TheBigQuestion Posted April 19, 2010 Posted April 19, 2010 Speaking of PUA tactics, does anyone else have the same issue with it as me? I am EXTREMELY well-versed in PUA theory, but I have a very hard time putting a lot of its principles into practice. If you present me with a hypothetical situation, I can tell you exactly the right way to go about it, what to say, what not to say, what type of body language I should use, what type of body language signs I should look for, etc. But I just haven't been able to practice it. I don't seem to get myself involved in a lot of situations where I could meet women, and when I do, I generally just freeze up for reasons I don't understand. I get an average amount of female attention but alas, it's attention from females I generally am not interested in. I'm a bit too picky. I know a lot of it has to do with the fact that in the year since I've graduated college and moved home, I've suffered from a pretty severe lack of motivation in general, and whenever I do want to do something social, I usually end up just hanging out and getting drunk with friends, and most of my friends are in committed relationships. The friends I have that are single are basically shut-ins/worse with women than I am. I always felt like if I had friends or acquaintances who were single AND were into socializing/meeting women, I'd fare better because we'd positively reinforce each other. At least I'll be moving out in July to go to law school, so maybe I can actually get some social motivation again.
USMCHokie Posted April 19, 2010 Posted April 19, 2010 Speaking of PUA tactics, does anyone else have the same issue with it as me? I am EXTREMELY well-versed in PUA theory, but I have a very hard time putting a lot of its principles into practice. If you present me with a hypothetical situation, I can tell you exactly the right way to go about it, what to say, what not to say, what type of body language I should use, what type of body language signs I should look for, etc. But I just haven't been able to practice it. I don't seem to get myself involved in a lot of situations where I could meet women, and when I do, I generally just freeze up for reasons I don't understand. I get an average amount of female attention but alas, it's attention from females I generally am not interested in. I'm a bit too picky. Well, all of this stuff may seem great in theory, but it really flies out the window when you step out onto the battlefield...just be comfortable being yourself... I know a lot of it has to do with the fact that in the year since I've graduated college and moved home, I've suffered from a pretty severe lack of motivation in general, and whenever I do want to do something social, I usually end up just hanging out and getting drunk with friends, and most of my friends are in committed relationships. The friends I have that are single are basically shut-ins/worse with women than I am. I always felt like if I had friends or acquaintances who were single AND were into socializing/meeting women, I'd fare better because we'd positively reinforce each other. And this is EXACTLY what you should be doing when you're going out with friends...having fun with your friends... Erica and I had this discussion last Sunday Funday...when you make it a "goal" or purpose to meet some girl or get a number or even take someone home when you go out, you'll have a miserable time if you don't achieve your goal...and instead of having fun, you'll associate going out with failure...eventually, after weekends pass with no action, going out will always feel like failure to you, and you'll want to stop going out...this was a big problem of mine right after my breakup...I felt like I had to go out and meet women...so it was my primary goal whenever I went out...but going out started sucking because I never met anyone... Bottom line, you shouldn't make it a point to go out with your friends and pick up women...just go out with your friends and have a good time...again, last Sunday Funday, I went out to have a good time with Erica, and I did exactly that. But I also got a number out of it...didn't intend on it at the beginning of the night, but it happened because I was having a good time and I guess a girl noticed that... At least I'll be moving out in July to go to law school, so maybe I can actually get some social motivation again. Congrats.
Author Don'tWannabeAWannabe Posted April 19, 2010 Author Posted April 19, 2010 See this? I told you that you had NO clue what you were doing. This is exactly the situation that I told you about, but you dont want to do the work to get to know PUA techniques. This is the place where only the PUA techniques work, and you have no clue what to do because youre too proud to try something new. Youre going to continue to be stuck with these scenarios until you step up to the plate. You need game to make yourself different from the other 200 guys there, and unless you study up, you might as well quit going to the clubs. Its all about game, so I had to requote your boy..... What do you think I've been doing? Where do you think I heard about "social proof" theory? I have been reading up, but what are you supposed to do when you freeze up and forget what you say and are forced to improv because the situation doesn't play out as it says in the book? And what should I have done? Asked a whole bunch of guys if they think spells work or if men lie more than women or play the cube or palm read them? Most of that ****s 7 years old already!
USMCHokie Posted April 19, 2010 Posted April 19, 2010 I have been reading up, but what are you supposed to do when you freeze up and forget what you say and are forced to improv because the situation doesn't play out as it says in the book? Heh. Improv = being yourself. It never plays out like it does in the book...so it becomes more a change in attitude and mentality than coming to the club armed with "tactics"...you have to charm the women with you...not some boxed tricks...so if you don't feel that "you" is working, then you need to improve the "you"...
TheBigQuestion Posted April 19, 2010 Posted April 19, 2010 I totally agree that I should be having fun with friends. I don't really regret that at all, and the fact that I can do it once a week at most makes me cherish it even more. However, I'm not really the kind of person who deals well with dry spells, so the fact that I don't frequently put myself in situations where I could meet new women often frustrates me. But of course, I have a hard time motivating myself to really do anything out of what's become the norm for me. There's my Catch-22. I know it's dumb though, and I've been taking some small steps to get myself out of my funk, which is also tied with a mild-to-moderate state of depression/getting over an unfortunate situation with a girl I used to date and my friend group (I wrote a long thread about it that didn't get many responses, but it's a good read if you like being reminded of how crappy your so called friends can be).
TheBigQuestion Posted April 19, 2010 Posted April 19, 2010 Heh. Improv = being yourself. It never plays out like it does in the book...so it becomes more a change in attitude and mentality than coming to the club armed with "tactics"...you have to charm the women with you...not some boxed tricks...so if you don't feel that "you" is working, then you need to improve the "you"... Well yes and no. The whole premise of a lot of PUA "inner game" stuff is that you use a "box of tricks" simply to get more comfortable with communicating with women.
marsle85 Posted April 19, 2010 Posted April 19, 2010 I actually met the guy I was dating for a while in a bar (packed on New Year's). I was coming back from... somewhere (I was pretty drunk) and I passed his group of friends. He just took me. Like literally, didn't let any of the other guys get a chance. He pulled my hand to him and asked me if we could switch New Year's hats. I of course declined, to which he said we should settle it fairly- over a game of Rock/Paper/Scissors. No girl can resist a challenge, so before I know it, I'm in between the bar and him, away from every other guy- playing a stupid game with this guy- while he is staring me in the eyes, intense, silly and challenging. He concluded that winner would get the other person's number. I won. He kept challenging me until he finally did And I gave it to him. It's possible. I mean, I was in there with that attitude you were talking about. I was out with 15 other women, limo waiting outside. I was drunk, not looking for the love of my life and focused on my fun. He completely took me out of my environment and my self-absorbed world, and made me play. Most of all, he was brave. If he was a creep, I would have moved on. He was confident, (not SUPER attractive) and handled me like a woman, not a little girl.
boogieboy Posted April 19, 2010 Posted April 19, 2010 What do you think I've been doing? Where do you think I heard about "social proof" theory? I have been reading up, but what are you supposed to do when you freeze up and forget what you say and are forced to improv because the situation doesn't play out as it says in the book? And what should I have done? Asked a whole bunch of guys if they think spells work or if men lie more than women or play the cube or palm read them? Most of that ****s 7 years old already! What have you been doing? What are you saying to these women when you walk up to them? If you cant be specific, then youre not running a routine. If you dont have anything planned (initially anyway) then you will keep freezing up. You think Dane Cook walks up on stage in and improvises all his material? Hell no, he'd bomb, because he has to try out different routines to different crowds to see what works best. Now he does his routines, but he can improvise for a line or two, and then he goes back into his routine. You have to start with a routine until you become pro. If you freeze up, you move on from the woman you froze up on, and go to the next one, and try the line again. If youre freezing up, you have to forge on until it becomes natural to you. You will have to sacrifice women until you get it right. You have to have specific things you talk about first. Even if you go up to all the women with the same opening line. You'll get some of the same responses and some different responses, but THEY will teach you what to say next. But if you forget what to say, you didnt memorize your lines enough to get past freezing. You wont be able to come up with your own stuff until youre comfortable approaching women first.
USMCHokie Posted April 19, 2010 Posted April 19, 2010 Well yes and no. The whole premise of a lot of PUA "inner game" stuff is that you use a "box of tricks" simply to get more comfortable with communicating with women. Hmmm, I see...I don't know how I really feel about the PUA stuff then...I mean, let's just assume that it worked to get your foot in the door...what about after that...? It will only mask your true self for so long...and then you'll eventually have to be yourself...and if your true self isn't someone that most women would find appealing, you're back to square one...? So by relying on PUA stuff, you forego improving yourself since you have this "box of tricks" that will work for the time being...eh, I don't quite see the draw...
boogieboy Posted April 19, 2010 Posted April 19, 2010 Hmmm, I see...I don't know how I really feel about the PUA stuff then...I mean, let's just assume that it worked to get your foot in the door...what about after that...? It will only mask your true self for so long...and then you'll eventually have to be yourself...and if your true self isn't someone that most women would find appealing, you're back to square one...? So by relying on PUA stuff, you forego improving yourself since you have this "box of tricks" that will work for the time being...eh, I don't quite see the draw... The idea of the box of tricks is to get in the door with women...to get over the anxiety of approaching them..and understanding the psychology of what works. Also to gain confidence when you see what works and knowing why it works. Its not to make yourself something that youre not...you just just add understanding to your personality. BTW Wannabe...rock/paper/scissors for a number- switching new years hats - thats a PUA technique, and look who it worked on...
Author Don'tWannabeAWannabe Posted April 19, 2010 Author Posted April 19, 2010 I actually met the guy I was dating for a while in a bar (packed on New Year's). I was coming back from... somewhere (I was pretty drunk) and I passed his group of friends. He just took me. Like literally, didn't let any of the other guys get a chance. He pulled my hand to him and asked me if we could switch New Year's hats. I of course declined, to which he said we should settle it fairly- over a game of Rock/Paper/Scissors. No girl can resist a challenge, so before I know it, I'm in between the bar and him, away from every other guy- playing a stupid game with this guy- while he is staring me in the eyes, intense, silly and challenging. He concluded that winner would get the other person's number. I won. He kept challenging me until he finally did And I gave it to him. It's possible. I mean, I was in there with that attitude you were talking about. I was out with 15 other women, limo waiting outside. I was drunk, not looking for the love of my life and focused on my fun. He completely took me out of my environment and my self-absorbed world, and made me play. Most of all, he was brave. If he was a creep, I would have moved on. He was confident, (not SUPER attractive) and handled me like a woman, not a little girl. Yeah, but how is a guy supposed to "take you" when you're surrounded by other men and you're having 2 or 3 conversations at once (and there are other guys hovering around waiting for their turn)?
boogieboy Posted April 19, 2010 Posted April 19, 2010 Yeah' date=' but how is a guy supposed to "take you" when you're surrounded by other men and you're having 2 or 3 conversations at once (and there are other guys hovering around waiting for their turn)?[/quote'] That guy took a chance that she would have pulled away from him. He was willing to be called a creep by him, and he would have walked off and tried it with another woman. He doesnt care about the negative reaction, he would have only cared about the good reaction. He knows its supposed to work with the right woman.
Author Don'tWannabeAWannabe Posted April 19, 2010 Author Posted April 19, 2010 If youre freezing up, you have to forge on until it becomes natural to you. You will have to sacrifice women until you get it right. Will I ever get a second chance with these girls if I blow it the first time (because all the PUA sites say that you bomb the first few dozen approaches)? Because this is a pretty small area; you run into the same faces frequently. It'd be one thing if I lived in New York City or LA or something, but here, where I live, I really cannot afford to blow my chances with the tiny few attractive young women around here in the name of "practice."
Author Don'tWannabeAWannabe Posted April 19, 2010 Author Posted April 19, 2010 That guy took a chance that she would have pulled away from him. He was willing to be called a creep by him, and he would have walked off and tried it with another woman. He doesnt care about the negative reaction, he would have only cared about the good reaction. He knows its supposed to work with the right woman. You realize that when you blow it with one girl, you blow it with her friends, her sisters and every girl who's overlooked in the vicinity, right? Even a lot of the women on this forum admitted this.
boogieboy Posted April 19, 2010 Posted April 19, 2010 (edited) Will I ever get a second chance with these girls if I blow it the first time (because all the PUA sites say that you bomb the first few dozen approaches)? Because this is a pretty small area; you run into the same faces frequently. It'd be one thing if I lived in New York City or LA or something' date=' but here, where I live, I really cannot afford to blow my chances with the tiny few attractive young women around here in the name of "practice."[/quote'] You do get a second chance, months later though. And if you bomb, you have to bail out quick so you dont give them much to remember about you. Your area isnt small, you just have to work more than just night clubs. You have to practice, you wont get it right the first few times. You cant be perfect, its not going to happen. You dont worry about her, or her friends, once you get it right, they will forget that you were awkward. Besides, as long as you bail out when its not working, they wont think youre a creep. if you stay there while shes hinting for you to leave, and you stalk her, then she'll tell her friends. You cant worry about that. Youre looking for that one, youre not looking for them all. You have to practice on someone. Edited April 19, 2010 by boogieboy
phineas Posted April 19, 2010 Posted April 19, 2010 This does nor apply to dj's of course Or their friends who get to hang out in the booth with them.
Author Don'tWannabeAWannabe Posted April 20, 2010 Author Posted April 20, 2010 It depends on what kind of people you're trying to meet. Cool people. Hot people. Bartenders. Club/Party promoters. DJ's. Band members. Performers (big or small). Designers. Them and lots of beautiful women. What does it take to break into this crowd? (Do not say drugs. Seriously, someone always mentions drugs)
D-Lish Posted April 20, 2010 Posted April 20, 2010 What else could I have done? And what could I do if I'm ever caught in this situation again? Maybe don't fall for a pretty bartender who wants to rope you into a marketing ploy that she most likely duped other suckers into attending. On top of that don't wear a suit to a club, i't douchey.
Author Don'tWannabeAWannabe Posted April 20, 2010 Author Posted April 20, 2010 Maybe don't fall for a pretty bartender who wants to rope you into a marketing ploy that she most likely duped other suckers into attending. On top of that don't wear a suit to a club, i't douchey. I didn't wear a suit, I wore dress pants and a dress shirt. I did because I didn't have time to go home and change, since I went straight from work. And besides, I don't own any of those God-awful "Affliction" or "Ed Harvey" rags.
Author Don'tWannabeAWannabe Posted May 3, 2010 Author Posted May 3, 2010 I am not sure what you mean by a "lounge." Do mean like a tavern--i.e. a neighborhood bar? That could work, except that few women frequent those. You know; the places with red and purple lighting and ambient smooth-jazz or electronic-chill; the places that have a dress code and ultra-modern furniture everywhere.
Popeye_Jones Posted May 3, 2010 Posted May 3, 2010 Welcome to the world of clubs. The male/female ratio in clubs is often horribly skewed, with men outnumbering women by a large margin. 6 to 1 is not even that bad. Worse, every one of those guys is after a hook up. The fact is clubs are terrible places to meet women. That sounds counter intuitive, but it's true. Clubs are not happy, go-lucky places where people get together to have fun. Not at all. Clubs are nasty, competitive, and occasionally violent places where drunken, aggressive guys go to try to impress women AND belittle and humiliate other men. The club scene in most cities is UGLY. Women know this. That is why so many of the women you meet in clubs have such an attitude. They know the place is crawling with creeps looking for a chance to grope them or, at best, get an easy hook up. This makes the women hyper-defensive and especially hard to talk to. What you said here is 110% correct. Clubs are just like prisons. Guys are violent and they are already not in rational thinking mode when they enter these places. Then they get drunk to boot. And they will shoot you for looking at them wrong.
homersheineken Posted May 3, 2010 Posted May 3, 2010 I am not sure what you mean by a "lounge." Do mean like a tavern--i.e. a neighborhood bar? That could work, except that few women frequent those. The basic rule is this: stay away from places where hordes of drunken, aggressive guys show up looking for hookups. It is not just a problem of the ratio. The whole dynamic in places like that is ugly. I can't say much more without knowing what a "lounge" is. I live in Chicago, and it is possible that is just not a term people use here. This is bad advice. Staying away from drunk/drinking girls? Really? A lounge is a lowly lit bar, with typically R&B/dance/techno-lite music. And there are plenty in Chicago. What neighborhood are you in? If you're only going to bars where are only guys are, find a new bar. There are numerous places in Chicago to go to to find women.
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