EmeraldHeart Posted June 6, 2010 Posted June 6, 2010 I have had men tell me that they are offended by certain things I do. I like to go dutch. I feel uncomfortable having the man pay for the entire date. I have been in situations when I really didn't have the money to spend at the moment (car issues, pet issues, for whatever reason you may not have access to much disposable income) and I will still pay for my half. I don't mind doors being opened for me but I hate a car door being opened for me. I want to know why these things are off putting? What impression does that leave?
DanielMadr Posted June 6, 2010 Posted June 6, 2010 I have had men tell me that they are offended by certain things I do. I like to go dutch. I feel uncomfortable having the man pay for the entire date. I have been in situations when I really didn't have the money to spend at the moment (car issues, pet issues, for whatever reason you may not have access to much disposable income) and I will still pay for my half. I don't mind doors being opened for me but I hate a car door being opened for me. I want to know why these things are off putting? What impression does that leave? If someone does something nice for you, you say Thank you or you say"Thank you, you shouldn't. Next time is on me, I insist.". If you start to make issues out of it or gender equality debate....it is bad manners. Dating or no dating. Reminder> When a guy holds doors open for you...thank him...walk inside....turn around and wait for him. Girl who just goes inside and continues walking is rude = red flag. If a guy thinks you owe him after he paid for both, he is a retard. And you don't need to worry about being a leech.
Jilly Bean Posted June 6, 2010 Posted June 6, 2010 I think it sends the message you don't like to treated like a lady, shown respect, and that you are so ultra-independent, you have no need for men. Why can't you let a man treat you decently? Why the power bitch routine? I think one of the best parts of dating is having a man be a gentleman, and show a woman all the signs of courtship. I don't get why you're resisting that...
marsle85 Posted June 6, 2010 Posted June 6, 2010 Following traditional gender roles helps us interact and socialize with others efficiently, and without offending the other. If we didn't have "rules," we wouldn't know what to do. It has less to do with power and feminism, as it's based on social cues and rituals. It simply works. Secondly, what is the very worst that can happen? A typical man understands he is responsible for taking a woman out for dinner, and paying. I can sympathize, as it's doubtful he will end up dating every woman he dines- but in general, a man knows this. Despite what you read on LS, I find it unlikely men pay begrudgingly-- it's part of the deal. Let him take care of you, and ENJOY your role. If you were a man, you would be paying. It's just how the dice rolled. Things even out in the end.
Author EmeraldHeart Posted June 6, 2010 Author Posted June 6, 2010 I think it sends the message you don't like to treated like a lady, shown respect, and that you are so ultra-independent, you have no need for men. Why can't you let a man treat you decently? Why the power bitch routine? I think one of the best parts of dating is having a man be a gentleman, and show a woman all the signs of courtship. I don't get why you're resisting that... I don't play a power bitch routine. I have issues...LOL! It has been ingrained in me from childhood, by my mother, to make sure you can always take care of yourself. I always think that the guy is relieved to see a woman willing to pay her way, but only recently have been told that isn't necessarily the case. I am 6 weeks into seeing a guy. We have always gone dutch. How do I let him pay now? I would love to let the guy pay, but I feel so crappy when he does...like I am taking advantage of him.
norajane Posted June 6, 2010 Posted June 6, 2010 Going dutch sends the signal you aren't so interested in him. I always pay if I'm not interested, and that's the only time I will pay on the first few dates. After that, I'm happy to trade off, if he'll let me. As for door opening, jeez, if he has the manners to do that for you, enjoy it and be happy you're dating a gentleman. Just as your mother taught you to be able to stand on your own two feet, his mother taught him to be polite. Let him be polite, and graciously thank him. What's the big deal? Being capable of taking care of yourself doesn't mean you have to get mad if someone does something nice for you.
Author EmeraldHeart Posted June 6, 2010 Author Posted June 6, 2010 Following traditional gender roles helps us interact and socialize with others efficiently, and without offending the other. If we didn't have "rules," we wouldn't know what to do. It has less to do with power and feminism, as it's based on social cues and rituals. It simply works. Secondly, what is the very worst that can happen? A typical man understands he is responsible for taking a woman out for dinner, and paying. I can sympathize, as it's doubtful he will end up dating every woman he dines- but in general, a man knows this. Despite what you read on LS, I find it unlikely men pay begrudgingly-- it's part of the deal. Let him take care of you, and ENJOY your role. If you were a man, you would be paying. It's just how the dice rolled. Things even out in the end. I am afraid I have been really sending the wrong signals to the new man and I am VERY interested in him. I have always been the type of woman to go dutch, to not make a big deal about things...like when he told me he may not be able to see me this weekend, I tell him it is no big deal. It was a big deal...I would like to see him as often as I can, but don't want to appear clingy. He stated that he was going to buy a new couch because his current one isn't in the best shape due to the fact his dog basically lives on it and he wants there to be something nice for me to sit on when I come over. I said that it didn't matter to me, I have a dog and am used to that. It lands up he doesn't have the money right now for a new couch anyway. I try to be as accommodating and laid back as possible. I have always found it difficult to allow a man to "take care" of me. I feel like they think I am just another typical woman. Damn, I have more issues than I realized. I hope I haven't screwed things up with the new guy already. I expected a call from him this afternoon and did not receive. What advice would you give to change the tide?
norajane Posted June 6, 2010 Posted June 6, 2010 It's fine that things are no big deal, but there are ways to let him know that you appreciate he thought of you even though you don't care. Like, in the couch situation, you could have said, "Oh, it's so thoughtful of you to think of me and my comfort! That's such an awesome thing to do. You know what, though, I have a dog, too, so I get it and I'm comfortable on your couch. You don't have to go out and buy something just for me, but if you want to get a new couch anyway, I'd be happy to help you look." When he says he can't see you this weekend, you can say, "Oh, I understand, and it's all right. I was looking forward to seeing you, though, so I am a little disappointed. Can we get together on Sunday instead? I know a great brunch place."
Author EmeraldHeart Posted June 6, 2010 Author Posted June 6, 2010 I think it boils down to insecurity. During our conversation over the weekend we spoke a bit about his ex, which prompted me to say..."You have noticed that I make sure we go dutch." He didn't respond. How do I now let him pay when we go out? He is probably expecting me to pay my share. It wouldn't be that I would always make him pay...I don't feel comfortable with that, but it would be nice, for a change, to let a man take on that traditional role.
Author EmeraldHeart Posted June 6, 2010 Author Posted June 6, 2010 Going dutch sends the signal you aren't so interested in him. I always pay if I'm not interested, and that's the only time I will pay on the first few dates. After that, I'm happy to trade off, if he'll let me. As for door opening, jeez, if he has the manners to do that for you, enjoy it and be happy you're dating a gentleman. Just as your mother taught you to be able to stand on your own two feet, his mother taught him to be polite. Let him be polite, and graciously thank him. What's the big deal? Being capable of taking care of yourself doesn't mean you have to get mad if someone does something nice for you. I don't get mad if someone opens my door or pays...I feel uncomfortable. I am not going to get into it, but is stems way back for me and I have never been able to allow a guy to do that for me. I really want it to work with this guy and hope that he isn't seeing it like you are.
Author EmeraldHeart Posted June 6, 2010 Author Posted June 6, 2010 I think it sends the message you don't like to treated like a lady, shown respect, and that you are so ultra-independent, you have no need for men. Why can't you let a man treat you decently? Why the power bitch routine? I think one of the best parts of dating is having a man be a gentleman, and show a woman all the signs of courtship. I don't get why you're resisting that... I don't like to be treated with respect and like a lady because I am willing to pay for my share? I don't get how that is. I resist due to my past. I haven't been able to shake the way my father made me feel like a worthless piece of ****, to be honest with you.
Mac91 Posted June 6, 2010 Posted June 6, 2010 Isn't this called Chivalry? and women complain that it's "dead". And I'm sorry about your situation with your father. But, that's something we can't solve for you.
TaurusTerp Posted June 6, 2010 Posted June 6, 2010 It will differ a lot depending on the guy. I personally wouldn't give it another thought besides "oh, that's nice of her". Others will take it as a sign of disinterest, or will be turned off by it. Pretty hard to say.
Author EmeraldHeart Posted June 6, 2010 Author Posted June 6, 2010 Isn't this called Chivalry? and women complain that it's "dead". And I'm sorry about your situation with your father. But, that's something we can't solve for you. HAHA! Wasn't asking anyone to solve my daddy issues. lol I would rather a man be romantic by saying sweet things to me or surprising me with some silly, cheap gift. If he wants to pay, I will let him pay if there is another date. Is that going to send a different message now since we have always gone dutch before?
Mac91 Posted June 7, 2010 Posted June 7, 2010 HAHA! Wasn't asking anyone to solve my daddy issues. lol I would rather a man be romantic by saying sweet things to me or surprising me with some silly, cheap gift. If he wants to pay, I will let him pay if there is another date. Is that going to send a different message now since we have always gone dutch before? Well, honestly, it's up to you. You seem like to be the type of gal that's very headstrong in her beliefs. I don't think the guy's should be offended, but just let them know that you like to contribute and all that. If he wants to pay, then, just be a little lenient with your ways IMO, it will make him feel a little more "comfortable" But hey, I think you just need to get used to being "pampered" a little.
Author EmeraldHeart Posted June 7, 2010 Author Posted June 7, 2010 ^I would actually like to be pampered. How do I allow this to happen with the current guy when I have already set a precedent? Would it be weird if I suddenly didn't try and pay for my share?
Mac91 Posted June 7, 2010 Posted June 7, 2010 ^I would actually like to be pampered. How do I allow this to happen with the current guy when I have already set a precedent? Would it be weird if I suddenly didn't try and pay for my share? Well, from a guy's perspective... I'd say right now he understands you want to take care of yourself etc... if suddenly out of the blue you stop... then he might get confused... I might too. So, I'd say that if he offers to pay for the next one, then gracefully accept and thank him. If he's prepared to go dutch... then go dutch. But after, let him know why, and tell him that you do appreciate him being a gentleman, and you actually like it(him treating you out for dinner). Then, hopefully he will take a hint, and be pay for dinners(unless otherwise stated).
Knittress Posted June 7, 2010 Posted June 7, 2010 If you want him to treat you every once in a while why don't you start off by buying HIM dinner? Trading paying for dinner sets a much nicer tone, in my opinion, than splitting the bill.
Shakz Posted June 7, 2010 Posted June 7, 2010 If you want him to treat you every once in a while why don't you start off by buying HIM dinner? Trading paying for dinner sets a much nicer tone, in my opinion, than splitting the bill. Right on, the obvious solution. I don't mind going dutch if the woman asks me out. What? This happened once. Okay, so it never happened, but if it ever did I would be willing to go dutch.
Author EmeraldHeart Posted June 7, 2010 Author Posted June 7, 2010 If we go to the movies and he pays for the movie, I pay for the snacks...even when he is the one asking if I want snacks. So, I should just say yes, step back and let him pay?
Shakz Posted June 7, 2010 Posted June 7, 2010 If we go to the movies and he pays for the movie, I pay for the snacks...even when he is the one asking if I want snacks. So, I should just say yes, step back and let him pay? Well, that's not quite the same as splitting a dinner bill, but close enough. Of course, at this point if you just say "Yes, thank you, I'll have popcorn," he'll probably ask, "What's the matter? Did you get fired?"
Author EmeraldHeart Posted June 7, 2010 Author Posted June 7, 2010 The above was just an example of the last time we were out, out and not hanging at each other's home. Haha! We are co-workers, so I can't lie and say yes! lol
ADF Posted June 7, 2010 Posted June 7, 2010 Actually, I've heard a lot of men on LS gripe about having to pay on dates--lol. Why is it off-putting? Because it isn't what we expect. Early in a relationship, a man expects to pay because it signals to the woman that he values her time and appreciates her willingness to spend it with him. Conversely, by allowing the man to pay, the woman signals to him that they are indeed on a date, and that she is at least open to the idea of a more intimate acquaintance with him in the future. When a woman insists on paying her own way, she seems to be signaling to the man that this is NOT a date, and the man shouldn't expect things to go any further in the future. Needless to say, that isn't what he wants to hear.
Els Posted June 7, 2010 Posted June 7, 2010 There's no way you can reverse it now, evidently. If he tries to pay, let him. If he expects dutch as usual - well, nothing so very wrong with that, IMO.
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