Can love be promised?

[pureinheart]

We all look at things from our own unique perspective. I suppose that's why this question confuses me, and granted, it's entirely possible that I'm the oddball, that everyone else is sane and I'm not, but, how do you love someone, and then one day not love them anymore?

 

I can see where abuse, mental, physical, both, whatever, could drive love out of someone (fortunately I've never suffered that), but the idea that I can just wake up one morning and suddenly not love someone I've loved for years is just foreign and incomprehensible to me.

 

I suppose it's possible I'm just missing the point here. If so, I'd sure like to know what it is.

 

Love CAN die and does...when a person is continually mistreated "the love" they once felt is now tainted.

 

I was CRAZY about my daughters dad, he seemed too good to be true...OMG, he wasd HOT inh everyway imaginable...then he became violent after using injectionable streroids (to make a real long story short)...he began to threaten me all of the time, bought a gun, wanted to sell massive quantities of drugs through the house...it was a nightmare reboot...no lie dude.

 

I am reminded of what we shared prior to the steroids and I get fluttery and giddy...then I think about what happened post steroids and I become remorseful, and the thought about reconcilliation ceases (he wanted to get back together for over 20 years now, although has since re-married so this has ceased). Even writing this response to you reboot was hard...

[ladydesigner]

Love CAN die and does...when a person is continually mistreated "the love" they once felt is now tainted.

 

I was CRAZY about my daughters dad, he seemed too good to be true...OMG, he wasd HOT inh everyway imaginable...then he became violent after using injectionable streroids (to make a real long story short)...he began to threaten me all of the time, bought a gun, wanted to sell massive quantities of drugs through the house...it was a nightmare reboot...no lie dude.

 

I am reminded of what we shared prior to the steroids and I get fluttery and giddy...then I think about what happened post steroids and I become remorseful, and the thought about reconcilliation ceases (he wanted to get back together for over 20 years now, although has since re-married so this has ceased). Even writing this response to you reboot was hard...

 

I often wonder if this "dead love" can be rekindled. The love in my M "died" a long time ago, but it wasn't until both of us got our acts together and realized what had happened that we are now making great efforts to make our M work. The "love" we once had, that "innocent love" is GONE. But we have a new type of love that is understanding, supportive and communicative. We are still the best of friends and are reconnecting intimately.

[pureinheart]

*Excuse the typos...FA, I think I have you beat...lol....

[pureinheart]

I often wonder if this "dead love" can be rekindled. The love in my M "died" a long time ago, but it wasn't until both of us got our acts together and realized what had happened that we are now making great efforts to make our M work. The "love" we once had, that "innocent love" is GONE. But we have a new type of love that is understanding, supportive and communicative. We are still the best of friends and are reconnecting intimately.

 

BTW, I am sooooo glad you two have found common ground/peace in your M.

 

I think it can possibly if the factors are removed that caused the love to die in the first place. Sometimes both parties aren't willing, nor will they admit "their" mistakes...it takes maturity also...I was too traumatized with my life being threatened by my ex and the people who "I thought" were my friends too...

 

When I see my daughters father I see all of the mess...his attitude has not changed either, which plays a big part...

[crazycatlady]

I think we agree here, reboot. I do love all my exSOs. But I have moved on. I am not in a love relationship with them anymore, because I stopped being in love with them and fell in love with someone else whom I also love now.

 

Maybe I am the oddball but I stay in love for decades. When I am no longer in love with my SO, when my love has transformed from a selfish love to an altruistic love, I have no wish to be in a relationship with him any longer. But I still love him!

 

I think to me it is the difference between selfish love (in love) and altruistic love (love). I feel altruistic love for my children, parents, friends and my exSOs. I feel selfish love for my present partner, ie he makes me feel good and that is why I want to be around him.

 

I like this a lot. I find myself pretty much agreeing totally with them.

 

But as to way the love changes or even dies....anything untended will not thrive. A garden left alone will be overrun by weeds, a fire left unattended will either get out of control, or die, cats not pet and loved from early on are skittish and afraid even as they long for affection....everything needs attention, everything needs tending stroking and care. If you allow complacency to replace care, and indeference to over come tenderness, yeah you will lose that loving feeling. Love is more then just an emotion.

 

Those saying love is an action will say this supports their position. But I disagree. Because you can care and tend for a partner, but if its not fueled by the emotion love its either 1 a job, 2 a chore, 3 an annoyance, 4 a habit. Love is an emotion backed by actions. Both must be present for there to be what we think of as LOVE. Both most troubled marriages somewhere there has been a breakdown in the emotion or in the action of love.

 

CCL

[jthorne]

ANYTHING can be promised. It's up to the integrity of the person promising to deliver.

[jennie-jennie]

ANYTHING can be promised. It's up to the integrity of the person promising to deliver.

 

It does not matter how good your integrity is, if you do not harbor specific feelings there is no way of making them appear.

[pureinheart]

So to answer the OP's question, I can with pretty much certainty promise to hold altruistic love for an SO for the rest of my life, but altruistic love is not enough for me to want to stay in a relationship.

 

The selfish love which is necessary for me to want to stay in a relationship with a man can only be given to one man at a time, so when the object for that love has changed, I am gone. This kind of love can not be promised. This is the kind of love which makes me desire a man. Without desire I am not interested in having a relationship. Without desire it is friendship not a relationship in my opinion.

 

 

 

You know jennie, when the love was gone, I was also, and something(s) took place in all cases for that to happen...I didn't just "fall out of love", I was "sent" away whether it be by mistreatment or otherwise. At that point contract or no contract...I was simply not M'ed at that point...and never looked back.

 

I believe in the M contract, although the men I M'ed didn't. They did try to work things out years later, although it was too little too late.

 

There are cases also in which it's a verbal contract, to me those are as binding and legal....although contracts is another thread.

[marlena]

I don't think anyone can truly say how they will feel at any given point in the future, but one CAN promise to be honest and deal with a R with integrity, even at its end.

 

Yes, we would all be Cassandras if we could. Emotions are funny things. They are highly volatile and have a life of their own. Like children, they are capricious, overwhelming and hard to control sometimes. What's important, I agree with Donna, is being honest about your emotions, first to yourself, and then to your partner.

[pureinheart]

The butterflies always go away. But that's not love. I can't promise to always feel butterflies when I see you, but I can promise that if I ever loved you, I always will.

 

Awwww that's sweet reboot...although isn't it a different type of love? Like let's say you met someone...if you still loved all the others in the sense of wanting to be M'ed, then that would put a damper on the current R.

 

I really hope this is making sense...have a really bad kidney infection and am on ANTIBIOTICS....WF knows about antibiotics:):)

 

EmDM said the same thing I quoted you (I'm not too sure he loves his exW though....lol)...and other guys have said and followed through with actions that they would love me forever...is that a guy thing????

 

This is great having you on LS reboot (your personality is great also)...don't get me wrong, I love the ladies, it's just nice to have a guys perspective also...

[Silly_Girl]

It does not matter how good your integrity is, if you do not harbor specific feelings there is no way of making them appear.

 

Agree, agree, agree.

 

I think love can be encouraged and supported but it is so linked to respect, in my view, that other events can impact and mean that you can't love someone no matter how hard you try.

[jthorne]

It does not matter how good your integrity is, if you do not harbor specific feelings there is no way of making them appear.

I was referring to Bent's post about "love" vs "in love". We all know there's more to real love than hormones.

[marlena]

ANYTHING can be promised. It's up to the integrity of the person promising to deliver.

 

The problem with this is that he/she may deliver but it won't be out of love if the love isn't really there. It will be out of a sense of duty to keep the promise.

[pureinheart]

My English professor in college always said he didn't believe in 'unconditional love'. He said love came with many conditions such as, 'I promise never to cheat/lie/abuse', etc. I'm not so sure love isn't conditional, but the institution of M certainly is.

 

As human beings with faults and frailties unconditional love is difficult to attain, it takes a lot of work...wisdom, knowledge and understanding.

 

We are all "works in progress"

 

Possibly love has no conditions, it's the people that do.

[jennie-jennie]

I was referring to Bent's post about "love" vs "in love". We all know there's more to real love than hormones.

 

And real love is?

 

I can be in love and love the same person. This is what I call selfish love.

 

I can love a person without being in love with them. This is altruistic love.

 

I can't see how one of these loves would be more real than the other.

[pureinheart]

Sorry, I'd carried over the context of the original question from previous threads.

 

In truth, there isn't a person in the world who can promise ANYTHING about the future, not even if it's 5 seconds from the moment the promise is made.

 

There's too many variables outside of anyone's control to TRULY promise much of anything.

 

I could promise to be with my wife forever...and then get hit by a beer truck as I crossed the street.

 

But...the idea of promising to jointly renegotiate if the situation changes is a good one...if everyone stuck to it.

 

ExDM hated to make promises for the reasons you state owl...and thanks to you and all the guys that post...it's great to see your side of the story BTW...

 

I don't know what happened to exDM, but he was adamant about promise making and said he feared not being able to keep the promise.

[pureinheart]

The problem with this is that he/she may deliver but it won't be out of love if the love isn't really there. It will be out of a sense of duty to keep the promise.

 

No way Marlena would I EVER want this...

[fooled once]

I borrowed a couple of quotes from November-Rain's thread which seems to be going off topic:

 

I've been thinking about this topic for quite some time. I adamently believe love can be promised IF and only if we are mature, know ourselves, and have the ability to stay true to something as we evolve in other areas. I adamantly don't believe love can be promised otherwise.

 

Just a small example. MM chose to marry at a very young age. He's pretty sure he fell out of love with his W some time before his wedding day but went through on his promise to M her. He has been faking it for nearly 40 years now. He kept his promise to remain M, but not in loving her.

 

Another example. I loved my exH dearly and did everything in my power to ensure love would survive. I supported him emotionally and financially, I bought books on Rs, I got us into counseling. When I recognized he was never going to do the OTHER work to support love, my love for him eventually died.

 

But we both M young, both around the age of 21. Now that we're mature, know ourselves very well, physically, mentally, and emotionally, we know what our needs are and know how to sustain Rs that are very dear to us.

 

I have often suggested that love cannot be promised, but if that is true, how can MM trust that I will always love him? Why would he leave his W if I cannot promise I will love him forever or at least until death do us part?

 

Since my A I have pondered this 'promise to love forever issue' and I think I've finally come to a conclusion: I know I love him already and I know he loves me. This is a fact, not a promise. We can only promise to try to work things out, try to communicate, be there for each other, and do the OTHER things that help to keep love alive. I can promise those things, and if he keeps his end of the deal, then and only then can we promise to love.

 

Any thoughts?

 

I have only read your original post, so to answer your question, YES I believe we can promise to love You aren't asking can we promise to love ONE person forever

 

I take my wedding vows seriously - both times. I promised to love .... etc. I should have written into them "I promise to love and stay true to that love so long as you don't use me as a punching bad or put alcohol above our marriage"

 

I would have stayed with my ex 'forever' had he not done those 2 things. I am with my H now FOREVER unless he hits me, abuses alcohol/drugs or until HE chooses to end our marriage.

 

I also DO believe we can choose who we fall in love with. To fall in love, IN MY VIEW, you must KNOW the person, trust the person, etc., so we most definitely can chose who we fall in love with because love takes time, it takes work and it needs nurturing.

 

The ONLY love I believe that is unconditional is the love I have for my son. There is NOTHING in this entire world he could ever do that would make me stop loving him. Not A Thing.

 

So to answer your questions, yes, I personally do believe we can promise to love.

[fooled once]

The butterflies always go away. But that's not love. I can't promise to always feel butterflies when I see you, but I can promise that if I ever loved you, I always will.

 

I am not this way. Just because I loved someone once doesn't mean I will always love them.

 

I loved my ex, but HIS ACTIONS killed that love.

 

I loved someone (family) before, but his abuse killed that love.

 

Same with friends...in my view, you can love friends dearly, but if they intentionally hurt you over and over and have no regret for their actions, I can't and won't love them forever. I may MISS them at times, but there is no longer love. Love for me is very special, it isn't given out willy nilly. I am not one of those people who profess to "love you" when I really don't. I don't use those words lightly nor do I feel those feelings for just anyone. And once I do love, it does take a lot for me to stop, but it can and has stopped.

[SidLyon]

I borrowed a couple of quotes from November-Rain's thread which seems to be going off topic:

 

 

 

 

 

I've been thinking about this topic for quite some time. I adamantly believe love can be promised IF and only if we are mature, know ourselves, and have the ability to stay true to something as we evolve in other areas. I adamantly don't believe love can be promised otherwise.

 

Just a small example. MM chose to marry at a very young age. He's pretty sure he fell out of love with his W some time before his wedding day but went through on his promise to M her. He has been faking it for nearly 40 years now. He kept his promise to remain M, but not in loving her.

 

Another example. I loved my exH dearly and did everything in my power to ensure love would survive. I supported him emotionally and financially, I bought books on Rs, I got us into counseling. When I recognized he was never going to do the OTHER work to support love, my love for him eventually died.

 

But we both M young, both around the age of 21. Now that we're mature, know ourselves very well, physically, mentally, and emotionally, we know what our needs are and know how to sustain Rs that are very dear to us.

 

I have often suggested that love cannot be promised, but if that is true, how can MM trust that I will always love him? Why would he leave his W if I cannot promise I will love him forever or at least until death do us part?

 

Since my A I have pondered this 'promise to love forever issue' and I think I've finally come to a conclusion: I know I love him already and I know he loves me. This is a fact, not a promise. We can only promise to try to work things out, try to communicate, be there for each other, and do the OTHER things that help to keep love alive. I can promise those things, and if he keeps his end of the deal, then and only then can we promise to love.

 

Any thoughts?

 

I have read only the first post in this thread so I don't know what everyone else has said.

 

Yes, for me future love can be promised. For example I know I will always love my children. The same with romantic partners. I have been in love several times but only made the future love promise to one person (the one I married). He betrayed me abysmally yet I still love him and will continue to do so irrespective of what happens to our relationship.

 

I accept that other posters know that they themselves cannot make such a promise, but I object to those that shout (using capitals when in writing) to someone else, that future love cannot be promised. For me it can be.

 

Sid

[Silly_Girl]

I've read posts in other forums by parents whose children have sexually abused their other children, taken drugs, stolen from them, beaten them.

 

They no longer love their child and never will.

 

I know it's really extreme but it's why I think all love is conditional.

 

And I love my son more than I ever knew it was possible to love someone. I think he is a beautiful, kind, conscientious and funny person, with untold qualities and he shines a light on my world. The thought of being without him has, at times, made me feel physically sick. I can't for half a seconnd imagine it, but if he behaved as some boys do, I'd stop loving him eventually, I imagine.

[jthorne]

And real love is?

 

I can be in love and love the same person. This is what I call selfish love.

 

I can love a person without being in love with them. This is altruistic love.

 

I can't see how one of these loves would be more real than the other.

Ok, I was really tired when I posted, but what I mean is really a combination of things already posted.

When I get married, I will promise my love to my spouse forever. And I will give it willingly and freely, in sickness and in health, blah blah blah. I won't just bail on him when he stops meeting my needs. At that point, it would be up to us to work on those things together. However, if conditions drastically changed, it's up to me to have enough integrity to speak up. It is not appropriate for me to promise my love forever, but decide I no longer love him and then not tell him I intend to break my promise.

 

I'm going to differ with you a bit on altruistic love. Altruistic to me implies obligation, and means giving and receiving nothing in return. I think in any love relationship, both parties receive something in return, even if it's just self validation. I personally do not feel obligated to love anyone, not even my parents. I don't love them because I have to. I love them because I want to. OTOH, my aunt is a very bad person. Though she is my family, I do not love her, nor do I feel obligated to love her.

[fooled once]

I've read posts in other forums by parents whose children have sexually abused their other children, taken drugs, stolen from them, beaten them.

 

They no longer love their child and never will.

 

I know it's really extreme but it's why I think all love is conditional.

 

And I love my son more than I ever knew it was possible to love someone. I think he is a beautiful, kind, conscientious and funny person, with untold qualities and he shines a light on my world. The thought of being without him has, at times, made me feel physically sick. I can't for half a seconnd imagine it, but if he behaved as some boys do, I'd stop loving him eventually, I imagine.

 

See, and I can't image no matter what my son ever does - even horrible things - ever not loving him. Just differences in views. No 2 people feel the same about anything. I know my H loves his children very differently than I love my son -- he can go weeks without talking to them (they are grown and live 3000 miles away), but I have to talk to my son at least 2 times a week and see him weekly (and he is grown but lives nearby). I was devastated when he moved out; even though everyone told me that meant I did a great job and he was ready to go - I wasn't ready and it took another year for me to really accept it. There aren't that many 18 year old's today who move out, with no financial help from parents and stay moved out. It has been 3 years now and since he just bought his own house, I am pretty sure he isn't moving back home anytime soon

 

He has and will continue to make mistakes in life (part of growing up) but nope, my love for him is unconditional. I know many will disagree, but that's fine - we each love differently!

[bittersweet memories]

See, and I can't image no matter what my son ever does - even horrible things - ever not loving him. Just differences in views. No 2 people feel the same about anything. I know my H loves his children very differently than I love my son -- he can go weeks without talking to them (they are grown and live 3000 miles away), but I have to talk to my son at least 2 times a week and see him weekly (and he is grown but lives nearby). I was devastated when he moved out; even though everyone told me that meant I did a great job and he was ready to go - I wasn't ready and it took another year for me to really accept it. There aren't that many 18 year old's today who move out, with no financial help from parents and stay moved out. It has been 3 years now and since he just bought his own house, I am pretty sure he isn't moving back home anytime soon

 

He has and will continue to make mistakes in life (part of growing up) but nope, my love for him is unconditional. I know many will disagree, but that's fine - we each love differently!

 

Beautiful! He's very lucky to have a mom like you.

[pureinheart]

On the lines of unconditional love I found this and thought it to be extremely profound...

 

 

The civil rights leader Martin Luther King Jr. was quoted as saying “I believe that unarmed truth and unconditional love will have the final word in reality”.