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Posted

The pic enrages you--

go back and read my previous post. Why do you desire to hurt yourself at this stage? Because that's what the anger is--causing yourself pain--and that anger can turn inwards to depression. So STOP IT.

 

I don't know why I choose to dwell on it. Can be going along happily and then I allow myself to become entangled in the rage again. Perhaps I don't want to let my guard down completely again. It is easier to come from a position of "strength" when you're angry than when you're weak and sad. I never want to be the stupid wife again.

Posted
I hear ya.... :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

 

Maybe some part of that comes from them choosing really capable wives who don't need "saving".....

 

Yeah, go figure.....:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

 

I have drama in my life now! It's HIM!

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Posted
It is amazing to me, that the people I did confide his affair to, immediately wanted to know how young, how attractive she was, as if men seek that out to begin with.

 

That's our female insecurity projecting.

 

They were stunned to learn that she was slightly younger than I, and not a drop-dead beauty.

 

But she did make him feel like her Knight-In-Shining-Armor.

 

And that was all it apparently took. Solving her damsel in distress dramas, rescuing her was just a substitute for doing the hard work of rescuing himself from a mid-life depression.

 

 

I agree, Spark, with the whole female insecurity thing. She was thin, no question, and for sure dressed slutty. I dress sexy, but in a classy way. There is a HUGE difference. I am thin, tan, in shape, with large breasts and long blonde hair. She looks completely different than me, so I guess I am feeling a bit battered in self-esteem after finally seeing her pics, even though I don't deem her to be more attractive than me at all. Oh, and that's even though I am ten years older than her! Analyzing her every inch trying to see what was so attractive about her. I know it's ridiculous and futile, but it's the way women think sometimes. (Sad to say, I am falling right into that!)

Posted
The pic enrages you--

go back and read my previous post. Why do you desire to hurt yourself at this stage? Because that's what the anger is--causing yourself pain--and that anger can turn inwards to depression. So STOP IT.

 

I don't know why I choose to dwell on it. Can be going along happily and then I allow myself to become entangled in the rage again. Perhaps I don't want to let my guard down completely again. It is easier to come from a position of "strength" when you're angry than when you're weak and sad. I never want to be the stupid wife again.

 

There is truth in this! I am the clearest most concise communicator when I take that anger, center it, and speak my feelings confidently.

 

I too will never be that stupid wife again. And anger does not just go away because you demand it to. Never happens.

 

If a photo enrages you, than you dwell on that until the rage goes away. I spent countless hours staring at thousands of texts and phone calls until they couldn't hurt me anymore.

 

People deal with anger the best they can; some confront, some avoid, but ANGER, like PAIN does not disappear just because you decide to avoid it.

 

It only goes away when it dissipates of it's own accord, however, and often, it needs to be released.

Posted
I agree, Spark, with the whole female insecurity thing. She was thin, no question, and for sure dressed slutty. I dress sexy, but in a classy way. There is a HUGE difference. I am thin, tan, in shape, with large breasts and long blonde hair. She looks completely different than me, so I guess I am feeling a bit battered in self-esteem after finally seeing her pics, even though I don't deem her to be more attractive than me at all. Oh, and that's even though I am ten years older than her! Analyzing her every inch trying to see what was so attractive about her. I know it's ridiculous and futile, but it's the way women think sometimes. (Sad to say, I am falling right into that!)

 

Did the same thing. And it is perfectly normal. Kept trying to grasp my head around his choice. Only in time, did I realize it had less to do with her looks, than it had to filling some unmet need within him. And for us, it wasn't sex.

 

Hey, gorgeous movie stars get cheated on. The bottom line: It had nothing to do with me. And I can live with that.

  • Author
Posted
Are you still dating around? Did your husband forgive your revenge affairs? How does he feel about the affair(s) that you had?

 

Do you really see yourself married after the kids are gone?

 

I am not still dating around. I do get male attention. My revenge A was with an old bf who I had absolutely NO interest in other than making me feel wanted again. After I pulled my head out and came up for breath, (a few weeks) I was done. My H says he forgives me. I came home and immediately confessed. I will say that there are times when I believe that I haven't left/fallen in love/etc because I don't perceive there to be anyone "of quality" that I am remotely interested in. Maybe that says little for my H or maybe that says a lot--I do believe that my H is a wonderful man in most every way but his A. I guess I don't feel anyone measures up to my H. I just wish I could get over his A. Maybe yesterday was such a bad day bc it was the first time I saw her.

 

And, yes, I do see us married after the kids are gone.....most of the time ;)

  • Author
Posted (edited)
One recent book I read stated that in their survey, most marriages had had a breakdown in sexual relations before the affair. However, in some cases, the reality is...a lack of sex is related to the complete marriage and not simply the amount of times the couple has sex.

 

I would say we had a breakdown in sex for about two years before his A started. The sex was about once a week the first year. The second year it decreased to once every two weeks. When we had it though, it was always good.

Edited by aeh
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Posted
We have a virtually sexless marriage. It has its good times. I understand the temptation to seek out or rather yield to an affair, yet I cannot understand how someone cannot look beyond the immediate pleasure. In this case, he simply could have felt desperate and angry.

 

How often did the two of you have sex? You say he is justified, but I wonder.

 

 

I do think he felt desperate and angry. He would get frustrated with me when he would reach for me and I would not be in the mood. He says he felt very rejected. During the second year, as the A was going on, I was keenly aware that there was a bigger dropoff in the amount of sex we had and it even bothered me. I wondered why he never initiated things anymore, but assumed he had gotten used to less sex and it was now fine with him, he had accepted it. We used to have this joke, which I won't go into specifics here, but basically it involved me asking if he had pleasured himself in the shower--totally kidding around....I always assumed he did. He tells me now that he thought I was making fun of him and so for at least that last year, he very very very rarely did that. Oh, okay, so you think I don't want you to masturbate, but I want you to go have an A :eek:

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Posted
Would you feel better if the woman looked better than you or would you now question his love for you? Now at least you can see that he does think you are prettier than her and you feel that you are as well. If she were a sexy model, then you would wonder why he came back to you if it was only about sex. Yes or no?

 

In some of the additional pics I saw of her, I could see that she does have a "cute figure". But again, her face, and the way she dresses.....ick!

 

 

 

It could have been any woman. However, it does take two. She chased him even though she knew he was married. Just as he could have stopped the affair...she could have done so, too.

 

She was married, too, btw.

 

Was this a "we got friendly and happened to have sex" relationship, or was it a "we had a chemical reaction" relationship?"

 

Hmm, good question. I think it was that they got friendly. But he definitely knew it was leading up to sex...and he definitely knew it was inappropriate from the start. As I have mentioned maybe before, my H has always been very possessive so I never really went out with girls before this (on rare occasions, and not to bars or out at night except maybe to a dinner here or there). But him going to lunch one on one with a girl 15 yrs younger than him maybe 8 times gave him PLENTY of opportunity to say, "hmm, maybe I shouldn't be doing this." He had many opportunities to back out of it, to think through it, many stop signs along the way which he didn't heed.

 

 

 

He received nothing negative here but some brief uncomfortable pain in his marriage. What he did receive is the reward of alot of sex with his wife AND sex with another woman. If he complained about the lack of sex with you, then when you two have less sex (which will happen if the root problem isn't solved) he will choose another woman to fill the void IF his affair wasn't simply a situational reaction to his poor marriage at the time.

 

Yes, this burned me up at first. What he got in the end was a TON of sex from me. So see...you go out and have an affair and you get your reward! I think this is what spurred me to have my revenge A. I was going to make sure he felt plenty of pain. (I know this is not a mature way to act and is a decision that had absolutely no integrity whatsoever).

 

We had really gotten to the point where we were all about the kids. We would kiss briefly when he walked in the door but that was it. No cuddling on the sofa, etc. We have made our marriage a priority and on my "up" days, I would say that we do have an awesome relationship. We talk all day, text back and forth, have gone to lunch together EVERYDAY but maybe three for the last year since I found out (!!!), go on dates every weekend. At home our kids see us cuddling and kissing all the time. We are truly excited to see each other.

 

Right now, you feel that sex with him is great again because you feel that you can solve the problem by having sex. Yet in the future, two things could happen....sex can become boring again without a deep love, or the reason the two of you enjoy sex which for you is to keep from losing him and for him is simply the enjoyment of you wanting him (maybe) will disappear. THEN what will happen.

 

I do believe we have a deep love for one another. However, the one thing standing in our way is my intermittent rage that seems to crop up out of the blue a few times a week. We talk through it or I ask him questions, we have discussed it ad nauseum.

 

Sex for both should be an expression of love or it will lose its magic IMO.

 

 

Yes, I totally agree.

 

I disagree. I understand how your husband's serial affairs is a reflection of his overall integrity, but many men and women end up in an affair out of desperation and because they are vulnerable when confronted with the temptation of an affair. Most people cannot imagine choosing an affair even though some do. They do so not because of a lack of integrity per se but in many cases, because of a few weak moments. In no way can their affair be justified due to a "weak moment," but it can be understood.

 

 

If you would have put all the guys who I would have thought would have an affair together, my H would have been one of the last I would have ever chosen. I have had many people tell me this over the years (just in innocent, hypothetical conversations). Also, of the few people I did tell, all were beyond shocked that HE would do such a thing. Everyone comments on how well he treats me, adores me, how I'm his world, etc

 

I agree. While I think affairs do happen because of a lack of sex, I also think that many affairs are an avoidance to fixing the problem in the marriage. It seems that the lack of sex makes it only your problem. IMO it is both. He chose an affair which is horrible, but to fix the problem, both of you need to recognize what has led to the affair.

 

You WILL need to dig deep and re evaluate your marriage.

 

 

I agree, James, that the lack of sex makes it only my problem and that is something that frustrates me. I do think I had some resentment against him regarding a few items and I think it eventually carried over into the bedroom. Also, he was never into kissing so much. Just wanted to get right to the other kind of oral :o. I had complained about this over the years but it never changed so I just kind of gave up. I think this was also a big factor for me in my decreasing sexual appetite for him.

Posted
I agree, Spark, with the whole female insecurity thing. She was thin, no question, and for sure dressed slutty. I dress sexy, but in a classy way. There is a HUGE difference. I am thin, tan, in shape, with large breasts and long blonde hair. She looks completely different than me, so I guess I am feeling a bit battered in self-esteem after finally seeing her pics, even though I don't deem her to be more attractive than me at all. Oh, and that's even though I am ten years older than her! Analyzing her every inch trying to see what was so attractive about her. I know it's ridiculous and futile, but it's the way women think sometimes. (Sad to say, I am falling right into that!)

 

Did your husband dwell on your affair as you did his? Does he care what the OM looked like and asked questions about your affair? How come he was able to forgive you so fast?

Posted

Listen to your anger, AEH. It's telling you something is still not right about the terms of the reconciliation. I mean for Godsake you had a revenge A!

 

Honesty, I think IC would be better than coming to LS alone in your recovery.

Posted (edited)
If you would have put all the guys who I would have thought would have an affair together, my H would have been one of the last I would have ever chosen. I have had many people tell me this over the years (just in innocent, hypothetical conversations). Also, of the few people I did tell, all were beyond shocked that HE would do such a thing. Everyone comments on how well he treats me, adores me, how I'm his world, etc
I'm going to reference my experience with this one. My xMM is a married father of 5, pillar in the community. When I ended the A once, around mothers day, H saw him getting breakfast and flowers for his W at our local grocery store, then they went on their anniversary trip couple weeks later. Two days upon his return, I'm getting emails telling me how much he missed and thinks of me. I mean, WTF? I thought, I can only imagine how his W must think their M is normal and what a wonderful H and father he is. I think some philanders are much better at living double lives. This is where the "shock" comes in. My H knew something was effed up during my A but he just shrugged it off as depression and let me deal with it. I think there is going through the motions of marriage versus having an emotional life partner. For me, I can't settle for anything less than the second and I really didn't understand about myself prior to my A. And this is the part that takes work for me. I need to connect emotionally with my H. Keep him in touch with what I'm feeling. Anger is not a feeling, pain is. If that makes sense. My M has to go deeper, it's just how I'm wired. Wish there was another way than how I got here to understand this important part of myself.

 

ETA: My Sharon Stone quote references this amazing ability some people have to fake a happy m when in fact they're cheating.

 

One more thought. I think telling my H that he wasn't paying enough attention to me and that's why I cheated. And if his response would be more dinners, hugs, how was your day honey? stuff it wouldn't really get to the root of why the A happened. I guess that's how I see your reconciliation. High level and I think that's why the anger crops up for you as often as it does. I'd still feel pretty empty and unsatisfied with my M if my Hs response was just to do more stuff for me. Make sense??

Edited by OFGnomore
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Posted
Did your husband dwell on your affair as you did his? Does he care what the OM looked like and asked questions about your affair? How come he was able to forgive you so fast?

 

Ah, but there is the rub. He asked but a few questions about it and that was it. Said the pain would be too much to handle and put it out of his mind. He tells me he still thinks about it, but he knows why I did it and he doesn't want to know any details. On the other hand, I wanted to know every last little thing--so there were no secrets left between them. He does know a general description about my AP but that is about it. My A took place literally a few weeks after D-Day. Looking back, I was literally out of my mind. It was all such a whirlwind of emotion and I would have done ANYTHING to ease the pain. I am a tee-totaler in normal life, and I actually was having a glass or two (or three!!) of wine every night for a few weeks. It made me feel compassion for people who are alcoholics or drug addicts who have had much worse lives than I and who turn to other means to numb their pain. I had never understood that before. I was in a very bad place. I feel in most ways like I have made tremendous strides. I can't tell you what a different person I am now than I was then (although I would still say I am different from the way I was before his A). I am once again a productive member of society, can focus on those around me. But obviously there is still work to be done...

Posted

Sorry, I'm just rambling. I'm just angry, confused, and it reopens a lot of old wounds. I had been doing pretty well until I saw those pics. Ughhh!

 

does your husband know she is pregnant? as part of his consequences, you could always show him the pic and say, "well....looks like you weren't all that special to her after all";)

  • Author
Posted
I think there is going through the motions of marriage versus having an emotional life partner. For me, I can't settle for anything less than the second and I really didn't understand about myself prior to my A.

 

I get this. I won't live my life and not be passionate anymore. I think I was passionate about everything BUT my husband. Passionate about my hobbie and interests and community, etc But perhaps regarded him as more of a best friend or something....or maybe as a life partner who I just didn't have sex with much anymore which I think had disintegrated bc of my resentment over some ways he had handles some situations with the kids and some life situations we were faced with and couple this with him not kissing...well, ,y desire just dried up.

 

And this is the part that takes work for me. I need to connect emotionally with my H. Keep him in touch with what I'm feeling. Anger is not a feeling, pain is. If that makes sense. My M has to go deeper, it's just how I'm wired. Wish there was another way than how I got here to understand this important part of myself.

 

I agree. Mine has to go deeper too. We talk about everything I think we could possibly talk about. My pain, his pain at witnessing me in such pain, EVERYTHING..

 

ETA: My Sharon Stone quote references this amazing ability some people have to fake a happy m when in fact they're cheating.

 

One more thought. I think telling my H that he wasn't paying enough attention to me and that's why I cheated. And if his response would be more dinners, hugs, how was your day honey? stuff it wouldn't really get to the root of why the A happened. I guess that's how I see your reconciliation. High level and I think that's why the anger crops up for you as often as it does. I'd still feel pretty empty and unsatisfied with my M if my Hs response was just to do more stuff for me. Make sense??

 

 

I truly truly do not mean to be dense. My H always treated me very very very well. And we do talk on a deep level. But I want to know more about what you're saying here. Does it not seem like we have gotten to the root? I think also I keep it stirred up. I didn't visit LS for awhile because I found myself almost TRYING to keep myself angry. It's ridiculous, I know. I am really interested in your opinion OFG.

Posted

One more thought. I think telling my H that he wasn't paying enough attention to me and that's why I cheated. And if his response would be more dinners, hugs, how was your day honey? stuff it wouldn't really get to the root of why the A happened. I guess that's how I see your reconciliation. High level and I think that's why the anger crops up for you as often as it does. I'd still feel pretty empty and unsatisfied with my M if my Hs response was just to do more stuff for me. Make sense??

 

What more could he do or say? What more can you do or say?

Posted

Aeh--

I think what your H needs to do is learn to be a passionate lover. You have given him loads more sex--

what has he done to please you?

You say he can't kiss. Oh, do I understand that! He needs to learn, and you can show him, because you will kiss from your heart and therefore it will be a very good kiss.

Get that man to learn the value of a really intimate loving body hug, the passion that can arise from only a kiss without any other fooling around...how to turn each other into "I want you NOW!" lovers from just kissing.

He can be taught...he can learn, if only he is willing. But he has to learn the value of a kiss. That comes from being taught by you HOW to kiss passionately.

In short, your H needs to learn how to make love to you, instead of just having sex with you.

If he learns, it will change his thinking about sex forever.

For very intimate loving partners...the lovemaking can be so good they are brought to tears by the incredible intimacy.

Posted (edited)
does your husband know she is pregnant? as part of his consequences, you could always show him the pic and say, "well....looks like you weren't all that special to her after all";)

 

As part of his consequences, seriously, Dex, what the hell difference does it make if her H was special to his former lover??? AEH should punish her H with knowledge that his xMW didn't really matter to him? And if AEHs assessment of her H's motives that "it was just sex", that it really wouldn't matter.

Edited by OFGnomore
Posted
What more could he do or say? What more can you do or say?

 

Well this is the part that goes deeper for me, talking to my H about my childhood stuff. Not being afraid, that he'll think I'm too damaged etc. Just listening, being supportive. Allowing yourself to really be known by someone. xMM said something to me that really resonated with what we probably provided to each other. He said, I don't have to be anyone when I'm with you. He was married for almost 20 years and he has to be someone other than himself with his W? The difference between my H and his W is that my H has allowed me to be me. Always has, it was me holding back. And the blow up of my A helped me get to this deeper level of intimacy with my H. That's the best I can explain it. And although my H still feels pain, the anger and need for "revenge" is gone. We've talked, and talked and talked some more about everything. I was patient with him when the outbursts happen, focused on his pain and not his anger. Never tried to rush the reconciliation.

 

AEH, I really think you should consider IC, for yourself and your healing.

Posted
Ah, but there is the rub. He asked but a few questions about it and that was it. Said the pain would be too much to handle and put it out of his mind. He tells me he still thinks about it, but he knows why I did it and he doesn't want to know any details. On the other hand, I wanted to know every last little thing--so there were no secrets left between them. He does know a general description about my AP but that is about it. My A took place literally a few weeks after D-Day. Looking back, I was literally out of my mind. ......,etc.

 

Your story is almost identical to that of the poster Katerina.

  • Author
Posted
does your husband know she is pregnant? as part of his consequences, you could always show him the pic and say, "well....looks like you weren't all that special to her after all";)

 

Hi Dex, Haven't seen you around as much on here. I did show him the pic of her pregnant. He was surprised she was pregnant bc I guess she had been trying for a long time with her H. He has always claimed it was a "just sex" deal--but that she did tell him she loved him a few times during sex, and he did reciprocate in saying it back because he still wanted the sex. She also suggested that they "run away together" a few times in which he supposedly always told her he would never leave me, etc. He said he thought that she was probably as relieved as he was once I found out about it and the A ended as they both felt guilty. And he also said he didn't really think she loved him, that it was just a sex deal for her, too.

  • Author
Posted
Aeh--

I think what your H needs to do is learn to be a passionate lover. You have given him loads more sex--

what has he done to please you?

You say he can't kiss. Oh, do I understand that! He needs to learn, and you can show him, because you will kiss from your heart and therefore it will be a very good kiss.

Get that man to learn the value of a really intimate loving body hug, the passion that can arise from only a kiss without any other fooling around...how to turn each other into "I want you NOW!" lovers from just kissing.

He can be taught...he can learn, if only he is willing. But he has to learn the value of a kiss. That comes from being taught by you HOW to kiss passionately.

In short, your H needs to learn how to make love to you, instead of just having sex with you.

If he learns, it will change his thinking about sex forever.

For very intimate loving partners...the lovemaking can be so good they are brought to tears by the incredible intimacy.

 

I should clarify here. My H IS a passionate lover. We kiss/make out all the time now and have been doing this for the last 11 months. (It's almost funny really--I'm almost 40 and we are making out like teenagers!) The word that would first come to mind now when I think about our relationship is "passionate". I wouldn't have described it as such before. He is a great kisser, and great in bed...ALWAYS satisfies me. Actually, he always satisfied me before, too...we just didn't do it often!

  • Author
Posted
As part of his consequences, seriously, Dex, what the hell difference does it make if her H was special to his former lover??? AEH should punish her H with knowledge that his xMW didn't really matter to him? And if AEHs assessment of her H's motives that "it was just sex", that it really wouldn't matter.

 

My H didn't seem phased at all about her just having a baby (she had it within the last few weeks). Very surprised, but not phased. He always claimed she loved her H and he loved me. He says he didn't think about her all the time or even every day (I call BS on this), just when he was horny. But from everything I've ever read on affairs, I know this can't be true.

  • Author
Posted
Well this is the part that goes deeper for me, talking to my H about my childhood stuff. Not being afraid, that he'll think I'm too damaged etc. Just listening, being supportive. Allowing yourself to really be known by someone. xMM said something to me that really resonated with what we probably provided to each other. He said, I don't have to be anyone when I'm with you. He was married for almost 20 years and he has to be someone other than himself with his W? The difference between my H and his W is that my H has allowed me to be me. Always has, it was me holding back. And the blow up of my A helped me get to this deeper level of intimacy with my H. That's the best I can explain it. And although my H still feels pain, the anger and need for "revenge" is gone. We've talked, and talked and talked some more about everything. I was patient with him when the outbursts happen, focused on his pain and not his anger. Never tried to rush the reconciliation.

 

AEH, I really think you should consider IC, for yourself and your healing.

 

Thanks, OFG. I will consider it. I do feel like my H and I have talked about it more than anyone possibly could--every facet, every hypothetical, every feeling, every nuance. I guess I need to explore why the anger in me runs so deep. I think it is more of an ego thing. I probably have but not sure if I have said before that when I married my H, one of the main reasons I married him was because I thought he would always be faithful. He wasn't really my type, in a lot of ways (although this is laughable because we get along so perfectly, we know each other inside and out)--not as outgoing as I probably prefer, he is blonde and medium height and I like taller, dark haired guys. But I always thought he would be faithful--unlike some other guys I had dated in the past who had not been unfaithful to me (that I know of)but that I thought had the potential to be...

 

Anyway, I guess part of my anger is that I felt duped (don't we all?). That was the one thing that was so paramount to me and here, I didn't even get that....Thus, the anger ....

  • Author
Posted
Your story is almost identical to that of the poster Katerina.

 

I will have to look up Katerina's story. I thought I was the only idiot here who had participated in a RA, besides LadyDesigner (not calling her an idiot, BY ANY MEANS!!) as I know she is also very remorseful about her A and had her heart broken.

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