Building real confidence without success or affirmations.

[Lights]

When you're among people - do you give out a positive vibe? Are you this guy who is genuinely happy with his life and with what he does and where he's heading, or are you rather this 'whatever...'-guy who just stands around and watches other people waiting for something to happen.

I actually don't know. I don't that often stand around or stay in one place unless the situation requires it (e.g. waiting in line, sitting/standing in a train, studying in class or in a library, etc.), so there really isn't any standing around or waiting for something that ever really happens.

 

I'm not happy with my life and where it's headed. This lack of ability to attract desirables (and not even just romantosexual desirables) has wrecked far too many areas of my life.

 

I've noticed that the first one is somehow attractive. Not only to women but to people in general. If you're open to people in general, girls notice that and even if it's not them initiating a conversation they won't perceive you as a creeper (this was my biggest concern some time ago).

What's a creeper?

 

I'm just saying - for me to become the person who I'm now, working out helped tremendously!

 

Congratulations Lakeside Runner!

 

Then just do more of whatever you have confidence in. Let's say you're strong career-wise. When you're on a date, talk about how your growth in your career is important to you and what you're doing to achieve it. The confidence and passion you have in that area of life is attractive and will be projected.

I must have miscommunicated something. There is no dating going on. I am currently apparently unable to get people to even recognize my existence or even respond to a hi.

 

It's OK if you don't have a super successful track record with women.

Perhaps, but a track record of absolute failure isn't helping me build confidence in my attractiveness.

 

I thought it was cute and was extremely flattered when a guy told me he'd never really dated before and wasn't sure what to do.

Wow. People where I come from do not show any similar mercy. I need to move out of this hellhole. The moment I find some well-paying international jobs in my field, I am so out of here.

Edited May 13, 2010 by Lights

[SoccerPlaya]

Don't try to build your confidence through "flings", dating, or relationships. Even confident people face rejection - the difference is that they don't beat them selves up about it.

 

Someone on here already said this, but real confidence comes through other things: friends, family, hobbies, career...even religion. When you excel in these other areas in your life you will start to gain confidence in yourself, and that's what people are drawn to.

 

In my non-professional opinion, it sounds like you need to take a hiatus from looking for self-affirmation in sexual partners and start building self-esteem in other areas of your life. Once you are happy in other areas of your life, the confidence will come naturally.

 

Good luck.

[Lights]

http://www.scotthyoung.com/blog/2006/09/20/the-confidence-myth/

 

http://www.scotthyoung.com/blog/2007/04/08/the-myth-of-confidence/

 

Build skill in talking to women first. Go to the gym and get an attractive body and attractive job and attractive hobbies. You can't have confidence without the success first. It just doesn't work.

 

Interesting article. How is this skill built? It clearly is not built on trial and error, or through experience; otherwise, I'd be a master of it by now.

 

For now, considering how horrifyingly bad things have become, I would like to scale down the goal and become highly skillful in getting people to respond to a hi. How would I build that skill?

 

 

Someone on here already said this, but real confidence comes through other things: friends, family, hobbies, career...even religion. When you excel in these other areas in your life you will start to gain confidence in yourself, and that's what people are drawn to.

Sorry. My life seems to have disproven that, as I have written before. Improved ability in unrelated areas of my life has not yielded that result.

 

Once you are happy in other areas of your life, the confidence will come naturally.

 

Once again, that has not been the case. Thanks anyways.

[Engadget]

One tip I can give you, just go out and ACT confident. It may not work, but eventually it may give you the actual confidence to do things.

 

Do you have any social phobias or anything? Do you find you shy away from big groups or anything like that?

[Rhythmic]

Interesting article. How is this skill built? It clearly is not built on trial and error, or through experience; otherwise, I'd be a master of it by now.

 

For now, considering how horrifyingly bad things have become, I would like to scale down the goal and become highly skillful in getting people to respond to a hi. How would I build that skill?

 

 

 

 

 

 

If you can't get people to respond to a hi then you can't build skill. you do it the same way you would do anything else. How do you get good at basketball? Go play it and go play with people better than you and mimic what they do. If you can't get people to respond to you at all that is like having a broken leg and you can't even run on the court to play ball.

 

Which in that case you'd have to go get your leg fix. Or for you. Go fix whatever you can that causes people to discount you as super creepy. Get your but in the gym and get a better body. Get a better paying job to afford better and higher status clothes. Then finally, Go do some volunteer work or do anything that requires having to interact with people as a necessity and start building a social circle.

[sagetalk]

aptitude, beliefs and emotional control.

 

That's it right there. If I had a daughter I would tell her to find a man that had those three things and she would have a real catch. Excellent quote on defining what characteristics a real man has .

 

Confidence can be faked or misplaced (and often is), those three items above can only be faked for a short period of time.

[ADF]

First of all, you recognize that we men have been WAY oversold on this it-all-comes-down-to-confidence b____s___. Sure, feeling confident is great. But no one can feel confident all the time, just like no one can feel happy all the time. Life is all about joy and misery, confidence and doubt, anxiety and relief, anticipation and disappointment. All of us, every one, lives through the whole range of human emotions. Anyone who struts around 24/7 exuding "confidence" is good actor, nothing more.

 

Second, recognize that being confident will NOT get you whatever you want in life. To believe it can is wish-thinking, magical thinking. It is great when a man works up the confidence to ask a woman out. But he should still realize that while he can ask, her answer may still be "no."

 

Third, just live your life and stop trying to act so powerful or fascinating or whatever. There is no one right way for people to be. There's probably nothing wrong with you. Revel in you eccentricity rather than try to force yourself into a mold that wasn't caste for you.

[sumdude]

con·fi·dence

   /ˈkɒnfɪdəns/ Show Spelled[kon-fi-duhns]

–noun

1.

full trust; belief in the powers, trustworthiness, or reliability of a person or thing: We have every confidence in their ability to succeed.

2.

belief in oneself and one's powers or abilities; self-confidence; self-reliance; assurance: His lack of confidence defeated him.

3.

certitude; assurance: He described the situation with such confidence that the audience believed him completely.

 

That's what it means. I think what some are confusing it with and ranting about is something called...

 

 

ar·ro·gance

   /ˈærəgəns/ Show Spelled[ar-uh-guhns]

–noun

offensive display of superiority or self-importance; overbearing pride.

[Rhythmic]

con·fi·dence

   /ˈkɒnfɪdəns/ Show Spelled[kon-fi-duhns]

–noun

1.

full trust; belief in the powers, trustworthiness, or reliability of a person or thing: We have every confidence in their ability to succeed.

2.

belief in oneself and one's powers or abilities; self-confidence; self-reliance; assurance: His lack of confidence defeated him.

3.

certitude; assurance: He described the situation with such confidence that the audience believed him completely.

 

That's what it means. I think what some are confusing it with and ranting about is something called...

 

 

ar·ro·gance

   /ˈærəgəns/ Show Spelled[ar-uh-guhns]

–noun

offensive display of superiority or self-importance; overbearing pride.

 

 

 

 

The difference between confidence and arrogance is ability.

[impz]

I do apologize if these advice has been given by others. This is more like a step by step way to make yourself more confident. Hopefully it will work...

 

1. Engage in positive activities. Go to the gym, go to play sports, go jogging. Do these activities regularly so that you can first feel good about your body. Then that's one thing into your confident portfolio. You do that, so it's good.

 

2. Go for dancing, cooking or public communication classes. Any of the three classes provide opportunities to meet up for casual friendships and boost your confidence through these classes. They allow you to learn and express yourself, and stop wallowing in "oh, I suck, I suck mentality." You seem to lack the charisma to talk to women, from how people from the opposite sex avoid you like a plague (or that is how it seems).

3. Read up on female conversation topics. I am making a wild guess, but I guess you know little about female topics (be it entertainment, current affairs, fashion, tv series, work, hobbies?). Go read up a bit of everything, so that women find you interesting. You don't need to be a dictionary or a know-it-all, but know enough so that the woman finds some common topics between you two to have some interest to be your friend.

 

4. Thank yourself for mundane things. For example, you thank yourself for throwing away the rubbish in your own home. You thank yourself for waking up early. You thank yourself for paying your parents a visit. You thank yourself for initiating hi. When you start seeing every little thing as a good thing to thank, things might suddenly seem more promising.

 

Hopefully that helps a little. More importantly, confidence does not mean you get everything you want. Life isn't fair. However, confidence allows you to love yourself a bit more and know that you have the ability to bounce back after disappointment. People without confidence will just get so fixated on their mistakes that they will find any negative reinforcement to support their argument that they fail at everything. Confident people wallow in self-pity for a while, then move on to make sure that they learn from this mistake.

Edited May 14, 2010 by impz

[sumdude]

The difference between confidence and arrogance is ability.

 

Have to disagree. The are many very capable people who are confident and arrogant on top. There are also a lot of very capable people who are confident yet not arrogant.

 

The worst is one who is neither competent nor confident yet project arrogance to cover up the internal knowledge that they're totally full of it. Has a boss like that for three years, two days before I was going to walk out on a job I had for 10 years... he was fired.

[USMCHokie]

The best advice I can give you based on what I've read so far in this thread is that you actually have to want to succeed in dating.

 

Even after all the advice you have received in this thread, you have responded with nothing but excuses, self-deprecating remarks, and references to all your past failures. It's almost like you are more comfortable and content with staying a dating failure than to actually put in the effort and take the risks for a chance to succeed. I know, because I've been exactly where you are.

 

And I know you think you're stuck in a precarious little chicken and egg situation here...where you feel that you need confidence to make that first move, but you can't have confidence until you get positive feedback from women...so you have two options here to get out of this infinite loop:

 

(1) Pull your head out of your ass and make that first move, without fear or worry of rejection; OR

 

(2) Stop valuing yourself based on what other people think of you. Your self-worth should be based on how great of a person you feel you are. Past dating failures, present dating failures, and future potential dating failures should have absolutely no bearing on how you feel about yourself. But if you truly believe that you are not a worthwhile person, then there's nothing anyone can do to help you.

 

 

People can recommend all sorts of courses of action, ways and methods to improve yourself, and tips to fake confidence, et. al, but ultimately it's up to you to want to unf*ck yourself. Losing the defeatist attitude is the single most important thing you can possibly do right now, if nothing else.

[MrNate]

I see you're getting all these deep responses, but I prefer to keep it simple for you bud. Confidence stems from one thing: Making good decisions. No affirmations needed whatsoever.

 

 

 

Think about it.

 

 

MrNate

[Trimmer]

Hey, Lights - just hanging out to see if you get anything new and useful this time... Good luck.

[somedude81]

When I went to high school I was still a shy, nerdy kid. I became good friends with a girl, and we later started having sex and it changed slowly after that. I got in with the "wrong crowd" and began partying more than going to school, was called a "player", which I still laugh about because I've been called it recently despite being the opposite.

 

I don't know, it just happened slowly. I used to be averse to hanging out with groups of people I didn't know. Now I can do it and have no qualms about it. Working out back then helped, and it was kind of a slow, natural transformation I guess.

So the magic is sex? I have no doubt that regular sex does wonders for a mans confidence. I still have yet to actually have sex without paying for it, so no wonder I don't have any confidence.

 

http://www.scotthyoung.com/blog/2006/09/20/the-confidence-myth/

 

 

http://www.scotthyoung.com/blog/2007/04/08/the-myth-of-confidence/

 

 

Build skill in talking to women first. Go to the gym and get an attractive body and attractive job and attractive hobbies. You can't have confidence without the success first. It just doesn't work.

Great articles and I'm going to read the rest of them. I disagree with you that having an "attractive body and attractive job and attractive hobbies" will do anything for your confidence. None of those have any affect on 'social confidence.'

 

One tip I can give you, just go out and ACT confident. It may not work, but eventually it may give you the actual confidence to do things.

How do you act confident? Confidence basically affects ones ability to take risks and do what they really want to. Trying to act confident is irrelevant.

 

Don't try to build your confidence through "flings", dating, or relationships.

If one is unconfident because they have not had a sex life, then wouldn't having one give confidence?

 

From what I've read, being able have sex (attract and bed women) actually builds up a mans confidence.

[Rhythmic]

 

Great articles and I'm going to read the rest of them. I disagree with you that having an "attractive body and attractive job and attractive hobbies" will do anything for your confidence. None of those have any affect on 'social confidence.'

 

 

 

 

They aren't suppose to do anything for your confidence by themselves. But they will help you attract more women and that success will give you more confidence.

 

Confidence is a by product of success not the cause of it. You can't have confidence without success. Those attributes will help you become successful with women and social settings.

[somedude81]

They aren't suppose to do anything for your confidence by themselves. But they will help you attract more women and that success will give you more confidence.

 

Confidence is a by product of success not the cause of it. You can't have confidence without success. Those attributes will help you become successful with women and social settings.

Having a good job is irrelevant if your going to school. Not everybody can have an attractive body and it takes a lot of time and effort to get one. I'm currently work on mine but it'll probably be a year till I get to where I want to be. Still there are tons of guys that have bad bodies and have women. I don't even know what an attractive hobby is or how it will help.

 

I do agree with you that "confidence is a by product of success not the cause of it." My belief is that being confident leads to more success and it keeps getting easier. But the first success that create confidence were not caused by confidence. They actually happened because of luck. Some people "got lucky" and got confidence from that success and so on. Some people are still waiting for their lucky break.

[Rhythmic]

Still there are tons of guys that have bad bodies and have women. I don't even know what an attractive hobby is or how it will help.

 

 

 

And those people have natural charismatic personalities and obviously you nor the other guys with issues have one of those personalities so you have to try harder. Or just got lucky with somebody just as fat and ugly as they are. I hardly ever see good looking guy with fat ugly chick. It is rare.

 

 

But if you rather wait around and "be lucky" then have fun. Some guys have that *it* factor and others don't. The ones that don't have it got to work harder.

[kassy]

Not everybody can have an attractive body and it takes a lot of time and effort to get one. I'm currently work on mine but it'll probably be a year till I get to where I want to be. Still there are tons of guys that have bad bodies and have women. I don't even know what an attractive hobby is or how it will help.

 

I do agree with you that "confidence is a by product of success not the cause of it." My belief is that being confident leads to more success and it keeps getting easier. But the first success that create confidence were not caused by confidence. They actually happened because of luck. Some people "got lucky" and got confidence from that success and so on. Some people are still waiting for their lucky break.

 

If you work at it anyone can have a pretty great body...

 

An attractive hobby... well generally if you enjoy something there is something attractive about meeting someone else who also does it - I like cycling, I find guys who cycle very attractive... make sense? Find a hobby you like and then meet women who also like it. Hardly rocket science.

 

So you think the first success people had in life was simply luck? nothing to do with, working hard, or seizing an opportunity that came their way and running with it (when many people don't seize opportunities). Says a lot about your world view I think.

[somedude81]

An attractive hobby... well generally if you enjoy something there is something attractive about meeting someone else who also does it - I like cycling, I find guys who cycle very attractive... make sense? Find a hobby you like and then meet women who also like it. Hardly rocket science.

 

So you think the first success people had in life was simply luck? nothing to do with, working hard, or seizing an opportunity that came their way and running with it (when many people don't seize opportunities). Says a lot about your world view I think.

I guess the only things I do that can be considered attractive hobbies is surfing and salsa dancing. I'm not that good with either. I also don't know anybody to go with. Though I will put in the effort to meet people.

 

When I mentioned the first success's, I'm really talking about romantically. When a boy is in his early teens, finding the first girlfriend is all about luck. Nobody knows what they are doing yet. I also stopped growing very early and only got to 5'6 and I also had bad acne. Most girls despised me. So I never got the neccessary success to build confidence. Now I'm 29 trying to do things that I should have figured out when I was 19.

[Engadget]

How do you act confident? Confidence basically affects ones ability to take risks and do what they really want to. Trying to act confident is irrelevant.

 

What I mean is go outside your comfort zone and do something someone confident would.

 

For example, if you see a cute girl just walk up to her and ask her out. She may shoot you down, but use it as practice.

[Philetus]

The best advice I can give you based on what I've read so far in this thread is that you actually have to want to succeed in dating.

 

Even after all the advice you have received in this thread, you have responded with nothing but excuses, self-deprecating remarks, and references to all your past failures. It's almost like you are more comfortable and content with staying a dating failure than to actually put in the effort and take the risks for a chance to succeed. I know, because I've been exactly where you are.

 

And I know you think you're stuck in a precarious little chicken and egg situation here...where you feel that you need confidence to make that first move, but you can't have confidence until you get positive feedback from women...so you have two options here to get out of this infinite loop:

 

(1) Pull your head out of your ass and make that first move, without fear or worry of rejection; OR

 

(2) Stop valuing yourself based on what other people think of you. Your self-worth should be based on how great of a person you feel you are. Past dating failures, present dating failures, and future potential dating failures should have absolutely no bearing on how you feel about yourself. But if you truly believe that you are not a worthwhile person, then there's nothing anyone can do to help you.

 

 

People can recommend all sorts of courses of action, ways and methods to improve yourself, and tips to fake confidence, et. al, but ultimately it's up to you to want to unf*ck yourself. Losing the defeatist attitude is the single most important thing you can possibly do right now, if nothing else.

 

 

Very well said!

 

No one will help you but yourself. It is easy to shrug your shoulders and say, "there is nothing I can do" or blame it on other people. But, the world isn't fair and no one gives you anything.

 

As the song goes, "You've only one life to live." If you were told tomorrow that you had six months to live would you be happy with how you lived it? If not, get a strategy to change.

[Ross PK]

until then, i will give you this tip:

first you need to lose the attitude. it will be impossible to look at yourself in a positive light if you feel like everything you have done has been a failure.

 

What attitude?

 

He's just telling the truth because he needs help. Do you really expect him to pretend to himself and to others that he's been successful with women and he's been successful socially?

 

What good would that do?

[electricity]

Also, one thing that seems to go woefully unaddressed: talk about her! When you approach a woman you're interested in, don't make it all about you. Ask her what she does for a career, what she likes doing in her spare time, what kind of movies she likes, how long she's been in the area - show that you're interested in her as a human being, not a mere potential fling. If you're lucky, she'll mention she likes a particular kind of movie or food or SOMETHING, and you can ask if she'd like to see a movie with you or that you know this great <insert genre> restaurant, would she like to get dinner sometime? Even if you don't click, you don't come off as the arrogant creepy guy who only talks about himself. Maybe you won't get a date, but you could make a friend... one who has other female friends she might be able to set you up with if you come off as a fun, cool, confident guy.

 

It's so simple, and it's how guys have won me over in the past, and yet most people forget to mention it. And the best part is, you're just trying to make a friend. You have friends, you know how that works, it's easy, you're confident. You accidentally get a girlfriend out of it? Oh well lookit that, cool bonus.

Edited May 14, 2010 by electricity

[carhill]

As a male and observer of male behavior and its results with women, life experience has uniformly, nearly without exception, taught me that women are *attracted* to men they *perceive* as powerful and in charge and going places in life.

 

I'm fortunate to have a mix of male friends and it's interesting to watch these dynamics at work. Regardless of true power/success/confidence, it's how these qualities are *perceived* which drives *attraction*.

 

IOW, simply put, a man can be a true leader, successful, powerful and wealthy, but still not be *attractive* to women. The key? It's how he presents those qualities. The same criteria can apply to the man who has consistently been unsuccessful in his life. It all depends how he presents his lack of success. I'm watching this dynamic currently with some male friends on a regular basis and it's pretty amazing. The best lesson has been understanding why women blew on by me all those decades. It had nothing to do with who I was, rather how they *perceived* me, relevant to their own psychology. In retrospect, I feel I was very fortunate, as I was pursuing women who were patently incompatible. That clarity has inspired new confidence. Knowledge and understanding is indeed power.