Author EYECANDY000 Posted July 15, 2010 Author Posted July 15, 2010 I say this with your best interest in mind and not to be mean or hurtful. I think you need to dump this guy and go to counseling without him. You are clinging onto to poison, yet you want the poison to turn into medicine. This guy is toxic for you. Im aware that he is toxic. I am probaly to the point that I am obsessed over him. I know that I need to get rid of him, but its hard to let go. I dont think I need counceling, im just in love with someone who has emotional issues.
sagetalk Posted July 16, 2010 Posted July 16, 2010 He is one of the good guys. He's honest, respectful, loving. And I know he loves me. It is enough to make me stay but no matter how many times we break up, it is still hard on me. When we aren't together. I miss him like crazy, but also its like a weight is lifted off my shoulders. I don't have to worry about him dumping me again. I don't have to worry about getting hurt again. I don't think you know what love is or even what a good guy is for that matter. Did you know that love has nothing to do with sex? Did you know love has nothing to do with dating? If you think it does, then you know nothing about it. Love is the unselfish act of putting someone else's wants and desires above your own even at your own peril and discomfort. Love is a sacrifice of your own will for someone else. I do believe that you love him, that is obvious. His love for you is hard to see if it even exists at all. Love is not selfish and it sounds like this guy has plenty of that to go around. As I said in a previous post and as sugarmomma said, there is a good chance that he is doing untrustworthy things. He clearly trusts you from what you've said, I think the real problem is that he knows you should not trust him.
sagetalk Posted July 16, 2010 Posted July 16, 2010 Im aware that he is toxic. I am probaly to the point that I am obsessed over him. I know that I need to get rid of him, but its hard to let go. I dont think I need counceling, im just in love with someone who has emotional issues. Too many beautiful women's lives are wasted on men such as this. Toxic men who only care about themselves. There are millions of men who love and respect the opposite sex, but these toxic men seem to be the best catch in the eyes of many women. How many times must I say that a woman cannot change who a man is. They may mask it, but they never truly change him. Men who will love you as you love them are who you should desire and give your heart to. You will only find misery in the arms of a man who needs you to change him. You will find happiness and love in the arms of a man who simply needs you to return the love he has for you.
deux ex machina Posted July 16, 2010 Posted July 16, 2010 (edited) Thanks Ruby, I do think he needs to see a therapist, but he doesnt see how a therapist would benefit him. Plus he doesnt want to pay for it. you think its impossible to heal someone like this. I do feel like people change As a person who was an orphan-by-abandonment ("funny, you don't look it"), I can tell you that people can overcome trust issues. And being abandoned, all of it. But only if they (not you), are highly motivated, resourceful, and can let go of pride/defenses, ect. Even if he gets help, he'll have to do the work and take the risks himself. There are a lot of people in therapy or whatever that don't truly change, so even that is pointless in all too many cases. You won't be able to convince him of anything that he doesn't already believe...you can't do that for anyone, at all. Especially not him, he's too invested. So you'll give. Until it hurts, and past the point of hurting. You'll cajole. You'll get upset. You'll imply. You'll break up. Then get back together. You'll resent. And finally, you be too drained to care. Much. Or, too much will be in the way for anything to be the same again. And in the end, it is very possible that you could become so burned from this that the next person you're with will want to pull his hair out in frustration with you. The push-pull...all of that behavior is "sticky". Relationships like this are the gift that keeps on giving that way. Sorry to say this, and I am so not trying to be brusque, but honestly? Every reason he has told you as to why he will not attempt to sort this out rings hollow to me. In my view, his issues are his "Wooden Leg". There's nothing you can do to help it. You can't save him, but you can save you. Hold on to who you truly are. Edited July 16, 2010 by deux ex machina
gamma1 Posted July 16, 2010 Posted July 16, 2010 He is one of the good guys. He's honest, respectful, loving. And I know he loves me. It is enough to make me stay but no matter how many times we break up, it is still hard on me. I've read your posts and his actions seem far less than good. Breaking up continually is not something a good guy does. This issue you are having now reeks of dishonesty. Is breaking up with you every month respectful? It doesn't sound like love. He seems toxic to me. I have to think that if you break it off with him and find someone without all these issues, eventually you will forget about him. If you seemed happy about your situation now, then there wouldn't be such a problem. You certainly don't sound happy. Don't you deserve better? I'd put yourself first for a change.
Author EYECANDY000 Posted July 16, 2010 Author Posted July 16, 2010 I've read your posts and his actions seem far less than good. Breaking up continually is not something a good guy does. This issue you are having now reeks of dishonesty. Is breaking up with you every month respectful? It doesn't sound like love. He seems toxic to me. I have to think that if you break it off with him and find someone without all these issues, eventually you will forget about him. If you seemed happy about your situation now, then there wouldn't be such a problem. You certainly don't sound happy. Don't you deserve better? I'd put yourself first for a change. Breaking up with me every month isnt repectful. I know in the beginning he went back to his ex. and then once we started getting serious and he broke up with me he stated that he just needed some space. I know that I need to find someone new, but Im still in love with him. and I definately dont want to meet someone new, and then Im left to choose if I want my ex or the new guy. I know its a lot of assuptions!
sagetalk Posted July 16, 2010 Posted July 16, 2010 (edited) I know that I need to find someone new, but Im still in love with him. and I definately dont want to meet someone new, and then Im left to choose if I want my ex or the new guy. I know its a lot of assuptions! Love is an extremely valuable emotion, and there is little more tragic than love that is wasted on someone who will not return it. I don't know anything about your ex, but there is a vast ocean of single guys. Why rob them of the chance of treating you the way you should be treated and give passion and commitment to a man who does not deserve it? You have the power to tell society, young men and old men, what an attractive man is to you (and to a certain extent, womankind) is. Right now, you are telling us that men who do not return your love are worthy of your heart and life. This is something I and many men have been told and shown our whole lives and it slowly becomes a discouragement and a barrier to believing that women actually want to be treated well. Edited July 16, 2010 by sagetalk
SarahRose Posted July 16, 2010 Posted July 16, 2010 Breaking up with me every month isnt repectful. I know in the beginning he went back to his ex. and then once we started getting serious and he broke up with me he stated that he just needed some space. I know that I need to find someone new, but Im still in love with him. and I definately dont want to meet someone new, and then Im left to choose if I want my ex or the new guy. I know its a lot of assuptions! People like that are bottomless pits. It will really do damage to yourself to continue on with him. It may feel like love but his monthly rejection triggers your abandonment issues and makes you want to cling to him obsessively. It isn't really love but fear of abandonment.
Author EYECANDY000 Posted July 16, 2010 Author Posted July 16, 2010 People like that are bottomless pits. It will really do damage to yourself to continue on with him. It may feel like love but his monthly rejection triggers your abandonment issues and makes you want to cling to him obsessively. It isn't really love but fear of abandonment. i think you may be right. Because now that I think of it, his ex gf was so clingy. even after the breakup. Its been a whole year and she still texts him to this day. Throughout of relationship she would stop texting maybe a few days and then be right back at it. I know that right now it is doing damage to my self esteem. Its like he wants to feel loved so bad that he constantly makes up scenerios to see what I would do, but it makes me feel like Im not good enough. So far this is day 3 and I havent hear anything from him. He is usually the one who always gives in and call.
SarahRose Posted July 16, 2010 Posted July 16, 2010 i think you may be right. Because now that I think of it, his ex gf was so clingy. even after the breakup. Its been a whole year and she still texts him to this day. Throughout of relationship she would stop texting maybe a few days and then be right back at it. I know that right now it is doing damage to my self esteem. Its like he wants to feel loved so bad that he constantly makes up scenerios to see what I would do, but it makes me feel like Im not good enough. So far this is day 3 and I havent hear anything from him. He is usually the one who always gives in and call. See he is recreating being abandoned over and over in each relationship and hurting each girl along the way. It is hard but I think you know what to do. This wont ever get any better. Eventually you will be so hurt and broken by him, the relationship will end anyway. Good luck
gamma1 Posted July 16, 2010 Posted July 16, 2010 Breaking up with me every month isnt repectful. I know in the beginning he went back to his ex. and then once we started getting serious and he broke up with me he stated that he just needed some space. I know that I need to find someone new, but Im still in love with him. and I definately dont want to meet someone new, and then Im left to choose if I want my ex or the new guy. I know its a lot of assuptions! Breaking up with someone every month is far beyond just disrespectful. It's downright pathetic. I still wonder if there's something else about him. Does he have great looks or a lot of money? There's got to be something. How much longer are you going to put yourself through this? How much longer are you going to say no to meeting someone new? By staying with him, you are esentially telling every good man out there who may be interested in you that they are not wanted. He's treating you poorly, which is his fault. However, it's your responsibility to take yourself out of the situation. A short break from dating where you do things for yourself for a change might be a good idea. What you describe doesn't sound anything like love.
Lady vs Panda Posted July 16, 2010 Posted July 16, 2010 Im aware that he is toxic. I am probaly to the point that I am obsessed over him. I know that I need to get rid of him, but its hard to let go. I dont think I need counceling, im just in love with someone who has emotional issues. You describe yourself as obsessed with a toxic man. You are in love with someone who dumps you over and over again, and you keep coming back for more. Not to sound mean, but...You are the very definition of someone who needs counseling. His are not the only emotional issues at play here.
Untouchable_Fire Posted July 16, 2010 Posted July 16, 2010 i think you may be right. Because now that I think of it, his ex gf was so clingy. even after the breakup. Its been a whole year and she still texts him to this day. Throughout of relationship she would stop texting maybe a few days and then be right back at it. I know that right now it is doing damage to my self esteem. Its like he wants to feel loved so bad that he constantly makes up scenerios to see what I would do, but it makes me feel like Im not good enough. So far this is day 3 and I havent hear anything from him. He is usually the one who always gives in and call. This guy sounds like a crap boyfriend. Don't waste anymore time on him... he has you on this emotional roller coaster. In my experience the only women you automatically distrust are Canadian women. They cheat like crazy.
mortensorchid Posted July 16, 2010 Posted July 16, 2010 That's a shame that he feels that he can't trust women. It has nothing to do with you, you just happened to have been born a woman, so don't take it too hard. Yet, it would be in your best interest to end things before you get too emotionally invested. If he says this about himself, take it as the truth and know that you (nor anyone else) can change the situation. He can / could if he wanted to, but he obviously doesn't and will use this as an excuse as to why he does or doesn't do things. Chances are he goes for bad women as well who use and abuse him (not that I am accusing you of it), but he will expect to be treated badly from you as well even though you have no intention. Hope you can move on and not be too broken up about this.
marsle85 Posted July 16, 2010 Posted July 16, 2010 At the moment my bf and I are not speaking because we had an argument. But a few days ago we were texting each other and he stated that he could never trust me or any women. He went on to say " how can he believe that I wont leave him, when his mom left him. He has always has issues with women. He stated that he trust me, but not really. Im not sure what I can do or say to get him to know that I wont leave him. Has anyone ever experienced this before. Knowing that you are with someone who would never fully trust you? Sorry, but contrary to the past- a woman does not exist to solve men's problems nor fix their troublesome past. I've always thought that: I'm normal, loved, healthy... and there has a been a considerable effort on MY part be be this way- shouldn't I expect the same? Period. Don't allow anything less.
Author EYECANDY000 Posted July 16, 2010 Author Posted July 16, 2010 Chances are he goes for bad women as well who use and abuse him (not that I am accusing you of it), but he will expect to be treated badly from you as well even though you have no intention. QUOTE] Thank You Mortensorchid, He does accuse me of constantly doing wrong, and its like I am pactically proving myself to him that I wont hurt him. We've been together a whole year and I have asked him "have I hurt you yet? or done anything to hurt you?" and hes always like " not yet! I just dont want to let him go unfortunaltely. But I dont know how to help him.
Downtown Posted July 17, 2010 Posted July 17, 2010 Eyecandy, it sounds like your BF suffers from strong traits of BPD (borderline personality disorder). The push-you-away and pull-you-back cycle that occurs every month in your relationship is a hallmark of BPD. It occurs because he has two great fears: engulfment and abandonment. BPDers typically experienced a trauma in early childhood that destroyed their ability to trust and nearly destroyed their self image, leaving them with fragile egos. Hence, when you have an intimate encounter (not sex but true intimacy), your BF will feel suffocated by your strong personality. It will be very scary for him because he will feel like your personality is engulfing him. This is why that evening or the next day he will create an argument over nothing to push you away. Or he may temporarily dump you. Yet, as you back off to give him space, you will trigger his other great fear, abandonment. So, after his tantrum dies down (they typically last about five hours), he may wait a few days (or weeks) and will start reeling you back in by acting extra sweet and loving. Of course, as you draw close, the cycle starts all over again. For 15 years with my exW, I kept hunting for the Goldilocks position between "too close" and "too far" so as to avoid triggering both of those fears in my exW. I can tell you that, if that safe midpoint position exists at all, it is a knife edge that is continually shifting. As to the trust issues you complain about, your BF is being disingenuous to claim he cannot trust women. If he has strong BPD traits as I suspect, he is incapable of trusting anyone. The reason you are attracted to this man has little to do with him. Rather, it is all about you and your needs. Like me, you are a caregiver who is attracted to the wounded birds of life. You want badly to help this man but, in actuality, you are harming him by being an enabler when you are with him -- enabling him to avoid confronting his illness and learning how to control it. You enable him by soothing him, preventing him from realizing that he has to learn to calm himself down. I say this not to rob you of your sense of accomplishment but, rather, to rob you of your overpowering sense of obligation and guilt. As long as you persist in mistakenly believing that you can help him heal, you will be unable to leave him. Like me, you are a natural born caregiver. Hence, the notion of walking out on a sick loved one goes against your religion, your family's values -- indeed, against every fiber of your being. As I was, you likely were raised in a way that made you grow up too quickly. In my case, my dad was a bit alcoholic, causing my mother to rely on me -- at too young an age -- to meet many of her needs not met by my dad. Perhaps you did not take that path. But, like me, you ended up being a caregiver just the same. Our problem is not that we want to help people. That is a good thing. Our problem is that we are willing to keep doing it even when it is to our great detriment. This occurs because, when we were being raised, we were inadvertently taught that being needed is the same thing as being loved. The result is that our desire to be needed (for what we can do) far exceeds our desire to be loved (for the people we already are). As I said, we are drawn to wounded birds and we ignore the people running in the opposite direction. We also ignore the fact that BPD is the type of wound we cannot possibly fix. Attempting to heal a BPD sufferer with your love is a fool's errand. It is like trying to heal a burn patient by hugging him. Hence, even if you aren't sucked back into a relationship with your BF, there is great risk you will run into the arms of another man just like him. It therefore is important that you understand how you contributed to the toxic relationship by being an enabler. Significantly, emotionally healthy people who have strong personal boundaries do not remain in toxic relationships very long -- perhaps a year (or 18 months tops). Therapists therefore describe folks like us as being "codependent," a terribly misleading term. It is a bad name because most codependents that I've met are fiercely independent in nearly every respect. A typical codependent will be working full time, taking care of two kids and five dogs, and still find time on weekends to go out searching for a spouse to also take care of. For a much better explanation of why we grew up to be caregivers (i.e., the best detailed technical explanation I've seen), go to Shari Shreiber's website at GettinBetter.com/needlove.html. Schreiber articulates very well why "caregivers" are attracted to the intensity of a BPD relationship and explains how that dysfunctional type of intensity is perceived as "love" by people like us because it reflects what we experienced at a young age with our mothers, who needed us too much. The result is that we have difficulty feeling that we are loved if the person does not desperately need us. Hence, when dating, we will walk right past the people who actually love us and choose, instead, an emotionally unstable person who produces sufficient passion and drama to convince us that we are really needed. As many other posters have said above, you can do much better than that -- indeed, you deserve much better than that. If you would like to read more about how BPD traits affect a person's behavior, you may want to read some of my other posts where I discuss it at length and provide links to information about it. One such post is at http://www.loveshack.org/forums/showthread.php?p=2826724#post2826724 . If you have further questions about this disorder or codependence, I would be glad to try to answer them. I am not a psychologist. Rather, I am just a codependent man who tried in vain to care for a BPD sufferer (my exW) for 15 years.
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