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A huge mess

noelle303

By noelle303
in The Other Man / Woman

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IfWishesWereHorses Established Member

IfWishesWereHorses

Posted
Posted

Inform the MM and TOGETHER make a decision.

 

This 30 year old MM who is having a fling with a 20 year old while he has a wife and kids at home. You trust him to worry about what is in Noelle's and her baby's best interest (should she choose to keep it). The only man who you can trust to do that is her father. TALK TO A COUNSELOR FIRST! Then find out where you stand. And ignore the pro and con stances here. This is YOUR life and you need to make a responsible, informed choice before dealing with the manipulations of this man. Let your parents do their job and support and stand up for you right now.

herenow Established Member

herenow

Posted
Posted
Seriously Noelle, here's a link to start with. See if they have a location near you (I hope so!).

 

http://www.plannedparenthood.org/index.htm

 

First, go to a OB/GYN and get a real pregnancy test. Take it from there and use all the resources you can possibly find to make the decision that works best for you. Under your circumstances, any decision is going to be hard to make and will have long lasting effects in your life. One more than the other but can't take it back now. It is what it is...

 

Yes, yes, yes. You should see a doctor. If there is a chance that you will have the baby, you need to start a prenatal style of living.

RedDevil66 Established Member

RedDevil66

Posted
Posted

 

-------------------

 

I disagree... Not so ..

 

That's cool and I am all for abortion, BUT it's not YOUR choice or MINE. Get it!

 

But I'm not here telling her to get an abortion since abortion at this point, is not even terminating a baby, but a buch of cells that are not even formed yet

 

Let's not try to convince her whether to abort or not, let's try to support her on letting her make her own choices.

 

And I agree with SF above. There is no "for sure" with this married man. He's a liar and cheater and no matter what comes out of his mouth is not to be trusted.

Speak to your parents, a therapist or whomever else to clear your mind for your next move.

Mimolicious Established Member

Mimolicious

Posted
Posted
Inform the MM and TOGETHER make a decision.

 

This 30 year old MM who is having a fling with a 20 year old while he has a wife and kids at home. You trust him to worry about what is in Noelle's and her baby's best interest (should she choose to keep it). The only man who you can trust to do that is her father. TALK TO A COUNSELOR FIRST! Then find out where you stand. And ignore the pro and con stances here. This is YOUR life and you need to make a responsible, informed choice before dealing with the manipulations of this man. Let your parents do their job and support and stand up for you right now.

 

Wait a second IWWH... This is not a 12yr that was taken advantage of either, she is over the legal age. Her parents can be supportive but is not their decision to make. Her parents at the end of the day have no right over the MM in this pregnancy. Grandparents dont go before parents.

 

I do agree that her decision shouldn't depend on this MM but neither should it depend on her parents.

 

What is her parents job, at this point?

By no means do I think that my parental duty ends with the legal age, but my job as a parent is not to be responsible for my adult child's mistakes either. Once we are adults we are owners of our destiny.

Mimolicious Established Member

Mimolicious

Posted
Posted

Red Devil- I didnt say what is quoted on you post. :confused:

RedDevil66 Established Member

RedDevil66

Posted
Posted
Red Devil- I didnt say what is quoted on you post. :confused:

 

Sorry, it was how it was quoted. It was addressed to Califan. Sorry about that

califnan Established Member

califnan

Posted
Posted

 

But I'm not here telling her to get an abortion since abortion at this point, is not even terminating a baby, but a buch of cells that are not even formed yet

 

.

 

--------------------

 

A human from the beginning..

 

"a bunch of cells" is term that abortion clinics use to make $$$

lolalove Member

lolalove

Posted
Posted
This is patently disgusting.

I cannot find strong enough words to condemn this.

 

Whether we like it or not there IS a father.

And, unless I'm mistaken, HE has rights too. Such as...rights to have a say in the life of HIS child.

 

It is a HORRENDOUS mistake to NOT involve the MM in this decision making process.

 

He may want the child.

He may be against abortion and favor adoption.

He may offer the support she will need.

 

The FATHER DESERVES TO KNOW.

HE HAS A GOD GIVEN RIGHT to have a voice in this.

 

Inform the MM and TOGETHER make a decision.

 

Agree. How selfish to not involve the father. A woman doesn't make a baby herself. Accident or not, he is a parent who should have some input to what happens to his child.

herenow Established Member

herenow

Posted
Posted (edited)

 

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A human from the beginning..

 

"a bunch of cells" is term that abortion clinics use to make $$$

 

And this is how people who want to deny a woman the right to choose guilt people into having babies they don't want.

 

This is Noelle's choice. She should not be made to feel guilty if she chooses to not bring an unwanted child into this world. Adoption, just like abortion, isn't right for everyone. Neither is being a single parent when you aren't ready. I hope Noelle gets a chance to speak to someone who has only her best interest in mind.

 

If Noelle decides that she wants the baby or wants to put it up for adoption, she should make that decision because it is what she wants. Not because someone guilts her into it.

 

Noelle, this is a very emotional time for you. Please make sure you do what is best for you no matter want me or anyone else tells you.

Edited by herenow
jj33 Established Member

jj33

Posted
Posted

Noelle. You are in a terrible state of turmoil and that is understandable.

 

But you need to be practical. Take a deep breath.

 

Have you spoken to your parents? Do you have any idea of what they might think about the situation if you were to keep it or give it up for adoption? Would they support that?

 

The decision is YOURS.

 

This man is married. He may SAY he will be there and support you in whatever you do but unless you have something from him IN WRITING that is binding that is executed after you speak with a lawyer and have them draw up the papers

 

you have NO guarantee that in a month 3 months or a year he wont say gee my W is furious and she wont let me do this anymore.

 

You could be in a position where you had to sue him for child support. Very very likely in my opinion. No matter how supportive he might be up front (if he is) absent the security of a legal obligatoin it would be VERY VERYfoolish for you to rely on him in any way.

 

Think very hard about this.

 

If you and this man are meant to have children together, you can have those children once he is divorced.

 

Its foolish to think of having this baby now.

 

Noone wants that for their daughter their sister or their child (to have a married mans baby).

 

You sound like a smart cookie. Take care of it and take care of yourself.

 

As for the idea of deciding after he moves out - thats not possible. Unless he backs his little bag immediately you wont have time for that before making your decision about whether to keep it.

 

So youd need the legal agreement and him moving out.

 

This is not some romantic fantasy unfortunately.

 

You are in charge of you and your body. Embrace that and do what is best for you.

 

Only you know what that is. If its keeping the baby I wish you alot of luck but I suspect that is not the right solution for you.

herenow Established Member

herenow

Posted
Posted

 

As for the idea of deciding after he moves out - thats not possible. Unless he backs his little bag immediately you wont have time for that before making your decision about whether to keep it.

 

Good point. I'm not sure where you live, but in some places you can't get an abortion past the first trimester. As pro choice as I am, I'm even against abortion after the first trimester. As difficult as this decision is, time is a real factor.

califnan Established Member

califnan

Posted
Posted
And this is how people who want to deny a woman the right to choose guilt people into having babies they don't want.

 

.

 

-------------------

 

No guilt if going in the right direction .. 'Choice' was a term given a woman to choose whatever she wished to do with her body .. But now her Child is involved..

 

Anyone can make a mistake in sleeping with the wrong person.. It's what we do with our previous mistakes that defines us..

herenow Established Member

herenow

Posted
Posted (edited)
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No guilt if going in the right direction .. 'Choice' was a term given a woman to choose whatever she wished to do with her body .. But now her Child is involved..

 

Anyone can make a mistake in sleeping with the wrong person.. It's what we do with our previous mistakes that defines us..

 

OK, I have to admit I have no idea what you mean by previous mistakes. However, I don't think a young woman should have to pay with her body (and future) for a mistake she made. And, IMO, if women were forced to have children they don't want, how sad for the innocent unwanted babies. If a woman is ready to be a mother or can deal with adoption, then great. If not, then the choice to have a abortion is what is best for both the mother and the baby IMO.

 

You can paint as many happy endings when it comes to young single mothers or children who have been adopted. I can show you many situations where children are born unwanted and life goes terribly wrong. I have no intention of playing that game because I trust that Noelle will do what is best for her.

 

And just because you determine what the "right direction" is for you does not mean that is the right direction for anyone else. That is your right, you have no say for what others choose.

 

And, while I'm at it, choice is choice. The term is used as it is defined. Choice (in the USA at this moment anyway) is everyone's legal right.

Edited by herenow
califnan Established Member

califnan

Posted
Posted
OK, I have to admit I have no idea what you mean by previous mistakes. However, I don't think a young woman should have to pay with her body (and future) for a mistake she made. And, IMO, if women were made to have children they don't want, how sad for the innocent unwanted babies. If a woman is ready to be a mother or can deal with adoption, then great. If not, then the choice to have a abortion is what is best for both the mother and the baby IMO.

 

You can paint as many happy endings when it comes to young single mothers or children who have been adopted. I can show you many situations where children are born unwanted and life goes terribly wrong. I have no intention of playing that game because I trust that Noelle will do what is best for her.

 

And just because you determine what the "right direction" is for you does not mean that is the right direction for anyone else. That is your right, you have no say for what others choose.

 

---------------------------

 

She's not being made to pay for any mistake - unless she kills her baby ..

 

Not killing a baby thru abortion - has never been an excuse for abuse of unwanted children afterward..

 

People sleep around - outside of marriage - all the time, as part of recreation .. That doesn't mean that the innocent little ones are supposed to pay with their lives..

 

There are no frest starts after an abortion.

GreenEyedLady Established Member

GreenEyedLady

Posted
Posted
And this is how people who want to deny a woman the right to choose guilt people into having babies they don't want.

 

This is Noelle's choice. She should not be made to feel guilty if she chooses to not bring an unwanted child into this world. Adoption, just like abortion, isn't right for everyone. Neither is being a single parent when you aren't ready. I hope Noelle gets a chance to speak to someone who has only her best interest in mind.

 

If Noelle decides that she wants the baby or wants to put it up for adoption, she should make that decision because it is what she wants. Not because someone guilts her into it.

 

Noelle, this is a very emotional time for you. Please make sure you do what is best for you no matter want me or anyone else tells you.

 

I agree.

 

Talk to someone you feel comfortable discussing this with, a counselor perhaps.

 

You have to make the best decision for YOU.

 

((HUGS))

 

GEL

herenow Established Member

herenow

Posted
Posted (edited)
---------------------------

 

She's not being made to pay for any mistake - unless she kills her baby ..

 

Not killing a baby thru abortion - has never been an excuse for abuse of unwanted children afterward..

 

People sleep around - outside of marriage - all the time, as part of recreation .. That doesn't mean that the innocent little ones are supposed to pay with their lives..

 

There are no frest starts after an abortion.

 

And you think there is a fresh start for a 20 year old a student who has a baby with a MM? Please explain how that goes. Even if she gives the baby up for adoption, she still has to deal with it. Not to mention the nine months she will carry the baby and most likely form some attachment . How is that a fresh start?

 

In a perfect world all children should be wanted. But, the world is not perfect. The least we can do is allow women the choice to have or not have a child when a pregnancy is unwanted. Without that choice, there will be more unwanted children born into an already difficult world to grow up in. Some will be just fine, but what about those who won't be so well off? How do you justify that?

 

And, how exactly do you think she should pay for her mistake if she has an abortion? I'm really interested in your POV. I find it fascinating. And, I'm not being sarcastic, I really what to know. I'm also interested in how it's OK to sleep around outside of marriage for "recreation".

Edited by herenow
califnan Established Member

califnan

Posted
Posted
And you think there is a fresh start for a 20 year old a student who has a baby with a MM? Please explain how that goes. Even if she gives the baby up for adoption, she still has to deal with it. Not to mention the nine moths she will carry the baby and most likely form some attachment . How is that a fresh start?

 

In a perfect world all children should be wanted. But, the world is not perfect. The least we can do is allow women the choice to have or not have a child when a pregnancy is unwanted. Without that choice, there will be more unwanted children born into an already difficult world to grow up in. Some will be just fine, but what about those who won't be so well off? How do you justify that?

 

And, how exactly do you think she should pay for her mistake if she has an abortion? I'm really interested in your POV. I find it fascinating. And, I'm not being sarcastic, I really what to know.

 

----------------

 

I said there are no fresh starts with abortion.. Most women who have aborted, will remember it forever..

 

Yours and my interpretation of how a baby should be embraced - has Never been a reason to kill the baby beforehand - so a woman will not have to "deal with it" ..

herenow Established Member

herenow

Posted
Posted
----------------

 

I said there are no fresh starts with abortion.. Most women who have aborted, will remember it forever..

 

Yours and my interpretation of how a baby should be embraced - has Never been a reason to kill the baby beforehand - so a woman will not have to "deal with it" ..

 

and you think having a baby and giving it up for adoption is a forgettable experience? The pregnancy itself will be a life changing experience she will never forget no matter what she chooses to do.

 

As far as "deal with it", Noelle has to deal with it. She has to deal with it in her own way. Not yours or mine, hers. Your POV does not give her a choice. At least the law allows her to choose what is best for her. This has nothing to do with how you or I would embrace a child, this is about Noelle and thankfully she has a choice. You may not want her to have a choice, but she does. Unless someone decides to murder her doctor. Are you OK with that?

jj33 Established Member

jj33

Posted
Posted (edited)
---------------------------

 

She's not being made to pay for any mistake - unless she kills her baby ..

 

Not killing a baby thru abortion - has never been an excuse for abuse of unwanted children afterward..

 

People sleep around - outside of marriage - all the time, as part of recreation .. That doesn't mean that the innocent little ones are supposed to pay with their lives..

 

There are no frest starts after an abortion.

 

Have YOU ever had an abortion? I have and YES I had a fresh start. I beg to differ with you. ANd PLEASE spare me a post coming back and telling me that God judges me. Im not buying it.

 

Califnan, if Noelle didnt believe that abortion was a choice she would have posed her question differently. She does. Telling her that hellfire and brimstone will descend on her is not helpful IMHO.

 

Noelle I assume you are savvy enough to know that you are simply witnessing pro choice v no choice.

 

Califnan its called CHOICE because the woman gets to choose whether or not she has a baby. To say that she is not permitted this choice once she becomes pregnant is simply wrong as a matter of fact and a matter of law.

 

I appreciate that to you there is no choice once someone is pregnant because you dont beleive in abortion, but that doesnt mean that Noelle doesnt have a choice. She does.

 

Hang in there Noelle. You will get through this. If you decide to have an abortion, I can tell you it is not a big deal. Its over before you know it and if you go somewhere reputable you will be fine physically.

 

The bigger issue for you will be dealing with the MMs response. And dont let him get all fatherly about this. If he isnt willing to put something in a legally binding document, his word is worth 0. If you read the boards his leaving is worth 0 without a legally binding document in place.

 

I almost hope MM runs scared or offers to go with you to take care of it. It will be upsetting because the happy family fantasy wiill burst into flames. But it will be the best thing for you.

 

My thoughts are with you.

 

And lets face it. Most 20 year old university students (and I said most not all) who have babies in this situation dont end up with university degrees. They end up with careers well below their potential struggling to make ends meet, and secretly spend a lot of time wondering what might have been if things had gone differently.

 

Is that what you want for your future? You would miss out on your youth. You dont deserve that. Thats not what you want for yourself and I cant imagine its what your parents want for you. Dont let the romantic fantasy sway you into a bad decision. This isnt the 1950s. You arent stuck. You have a choice.

Edited by jj33
jj33 Established Member

jj33

Posted
Posted
Good point. I'm not sure where you live, but in some places you can't get an abortion past the first trimester. As pro choice as I am, I'm even against abortion after the first trimester. As difficult as this decision is, time is a real factor.

 

Excellent point Herenow. Time is a big factor.

califnan Established Member

califnan

Posted
Posted
and you think having a baby and giving it up for adoption is a forgettable experience? The pregnancy itself will be a life changing experience she will never forget no matter what she chooses to do.

 

As far as "deal with it", Noelle has to deal with it. She has to deal with it in her own way. Not yours or mine, hers. Your POV does not give her a choice. At least the law allows her to choose what is best for her. This has nothing to do with how you or I would embrace a child, this is about Noelle and thankfully she has a choice. You may not want her to have a choice, but she does. Unless someone decides to murder her doctor. Are you OK with that?

 

----------------

 

I knew a few men who was raised in orphanages.. They are Happy to be alive!

 

As for the lechers who perform 'legal' abortions .. You will not run out of them .. But the 50 million legalized abortions ... God had good intentions for His babies.. ..

jj33 Established Member

jj33

Posted
Posted
Welcome back JJ, I gotta go so tag your it!

 

Sadly I have to go too but Noelle we are thinking of you.

fooled once Established Member

fooled once

Posted
Posted
Noelle my response is going to be HUGELY unpopular on a forum where God is invoked every other minute and with no disrespect to PIH and others who were adopted but

 

IMHO (Ill say it again) IMHO you would be crazy to have this child.

 

You made a mistake. You got sucked in by a sleezy guy.

 

Are you going to give up your education, give up your youth to raise a child (sweet and innocent and wonderful as it may be) who was fathered by this sleezebag.

 

Abortion is still legal in the US. Take advantage of that right and dont look back.

 

If you decide to have that child Im sure it will be the light of your life.

 

But if you do make that decision, the course of your life in SO many ways, financially, socially, career, future husband etc.

 

having that child will be like wearing a scarlet "A" for the rest of your life.

 

As sweet and innocent as a child may be this is not how you want to have a baby and not when you want to have a baby.

 

Geez if you were my daughter Id march you to Planned Parenthood myself and thump you across the head for being so silly as to get yourself into this position.

 

 

And NO the MM will NOT be there. Dont be surprised if he gives you the $$ for the abortion himself and then disappears.

 

Really sorry you got yourself caught up in this.

 

Take good care of yourself.

 

Edited to add:

 

There is always the emotional and true argument that the child could be adopted by a good home as PIH was.

 

And that is very noble. Personally while I consider myself to be a good person I am not self sacrificing enough to do that. Look deep in your heart before you make a decision to have the child at your age and decide if yo really want to do that. If you are very religious, then I suppose your decision may already be made for you.

 

But if you arent, while its noble you can be noble in other ways. There are children all over the world available for adoption, you dont have to change the course of your life to have this one.

 

Excellent post JJ!!

 

Additionally, the MM could decide to sue the OP for FULL/SOLE custody of the child.

 

20 years old is not a child. She is old enough to know that any time you have sex that there could be unintended consequences.

 

Noelle, my heart does go out to you but you did get yourself into this situation. It's 50% your fault. Think long and hard about what you are going to do because depending on what you decide, this will affect you for the rest of your life. I wouldn't depend on the MM for much of anything. I say tell him, but don't expect miracles from him. And think about it, would you really want to have a child together with this man? He has already, in a sense, abandoned his first two children (and wife) to have fun with you.

 

Great post! 20 years old is NOT a child and the OP needs to take responsibility for what she has done.

 

Seems Noelle was totally enjoying screwing someone else's husband; even in the woman's home :eek: Seems like a competition with the wife - the innocent wife who has no idea of the pig she is married to. Noelle went into this with her eyes wide open for some sex and sneaking around. Yes, she is immature, especially by getting drunk when she KNEW she was pregnant and then calling the MM at home, to get a rise out of him. That screams immaturity. What the hell did the wife do to deserve all this? Her family possibly being blown apart by her husband fathering another child outside.

 

 

 

To be honest, it is quiet disturbing that you got drunk, spazzed out and called his home. Let's say you do go through with this pregnancy and he decides that he is not going to be a part of it, is this going to trigger you into more calling and causing drama? I mean, if you have this baby and he is the dad, there is always Family Court to get proper financial assistance. No getting out of that. If things that he said didn't indicate that he was very "happy" at home, watch what happens now.

 

I agree with Hereandnow- he didn't lie to you and told you he was single. You were fully aware of his situation.

 

:eek:

It actually scares the living hell out of me, that at this age in time young adults have hardly any knowledge of sex ed. :sick: AIDS/HIV is not a sign on anyone's forehead!!!!! :rolleyes: This is very ignorant for a 20yr old full-time student in the 21st Century.

 

 

This is unfair and incosiderate towards your parents.Dont you think? It is not their responsibility to care for your child. If this was a perfect scenario, where you were having a baby with your partner, you wouldn't be dependent on them. You had poor judgment and now is time to correct what you can.

 

ESPECIALLY the bolded!

 

Additionally, why should the parents of the irresponsible 20 year old have THEIR lives turned upside down by their daughter's actions? Yes, they may definitely want a grandchild, but I highly doubt they want their lives to come to a standstill so they can financially and physically support another child THEY didn't plan.

 

As for the MM leaving his family? Noelle, do you really honestly think he is going to blow HIS world apart for a 5 month sex relationship? Do you think he is going to leave his wife and children for you, a 20 year old girl in school? Do you think he is going to walk away from his 2 children and his wife -- and pay out the amount of money it is going to cost him to end that marriage? His wife will take him to the cleaners, definitely child support for their 2 kids, possibly alimony and his retirement and everything they have built to this point? Please OPEN YOUR EYES -- you were his side kick. If he wanted a life with you, he would have left his wife already. Do NOT plan one him being there - emotionally or physically. He will be required to be their financially, but other than that -- don't count on it.

 

I agree with jj. Talk to a counselor or OBGYN and schedule an abortion. I know others who have had one and they aren't scarred for life. At this point in your life you can't handle a child. You are - rightfully so - enjoying being 20. ENJOY it. Do not opt to bring a child into this world that you aren't ready for.

 

I don't mean to sound harsh, but you do not seem in any way ready to be a mom (and that isn't a slam). Do not expect your parents to alter their life to help you raise (or take on the primary raising) of YOUR child.

 

I hope you can find some resolution that fits YOU. Good luck.

pureinheart Established Member

pureinheart

Posted
Posted

I really can't believe that there is so little regard for human life...the baby is a baby period...if the government gives a "choice" to jump off a bridge are you going to do it? Just because it's legal doesnot make it right.

 

The most dangerous place for a baby in this day and hour is the mothers womb...a very sad state we live in. Very discouraging.

Fieldsofgold Established Member

Fieldsofgold

Posted
Posted (edited)

My H left me with a weeks-old baby when I was 20. He never paid child support or contributed in any helpful way. My daughter is the joy of my life. I cannot imagine not having her. As much as xH and his OW/W tried to get custody, they were never able to even get it off the ground. Because I was a good mother.

 

As for the scarlet A, you can't be serious. Single people rearing children these days is so common, I really don't believe ANYONE other than maybe some 80 y/o, would say such a thing! My daughter had my grandson without benefit of marriage, and he has been the greatest joy in my life. I financially helped my daughter finish college, and I provided babysitting while she did. She has told me many times how she would not trade him for anything. He is now an older teenager. Smart as a whip. Incredible aptitude for science. I can see him contributing greatly to the betterment of mankind. Who knows - he may find a cure for cancer, or AIDS, or who knows what. But I can promise you, he has a lot to give. He wants to pursue a medical career and work in empoverished countries. I'm thinking there are going to be a lot of people in his future who will be glad he wasn't flushed down a sink.

 

My friend had an open adoption. So far that is working out very well.

 

Lots of options to consider N.

 

Now, here's my opinion. I believe abortion ends an innocent life, one that might have many great things to contribute. I think it is terrible to not give that life a chance - with someone, adopted or otherwise - because it might be inconvenient.

Edited by Fieldsofgold
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