Author prettybaby Posted June 27, 2010 Author Posted June 27, 2010 Her mother seems pretty comfortable about her own sexuality. She takes her kids to saunas where everyone is naked. I personally would never do that, but apparently, taking children to saunas is common practice since they even have special deals for kids under 12 and whatnot. So they definitely know what naked people look like and all that stuff. Last night, the little girl insisted on giving my boyfriend and I a massage, because she had seen that at the sauna place lol
Jilly Bean Posted June 27, 2010 Posted June 27, 2010 Last night, the little girl insisted on giving my boyfriend and I a massage, because she had seen that at the sauna place lol LOL? You lol this? C'mon, Pretty. You can't tell us your gut isn't reeling from this. What kind of massage is this girl witnessing? I regularly get massaged. And if I didn't, I would have no clue what they're about. Why? Because massage is done naked, privately, behind closed doors. And is she exposed to grown men naked at the sauna, too? The thought of a grown man being naked in front of a naked child is making me ill. Please tell me no. *groan*
Kamille Posted June 27, 2010 Posted June 27, 2010 Pretty Baby, could your bf or you have a heart to heart with the kid to help understand her behavior. I mean, you stated a few times you and your bf told her her behavior was inappropriate, but a six year old acting out isn't likely to comprehend the concept of what's appropriate or not. Or, if nothing else is going on, she is likely going through a phase of sexual discovery and telling her something is inappropriate will only push her to test other boundaries. Someone needs to have a good heart to heart with the child. Most likely the parents, but I was a child's confidante during my friend's divorce. Most of the conversations stayed between the child and me. (She always insisted I tell her a bedtime story and then she would confide in me). Nothing, technically, stops you or your boyfriend from taking a more active role in the child's life if you feel there are areas of concern. I think the reasons you're getting the reactions that you are is that you seem to be holding a six year old responsible for her behavior. She isn't. She's six years old. If she is behaving in inappropriate ways, then there are issues that need to be addressed. In your shoes I would ask bf to share his concerns with his parents or either have him or you (whichever is most appropriate) spend some time with the child to try and guide her in the right direction.
Adunaphel Posted June 27, 2010 Posted June 27, 2010 PB, I am sorry that you and yur bf are in an unconfortable situation. I think you have, but *really* have to investigate deeply into this matter. What happened does not *necessarily* scream child molestation to me. But even in the best case scenario it screams possible danger for the child ahead. Children are.... children. Innocent. I do not think that at six a child can know what she is doing. The getting paid 1 euro to show her bits sounds like something that could actually have happened, but while until it is a thing between kids aged 6, who are *not* sexual, it is relatively harmless, if it continues... it could bring to dangerous situations (to embarassing or awkward situations, too). The taking pictures at nipples reference is quite scary, in this context. One can just hope she saw it in a video, but summed to the previous bit of information it sounds like more than that. Even if it was just other children taking pictures at her with cellphones(but how many kids have cellphones with cameras?) children are careless(expecially when innocent) and her pictures could end up in some place accessible to a pedophile. But what if some adult took such pics of her? Her parents could have apparently ignored the issue out of embarass but dug deeper into it later. (well..one hopes so). Absolutely talk about it with the other family members... parents of the girl first. And insist about it. Investigate with the girl herself. The idea of talking to a counselor is also great. I really hope she has not been actually molested, but issues such as these cannot be ignored, and she *could* be in very actual danger with no one to help her.
Author prettybaby Posted June 27, 2010 Author Posted June 27, 2010 LOL? You lol this? C'mon, Pretty. You can't tell us your gut isn't reeling from this. What kind of massage is this girl witnessing? I regularly get massaged. And if I didn't, I would have no clue what they're about. Why? Because massage is done naked, privately, behind closed doors. Yeah, I lol about that particular point. It's not that big of a deal. I've been to that same sauna and I know exactly what massage she saw. It's one that's given to customers by the pool (not naked). It's a basic neck, shoulders and back massage. I've only been there in the evenings, but I think the kid-friendly hours have gender separated areas. I mean, I personally wouldn't take my children there even if it has separated areas. But their mother does, and it's perfectly allowed, so what can I do?
Taramere Posted June 27, 2010 Posted June 27, 2010 Her mother seems pretty comfortable about her own sexuality. She takes her kids to saunas where everyone is naked. I personally would never do that, but apparently, taking children to saunas is common practice since they even have special deals for kids under 12 and whatnot. So they definitely know what naked people look like and all that stuff. Last night, the little girl insisted on giving my boyfriend and I a massage, because she had seen that at the sauna place lol Little girls can often be flirtatious, but it's something that adults need to keep in check - without making them feel bad about the flirtiness. Distraction is often a good technique, but if she's being aggressively sexual then a firm "no. You do not touch Uncle (X) like that" is in order. Very precocious sexualised behaviour can certainly be a sign that a child has been abused, but it's not firm evidence of it. It could simply be that her parents are all hippyish and "let it all hang out", with the result that this little girl lacks social boundaries. I think the pressing issue is that if a child is behaving in that very sexualised manner and the adults around her aren't putting boundaries in place to stop it, then regardless of whether her parents are innocent (if somewhat irresponsible) adults, that child is going to be attractive and vulnerable to a more predatory, dangerous kind of adult.
Author prettybaby Posted June 27, 2010 Author Posted June 27, 2010 It could simply be that her parents are all hippyish and "let it all hang out", with the result that this little girl lacks social boundaries. Honestly, that is my gut feeling about the whole thing. But as I mentioned earlier, I'll have a chat with my old college friend/child psychologist to see what she thinks about it. I just looked up symptoms of abused kids, and except for the sexual references, she has absolutely none of the symptoms listed.
Taramere Posted June 27, 2010 Posted June 27, 2010 Honestly, that is my gut feeling about the whole thing. But as I mentioned earlier, I'll have a chat with my old college friend/child psychologist to see what she thinks about it. I think that would be a good idea. Not sure where you live, but where I am social work, police and schools are all supposed to work together in these matters. In a situation like this where there are somewhat concerning aspects to a child's behaviour, the first obvious port of call would be the school. A request for teachers to keep an eye on the situation, to create opportunities for the child to talk to an adult if she wishes....and, in this case, to pay attention to what's going on in the playground.
Green Posted June 27, 2010 Posted June 27, 2010 I really think every one is getting CRAZY on this thread as it is not obviouse the KID has been abused. I remember my little brother once shocked us all by pulling down his pants and anouching he was going to stick his finger in his ass. He did it and pulled out a bit of sht on the tip of his finger and tried to touch us with it. I also remember taking baths with my sister and bros when we were all young and my sister opened up her vagina to me and my brother and pointed to her clit or what ever and said "look guys its like a penis in my vagina".... I'm sure their are tons of shocking sht from my child hood that kids did that I don't even remember. I agree MAYBE this girl is in TROUBLE but not necesarily. At a minimum she does need GUIDANCE but it really NEEDS to come from her parents. I really think that she might just be a misguided kid looking for reactions.
Taramere Posted June 27, 2010 Posted June 27, 2010 I really think every one is getting CRAZY on this thread as it is not obviouse the KID has been abused. I certainly don't agree that people are going crazy on this thread. There's a variety of opinions, but most of them are veering towards the "there could be cause for concern here" school of thought. There's a balance between not over-reacting to every bit of odd behaviour a child presents, and not reacting at all. A balance between being over-protective, and being laid back about things to the point of negligence. It's not always an easy balance to find, but I would say that most of the responses on here are demonstrating an awareness of the need for that balance. I don't really get why you're insulting the other posters on this thread by telling them they're being crazy, Green. I think people are demonstrating appropriate concern for this little girl.
Author prettybaby Posted June 27, 2010 Author Posted June 27, 2010 I don't think she's been abused either, really. There's simply some serious flaws in their upbringing. I will - for my own peace of mind - discuss it with my old friend. But don't expect me to call social services tonight on my soon to be in-law family, just because she acted inappropriately. She's 6. There are 2 or 3 psychological evaluations / year at that age organized at school, as well as regular medical check ups. So if something dramatic happened, I'm thinking that professionals would have most likely noticed by now.
norajane Posted June 27, 2010 Posted June 27, 2010 She's 6. There are 2 or 3 psychological evaluations / year at that age organized at school, as well as regular medical check ups. So if something dramatic happened, I'm thinking that professionals would have most likely noticed by now. Well, they apparently didn't notice that she's been selling views of her vagina for a euro each, so let's not give them too much credit nor total responsibility over her well-being. The school needs to be notified this is happening, so they can prevent it from happening and prevent it from escalating into something worse. If those boys are taking pics of her on their camera phones, this can get really ugly. We don't know if those boys are 6 or 12, so THIS, at the very least, needs to be shut down immediately.
Green Posted June 27, 2010 Posted June 27, 2010 Well, they apparently didn't notice that she's been selling views of her vagina for a euro each, so let's not give them too much credit nor total responsibility over her well-being. The school needs to be notified this is happening, so they can prevent it from happening and prevent it from escalating into something worse. If those boys are taking pics of her on their camera phones, this can get really ugly. We don't know if those boys are 6 or 12, so THIS, at the very least, needs to be shut down immediately. If she just calls the school she could get this girl kicked out. Its really the parents who need to do something about the school situation... which may or may not be true. First some one needs to sit down with the kid and ask if its really hapening. Even if the kid changes her story to "NO" its pretty easy to spot if a kid is lying. Then if it is happening you need to do whats best for the child which doesn't necesarily include getting her labeld or kicked out of school.
Jilly Bean Posted June 28, 2010 Posted June 28, 2010 I don't think she's been abused either, really. There's simply some serious flaws in their upbringing. Um, let's HOPE she's not been molested. However, you have to concede the child is being exposed to some very inappropriate sexual imaging and experiences, and that's not something you write off to her parents being non-involved or hippies. Someone taught/encouraged this child to expose her vagina for money to his classmates and someone taught/encouraged this child to ask adults to take pictures of her nipples. And again, it's NOT a situation where the child is behaving badly or inappropriately, as in a category of interrupting Mommy when she's on the phone, or not being able to sit quietly in class. These actions she has displayed are entirely wrong for a 6-year old, and the real issue is WHERE and by WHOM she is learning these things. And like Nora said - don't be so quick to assume the "system" will catch every case of abuse. Look at it this way, Pretty. SOMETHING needs to change in this girl's life. Even if (I pray) she has not been the victim of abuse, the culprit to these lessons needs to be found, and more importantly, her parents need to stop turning a blind eye to what's going on with her. If this situation continues to manifest, how do you think she is going to be acting out when she's 12? Or 18? If no one is protecting her, and no one is teaching her proper boundaries, she's in for a very rough life. Honestly, Pretty. I'm continually agog you don't find this as upsetting as you should. These aren't light little cute kid actions by a long shot. Hypersexualized activity at that age is a bad sign...
norajane Posted June 28, 2010 Posted June 28, 2010 If she just calls the school she could get this girl kicked out. Its really the parents who need to do something about the school situation... which may or may not be true. First some one needs to sit down with the kid and ask if its really hapening. Even if the kid changes her story to "NO" its pretty easy to spot if a kid is lying. Then if it is happening you need to do whats best for the child which doesn't necesarily include getting her labeld or kicked out of school. Her mother is already aware of the situation and doesn't seem to give a crap: And when the little girl said she shows her bits at school all the time, and kids pay her 1 euro every time she does, her brother was like "EW You're so GROSS!". The mother looked at him and was like "what's going on?". So the little boy repeated what his little sister had just said. I was expecting her to finally say something, but she just turned her head and kept talking to someone else. So who is going to sit down with her and have that discussion? Who is going to do anything here?
threebyfate Posted June 28, 2010 Posted June 28, 2010 I don't think she's been abused either, really. There's simply some serious flaws in their upbringing. I will - for my own peace of mind - discuss it with my old friend. But don't expect me to call social services tonight on my soon to be in-law family, just because she acted inappropriately. She's 6. There are 2 or 3 psychological evaluations / year at that age organized at school, as well as regular medical check ups. So if something dramatic happened, I'm thinking that professionals would have most likely noticed by now.It's true she's not your responsibility. She's the responsibility of her parents. As you can see, her parents aren't terribly concerned about her behaviour but both your b/f and yourself have noticed that her behaviour isn't normal for a six year old girl. As you can see, a number of LS members just through a description of one night of behaviour feel that she's overtly sexual for a little girl. Something's not right in Kansas. It's up to you to ignore it or see if you can't in some way, determine if she needs help. IMO, she does need help, maybe not the help of Social Services but some kind of help. No matter how anyone spins this, this little girl isn't right and what would be best for her, is to have her sit and chat with a child psychologist who's qualified to determine her problems. But that you're willing to fully divulge her inappropriate behaviours to a professional, is one step in the right direction.
Author prettybaby Posted June 28, 2010 Author Posted June 28, 2010 I hope you understand that I can't just take somebody else's kid and schedule an appointment for her with a psychologist. I'll give a call to my college friend later today, and I'll have a talk with my boyfriend.
Ariadne Posted June 28, 2010 Posted June 28, 2010 I hope you understand that I can't just take somebody else's kid and schedule an appointment for her with a psychologist. I'll give a call to my college friend later today, and I'll have a talk with my boyfriend. I'd say schedule an appt with a Psychologist and Psychiatrist, call the Child Protective Services, and the police to start an investigation on the case. Someone has to do something here!
Ariadne Posted June 28, 2010 Posted June 28, 2010 I'll have a chat with my old college friend/child psychologist to see what she thinks about it. Yes! At least this is one step on the right direction. You must always talk to the experts.
Ariadne Posted June 28, 2010 Posted June 28, 2010 But don't expect me to call social services tonight on my soon to be in-law family, just because she acted inappropriately. You don't expect that you are going to call child protective services and have something remotely resembling of a family, do you? That goes bye bye. But that is the price of doing the right thing!
threebyfate Posted June 28, 2010 Posted June 28, 2010 I hope you understand that I can't just take somebody else's kid and schedule an appointment for her with a psychologist. I'll give a call to my college friend later today, and I'll have a talk with my boyfriend.I think that's a given that you can't just take anyone's child to a psychologist. But that's the end result of what that little girl needs in order to figure out why she acts the way she does. How you choose to get there, if at all, is up to you. Once again, this problematic little girl isn't your responsibility. It's up to you to decide if you want to get the ball rolling to help her or not.
Mimolicious Posted June 29, 2010 Posted June 29, 2010 Whoa! This turned into a disturbing case! Something is seriously wrong... One thing is for a child to strip naked and run around but to say "take a picture" and " I put my undies down an get an euro". This is going to be "Ho's INC" if she is not given some kind of help. This little girl has seen this type of behavior somewhere. :(
torranceshipman Posted June 29, 2010 Posted June 29, 2010 Well, they apparently didn't notice that she's been selling views of her vagina for a euro each, so let's not give them too much credit nor total responsibility over her well-being. QUOTE] WTF?!?! I am a teacher and this disgusts me and worries the hell out of me. This needs to be reported. Granted, I have only skimmed this post and need to go back (now!) and read it properly in case I have misunderstood something. But if this kid is 6 and this is really happening, lord above, this kid needs some help. OP I think you need to do whatever you can to find out more and to report this.
torranceshipman Posted June 29, 2010 Posted June 29, 2010 OK having read this whole post, it is really worrying. This poor little kid. You said that she doesn't have any signs of child abuse EXCEPT the sexual references. Well, that might be enough on its own to indicate abuse. And if there is even a possibility shouldn't it be followed up? If you are wrong then great. But something seems off here. And if anyone has purchased intimate pictures of her then they can be prosecuted for child pornography. Do you not see why such laws exist? At the end of the day, we should all take responsibility for helping a little kid who might be in trouble. If you accept that there is a chance of sexual abuse meted out to a 6yr old, and you basically do nothing (for whatever reason), then unfortunately you have to live with the fact that you were complicit in the abuse. That is how abuse works - everyone sees it as dirty, doesn't want to rock the boat, decides to look the other way, has caring, good intentions, but has a reason that they don't want to speak out (such as losing a boyfriend or falling out with his family). There are plenty of things you can do - start by ringing a couple of support lines and asking their advice, consider calling the school and talking to a sympathetic teacher. Or talk to a family member-remember that it could be anyone - heck, even the priest!-or anyone - who could be doing something bad - and people need to keep their eyes open. If you have worries about discussing this with your boyfriend show him this post. Ultimately her wellbeing is more important than any arguments that bringing this up might cause.
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