Ramblings of a former OW who is sad about some of the posts here...

[complicatedlife]

I decided to start an entire new thread because I didn't want to do the whole thread-jacking thing.

 

Please forgive my use of titles such as OW, WS, etc...I don't like to use them, but they make life easier for writing here on LS.

 

When I read some of the thought patterns of some of the OWs here, I felt disenheartened. I can't understand why some of the women here blindly believe their MMs. Did I believe my MM when he used to tell me about how it "really was" at home? Yes. And no. The love I felt in my heart for him as well as my hope that he was indeed being honest with me because he loved me compelled me to believe him. My mind, on the other hand, (as well as my cousin who is a marriage and family therapist) was screaming, "No! Don't believe anything he says! He loved his wife, married her, and is now lying to her; what makes YOU any different?" I always, always had an element of doubt about his "truth". And even now that I know that most of the things that I was told while the affair was going on were true, I STILL, to this day, will be in the dark about what REALLY went on in that house between the two of them; the only people who really and truly know is my BF and his ex. The blind faith that I see some OWs giving here is not only unrealistic, it's unhealthy.

 

Also, in regards to telling children the initmate details of their parents' relationship in the event of a D-Day or a "confession" day, it really depends on the age and maturity of the child; I personally don't think it's a good idea if the kids aren't at least pre-teen age. But I believe that it is of the utmost importance for BOTH parents to have that sit down talk with the children together, after they have both discussed it with each other. Maybe the BS can sit at the table while the WS answers the questions the children will surely ask as to why the parents are having difficulty. I don't think it's right that the BS should make unilateral decisions about ANYTHING that involves their kids. The parents may not have their *ish right with each other, but they need to stand together and get their *ish right when it comes to those children.

 

Lastly, to go back to my first point: no matter how much "truth" I was told about the details of the marriage/relationship, it never, ever gave me peace, comfort, or happiness to know that he stlll went home to her everyday, had dinner as a family everyday, slept in the same bed as her everyday. Even if I had a tape recorder and video tape in their bedroom for every night of our affair that provided evidence that nothing ever went on between him and his ex, he wasn't with ME. And that hurt like hell. I received as much attention as he could give me and he also stepped up to do whatever I asked/needed the few times that I complained, but it never consoled me at night. Or on holidays. Thank God there were no vacations to worry about. It was certainly a full time love, but most certainly a part time relationship in the physical sense, and I can't wrap my head around how that can be "okay" with an OW - how does that not slowly make you die a little everyday inside? As you develop more feelings and grow closer with time, it's just natural that you will want to spend more time with him...when that happens and you do nothing about it but accept the status quo, that is when the tides turn, and he knows he has the power. Don't give your power away. Stand up for what you really want, whatever that is, and accept nothing less- if it's that you're tired, move on, if you want HIM full time, then tell him that; if he doesn't make a move to give you what you want, then he doesn't really want YOU.

 

Be strong, have courage, and pray, if you believe in a higher being.

 

CL

[califnan]

I decided to start an entire new thread because I didn't want to do the whole thread-jacking thing.

 

Please forgive my use of titles such as OW, WS, etc...I don't like to use them, but they make life easier for writing here on LS.

 

When I read some of the thought patterns of some of the OWs here, I felt disenheartened. I can't understand why some of the women here blindly believe their MMs. Did I believe my MM when he used to tell me about how it "really was" at home? Yes. And no. The love I felt in my heart for him as well as my hope that he was indeed being honest with me because he loved me compelled me to believe him. My mind, on the other hand, (as well as my cousin who is a marriage and family therapist) was screaming, "No! Don't believe anything he says! He loved his wife, married her, and is now lying to her; what makes YOU any different?" I always, always had an element of doubt about his "truth". And even now that I know that most of the things that I was told while the affair was going on were true, I STILL, to this day, will be in the dark about what REALLY went on in that house between the two of them; the only people who really and truly know is my BF and his ex. The blind faith that I see some OWs giving here is not only unrealistic, it's unhealthy.

 

Also, in regards to telling children the initmate details of their parents' relationship in the event of a D-Day or a "confession" day, it really depends on the age and maturity of the child; I personally don't think it's a good idea if the kids aren't at least pre-teen age. But I believe that it is of the utmost importance for BOTH parents to have that sit down talk with the children together, after they have both discussed it with each other. Maybe the BS can sit at the table while the WS answers the questions the children will surely ask as to why the parents are having difficulty. I don't think it's right that the BS should make unilateral decisions about ANYTHING that involves their kids. The parents may not have their *ish right with each other, but they need to stand together and get their *ish right when it comes to those children.

 

Lastly, to go back to my first point: no matter how much "truth" I was told about the details of the marriage/relationship, it never, ever gave me peace, comfort, or happiness to know that he stlll went home to her everyday, had dinner as a family everyday, slept in the same bed as her everyday. Even if I had a tape recorder and video tape in their bedroom for every night of our affair that provided evidence that nothing ever went on between him and his ex, he wasn't with ME. And that hurt like hell. I received as much attention as he could give me and he also stepped up to do whatever I asked/needed the few times that I complained, but it never consoled me at night. Or on holidays. Thank God there were no vacations to worry about. It was certainly a full time love, but most certainly a part time relationship in the physical sense, and I can't wrap my head around how that can be "okay" with an OW - how does that not slowly make you die a little everyday inside? As you develop more feelings and grow closer with time, it's just natural that you will want to spend more time with him...when that happens and you do nothing about it but accept the status quo, that is when the tides turn, and he knows he has the power. Don't give your power away. Stand up for what you really want, whatever that is, and accept nothing less- if it's that you're tired, move on, if you want HIM full time, then tell him that; if he doesn't make a move to give you what you want, then he doesn't really want YOU.

 

Be strong, have courage, and pray, if you believe in a higher being.

 

CL

 

-------------------

 

I think the different stages of the OW on here - in or out of the relationship, are just representative of how it is in the world.

 

There are those who have been through it and may think, why did I waste my time on that .. Then there are those who are in the relationship and nonrepentant and think it's worth it ..

 

I have the hardest time with the OW who marries the MM, and thinks that the marriage has made it right..

[OpenBook]

I do believe that many MM do indeed love their OW. And they also love their W at the same time, although in a different way - the W is more like an old comfortable familiar shoe that has molded itself to their foot - or a convenient replacement for Mom.

 

The question for both the W and the OW is - is that kind of love enough?

 

It all boils down to what you're willing to tolerate.

[complicatedlife]

-------------------

 

I think the different stages of the OW on here - in or out of the relationship, are just representative of how it is in the world.

 

There are those who have been through it and may think, why did I waste my time on that .. Then there are those who are in the relationship and nonrepentant and think it's worth it ..

 

I have the hardest time with the OW who marries the MM, and thinks that the marriage has made it right..

 

I'm not really sure what you mean by the OW thinking the marriage makes it right...makes WHAT right, exactly, the marital relationship or some sort of amends for her part in the demise of the marriage?

 

In either case, thank God the only person I need to make sure I make things right with is the one man who I know forgives over and over again...The Man Upstairs.

[jthorne]

It all boils down to what you're willing to tolerate.

My perspective now is a bit different. I think it boils down to what God or your Higher Power teaches you is right.

[complicatedlife]

It all boils down to what you're willing to tolerate.

Exactly. And I think even OWs should all have some sort of threshold.

[califnan]

I'm not really sure what you mean by the OW thinking the marriage makes it right...makes WHAT right, exactly, the marital relationship or some sort of amends for her part in the demise of the marriage?

 

In either case, thank God the only person I need to make sure I make things right with is the one man who I know forgives over and over again...The Man Upstairs.

 

-------------------

 

Yes, God forgives - but I still reap for my actions/sins..

 

I am speaking about when the MM does divorce his W and marries the OW - and the OW thinks that the new marriage has made an honest woman of her .. complete w 'blending' families/children - and the whole bit ..

[complicatedlife]

-------------------

 

Yes, God forgives - but I still reap for my actions/sins..

 

I am speaking about when the MM does divorce his W and marries the OW - and the OW thinks that the new marriage has made an honest woman of her .. complete w 'blending' families/children - and the whole bit ..

 

Yes, He does. We all reap what we sow whenever we sin for a season, not forever. So thank God that there is no condemnation for those that are in Christ.

 

I don't think most OW or people in general, for that matter, get married SOLELY because it's going to make an "honest person" of them - people choose to get married for many reasons: love, for money, for preganancy, etc. And, if it does make someone feel more "honorable", I see absolutely nothing wrong with that at all. That's too bad that a relationship that may have started in an incorrect manner and resulted in a more socially accepted relationship is NOT acceptable to you; obviously, an OW would never be redeemed in your eyes...hey, that's your choice- to each his own. But...let's hope that in your eyes that it didn't make an honest man of the MM, too, because if it didn't, that'd be sort of hypocritical!

Edited July 22, 2010 by complicatedlife

[califnan]

Yes, He does. We all reap what we sow whenever we sin for a season, not forever. So thank God that there is no condemnation for those that are in Christ.

 

I don't think most OW or people in general, for that matter, get married because it's going to make an "honest person" of them - people choose to get married for many reasons: love, for money, for preganancy, etc. That's too bad that a relationship that may have started in an incorrect manner and resulted in a more socially accepted relationship is NOT acceptable to you. Let's hope that in your eyes that it didn't make an honest man of the MM, too!

 

------------------

 

Your thread seemed to speak to mostly the OW.

 

So yes, in my eyes - it's just pretending - whether they dump their spouse(s) - and marry, or not .. and involving the children as well..

[complicatedlife]

------------------

 

Your thread seemed to speak to mostly the OW.

 

So yes, in my eyes - it's just pretending - whether they dump their spouse(s) - and marry, or not .. and involving the children as well..

Yep, it's for OWs, but also for anyone who may feel they needed to hear what I had to share and it helped them in some way; I posted this to help anyone who may be in need of hearing how a former OW's life was during her tenure as an OW, not to discuss whether an OW is "redeemable" or not.

 

In regards to you thinking it's pretending, oh well, I think we can live with you feeling that way. And I'm not saying that to be condescending or flippant, I really mean that...you won't be the first or the last person who thinks and feels that way.

[califnan]

That's too bad that a relationship that may have started in an incorrect manner and resulted in a more socially accepted relationship is NOT acceptable to you; QUOTE]

 

-----------------

 

"a relationship that may have started in an incorrect manner" ... Can you say Sin??

 

Sin is something that adversely affects more than the one or two involved.. It affects the original wife and or husband, children of both families .. and yes, I even knew it to spread to their other family members as well.. Reminds me of something I read once, about each sin affecting 19 people..

[califnan]

I feel that I have been on both sides CL..

 

I credit LS and the testimonies, for straightening me out ..

[complicatedlife]

That's too bad that a relationship that may have started in an incorrect manner and resulted in a more socially accepted relationship is NOT acceptable to you; QUOTE]

 

-----------------

 

"a relationship that may have started in an incorrect manner" ... Can you say Sin??

 

Sin is something that adversely affects more than the one or two involved.. It affects the original wife and or husband, children of both families .. and yes, I even knew it to spread to their other family members as well.. Reminds me of something I read once, about each sin affecting 19 people..

 

I'm not sure why you're pointing out that statement when everyone knows that affairs are wrong and in the spiritual world, yes, a sin. I could take what this post of yours is seemigly trying to do: provoke me, which is also a sin (oh, you do that, too?), but I will take the benefit of the doubt route and chalk it up to just some good ole regular LS banter. ;-).

[califnan]

 

I'm not sure why you're pointing out that statement when everyone knows that affairs are wrong and in the spiritual world, yes, a sin. I could take what this post of yours is seemigly trying to do: provoke me, which is also a sin (oh, you do that, too?), but I will take the benefit of the doubt route and chalk it up to just some good ole regular LS banter. ;-).

 

----------------------

 

Go ahead and have your thread CL ..

 

I was just trying to explain the whole life of the affair .. that it doesn't all of a sudden get holy when the marriage(s) breaks up .. and there is new marriage (based on the adultery) .. still sin..

 

Am certain, you will find other posters who will not provoke you ..

[califnan]

sorry .. from time to time I am noticing that quoted info is showing the wrong originater name in it ..

[Fallen Angel]

The poster you were speaking with was left by her XH and he then married the OW.

 

So that's why she doesn't like to hear about when it works out between the MM and the OW.

 

EEG

 

Amen. (ten characters required)

[scatterd]

Sometimes no matter what you say they try to justify their actions.A sin is a sin and hurting family and children and having no remorse is plain wrong.I guess we can live with her not caring.Its not our job to save someone that does not know of right from wrong.Its fine she has her view and Im g;ad to say not all here think that way.some other woman don't shove it down our throats we are here to lean on and give support to who needs it.She does not know your a good person but we do.

[califnan]

My perspective now is a bit different. I think it boils down to what God or your Higher Power teaches you is right.

 

-------------------

 

Amen .. and when I'm not walking right .. I find out ..

[complicatedlife]

@ EEG and FA: Thanks. I now completely understand.

[complicatedlife]

Sometimes no matter what you say they try to justify their actions.A sin is a sin and hurting family and children and having no remorse is plain wrong.I guess we can live with her not caring.Its not our job to save someone that does not know of right from wrong.Its fine she has her view and Im g;ad to say not all here think that way.some other woman don't shove it down our throats we are here to lean on and give support to who needs it.She does not know your a good person but we do.

 

Not caring? Save someone? Shoving it down people's throats?

 

Can someone enlighten me, please, as to:

 

1. Where this is coming from?

 

And

 

2. How this relates to what I originally posted as I can't comprehend the relevance?

[scatterd]

I understand a little better also.It is sad anybody hurts.

[scatterd]

Miss understanding sorry.

[jennie-jennie]

I decided to start an entire new thread because I didn't want to do the whole thread-jacking thing.

 

Please forgive my use of titles such as OW, WS, etc...I don't like to use them, but they make life easier for writing here on LS.

 

When I read some of the thought patterns of some of the OWs here, I felt disenheartened. I can't understand why some of the women here blindly believe their MMs. Did I believe my MM when he used to tell me about how it "really was" at home? Yes. And no. The love I felt in my heart for him as well as my hope that he was indeed being honest with me because he loved me compelled me to believe him. My mind, on the other hand, (as well as my cousin who is a marriage and family therapist) was screaming, "No! Don't believe anything he says! He loved his wife, married her, and is now lying to her; what makes YOU any different?" I always, always had an element of doubt about his "truth". And even now that I know that most of the things that I was told while the affair was going on were true, I STILL, to this day, will be in the dark about what REALLY went on in that house between the two of them; the only people who really and truly know is my BF and his ex. The blind faith that I see some OWs giving here is not only unrealistic, it's unhealthy.

 

Also, in regards to telling children the initmate details of their parents' relationship in the event of a D-Day or a "confession" day, it really depends on the age and maturity of the child; I personally don't think it's a good idea if the kids aren't at least pre-teen age. But I believe that it is of the utmost importance for BOTH parents to have that sit down talk with the children together, after they have both discussed it with each other. Maybe the BS can sit at the table while the WS answers the questions the children will surely ask as to why the parents are having difficulty. I don't think it's right that the BS should make unilateral decisions about ANYTHING that involves their kids. The parents may not have their *ish right with each other, but they need to stand together and get their *ish right when it comes to those children.

 

Lastly, to go back to my first point: no matter how much "truth" I was told about the details of the marriage/relationship, it never, ever gave me peace, comfort, or happiness to know that he stlll went home to her everyday, had dinner as a family everyday, slept in the same bed as her everyday. Even if I had a tape recorder and video tape in their bedroom for every night of our affair that provided evidence that nothing ever went on between him and his ex, he wasn't with ME. And that hurt like hell. I received as much attention as he could give me and he also stepped up to do whatever I asked/needed the few times that I complained, but it never consoled me at night. Or on holidays. Thank God there were no vacations to worry about. It was certainly a full time love, but most certainly a part time relationship in the physical sense, and I can't wrap my head around how that can be "okay" with an OW - how does that not slowly make you die a little everyday inside? As you develop more feelings and grow closer with time, it's just natural that you will want to spend more time with him...when that happens and you do nothing about it but accept the status quo, that is when the tides turn, and he knows he has the power. Don't give your power away. Stand up for what you really want, whatever that is, and accept nothing less- if it's that you're tired, move on, if you want HIM full time, then tell him that; if he doesn't make a move to give you what you want, then he doesn't really want YOU.

 

Be strong, have courage, and pray, if you believe in a higher being.

 

CL

 

Interesting post. I agree with a lot of it.

 

I do wonder though about the bolded. So apparently you did find out that your committed man was truthful to you during your relationship, and still you are advising other OW to be suspicious of what their MM are saying. To me it is much worse to doubt someone you love who is truthful to you, than to be fooled by someone you love who is not truthful to you.

[theodora]

Seems to me like what we believe as humans is much of the time what we want to believe.

 

It's interesting that there's been a kind of moral backlash to this post. I wonder if it's actually quite a touchy subject, this idea of belief shaping our situation and determining our actions.

 

Because, it seems to me like there are three people involved in an A whose beliefs shape a certain situation.

 

Eg, this may be a controversial thing to say, but for example, my xMM was a serial cheater. Or at least - so he told me - course it may or may not be true.

 

He also always told me he would NEVER leave his W...and he never did. He was being honest about that thing at least lol. So I also believed that he had cheated on her before. He said there were times when he had told her, she had said if he ever did she wanted to kno. But when he told her, it upset her. She felt sad. But she stayed with him. So when he did it again, he decided not to tell her. He knew he would never leaver her. But this was the arrangment of their marriage.

 

Now some people might find that morally reprehansible. But, to an extent, I believed, and she believed, and he believed that the situation we wanted to believe was happening. I allowed myself to believe he loved me, until it was so obvious he didn't that I had to reassemble that belief.

 

She believed he was being faithful to her, because the real truth - that he will NEVER be faithful to her - was too painful. I can completely understand how a woman in that situation faces an impossible choice, to face the truth and end the relationship, or stay in the relationship choosing to believe in the fidelity of a man who will never be faithful.

 

Maybe all this seems irrelevant, but I guess my point is, we all believe what we want to believe when it most suits us to believe it.

 

I reckon the backlash here might be because there are some W's out there...and I'm just saying some, not all...who maybe don't acknowledge what is really going on in their M and would rather believe they are the victim of some kind of sinful woman and her evil ways.

 

I reckon the awful truth is, if a Husband/wife wants to cheat, they will find someone to cheat with. No matter how much when we OW want to believe that it's because we are special, that love struck and couldn't be helped. When we are looking for something, we find it. And when we don't find it, it's because we aren't really looking.

 

Every situation is the sum of all of its parts.

[jennie-jennie]

I have slowly been losing faith since the day I questioned God's existence as a 25-year old struggling with my SO's alcoholism. My exSO's obsessive religiosity continued to wear on my faith. The last nail in the coffin of my faith was seeing how religion was part of what was keeping my MM stuck in limbo. To me religion is nowadays just part of society's attempts to keep people where it wants them.