Sick of the Dating and Game Playing Circus

[SassyKitten]

I know it will. I just want to be out of Georgia pretty much immediately. And I do regret getting together with my last boyfriend while I was so emotional from the drama with my mother. There was a void there, and he filled it, or so I thought. And now getting together with him as quickly as I did is one of my top 3 regrets from this year.

 

When I'm ready to, I might try going back on OkCupid and making a game of how many dates I can get in a week, and try not to get emotionally attached to anyone. It will be easier I think when I'm in a place like New York where I have a much broader selection of men on my wavelength than I do here. Right now, it's a very lonely road. And frustrating when I want something so badly, but it's out of reach.

 

Thanks anyone who's read this far.

[SassyKitten]

That will be easier once I'm outside of Georgia!

 

Though hopefully my trip to Montreal will contribute towards me increasing my circle of friends. Thank you Facebook for making it easier to keep in touch.

[Brady_to_Moss]

I just want to be out of Georgia pretty much immediately.

 

 

This. Gotta get away from the rednecks!

[SassyKitten]

This. Gotta get away from the rednecks!

 

Hell yes, can't wait!!

[brainygirl]

Hell yes, can't wait!!

 

(sigh) I'm stuck in redneck-ville, probably forever. Because this is where my licensure is and this is where my kids are rooted.

 

I think I'd do better in a city, but I'm also afraid of being alone in a city with three kids and no one I know around.

 

I'd certainly have more romantic options.

[SassyKitten]

I don't have children to think about, but I am about to be in a place where I'll be new in an unfamiliar city with no one else around. But then I'm taking heart with the fact that I'm sure I won't be the only person around me in the same boat.

[jamesum]

So you are 5'10?

 

Thats very tall for a woman.

 

And if you are also good looking then sorry to say that most of the nicer men aren't going to bother trying their chances with you at all.

[motive2002]

I tell you what. If you're aren't successfully dating now, you're past experiences will "hone" your BS detector to be more sensitive to things like other women and so on.

 

I was being pursued by an ex for a while, and after talking with her and seeing her only a few times sure enough the detector went off. Her behavior simply suggested something very fishy, and after a while I simply walked away.

 

The difference here is that I chose to walk away from something unhealthy. The excuses, lies, strange behavior etc was unnerving so I left. My choice. Doing things my way.

 

Your gut feeling is something that shouldn't be ignored. I don't fully support the idea of "snooping" someones e-mail, but you need to have some peace of mind and if you aren't getting it, it's time to bail.

 

Withholding sex is also your option to make. If you don't want to jump right into it without gettng a better picture of the guy, that's your prerogative. If you're getting a bad gut feeling all the better to wait.

 

Some guys are total dogs, but not all of us. I've had similar experiences with women that you've had with men so I don't think it's gender specific.

Someday you'll meet someone that's been in the same boat as you and just wants an honest, decent partner. That person will be willing to get through the trust issues and make an effort to provide you with peace of mind in his own way.

 

But keep that BS detector on and trust your gut in the meantime

[Brady_to_Moss]

I don't have children to think about, but I am about to be in a place where I'll be new in an unfamiliar city with no one else around. But then I'm taking heart with the fact that I'm sure I won't be the only person around me in the same boat.

 

 

You wont be. Lots of new people move to my area knowing no one and moving here for jobs since its so close to Boston. You will have fun. Compared to GA...i always picture it as boring as hell down there.

[Brady_to_Moss]

 

And if you are also good looking then sorry to say that most of the nicer men aren't going to bother trying their chances with you at all.

 

 

This. I like to think i am a nice guy and i usually wont approach a good looking girl because i know she wont give me the time of day. But i really don't want to be with someone so maybe thats the reason.

[SassyKitten]

Georgia is extremely boring, I feel like an alien here!

 

And thank you guys, I was having an extremely difficult weekend in the aftermath of my last breakup, but I do feel tremendously better now. And I'm sure it's not gender specific, I've heard some horror stories from some male friends, and there's clearly a lot of nice guys on here as well. And Actually I'm thinking as a 5'10" and not unattractive woman, one approach worth considering is me doing the approaching from now on. Something tells me that nice guys may easily think they have no chance with me, so if I approach them without coming on too strongly, that proves them wrong.

 

And actually, I have never started a relationship where I've approached the man first. Might be something good to try.

[motive2002]

one approach worth considering is me doing the approaching from now on.

 

I read somewhere that women do vastly more approaching than men do. We're simply big chickens in that department haha!

By approach however I mean by use of subtlety. Eye contact and flashing a broad smile for example. That will encourage the man you're looking at to come approach you. He still thinks he made the "first move", when really your little subtle "clues" are what's initiated things.

If the eye contact or other hints are giving you feedback, you can move to more casual flirting. Then the guy will probably ask you out or for your number, again thinking he's done all the "forward" stuff.

 

Sounds kinda like a silly game, but it will help bring out the shy nice guy types that might not have otherwise approached you in the first place if they felt intimidated.

 

I'm talking out of my butt mostly, but maybe it will help lol.

[SassyKitten]

I think that will definitely help. And it's a good way of weeding men out. If he's the type who's adverse to me taking initiative, he's not the kind I want anyway!

[carhill]

I'm thinking as a 5'10" and not unattractive woman, one approach worth considering is me doing the approaching from now on. Something tells me that nice guys may easily think they have no chance with me, so if I approach them without coming on too strongly, that proves them wrong.

That's possible, but I've noted that, throughout the 'scale' (which is generally meaningless to me), it's women who send out signals of being *approachable* which cause me to notice beyond the norm. Something about their aura causes them to spring from the page. I have no idea where that comes from. It can't be assigned numbers, IME.

 

One way to look at this is, if the man isn't the sort to approach you if/when you feel and indicate receptiveness, he likely is incompatible with you. Different path. His perception is impaired or he lacks the self-confidence to act on his perception. Doubt and fear rule him. Different path.

 

Enjoy the trip:)

[SassyKitten]

Thanks.

 

I'm so quickly realizing now that my problems with dating do come from my unwillingness to sit back and be at the man's mercy. But life is way too short for that. We're both grown adults, and if not, then there's something very fundamentally wrong about the relationship!

[Sphere]

So you are 5'10?

 

Thats very tall for a woman.

 

And if you are also good looking then sorry to say that most of the nicer men aren't going to bother trying their chances with you at all.

 

Percisely, nice guys are wimpy and aren't men at all. Rejection is nothing to be scared of, if I approached Sassy and she wasn't interested, it wouldn't bother me the slightest.

 

Nice guys need to grow a pair and risk.

 

"The greatest risk is not to risk at all".

[SassyKitten]

Percisely, nice guys are wimpy and aren't men at all. Rejection is nothing to be scared of, if I approached Sassy and she wasn't interested, it wouldn't bother me the slightest.

 

Nice guys need to grow a pair and risk.

 

"The greatest risk is not to risk at all".

 

But also, and very important, don't come on too strongly. Come on to me in a way the suggests you genuinely want to get to know me, and suss out whether we're compatible before anything physical, even a kiss, enters into the equation.

 

From now on, anything any other way will scare me off. Because I have been there, grown wiser, and know what I am avoiding like the plague.

[jamesum]

Percisely, nice guys are wimpy and aren't men at all. Rejection is nothing to be scared of, if I approached Sassy and she wasn't interested, it wouldn't bother me the slightest.

 

Nice guys need to grow a pair and risk.

 

"The greatest risk is not to risk at all".

You sound like those kind of guys whom Sassy had horrible experiences with. Werent you the same guy who said that you like to date two girls at the same time?

 

I find that there is a fine line between confidence and arrogance as a man.

 

So if you want a guy with a larger than life confidence, then you will get someone like Sphere.

 

When I try to be a fearless confident guy, I tend to become an aggressive jerk also and I dont like it. Its like when you are a soldier, you need to dehumanize your enemies in order to feel braver and merciless.

 

I prefer to remain being a nice guy even if I dont get a lot of women.

 

By the way, nice guys may not be the most confident. But not all of them are necessarily shy and quiet. They are just less extroverted.

 

Besides, I know tons of male friends who are fearless when it comes to women. But one thing I can say is that none of them has high regards for women.

Edited August 2, 2010 by jamesum

[Sphere]

You sound like those kind of guys whom Sassy had horrible experiences with. Werent you the same guy who said that you like to date two girls at the same time?

 

I find that there is a fine line between confidence and arrogance as a man.

 

So if you want a guy with a larger than life confidence, then you will get someone like Sphere.

 

When I try to be a fearless confident guy, I tend to become an aggressive jerk also and I dont like it. Its like when you are a soldier, you need to dehumanize your enemies in order to feel braver and merciless.

 

I prefer to remain being a nice guy even if I dont get a lot of women.

 

By the way, nice guys may not be the most confident. But not all of them are necessarily shy and quiet. They are just less extroverted.

 

Besides, I know tons of male friends who are fearless when it comes to women. But one thing I can say is that none of them has high regards for women.

 

Sassy has been dating jerks, aka players. I am not a player. I do not date women purely to get into their underpants. I do not hit on women in clubs looking to score as many women as possible. A jerk only cares about getting laid, he wants to have as many notches to his bed post as Dennis Rodman.

 

I go on dates a) to have fun b) to meet new women and c) to find a woman who is interested in ME and who I can have a long term relationship with.

 

Yes, I do spin plates, I always spin two, so what? I'm not doing anything illegal. I am not exclusive with these women, I'm casually dating them and I'm having fun. Women can do this too.

 

Being confident is not about being a jerk, being confident is about respecting yourself, loving yourself and being comfortable with your sexuality. Just like being a man isn't about being oppressive to your woman. It's about standing up for yourself, it's about taking pride in yourself, it's about being a leader, being at the forefront of things.

 

I've met nice guys, these men have good personalities, good jobs, are handsome, hit the gym, but they place all the emphasis on the woman, they put a woman on a pedestal. Women determine their own self worth, their own value. They then believe they can get a woman by being Hugh Grant and bringing flowers and chocolates. Then they wonder why they are flaked on or she goes for the jerk or she goes for someone else other than him.

 

Nice guys need to become great guys, they need to realise that their own self worth isn't determined by women, it's determined by themselves. They need to realise that they are the prize to be won, not the woman. They need to realise that a woman is not a source of happiness, she is an addition to your life. Nice men also need to be more fearless. If I go upto a woman and she says "Get lost", I laugh and walk off. I don't get upset, I don't demand a reason why she isn't interested.

 

At the end of the day, a woman is a woman to me, if she doesn't like me for who I am, someone else will. Rejection and failure are not things to be scorned at, they are lessons learnt. A man cannot become accomplished if he is scared of failure. I have been rejected more times than I care to remember, but I don't whinge about it. I accept it, I move on and find someone else.

 

I don't sit there hoping the woman of my dreams will turn up unexpectedly, I am patient, but not too patient that I am hesistant and do absolutely nothing. If I want something I chase it, but I am patient enough to know that it might take a while.

 

You can have confidence, you can embrace your sexuality, you can be masculine and you can be a great catch without being a nice guy or a jerk.

 

Live. Laugh. Love is what I tell people. Live the life you want, laugh and have fun and then love a good woman. There is no great secret to getting a woman, anyone can, you just have to make things happen.

 

I'd sooner approach a woman and get rejected, laughed at and mocked then sit there and do nothing why she gets away. For all I know she could be that woman. As for me not holding a woman in high regard. Women like men have to prove themselves to me. I don't expect to be held in high regard until I have earned it. But nice guys automatically hold the woman of their eye in high regard when she hasn't warranted it.

 

Remember in this world it is all about YOU. YOU are the MASTER and COMMANDER of YOUR universe. Nice guys do the opposite which is why they miss opportunity after opportunity.

 

Carpe Diem my friend.

[zengirl]

Concerning dating though, serious question. I'm thinking that from now on, when I'm on a first date, I should say something along the lines of "I am estranged from both of my parents, it was necessary for my safety." Especially as family is a common topic of conversation on first dates. I figure it can help me separate the emotionally nurturing men from the emotionally distant ones. If this isn't the best way to handle something lilke this, then what is? That's really what all of my negative emotion comes down to, the fear that I will never find anyone because of my parents. Which is easily my biggest fear.

 

I'd say: Never ever say that on a first date, unless it comes up naturally somehow. Even an emotionally nurturing man is just going to hear "DRAMA" if you come right out with it. That is a private part of your life, and this is a person you just met. Healthy boundaries are key and you need to work on going slow, including emotionally. That is not a healthy boundary.

 

If your parents come up organically, I'd start out with, "I don't talk to my family much" and leave it at that for the first few dates. Once you have an emotional connection with someone and the mutual sharing has begun, of course, you should be honest and open about it, and any decent man would be accepting of you. But nobody leads with their baggage.

 

Honestly, you also just have to accept the past. You clearly have a huge insecurity when it comes to this, and the wound is still open. . . Nobody wants to date somebody who's walking around with a gaping wound. The fact is that it's dangerous. Because if you do step into heal it, you have no idea if they like you for who you are or for being the person who could close their massive, gaping wound. Relationships started that way just don't work, and healthy people try to avoid them if at all possible. So, I think you need to work on closing the gaping wound for yourself.

 

And that's what makes my most recent breakup sting that much more. I'm seeing that fear come true right before my eyes.

 

That's what happens with a lot of our deepest fears.

 

When I'm ready to, I might try going back on OkCupid and making a game of how many dates I can get in a week, and try not to get emotionally attached to anyone. It will be easier I think when I'm in a place like New York where I have a much broader selection of men on my wavelength than I do here. Right now, it's a very lonely road. And frustrating when I want something so badly, but it's out of reach.

 

Thanks anyone who's read this far.

 

If you make dating a game like that, you will lose. Remember what I said about cultural capital? You're only building bad experiences by going on dates and (a) actively trying not to forge any emotional connection (b) not screening and going for quantity, rather than quality.

[Sphere]

 

 

You spin words too. Jerks usually don't admit they are jerks and they unfortunately come in many forms. You always date two women at a time and casually refer to it as spinning plates. Does any more need to be said?

 

You did fo a great job of making jamesum's point though.

 

SassyKitten deserves a great man who will date her and only her.

 

Hello Sherlock, of course jerks don't call themselves jerks, that's what I call them. I casually date because dating is supposed to be fun, it is supposed to be a chance to get to know someone. It isn't a job interview with a fancy meal for crying out loud. If things develop with a woman and I'm feeling it then fantastic, we'll go from there if she is also feeling it, but most of women I date the dates only last until the third date, by that time they are either not feeling or I am not feeling it or it's mutual so we call it a day.

 

I'm single, I'm not exclusive with anyone therefore I am well within my right to date multiple women if I choose too - now if you can't score one woman then that's not my problem. Your lame attempt at trying to take the moral high ground is futile at best and laughable at worse. If you choose to date one woman at a time, then more power to you. I choose to pursue every woman who catches my attention, more power to me.

 

My goal in life is to have a fantastic life, full of happiness and success and I want to share that with a special woman, the woman I love and I want to raise a family with, but unlike you, I'll never settle for the first thing that comes along. I never go on a date with a woman and think, "yes, I'm going to enter a relationship with this girl", I think "I've a good time, now it is time to unwind with a book or a DVD before I go to bed". I never look past the dating stage, nor do I over-analyze things either. Therefore I have a care free attitude towards dating, something that you probably don't have.

 

You see so many nice guys end up getting married and they get divorced some years later, then live a life of bitterness, regret and anger. They ask themselves, I did everything I could to make this marriage work. I did everything to make her happy. It never occurs to them that they landed the wrong woman for them. I'm happy to let a girl in, providing she is interested in ME and I am interested in HER. You see I might have three good dates with a woman and become exclusive with her sometime afterwards, but it doesn't mean to say she is the right woman for me. I believe a man and a woman instinctly know when they are the perfect match for each other. My grandfather and Grandmother have been married for fifty seven years, they were both young when they married, but they have been together ever since. I asked them what was their secret? They smiled and told me that they knew from the very moment they laid eyes on each other that they were perfect, and though there is no such thing as perfection, for it is boring, they have always loved one another and stuck by each other. They have argued in front of me and it's like two bulls locking horns, but they always find a way to make up and carry on.

 

This is the type of relationship I want with someone at some stage in my life. I will not be a nice guy and date one woman, put her on a pedestal, worship her like a godess in the vain hope she will date me. I will not be a jerk and lie about my intentions, I do not view women as sexual objects worthy of a screw and then a chuck. I view women as human beings, I feel nothing towards them at first other than what nature intended, sexual attraction and that is felt with some women and not others. I then ask these women for their numbers. If she says yes, I arrange the dates and see where it leads. I enjoy the dates and the company of these women on the large, even if I doubt it will lead anywhere, I am then honest about my intentions and view of where things are heading, then I will move onto someone else, if things do not work out.

 

I reckon you are bitter and that's why you are reacting like you are. In truth I am doing nothing wrong. I'm not playing a woman, I'm not in it just for sex, I am not lying to women and being dishonest about my intentions. I see dating as fun, the way it is meant to be.

 

If I date a girl and it leads to a relationship, a fantastic one then I can thank my lucky stars that nature has dealt me kindness, if I do not get into a relationship with the girl and we end the dating stage and leave it behind then I am thankful for the experience and the fact it never went any further.

 

My attitude isn't sexist or wrong, my attitude is the way dating should be approached. You won't see me whinging about a girl not liking me or where to take a girl on a date or how to act and what to do and not to do on a date. Life is so much enjoyable when you allow yourself to follow nature, after all most of our nature is instinctive, it is also nice to go into a date with no pressure on yourself to impress. Honestly, try it and see what happens.

 

As Einstein says "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." - He is absolutely right! I used to be the nice guy, but it never worked, all it did was send me to bed in tears, it made me bitter, it made me hate myself and women. I felt like a failure, but then I changed the way I view myself, view women, view life and through these changed perceptions, I changed the way I viewed life and when that happened, I couldn't just stop there, I changed the way I lived, not for women, not to attract more women, but to make me a better person for myself.

 

Anyway I'm bored of typing and I need a coffee, but take on board what I have said, some of it might come in handy at some point in the future.

Edited August 2, 2010 by Sphere

[Sphere]

More denial and more patting yourself on the back. Women end up heartbroken all the time by men with this attitude.

 

 

I needed a good laugh this morning. All one needs to do is read your posts in the thread below and come to their own conclusions.

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t240168/

 

 

Hey, the same quote SassyKitten used a few posts back. Einstein is right. She has ended up dating too many men like you getting the same results over and over again. I hope the next man she finds is different. A nice well balanced guy would be perfect for her.

 

If women get heartbroken by me dating them and then honestly ending it when I feel nothing for them, then that's their problem not mine. They shouldn't be so desperate as to develop feelings for me in the dating stage. I haven't proven myself to them, I haven't warranted such affection, so they shouldn't be quick to dole it out. Plenty of women hurt men with their attitudes, I don't see you running to their aid, a typical AFC if I have ever seen one.

 

Come to conclusions about what? Knowing what I want and ensuring I do everything I can to get a great woman? I make no apologises for how I am or how I approach things. It works for me and it will work for me in the long run when I find that woman.

 

Men like me? I'm nothing at all like those men you idiot and if you spent less time focusing on me and more time focusing on your flaws then maybe you could end up with a woman like SassyKitten? Food for thought.

[SassyKitten]

Sphere - A man doesn't have to screw as many women as possible to be a player, he can also be a player through leading women on and playing with their emotions. Sounds like by your definition, dating is fun, for you, at the woman's expense. You said yourself jerks don't call themselves jerks, but looking from the outside, your attitude screams "jerk".

 

Personally, I'm bored by flowers and chocolate. I prefer for a man to get ahead with me by his actions. And part of these actions are admiration for me. Not admiration for me in "Wow, your tits look great in that dress, let's go out and show you off", admiration in the sense that "Wow, you're a great package, you're definitely someone I want on my team".

 

I get the impression from reading your posts that you come across to your dates as patronizing. Which can easily explain why you don't make it past the 3rd date with many. You're a very tightly closed vault, and it would be a miracle if any woman ever gets in. In fact, it would take a very strong woman to get in. But then you said yourself in your other posts that you want a weak submissive female. So guess what, with that attitude you probably will end up single forever.

 

Also, in a healthy relationship, men do cater to the woman AND women cater to the men. it's called an equal exchange. It's called taking care of each other. I have been hurt when I've ended up being the only one who does the catering, as I'm sure so many of what you call "nice guys" have as well.

 

But you clearly seem to want a relationship that's about massaging your ego and allowing you to play out so-called alpha male instincts. Welcome to the 21st Century, wake up and smell the coffee!!

 

 

 

 

 

Zengirl - Thanks, and I will definitely take that on board. My family hasn't made it easy for me at all, but I am hoping that one day I will get to have my own family in order to reverse the cycle once and for all.

[SassyKitten]

If women get heartbroken by me dating them and then honestly ending it when I feel nothing for them, then that's their problem not mine. They shouldn't be so desperate as to develop feelings for me in the dating stage. I haven't proven myself to them, I haven't warranted such affection, so they shouldn't be quick to dole it out. Plenty of women hurt men with their attitudes, I don't see you running to their aid, a typical AFC if I have ever seen one.

 

Come to conclusions about what? Knowing what I want and ensuring I do everything I can to get a great woman? I make no apologises for how I am or how I approach things. It works for me and it will work for me in the long run when I find that woman.

 

Men like me? I'm nothing at all like those men you idiot and if you spent less time focusing on me and more time focusing on your flaws then maybe you could end up with a woman like SassyKitten? Food for thought.

 

First, people don't choose who they fall for. And it doesn't help matter if you, like so many men I have dated, pretend they want a future with them in order to get their goodies. This makes me wonder how many times you actually have fallen for someone. And if you have sex with your dates while you're still in that initial stage, that makes you even more of a jerk. Women tend to get much more emotionally attached from things like kissing and sex than men do. It's a major design flaw, granted. But DON'T make it out like it's her problem, not your's!

 

Second, it works for you at the woman's expense. In order to succeed with women, you need to understand women, and clearly you don't. And actually you sound so much like my last boyfriend it's scary, and I have been in tears for a week because him. Women have feelings, don't run away from it, don't condemn us for it, accept it, understand us, and work with it!!

[Sphere]

Sphere - A man doesn't have to screw as many women as possible to be a player, he can also be a player through leading women on and playing with their emotions. Sounds like by your definition, dating is fun, for you, at the woman's expense. You said yourself jerks don't call themselves jerks, but looking from the outside, your attitude screams "jerk".

 

Personally, I'm bored by flowers and chocolate. I prefer for a man to get ahead with me by his actions. And part of these actions are admiration for me. Not admiration for me in "Wow, your tits look great in that dress, let's go out and show you off", admiration in the sense that "Wow, you're a great package, you're definitely someone I want on my team".

 

I get the impression from reading your posts that you come across to your dates as patronizing. Which can easily explain why you don't make it past the 3rd date with many. You're a very tightly closed vault, and it would be a miracle if any woman ever gets in. In fact, it would take a very strong woman to get in. But then you said yourself in your other posts that you want a weak submissive female. So guess what, with that attitude you probably will end up single forever.

 

Also, in a healthy relationship, men do cater to the woman AND women cater to the men. it's called an equal exchange. It's called taking care of each other. I have been hurt when I've ended up being the only one who does the catering, as I'm sure so many of what you call "nice guys" have as well.

 

But you clearly seem to want a relationship that's about massaging your ego and allowing you to play out so-called alpha male instincts. Welcome to the 21st Century, wake up and smell the coffee!!.

 

I'm starting to wonder if people actually read my posts or do they just skim read it and reply to the bits that stand out to them?

 

Most of the women I have been on dates with haven't felt anything other than sexual attraction for me. Only a few have actually had feelings for me and were disappointed with me when I decided to end it, but I didn't sleep with these women. I didn't lie to them, in fact I just said I'm looking to casually date until I find a great woman that I'm truly interested in. I could have gone to second, third and fourth base with them and then bolted which really is jerk like behaviour.

 

Dating is fun because of the places I choose. I'm casually dating one girl at the moment, I asked the other one if she wanted to be friends as I didn't feel anything other than sexual attraction for her and she declined my offer. I took her paintballing Saturday and though she was reluctant at first, she really enjoyed it, she loved it and thanked me for a great day out. I throughly enjoyed it too and I am looking forward to the third date. If that goes well then I'll be looking to get to know this girl further. I have always made my intentions clear to any girl I have casually dated. Of course it seems you'll read whatever you want from my posts, but I am repeating myself lol.

 

I'm not patronising at all to my dates and I don't get past third date because half of the time I call it off, or they call it off. It doesn't matter who calls it off, it is nice to know that I won't be wasting my time with someone who isn't right for me.

 

If I am single forever, then I won't die a lonely and unhappy man. Women evolve around my world, they are not the centre of my world, they were once, but then I realised there is so much more to life than women, relationships, marriage, 2.4 children and sexual intercourse.