Fiancee's elderly Male Friend - Niggling problem?

[BlueDanube]

My Fiancee (we marry in 6 months and I've known her 2 years) maintains a 'friendship' with an elderly, unhappily married male (he 70, her 50) which has me wondering about overfamilairity. He fawns around her, doing jobs for her, e-mailing, phone calls and so on. A typical e-mail (which she showed me unintentionally) might go ' Hi [pet name], you naughty girl not calling me - when'X' (me) has gone I hope you can call me as I've missed seeing and chatting to you. Lot's of love [pet name] xxx'. In addition to such exchanges, he never asks about me or she and I and has also always put off meeting me which doesn't seem appropriate from a friend.

 

My view of this is that I don't feel particularly threatened and I actually tolerate the friendship (he's an old friend of her family and I trust my Fiancee) but his language and manner just niggle me. Not because he's a threat (at 70 and unwell he isn't) but it feels like I have to accept this 'emotional affair-like' behaviour because of his age/health (i.e. it has to be harmless because he's 70).

 

She says he's just a friend and appears not to detect the (to me) obvious sexual, flirtatious overtones of his calls. e-mails etc. It feels like an unhappily married elderly man indulging himself with a younger woman. Remove the age factor and it doesn't look appropriate. Would I be happy with all I read, listened to when they converse?. Probably not from his direction.

 

Should I be niggled by this (am I over-reacting) and, if it seems a little overfamiliar to you, what should I do?. Appreciate this is fairly mild compared to some problems but it remains a running sore for me.

[2sure]

Eh, just indulge the guy. Dont worry about it. It doesnt sound as though your gf thinks much of it.

Appropriate? No, not on his part.

If it bothers you that much, when you meet him, just act condescending. That should be a reality check for him.

 

Best advice: Laugh about it w/ your GF and ignore the rest

[BlueDanube]

Eh, just indulge the guy. Dont worry about it. It doesnt sound as though your gf thinks much of it.

Appropriate? No, not on his part.

 

Fair comment and indulge him is exactly what I have been doing so far of course. Should I raise things up a notch...still pondering that one. in a similar situation when a female friend of mind made a fruity comment or two I made a joke of it and pointed out I was engaged now. She got the message in a light-hearted way and behaves more appropriately now. I guess I feel my Fiancee (who knows about my instance above) should do the same thing.

 

As for condescending...I would put money on him never meeting me so it's not likely to be an opportunity that arises. If it does though, I take your point.

[RedRussian]

unhappily married male

 

The 70 year old fossil is not a problem but a symptom of your "unhappy marriage" Ones you fix that, the 70 year old guy with be no more, among some 30 year old she is taking up inside of her these days....

[Jilly Bean]

I think you're being a little over-reactive.

 

He has a crush on her, clearly. But, from what you say, he doesn't seem to have many other relationships in his life.

 

He's harmless, and his crush is harmless.

 

FWIW, most women have had a "clingon" guy in their lives from time to time. We consider them to be loyal puppy dogs, are fully aware of their adoration, and while we don't encourage it, we also see it as more of a need for the guy, than for us. Consider it a pity friendship, of sorts.

 

Congrats on your upcoming marriage, btw.

[RedRussian]

Yea...women like to do them "pity friendship, of sorts" type of things.

 

Men hope you getting this and know, there is no "nice guy inside road" just take it or leave it road. Grab what you want and if she sais no, well fine, drop her and go for another, would any REAL MAN would settle for "pity friendship"??????

[Green]

I'm not going to lie, I'm in my twenties and so is my gf and if some 70 year old man was flirting with her I would CRUSH IT.

[WintersNightTraveler]

A typical e-mail (which she showed me unintentionally) might go ' Hi [pet name], you naughty girl not calling me - when'X' (me) has gone I hope you can call me as I've missed seeing and chatting to you. Lot's of love [pet name] xxx'.

 

She says he's just a friend and appears not to detect the (to me) obvious sexual, flirtatious overtones of his calls. e-mails etc.

 

Come on. It's blatant. Don't doubt yourself or what's obvious. She knows this guy wants to stick it in. She knows he doesn't consider himself just a friend, even if she really does. At best she is too meek to end this man's innappropriate behavior. There are also worse possibilities all of which you've surely already considered.

 

It's not a healthy situation. Personally I'd ask her to end the situation and be calmly confident about maintaining my position against the continued nonsense she will reply about how he's just a friend.

[BlueDanube]

Hi folks and thanks for the comments - really appreciate the thoughts and views. Interesting how opinions differ..

 

JillyBean - thanks for a woman's insight on this and making the point about sympathy friendships. You are right in that this is almost certainly an example of that, coupled with a gratitude for the huge amount of help this guy has offered over the years. So I do believe it is harmless but......

 

As you can see from the guys replies below it doesn't sit easlily irrespective of the old guy's age or other circumstances. And here is the issue. Fundamentally, for any man it is hard to accept such a situation when you know it's going on. However harmless it may be. I think we all agree this friendship from him goes beyond a friendship in his mind and therefore is it acceptable?

 

My view has generally been the same as yours - don't get wound up because it's harmless and not going to go anywhere. But I find it an increasing niggle that it goes on, I'm aware of it and the underlying sentiment from him seems unacceptable. He has even admitted, 'were he younger, then he would have loved a relationship'. Is it acceptable?. However much I try and square the circle or conceed because of his circumstances it is an irritant. Not because it's a threat but because it's wrong and bad behaviour and I'm by default having to accept it.

 

Thanks for the congrats btw - very thoughtful :-)

 

Green / WintersNightTraveller - Thanks for the views guys and I know where you're coming from. I do believe this is no more than an infatuation based on his unhappy marriage situation. I know my fiancee pretty well and she is trustworthy if meek and non-confrontational. So, is this harmless - I believe so at present. Is it acceptable - not unless it's ok to have another male flirting and fawning with your fiancee and it being acceptable because he's elderly etc. Fundamentally, as you say WInter, it's not a healthy situation, not least because it's a slow irritant to the relationship and these things tend to grow if not tackled.

Edited June 11, 2010 by BlueDanube

[lkjh]

I wouldn't be ok with and I bet if the tables were reversed she wouldn't be ok with you doing the exact same thing

[Jilly Bean]

\JillyBean - thanks for a woman's insight on this and making the point about sympathy friendships. You are right in that this is almost certainly an example of that, coupled with a gratitude for the huge amount of help this guy has offered over the years. So I do believe it is harmless but......

 

As you can see from the guys replies below it doesn't sit easlily irrespective of the old guy's age or other circumstances. And here is the issue. Fundamentally, for any man it is hard to accept such a situation when you know it's going on. However harmless it may be. I think we all agree this friendship from him goes beyond a friendship in his mind and therefore is it acceptable?

 

My view has generally been the same as yours - don't get wound up because it's harmless and not going to go anywhere. But I find it an increasing niggle that it goes on, I'm aware of it and the underlying sentiment from him seems unacceptable. He has even admitted, 'were he younger, then he would have loved a relationship'. Is it acceptable?. However much I try and square the circle or conceed because of his circumstances it is an irritant. Not because it's a threat but because it's wrong and bad behaviour and I'm by default having to accept it.

 

Thanks for the congrats btw - very thoughtful :-)

 

Yes, I do agree their relationship is built up in his head into something more than it is. I think he's enjoying quite the fantasy relationship with your fiancee. I also can tell you that some people (men and women) are often CLUELESS about romantic intentions of people who present themselves as mere friends. So, I wouldn't assume your GF is aware, and probably views this guy as an elderly, possibly pitiful, father-type figure. I don't sense your relationship is unstable to the point that she is furthering the friendship knowing he has other aspirations. I think she's genuinely unaware that he thinks more of their relationship.

 

That all being said, from a chick perspective, I get your point as a DOOD. That you have peed on your fiancees hydrant, and you don't need anyone else sniffing around. I imagine you see it as encroachment, the breaking of "guy code", and overall inappropriate for him to act as he does, considering you're about to get married.

 

So, I advise you insist on meeting him. Socially, and casually. Have him AND HIS WIFE over for drinks or dinner, meet for coffee, etc. Tell your fiancee since he's an important friend, and you're about to be married, you'd like to get to know him better as well, as would welcome socializing AS A COUPLE.

 

See how that goes over...

 

What that would accomplish, is you subtlely setting some boudaries with him. By insisting he bring his wife, you send the message that couple activities are appropriate, single ones - not so much. Also, it will give you an opportunity to fawn over your lady, display physical affection, adoration, discuss the wedding, etc., and generally it will burst his bubble a bit and get him grounded that the sheriff is town, and he better watch himself...

[WintersNightTraveler]

That all being said, from a chick perspective, I get your point as a DOOD. That you have peed on your fiancees hydrant, and you don't need anyone else sniffing around. I imagine you see it as encroachment, the breaking of "guy code", and overall inappropriate for him to act as he does, considering you're about to get married.

 

I'm not sure you do get the dood perspective. Encroachment isn't the problem, you can solve that just by not giving a crap about fire hydrant type considerations. Or at least surpressing the annoyance. But either way that's under your own control (somewhat) since it's your own feeling.

 

The real problem, at least from this dood perspective, is that many times the woman isn't clueless as you suggest, but knows what is going on and either (in order from best possibility to worst):

 

1 - Just wants to avoid conflict

2 - Is not good at fidelity and thus doesn't know to avoid such situations and doesn't realize how dangerous it is

3 - Enjoys the flattery aspect

4 - Is cheating

5 - Some combination of the above

 

While I do think occasionally women really are clueless, I think it's more often one of those possibilities.

 

Dudes likewise sometimes pretend certain "friendships" are harmless. Maybe not possibility 1 very often, but certainly the other 4.

[jnj express]

Hey BD---it's been going on when your GF, was not specifically in a committed relationship----if she is now your fiance things have changed---and the other guy is now inapropriate-----tell her she needs to tone it down with her buddy, or actually she needs to tell the old guy to become much less familiar-----don't try to shut it off, as she will then come back and tell you, you are to controlling-----But don't just ignore this---old guys still can participate--------------actually you really wanna make the old guy go away----tell his wife-- or threaten him with telling his wife----cuz he actually IS CHEATING ON HIS WIFE

[Shakz]

You could either kick his wrinkled ass or get your own geriatric sugar momma, or both.

[BlueDanube]

Well, thanks folks really - there's some good info/opinion/insight there and I really, really appreciate it!.

 

Jilly Bean - Thank you particularly for a thoughtful and considered reply. You are right, the relationship has built up into something in his mind beyond what it should be. In reality it was inappropriate even when my fiancee was single because the old guy is married. Cheating in his mind therefore which, while not the same as a physical cheat, is, to me, a cheat none-the-less.

 

Coming forward to today, I take your point about my fiancee being clueless on these matters - she genuinely, is while if I published the e-mail exchanges on here, you'd all be in disbelief that something so obvious could be misinterpreted (no, really!). My complaint I suppose is that this guy has been getting away with it for so long he considers it normal and, by going beyond the appropriateness boundary is ultimately disrespecting both my fiancee's and my realtionship and also his own. It's something I can't just let lie I'm afraid so I'm debating how to proceed. To which, thanks for the great suggestion about getting him and his wife over...good call and I may well go down that road.

 

Winter - thanks to for those thoughts. It is (I believe) number 1 and 3 on your list, coupled with Jilly's point that she just can't see it for what it is and feels she 'owes' this guy for all the help he's given. Owing in this case means not upsetting him and another complex aspect regarding this guy's relationship with her parents (now deceased). I don't think she realises that with her parents pasing, so has the need for propriety and this old guy is exercising his long supressed fantasies. At least that's how i see it.

 

JNJ Ex -Can't argue with those points ...all incisive and spot on. Glad you can see where I'm coming from as it gives me confidence I'm not losing the plot and what appearst to be the case, actually is. Thanks buddy.

 

Shakz - thanks for the support there buddy....understand the thinking.

 

So, will consider how best to go about this as you've all given me the confidence that steps are necessary and good ideas on possible courses of action. Will keep you posted on developments.

 

Thanks again all...

[ComputerJock]

BD - I'm 63. Don't kid yourself, even at 70 with medical help he can get it up and she can ride for four hours. Can you keep it up that long. An affair is in the air, wake up and smell the stink.