just huffing and puffing as you're a chauvinist little piggy who can't handle the idea that a woman can be anything besides young, dumb, and full of cum. I'm certainly too good for you. As for other men, I am certainly worthy of at least one of them, and who is better than the men who have sexually assaulted me, largely because of this "natural order" that you swear by. **** you.
Untouchable_Fire Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 You, as an individual? I think there are probably some genetic predispositions, sure, but what does that have to do with the archaic social idea of womanhood? I think the genetic predispositions are likely extremely variable and certainly more based on appearance and pheromones than social or lifestyle factors, which are more socialized. That's what research seems to support, at least, limited as it is. Your ideas are only archaic when you apply them to society as a whole. You being attracted to particular things, as I stated, isn't odd or archaic, it's just when you call it "acting like a woman" that it becomes so. "Acting like the kind of woman I'm predisposed, socially and genetically, to like" has nothing to do with anything but you. That's totally reasonable. I think calling a trait feminine or masculine, besides a vagina or a penis, or some other physical difference, is silly. These are mostly socialized things. They are entirely subject to change. And they have. And will again. Why not actually name the traits for what they are instead of saying something silly like "acting like a woman" if it's about what you find attractive? Why hinge it on some out-dated societal norm that the trends are against? The ideas we have of gender as a society are based primarily on genetic characteristics. We think of women as nurse because most have a strong tendency to be nurturing... ect. You can't simply call them archaic and ignore that fact. Actually case in point... you argue like a woman! Which means I'm doomed to certainly lose this exchange.
Sphere Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 And that says everything to me. While I don't think everyone has to stay in perfect touch with their exes (actually, I'm not actively in touch with quite a few of mine, in terms of speaking to them or seeing them with any regularity), I think this is an unhealthy attitude. People aren't things to be used for a time and then discarded. People come and go in life. It's something you'll have to get used to, I'm afraid.
Sphere Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 Well you're just huffing and puffing as you're a chauvinist little piggy who can't handle the idea that a woman can be anything besides young, dumb, and full of cum. I'm certainly too good for you. As for other men, I am certainly worthy of at least one of them, and who is better than the men who have sexually assaulted me, largely because of this "natural order" that you swear by. **** you. What is this natural order you are on about?
zengirl Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 Sassy... just keep in mind that IF you choose to put your children into daycare... it doesn't matter how well you check up on it... there is a significant risk involved. They could just as easily be molested by an older child sharing daycare. I used to fight with the other kids all the time. Remember, no kid wants to be dumped into a situation with a bunch of strangers. It sucks. It feels like your parents have abandoned you. The kids around you feel the same, and most of them are from broken homes. The daycare workers get paid next to nothing and are typically burned out. It's really terrible. It's like a mini version of the foster system. I worked in a preschool in the States for a few months. I was terrified of the kids at the time, as I was just getting used to kids that young, but it was an awesome place. Daycares and preschools aren't the same, of course. . . but you can put a kid in preschool fairly young (we had an infant room!). They have to have a larger percentage of people with Education degrees (Early Childhood preferred, of course) and CDAs, and it requires an extensive background check. My immigration paperwork was easier! Most of the teachers loved being there. The certified teachers made halfway decent money (not a fortune, but 30K range), and even I, at the lowest pay grade made $10 an hour, which is a basic administrative/livable wage quite a bit above the minimum for the area. The kids were never left alone. Any problem children are dealt with easier than public school because they can be easily removed (and will be if they are such a threat). There are excellent preschools. And the oldest children at one are 4. How many 4 year olds are sexual predators? For younger elementary school children, there are good, certified, highly safe after-school programs. I was also put in preschool as a kid (an awesome one!), participated in available activity-enrichment after school programs, and was a latchkey kid myself, though driven home for most of Elementary school before I was able to take the bus in 5th grade. Honestly, getting home a few hours before my parents wasn't some terrible thing. I started my homework, called my friends, did my household chores, read books, and sometimes even helped get things ready for my folks to cook dinner. Nowadays, you can even lock the TV and computer if you like (we never did in my house, as the tech was barely born at the time to "kid safe" it, though there was a general culture not to overuse it in my home). I went to day camps in the Summer, mostly themed to my interests, and loved it. You've got some sort of phobia about two working people raising children that strikes me as quite odd. Significant risk? So silly. The risk comes in when the people stop paying attention to their children, working or not.
Untouchable_Fire Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 You must be joking. Never, ever will I date an American woman. Never! Where do you live and who would you date?
Sphere Posted August 3, 2010 Posted August 3, 2010 (edited) Where do you live and who would you date? I'm not obliged to say and I will date many women, just not Yank women. I have heard stories and every American man I have spoken to prefers our country's women and prefers European women in general. Edited August 3, 2010 by Sphere
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