breaking_bad Posted July 10, 2010 Posted July 10, 2010 I'm a long time reader, but never posted. I'm not sure why I'm even writing here, except that as you all so well know, I'm in a very isolated place to be emotionally and going through the pain of this without being able to talk to anyone is just almost unbearable. So I've read all your stories and advice and think that all of you are amazing and insightful and caring and really try to help each other through what I think is one of the more devastating things that a person can take themselves through. In the moment, it is really so wonderful to feel love and be loved, and it seems like it should be OK, like it should be right, like almost normal and natural to love someone, no matter what the situation is. But the "particulars" make it sincerely one of the more heartbreaking experiences I think can be possible for a human being to endure. Getting embarassed, and shamed, and humiliated and tormented as part of the process of loving someone? I mean, it's really very twisted no matter how it turns out.... (and I'm not saying that it isn't godawful for others involved, or that this is some sort of poor me thing, it just sucks on this end, regardless of the moral compass or how you think it should spin). So about me, I've been officially an OW for a little over a year, but part of an EA for at least 2 yrs. And as with most others I've read about, these things just happen before you have a chance to think about them logically, and before you know it, you're into the quicksand. Anyway, it's been a year of highs and lows - with either me or him coming back, leaving, then coming back to each other time after time. Because you know, we were in love, we were soul mates, we loved each other more than we ever loved anyone in our lives, couldn't live without each other, whatever. When things were high we were perfect. On the low side, he would have periods where he would detach himself from me with no explaination (well, his explaination usually was always I'm so busy and work is such hell, give me a break and back off), leaving me feeling sad and angry and destroyed and devastated. And of course looking back on it, he made such a microscopic effort to give me anything. And I waffled around too alot, looking for ways to get out of this situation that I just knew was toxic, but always just loving him to death and not being strong enough to face facts. In the back of my brain, I knew I was being manipulated, but I also really and truly felt that he loved me and that we would somehow figure out a way to be together someday. Well so finally, after a period of him being extremely attentive while I was trying to take a vacation w/ my son, followed by the cold shoulder and the "I'm not ignoring you but I'm just so busy" texts, things finally came to a close yesterday. And I finally, FINALLY got him to say it. There were no intentions, short or long term, for turning this into an actual relationship. And then I of course got the "if I could just turn time back, if I met you 10 years ago, things are so complex, this situation is so horrible for me...." and since I am a loveshack.org reader, well, I actually smiled through my tears when he said those things. And for how much I knew things all along would end here, in the back of my head, it was just a gift to finally get him to say it. Now granted, he didn't say all the stuff I would have liked him to say - including an explaination of exactly what was keeping him there and not with me, how he could say he loved me but not make any sacrifices, why he continued to try to manipulate me even when he knew he would never come through, how he could tell me he loved me and then hurt me in this way.... As much as I would like to hear the answers to those questions, they really don't change anything, so there is no difference in the end. And you just need psychology 101 to really know the basic answers to "why they do it." He loved being adored by me. He loved how that made him feel. He didn't want to let that go, but at the same time, didn't care enough about me to damage/disrupt his world. And he is more selfish than most people (we all are a little), he wanted what he wanted, he didn't think about what he was doing to me in the process, and has grown accustomed in life to getting what he wants. And he is good at being able to manipulate his way to get it. So, I finally got the GIFT of the TRUTH. Which makes me very relieved. But I am devastated and all puffy from crying my eyes out at the final end and my heart is split open over it. I had constructed a pretty nice fantasy for myself over the last year and I have to now go through the process of taking that down. Though I did congratulate myself yesterday in having created my very own DHARMA initiative. And it is so hard to go through this without having any support, or even being able to talk about it with anyone. So I want to thank you all for creating this place where people like me can come and be open and get this out. I'm sure most of you will understand and support me, even though you have no idea who I am, and that is a beautiful thing that you are doing for others that are hurting. Even if you can't solve anyone's situation, you help beyond measure. And before I go, I was thinking alot about this manipulation thing, and why I was letting it happen to me, in other words, was I just the world's biggest idiot, or am I getting something out of being manipulated that I needed to look at? And did find an interesting article that helped me a little, that might help others. this is what it said: [sIZE=3]"In relationships, manipulation can be defined as: any attempt to control, through coercion (overt or covert), another person's thoughts, feelings or behaviors. [/sIZE] [sIZE=3][/sIZE] [sIZE=3]From this definition, manipulation would seem to have no advantages. However, if you are codependent and defined by others, there can be many advantages. When you allow others to control your thoughts, feelings, behaviors, and make decisions for you,[/sIZE] [sIZE=3][/sIZE] [sIZE=3]-- you do not have to think for yourself;[/sIZE] [sIZE=3]-- you can avoid taking risks and making difficult decision;[/sIZE] [sIZE=3]-- you can avoid taking a stand on controversial issues;[/sIZE] [sIZE=3]-- you can avoid feeling responsible for negative outcomes;[/sIZE] [sIZE=3]-- you get to blame others when things go wrong;[/sIZE] [sIZE=3]-- you can believe, when others tell you how to behave, what to think, how to feel and what to decide, that you are "being loved" because they "want what is best for you";[/sIZE] [sIZE=3]-- you can avoid feeling separate and alone by avoiding conflict;[/sIZE] [sIZE=3]-- you can avoid the hard work of emotional growth and development.[/sIZE] [sIZE=3][/sIZE] [sIZE=3]Appreciating the advantages of not being manipulated is to accept the hard work of living and interacting with others. It is about being willing to grow and develop emotionally. These advantages can be that, [/sIZE] [sIZE=3][/sIZE] [sIZE=3]-- you learn to know who you are, what you like, what you think, and how you feel;[/sIZE] [sIZE=3]-- you learn to make difficult decisions;[/sIZE] [sIZE=3]-- you get to take credit for your decisions;[/sIZE] [sIZE=3]-- you learn to handle risks and uncertainty;[/sIZE] [sIZE=3]-- you learn to handle differences and conflicts;[/sIZE] [sIZE=3]-- you get to be in control of your life and know the freedom of personal self-reliance;[/sIZE] [sIZE=3]-- you get to have an increased sense of self worth by feeling competent and capable of taking responsibility for your life and personal happiness."[/sIZE] And with that, thanks for listening to my story. You helped me already And I just love this bunny
jthorne Posted July 10, 2010 Posted July 10, 2010 He loved being adored by me. He loved how that made him feel. He didn't want to let that go, but at the same time, didn't care enough about me to damage/disrupt his world. And he is more selfish than most people (we all are a little), he wanted what he wanted, he didn't think about what he was doing to me in the process, and has grown accustomed in life to getting what he wants. And he is good at being able to manipulate his way to get it. Glad that you can finally see this, as it's the mantra of 99.9% of MM- they want it all, and seldom think about who they are hurting to get it. I'm sorry you are hurting, but I hope you have learned in the process.
califnan Posted July 10, 2010 Posted July 10, 2010 Hi BB, Yes I agree with your word of 'fantasy'. These affairs are fantasies .. For a season A's take you away from your mundane organized everyday life.. As willing participants .. I wouldn't worry too much about the word manipulate.. Although the affairs are unplanned, they normally do begin as EA.. before graduating to the next step - and there is warning.. I don't know if you are married.. But one of the reasons that there are so many highs and lows with the MM .. is because he is going through a spiritual battle.. It is a battle as to whether to do the right thing and be true to his marriage - or to give in to what feels good with the OW .. I see a relief in you that the uncertainty is over .. while of course, berievement that the fantasy is over .. As you decide to stay NC, I think you will realize that the A was a destruction, belittling .. and at least took unnecessary time from your life.. because God has better things for You .. Take care, and keep reading other LS stories/testimonies.. ..
Ella whispers Posted July 10, 2010 Posted July 10, 2010 I'm glad you found an outlet for your feelings. I felt better when I wrote about mine also. I think manipulation plays a huge part in it. My XMM spun a story to me that had me pity him and view him as a victim whenin reality he is nothing close to that. He didn't have a need for me, just what I was willing to do for him. He is the most manipulative person I have ever met, he could talk the hair off a cat in a minute. Now that I have been NC for months I'm feeling much better. You will too, it just takes time.
Fieldsofgold Posted July 10, 2010 Posted July 10, 2010 I'm sorry you "qualified" to be here, but I am glad you had been reading and were *somewhat* prepared for what happened. The magazine exerpt is interesting. Thanks for sharing that. What is a DHARMA initiative? (I know who Dharma is, but haven't seen the show in so long.) ((((((((((hugs)))))))))
Author breaking_bad Posted July 10, 2010 Author Posted July 10, 2010 Califnan, you are really right on. It's very hard to come to terms with the fantasy part. It takes alot of time because it is almost a defense mechanism, it helps to protects us, which we probably very naturally want to do. The problem is that at some point, you've got to get on with it or get trapped under it. It is extremely difficult to shine the light back on the "relationship" as you work through the process, to see how very little of these things are actually real/tangible. For me, sadly it ended up that looking back on it, it was not alot. And then that makes me angry, and left feeling lonely, and stupid, and all of that. It's hard to go through the exercise, but I think it's very important for us to do, when we are ready. It's interesting that you mention the process the MM is going through also, to see where these highs and lows are driving from. It makes sense. But I do think that there is always the truth in there somewhere that he knows, but it's kept from us in order to perpetuate the positive things the MM is getting out of the A. It's a fantasy for him too I guess.... Maybe we're all crazy And an A is definitely a distraction, something amazing at the time, and I guess we build it how we want it. As I've gone through it, I've learned alot of really wise things from this forum and from all of you. So again just thank you for all of your advice and for showing such kindness to others. PS: The DHARMA initiative is from Lost - the experiement that they were doing on the Island, where they had everyone believing in so many weird things that no one even knew what was real anymore. Not that I ever fully understood Lost!
califnan Posted July 10, 2010 Posted July 10, 2010 Probably most people go through wrong relationships. I think all that matters is getting to the other side.. As you keep with NC, you will see the relationship for what it was .. while gathering strength .. as you are the whole, complete woman that God has created.. This woman cannot fit into the alloted fraction of a MM's life..
Diamante Posted July 10, 2010 Posted July 10, 2010 Welcome BB, I'm glad you have found some resources to help you through this. Congrats on getting xMM to admit that he was not planning a real relationship with you. I came to this same place myself when I said to my MOM "From where we stand right in our lives now, we do not have a legitimate future together". He paused for a moment before admitting I was correct. This was my way of knowing that I couldn't dream about a life with him. This actually helped me a lot. He later told me that if he were truly selfish, we would leave and be with me, but b/c he has a strong sense of responsibility and is the sole provider, he owes it to his family to try and work it out. I found the paradox of his statement interesting... One thing that I guess is different in my situation is that xMOM never tried to "lead me down the garden path" as he made absolutely no promises. He also never spoke badly of his W and he asked me few questions about my F. I can see how MM manipulate the OW, but I guess the dynamic in our case was different b/c we were both taken. Deep down, I think we both knew we were not going to leave our partners. I know the pain of being deceived is something that really stings. The first week will be the hardest but once you are over that, your world will start looking brighter. Take some 5HTP supplements from your health food store to help naturally manage your moods (this is what I do anyway, it works for me), exercise, and get some sunshine, maybe take a trip and have a vacation fling . You have made the hardest decision, now you just need to heal and become whole again. It just takes time and self-focus. Lots of positive energy and strength to you in this difficult time that will eventually be just a blip on your life's radar. Dia
Bitlost2 Posted July 11, 2010 Posted July 11, 2010 Hi BB Thanks for replying to my post. I was interested in finding out more so read your post too. In a very sad way it is lovely to 'meet' someone who has been thinking the same things as me for so long, understands and is hurting too. Wish I could take away the pain as I truly know how horrible it feels! Think my true problem is that I still really believe he's perfect for me and really wants to be with me and that's why I can't let go. We went out together briefly as teenagers and then were great friends until he married. When we met again properly after 7 years it was just amazing, meant to be etc! In my mind he only shuts me down in his head because he can't deal with the reality, but that's what keeps him coming back, it's never me. But he "couldn't do it to his children, you have to put up with your lot, he's had to lower his expectations of life" etc! But the way he treats his W nowadays is unbelievable. Between work and social life he's hardly at home, often out all night or getting drunk. This wasn't the man I met so something's going on! Basically this all feeds my very own fantasy that he's really an unhappy man and allows me to hold on to hope that he loves me and wants me after all!! After reading more posts here, it sounds like us ladies have common stories and I'm obviously a silly fool, lost in a fantasyland of my perfect man. Blah! Anyway just wanted to say hi, thanks for listening and thanks for sharing. I really, really hope that you'll be feeling much better soon xx
Hazyhead Posted July 11, 2010 Posted July 11, 2010 (((((((BB))))))) I'm sorry that you are going through this pain. It's cr@p and there is no easy way of getting though it, but posting here will definitely help. It helped me immensely. He's been straight with you and despite how harsh his truth seems, it's good. It's good that he's given you this as he could have just maintained it, let you believe that there was a chance for the two of you. After all, this way he had what he wanted. I'm not condoning him too much here, just wanted to say this is a gift in disguise. Get out and get out now. The fantasy will fade and lose it's importance as you heal and you'll find a new, better future without him. I suspect though he might try to pull you back in. Stay strong and remember all those low points that you do not need to experience.
fooled once Posted July 11, 2010 Posted July 11, 2010 Hi BB Thanks for replying to my post. I was interested in finding out more so read your post too. In a very sad way it is lovely to 'meet' someone who has been thinking the same things as me for so long, understands and is hurting too. Wish I could take away the pain as I truly know how horrible it feels! Think my true problem is that I still really believe he's perfect for me and really wants to be with me and that's why I can't let go. We went out together briefly as teenagers and then were great friends until he married. When we met again properly after 7 years it was just amazing, meant to be etc! In my mind he only shuts me down in his head because he can't deal with the reality, but that's what keeps him coming back, it's never me. But he "couldn't do it to his children, you have to put up with your lot, he's had to lower his expectations of life" etc! But the way he treats his W nowadays is unbelievable. Between work and social life he's hardly at home, often out all night or getting drunk. This wasn't the man I met so something's going on! Basically this all feeds my very own fantasy that he's really an unhappy man and allows me to hold on to hope that he loves me and wants me after all!! After reading more posts here, it sounds like us ladies have common stories and I'm obviously a silly fool, lost in a fantasyland of my perfect man. Blah! Anyway just wanted to say hi, thanks for listening and thanks for sharing. I really, really hope that you'll be feeling much better soon xx How do you know how he treats his wife? Because of what he tells you??? Don't believe everything you are told So is he divorcing? Since it is you he tells you he truly wants. Has he filed for divorce and moved out? Oh wait...he can't can he, because of the kids (his excuse). Sounds like a game he is playing -- who can win the great prize of the cheater! How about instead of playing this game with him, you back out and say "If you want a life with me, divorce and come find me". Don't let him disrespect you by keeping you a secret, not telling the world he loves you. If he wants you, he will move mountains to be with you AND share a life with you -- instead of sneaking a round and sending you a text instead of being by your side. WHY so many women accept these crumbs, I just don't get. As if a "I love you" text makes things all right? He goes home to his wife, night after night, sleeping next to her, making love to her, enjoying her -- but he sends the OW a text and she forgets that he is CHOOSING to be with this wife and not the woman he proclaims to love.
Bitlost2 Posted July 11, 2010 Posted July 11, 2010 Totally agree with you! Everything you say!! Just can't believe how long I've craved these crumbs, put up with these crumbs, accepted these crumbs in the hope that they build into something real or at least to how good it used to be! I'm embarrassed by myself and my inability to move on.
Hazyhead Posted July 11, 2010 Posted July 11, 2010 Totally agree with you! Everything you say!! Just can't believe how long I've craved these crumbs, put up with these crumbs, accepted these crumbs in the hope that they build into something real or at least to how good it used to be! I'm embarrassed by myself and my inability to move on. Don't be embarrassed! Hon, you are not alone in this behaviour/experience. Instead of embarrassment use it to grow from. You'll never let yourself be treated like this again.
Bitlost2 Posted July 12, 2010 Posted July 12, 2010 Thanks to everyone for kind words/words of encouragement. It helps so so much. I've hit the lowest point since January this weekend, as if I'm not on the meds again. Crying, lost, lonely, scared and terrified of the future. Not only am I trying to get over my crumbly life left by Crumb Man (OMM!!) while he's sort of still there, I'm in a mess over my separation from a lovely man who has never, ever hurt me and is the father to my child. So undecided and confused. He's wonderful but there's obviously so much missing which is why I fell so hard and fast for OM because he provided something my H never has - the special bond created by a sexual, passionate relationship that makes you different from just mates. I could try and bury it like I have for the last 15 years (although I'm not sure I can anymore) however I'm sure it'll explode again in the future. My H describes it as a ticking bomb that was going to go off at some point. I'm really worried that between my dodgy relationships with these two men I'm going to panic myself into a really, really bad place. I don't want to leave this forum and your words. I feel stronger here, foolish but a bit stronger! x
wheelwright Posted July 12, 2010 Posted July 12, 2010 I'm really worried that between my dodgy relationships with these two men I'm going to panic myself into a really, really bad place. I read your story, and feel bad for you. I have been through similar. I have also felt as you describe above - it's a very frightening feeling. I think for me this feeling was about being thrown completely off balance by all aspects of the A. Deceit, fear about feeling the M was wrong, undreamt of passion and intimacy, being messed around by MOM, heartbreak, no longer knowing what the right thing to do might be. Trusting my feelings and then being betrayed. And I recognised that I needed to find some balance before I made any big decisions about my life. And this is a slow process for me, though I am getting there. Hope you are doing OK.
Bitlost2 Posted July 12, 2010 Posted July 12, 2010 "I have also felt as you describe above - it's a very frightening feeling. I think for me this feeling was about being thrown completely off balance by all aspects of the A. Deceit, fear about feeling the M was wrong, undreamt of passion and intimacy, being messed around by MOM, heartbreak, no longer knowing what the right thing to do might be. Trusting my feelings and then being betrayed." Thank you - you are so right! I'm completely off balance. Everything I've ever believed, dreamt and hoped for has been totally mixed up. Not knowing what's right and wrong, who to trust, what you can trust or believe etc. What a mashed up mess! The only one I do really trust is my H and he said to me this morning that staying together is no longer an option (at this current time) as I don't have the right feelings for him and that I need to stop getting so panicky and depressed and make plans for my new life! Ok, will do!!! (After all this I so wish I were a man!! One man in my life can turn a switch off and on to his feelings and keep different aspects of his life in boxes to cope and the other can still be rather level headed at the end of a 15 year relationship and the distruction of his hopes, dreams and happy family!! I wish I could be like them!!! ) xx
ladydesigner Posted July 12, 2010 Posted July 12, 2010 "I have also felt as you describe above - it's a very frightening feeling. I think for me this feeling was about being thrown completely off balance by all aspects of the A. Deceit, fear about feeling the M was wrong, undreamt of passion and intimacy, being messed around by MOM, heartbreak, no longer knowing what the right thing to do might be. Trusting my feelings and then being betrayed." Thank you - you are so right! I'm completely off balance. Everything I've ever believed, dreamt and hoped for has been totally mixed up. Not knowing what's right and wrong, who to trust, what you can trust or believe etc. What a mashed up mess! The only one I do really trust is my H and he said to me this morning that staying together is no longer an option (at this current time) as I don't have the right feelings for him and that I need to stop getting so panicky and depressed and make plans for my new life! Ok, will do!!! (After all this I so wish I were a man!! One man in my life can turn a switch off and on to his feelings and keep different aspects of his life in boxes to cope and the other can still be rather level headed at the end of a 15 year relationship and the distruction of his hopes, dreams and happy family!! I wish I could be like them!!! ) xx Isn't that the truth. I am sorry you are in this pain. I have walked this long hard road too and I am still M to my H. I felt much like you did and like wheelwright as well. It does get easier with time. NC may be a good option to clear your head especially if OM starts fishing and starting up with the whole "lets be friends" gig *barf* Hang in there!
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