I want my troubled sister to turn over her paychecks to me. Reasonable?

[magda]

Having family issues. You can read some backstory here:

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t231106/

 

The gist is: my sister has a long and not pretty history. Drugs, anger, now a marriage ending really badly and somewhat violently. She has been mixed up with a lot of gross people, always had weird shady things going on, selling this, buying that, broke but then has money. She needs to get normal!!!! I don't want to enable her, I don't want to suffer for it any more, but I want to help her.

 

But lately drugs hasn't been the problem as much as this ending relationship, detailed a bit more in the link above.

 

So she may or may not be needing a place to stay (she's sleeping on my couch for tonight, saying her relationship is over, but she said that emphatically earlier this week as well and turned on a dime) depending on what tomorrow brings, my poor grandmother has space and is willing to let my sister move in (again), but last time my sister lived there it didn't end well. Because she was doing/selling drugs, mainly. It wasn't pretty and she got worse and worse until we had to kick her out. Lately drugs haven't seemed to be an issue with her but she's probably still doing them, I don't know. I used to be able to tell when she'd been up for a couple days and I haven't noticed that for a long time. She actually has seemed pretty great, relatively, until this guy started being a jackass. I think it's prudent to act as if drugs are a prroblem, though.

 

SO in order to get my sister a place to stay so she can leave her ******* husband and save for the next apartment, she needs to agree to rules. Previously we've tried a lot of things.... This is new: I think the only way I want to help her is if she just turns her paychecks over to me. I pay back people with it, I pay my grandmother some rent from it, I buy her a bus pass, a carton of cigarettes, maybe gift cards to the grocery store, pay her phone bill, some pocket money and most importantly SAVE the rest.

I also want there to be a rule that no one can come to the house but a few "good friends" and no all-nighters. I would really like to force her into voluteer work or counseling as well. She sucks at life, she needs to let go of her autonomy for awhile, the way I see it. I think the money part is the most important. If she didn't have money to blow, she could only get from here to there. Anyone who is not a real friend would probably disappear - have nothing in it for them. She would not be able to run out of money for important stuff and use that for excuses to either do something illegal or just not pay my gramma.

 

But my sister is a 31 year old, and she's not always crazy, she's often downright enjoyable. I think a social life and some feeling of empowerment will be necessary to her recovery and I don't think it will work if it is humiliating. Not to mention, now that this relationship is over, she's suicidal... she needs to see that she can have a better life, and have space to find it.

 

I think it needs to be my way or the highway, but my way has to be fair but firm. The volunteering is probably a pipe dream. She's not stranger to counseling. The problem is getting her to actually go. she's lazy and I don't want to have to drag her places, that's just wasting my time. She has to do it and be grateful or I don't want to deal with her, ya know? If she doesn't want to go along with my general plan whatever that ends up being, I'll just have to go over and put her stuff out on the porch, I guess. That will be it: do it this way, or go.

 

I don't know how else to ensure my grandmother's well-being and have this work. My grandmother is too old to handle being taken advantage of for herself. I can't be there all the time nor can I have her abusing/defying my Grandma in any way. Not to mention this is probably the 200th sleepless night of my lifetime because of her... I have an adult cousin also living at my Grandmother's house so I'll have someone else looking out for my Grandma and watching the situation.

 

Does anyone have any advice for me? My grandma wants me to handle all the "rules" and basically be my sister's handler-from-afar. My apparent lot in life! I was wondering if I should call a social worker or something.

 

Any one else have any advice, resources I may not be aware of, opinions on how to handle her or opinion that I should tell her she's on her own?

[Ronni_W]

Any one else have any advice, resources I may not be aware of,

You might try Al-Anon for guidance with what "rules" might be appropriate/helpful/effective and also how to implement them. EVEN IF substance abuse is not your sister's biggest problem right now, the basic principles of dealing with and helping an under-responsible adult would be similar. A different source to gather information would be from the counselors at shelters for abused women.

 

Share the info and brainstorm with Grandma, your cousin and any others who are interested in helping your sister get back on her feet, create a 'plan of action' and then let your sister know what you're each willing to do to help her get back on her feet. Be clear about limits, boundaries and expectations. If it's going to work for the best, she needs to want the help and be willing to agree to whatever "conditions" you'all put in place.

 

Let your sister know that the 'plan' is not just based on ideas that you pulled from your collective asses...but on solid info that you acquired from relevant, knowledgeable organizations.

 

For what it's worth. I think your Grandma is copping out. If she really wants to be a helpful support, she needs to be more actively engaged than just offering a place to stay. IMO. But find out what Al-Anon's take is, on these types of arrangements and family dynamics.

 

Best of luck to all of you.

[magda]

I see your point. I will try to find some outside resources for what to do so she doesn't take it as totally arbitrary.

 

The thing about Grandma is she's 84, has a bit of dementia and health problems. She's concerned but she can only do so much.

 

Now the hard part is just getting her to make a choice. My sister is here at my house today. I think she's on painkillers again. I have a friend coming by to help me talk sense but I doubt much will happen. She's mad at him so she'll agree with us but as far as long-term, I think she's just going to milk me for all I'm worth. Going to have to push her out I guess.

[brainygirl]

Don't impose this mess on an 84 year old with dementia! Take her in yourself if you think she needs a place to stay.

 

I think she'd be better off going to treatment or something from the sound of it. Get her to go to some meetings and seek counseling. Go to alanon meetings yourself.

 

And if she keeps burning people in the family, cut ties.

[Ronni_W]

as far as long-term, I think she's just going to milk me for all I'm worth. Going to have to push her out I guess.

You make an excellent point! Unless you start to set firm boundaries and stand your own ground, you definitely will be enabling her and allowing her to take advantage of you.

 

Codependents Anonymous as another very good resource for this type of relationship dynamic. codependents.org is their main site.

 

Given your Grandma's circumstances, I agree with brainygirl. But put a limit on how long your sis can stay with you, be clear with her about what you expect and will not put up with, and be ready to put her out if she does not live up to her side of the deal.

 

Based on how she's acted in the past, it doesn't sound as if she is going to make better choices for herself until she stops having the "safety net" that her enablers are willingly providing.

 

It's not easy to do "tough love" -- Al-Anon and CoDA will also be able to offer you the strength and support that you may need to follow through on doing what's in your sister's long-term best interest...which is also what's in the long-term best interest of you, other family members, and friends.

For yourself, you might consider it short-term pain for long-term gain.

 

Sending courage, wisdom and strength to all of you.

[magda]

Yeah. You guys are right. I was trying to be there for her... I'm done. I never thought she was "unreachable" until I suspected her of stealing from me when she was here. She's going to do anything to please her money-obsessed man. I'm a resource to her.

 

Previously she mostly tip-toed around me but I now recognize that she's just gone. I told my Gramma how I feel. She may still let her spend a night but we agree that we're not going to put ourselves out anymore. She's made a strong case for being a hopeless cause. Now that we know these new details it makes it an easy choice. Well, not easy, but still.

 

I'm sorry she didn't steal from me a year ago. I didn't before see that she uses me like a tool to get what she wants. In my eyes I don't give her all that much. Usually when people talk of enablers they describe it in such a way that I'm like "well you'd have to be an idiot to do that." I've always had boundaries, and I've told her the news when she crossed them. She hides things from me because she knows what I'll say.

 

I'm done. You're right. She's horrible for me and my family and I'm done. I already told her. I don't even want to be her "friend" anymore but we'll see. I feel like she died, or that I finally woke up and saw that she's been dead.

Edited May 20, 2010 by magda

[Ronni_W]

magda,

Your sister still needs your love, compassion and support.

 

It's just that...well, I know can be difficult to admit that you made mistakes in your selection of the type of support that you gave her in the past. But that's really the truth of it -- you're the one who was well-intentioned but misguidedly doing the enabling (along with Grandma and others.) It does not make your sister "horrible" or a "hopeless cause".

 

I also get that it is easier to not feel guilty if we 'demonize' (judge, convict, sentence and reject) the person who we realize we must say "no" to. But that don't make it a wise/functional strategy.

 

You do have the perfect right to say 'no' to ANYBODY, and to protect your own mind, body, spirit, heart and your material possessions. In fact, that is your adult responsibility and obligation to yourself. In reality, self-care is not something to feel the slightest bit guilty about. Yes?

[magda]

You're right, Ronnie. That post was just a mood I was in. Today I'm struggling with this still but feeling over the anger. I don't think she's a lost cause but I know in her own little way she's trying and that thought and her hopelessness that is seemingly inevitable in this stupid situation is heartbreaking. But I realize... it's been so long. So much of me is tied up in this situation that I want to distance myself and say, "call me when you're better." Purely economically, she's worse for me than she is good. Self-preservation tells me: be done. Then the other part: don't give up completely.

 

I had written her a rather compassionate but also firm letter basically saying I was going to distance myself from her. But I haven't resolved my feelings on the matter so I haven't sent it.

[magda]

The thing is, Ronni. She's on a countdown to being arrested right now. I know that she's doing drugs and that he sells them. And they are pretty dumb. Maybe after he goes back to jail and she loses her job and goes to jail herself I'll see what she does. But what I am not wanting to do is house her after such time while she has no job and lecture her about what to do and battle with her over things she isn't doing. No more temporary charades of getting better. I have never before been able to help her, so what does she need me for? I've been a wreck for a week and a half. Not sleeping, forgot to take my daughter to her dance class and her cooking class. I missed my own class because I was sleeping after being up all night. I cancelled a bbq at my house pretending to be sick. I can't know about her problems and not go crazy tripping about it. I've never helped her, she's still the same. I guess I do need al-anon or something. But I just want to figure out where I stand, get a plan, and stop thinking about it so going around talking in meetings and thinking about it all the time does not sound attractive to me.

Edited May 20, 2010 by magda

[Ronni_W]

Hugs, magda.

I know it's difficult. And I know that, intellectually, you know what you "should" be doing. It's just getting to that same place, emotionally, which is so darned tough.

 

You have done more than enough, as you're well aware. You can give yourself permission to quit anytime now. Especially since it's causing so much disruption/chaos in your and your daughter's lives, I would say it is PAST time for you to just say 'no'. Just tell her that both you and Grandma have reached your limits, and do not have the inner resources to deal with the repercussions of her bad choices and decisions. Tell her that neither of you can offer her a place to stay (not even for one night) or anything else.

 

You wish her well, you want her to be safe and happy...but all you have it in you to do right now, is send positive thoughts/prayers from a distance.

 

And then, stand firm. Do not let her manipulate you or Grandma with threats of any kind. Given her lifestyle, you can bet she is a survivor. She will somehow manage...or muddle through. We've all had to do that and she doesn't get an exemption. You have ALL been carrying on under the misguided belief/idea that she gets an exemption, perhaps?

 

BTW. You don't need to sit in on any meetings. Just connect with the organizations and ask for a list of articles, pamphlets or books you can read on your own.

 

In any event. Good luck with all of it. As I said, I know it's much easier talked about than done. But. You've done more than enough, yes?

[magda]

Thank you a lot for all your replies, Ronni. Today I was taking a walk and just totally worked through this for the moment. I feel like, I know what my plan is. I won't write her a letter, I'll just back off. She'll probably catch the vibe and hesitate to ask me anything. Then, I'll just let her do the talking.

 

Seems like a plan I could've been following all along. I will see her less often than I have been recently but maybe not that much else will change except I think I may be successful at dropping this sense of responsibility I have been feeling, and the guilt. We'll see, of course, what happens later. But I feel like the weight has been lifted for now and I'm gonna get back to the rest of my life. thanks again, I really appreciate your advice and just having a sounding board.