Male Empowerment Thread

[A O]

Never said parents shouldn't help their children have healthy self-esteem. You make it sound like an easy fix.

The answer is simple, implementing it on the other hand, isn't necessarily so. The situation you mentioned, is little more than a problem. And every problem has a solution. Unfortunately, many either choose the wrong solution or fail to address the problem in the first place.

 

Basically you want women to take on the burden of everything and be far better and above men that they practice self control and self esttem by ignoring media messages all the while condoning it as okay for men to buy into these same messages and indulge in them .

I want people to be strong enough, internally, to not let the outside world influence how they should see themselves. And naturally, the best way to achieve this is from within. It is not from asking the world to bend itself to fit into a specific criteria. Its not ever going to happen. Control the controllable - control ourselves!

 

They tell their sons ' you go get um tiger" and they tell their daughters " wait until a man respects you".

Rubbish to both. The latter is usually a warning of what boys want and the consequences that may arise if y'all not careful.

 

I think you need to do some more reading on adolecents and what kids go through. Sure your warm cozy words are pc and nice but they aren't reality

Its all about good parenting and that's an achievable reality.

 

 

.

[TheBigQuestion]

Please Big Question, don't sit there and act like it's not a completely disrespectful term. Context is important only when the men get sit here and completely humilate women by calling them "cum dumpsters". If any woman here used an equally ugly term...lets take the word "pedo" and applied it around, you and the other men would be having a hissy fit about how much women dislike you. Any guy want to know why women dislike you and you can't get dates while you use terms like "cum dumpster", it isn't because your a nice guy or certainly a good man.

.

 

If a grown man is going around hitting on 15 year old girls, you're goddamn right it would be appropriate to brand him a "pedo." Calling someone a pedo for no reason obviously would be needlessly insulting. It's not like I go around calling every woman I meet a "cum dumpster" but that doesn't mean there aren't women out there whose choices make them apt to be branded with such names. This isn't exactly the best analogy you've ever used.

 

Also, don't assume how I'd react. If you've paid attention to my post history, you'd know that I have very little in common with the lonely jerks-who-pretend-to-be-nice-guys. I don't share their defeatist mentality for life and dating. And again, this all comes down to one important axiom about life: if you want to be treated respectfully, if you don't want to be called bad names, act in a responsible and respectful manner. If you don't, be prepared to face the negative consequences.

[Jersey Shortie]

It's not the best anagloy I've used but I was trying to think something so very equally insulting and that's about all I could come up with. Lovely though how you don't tour this board branding men equally disgusting names for their behavior. I have read some of your posts. And I have yet to see that. No, you save that for women who you think deserve to be branded with that name just because you, someone of no consequence thinking he gets to judge others so crudely, thinks he gets to throw around such names because of some kind of superoity complex.

 

It's fine if you don't agree with other's behaviors. It's fine that you don't want to be with a woman that you deem unworthy for any number of reasons. It's not fine to sit on this board and refer to even *some* women with that name. Your no one to sit there and deliever negative names based on the judgments of what others have done, that haven't even hurt YOU. It's utterly ridiculous that you think you can call women this when they've done nothing to you. It's not even any of your business what they've done with their lives. What mistakes they've made or not made.

 

In case you haven't figured it out, women are human beings. Sometimes, they even make mistakes and sometimes they wrongly judge men. You want to call someone a name based on a woman being used for her body? Why don't you call the man a name? Isn't he just as diporable? Where is your name calling for the men?

 

I am so sick of seeing the increased use of this word around this board. It's freaking awful that you guys can sit here and use that word like it's water off a ducks back. Tincanman is the only one that stood up said he found it digusting.

 

I want you to think real hard here TheBigQuestion. And any other guy that think that name is okay to use. Think about women sitting on this board and refering to men, even some men, in the same quality name you just helped to refer to women. (Yeah Woggle, your number one here. You would Never stand for it.) And I want you to think hard about what your opinion of that woman would be. I doubt it would very high. You want women to listen to your points? You're never going to accomplish that by throwing around low-class ignorant names like "cum dumpster". That shows who you are as a man, more then it shows what any woman is for you calling her that. And that is the reality.

 

I am rather disgusted right now.

[TheBigQuestion]

Pretty much every post I've made in this particular thread (and any other thread to which I've contributed) applies to either sex, and I almost always say so by saying something like "this goes for men AND women" or "this is regardless of gender." Clearly, I'm not excluding the fact that men can be shielded from criticism for their questionable behaviors, so I'm not really sure what you're getting at there. If women were using the same types of names to describe questionable behavior in some men that they knew, I would assume they have a good reason for saying what they say. If they weren't talking about me, I wouldn't care much. If I knew for a fact that the particular people they were referring to were undeserving of that name, then I'd butt in on the conversation as any normal person would do. I don't take everything said by members of the opposite sex and internalize it as a personal insult. Maybe it's because I grew up in a very un-politically correct neighborhood, but I tend to be more thick-skinned than that.

[Jersey Shortie]

Complete BS TheBigQuestion. Don't sit there and tell me you really use the term "cum dumpster" to apply to men too. You never have and you don't call men bad names. FACT. The guys here that sit and insist on bad mouthing women and calling them such names have NEVER said a bad name for a man.

 

Instead you say things like this: "Clearly, I'm not excluding the fact that men can be shielded from criticism for their questionable behaviors..." It's a joke. A total joke. You refer to men as having "questionable behavior" but then you both use and defend the use of the word "cum dumpster". Completely ridiculous. Where is your equally bad name for men? Where?

 

And don't sit there and tell me women shouldn't be offended. It's meant to be offensive and degrading. Don't act like I am ridiculous for finding that word completely disgusting and don't act like I don't have a right to voice that. And don't give me PC bs that if you aren't one you shouldn't be a offended. Not letting you get away with those games and deflections. At least take accountability for yourself. Nethier do I really believe you don't understand what I am saying. Infact, I think you do.

 

I see more men use it more often, and it's disturbting. It's also scary the amount of men just sit there shruging their shoulders and saying "oh well". And sorry, this subject has nothing to do with being un-politically correct and lame arguements about society being too politically correct now-a-days. Neither is about you being more thick skinned. Refering to any woman as a "cum dumpster", just because you don't like her personal choices that have nothing to do with you, is ridciulous. Please tell me, why you and other men don't come up for names for men that use women like this? Why do you insist on making these women the brunt of your bitterness? Where are your equally disgusting names to demean men yuo don't agree with? I have yet to see it.

[TheBigQuestion]

You have the right to feel as offended by the use of words as much or as little as you please. I was just pointing out that I personally am not like that. And in regards to the usage of the term "cum dumpster," I do admit that I've said it, probably once or twice in the heat of the moment, though it's certainly not in my daily vocabulary nor of anyone's that I know. In fact, until someone wrote it in this thread, I had forgotten it had even existed. And I do admit it's a harsh way to describe someone. You don't know in what context I've used it, and you don't know whether or not I used it in reference to someone that had personally hurt me. Yet you automatically assumed that I was just talking about some random girl in a bar or something. Making assumptions about these things in one way or another is a dangerous thing to do when discussing something, because you're simultaneously performing an ad-hominem attack against me AND building a strawman argument.

 

Also, I didn't make the term up, so I don't know why you expect me to baptize another term that refers to men too. I can think of a bunch that could be extremely offensive depending on the person who hears it: "player," "jerk," (if you're Woggle these are really bad), "---hole," "manwhore," "cum dispenser," (har har), "insecure creep," "filthy walking disease bag," "scumbag," ad infinitum Is that good enough?

[Pyro]

I like to have my fun and I have my indulgences but I have control of my life which is more than you can say for many people. A player should always have his life in order.

 

Don't make me laugh:lmao:

 

OMG! One woman admits she cheats for revenge. One woman out of millions? Oh wow, she proved your beliefs:rolleyes:

[Woggle]

Don't make me laugh:lmao:

 

OMG! One woman admits she cheats for revenge. One woman out of millions? Oh wow, she proved your beliefs:rolleyes:

 

Do you really think she is the only one to feel like that?

[Pyro]

Do you really think she is the only one to feel like that?

 

I already know you will ignore this post, but yes I am aware that there are many women who feel that way. I will spell this out so hopefully you see it.

 

THERE ARE MANY WOMEN IN ADDITION WHO THINK DIFFERENTLY AND VALUE AND HONOR A RELATIONSHIP. JUST BECAUSE YOU HAVEN'T SEEN IT DOESN'T MEAN THAT THOSE TYPE ARE NOT OUT THERE.

 

AGAIN, IF WHAT YOU THINK IS THE TRUTH THEN I WOULD BE MISERABLE AND BITTER AS WELL.

[Stung]

This thread has wandered pretty far afield from where I think Nate wanted it to go.

 

However to jump in to the current language debate, and perhaps put an end to it: if you would never drop the N-bomb in any context recognizing that it is, simply, hate speech, you should never use the term "cum dumpster," which is also, simply, hate speech. In any context.

[Woggle]

This thread has wandered pretty far afield from where I think Nate wanted it to go.

 

However to jump in to the current language debate, and perhaps put an end to it: if you would never drop the N-bomb in any context recognizing that it is, simply, hate speech, you should never use the term "cum dumpster," which is also, simply, hate speech. In any context.

 

If I said that many of the Tea Party people are mad because they don't want an N word in office that would not be racist because that is simply describing what many of them think of Obama. I am in no way endorsing the use of that word because I voted for him and would do it again. It is the same concept when I say what many players think of women.

[MrNate]

I'd rather be a girl than be a guy. Guys can't use being ugly as excuse for not getting dates. If a girl don't like me then it must be that my personality sucks. Whereas girls already have a caste system based on their looks so it's pretty easy to know who'll get the top guys.

 

Regardless, girls have to work much less.

 

See? It all works out.

[MrNate]

This thread has wandered pretty far afield from where I think Nate wanted it to go.

 

 

You have no idea. Every thread on this site works out to man vs. woman. Every single one. Next the women/men will blame it on the men/women. Why can't we just have decent discussions?

[sweetjasmine]

If I said that many of the Tea Party people are mad because they don't want an N word in office that would not be racist because that is simply describing what many of them think of Obama. I am in no way endorsing the use of that word because I voted for him and would do it again. It is the same concept when I say what many players think of women.

 

Yup, there are contexts in which usage of taboo words or slurs isn't hate speech or isn't intended to be offensive. I'm an academic and if I need to cite and discuss the N-word or any slur or swear word in a paper, lecture, or discussion, it's certainly not hate speech or offensive. It's linguistic analysis and is no more hate speech than an entry in the dictionary. Referring to the term and talking about it or how it's used isn't hate speech. You can't just pretend the words don't exist because they obviously do, and people obviously use them. And even though I'm willing to openly use slurs in analysis/discussions, I'd never ever dream of using them as a weapon to insult someone in conversation.

 

Then there are other usages, like John Lennon's song, "Woman is the N- of the World". Or sarcastic instances, where someone will use a slur to draw attention to another person or people's racism, sexism, xenophobia, etc. along the lines of "well, they think so-and-so is an X". Or "I can't believe so-and-so called that person an X".

[Jersey Shortie]

TheBigQuestion:

You have the right to feel as offended by the use of words as much or as little as you please. I was just pointing out that I personally am not like that. And in regards to the usage of the term "cum dumpster," I do admit that I've said it, probably once or twice in the heat of the moment, though it's certainly not in my daily vocabulary nor of anyone's that I know.

 

In fact, until someone wrote it in this thread, I had forgotten it had even existed. And I do admit it's a harsh way to describe someone. You don't know in what context I've used it, and you don't know whether or not I used it in reference to someone that had personally hurt me. Yet you automatically assumed that I was just talking about some random girl in a bar or something. Making assumptions about these things in one way or another is a dangerous thing to do when discussing something, because you're simultaneously performing an ad-hominem attack against me AND building a strawman argument.

 

How in the world do you turn this on an attack against you when you are the one throwing names around and saying you understand why it's okay to use the word "cum dumpster".

 

Why don’t you strive to make it not part of your vocab at all since you're so proud you only used it once or twice? You are part of the issue if you use the word, it doesn’t matter if you made the word up. I am also a little aghast that you are choosing to defend your use of it out of your own personal emotional hurt. As if that makes it okay. Said about a random girl you don’t know or someone that hurt you, it’s not right. And you know it. You're offended because I am calling you out on you crap. You want to be seen a certain way? Talk and act a certain way. Men that use the term "cum dumpster" get see exactly by what they put out there. Just as if a woman walked around here calling me ***holes but then defended it by her own personal emotional hurt.

 

Also, I didn't make the term up, so I don't know why you expect me to baptize another term that refers to men too. I can think of a bunch that could be extremely offensive depending on the person who hears it: "player," "jerk," (if you're Woggle these are really bad), "---hole," "manwhore," "cum dispenser," (har har), "insecure creep," "filthy walking disease bag," "scumbag," ad infinitum Is that good enough?

 

Player, jerk, ***hole, manwhore, insecure creep, scumbag…..are pretty akin to the other negative names men can use to describe women. As if those aren't belitting enough. I never heard a man or woman use the word “cum dispenser” when talking about a man that I’ve heard on “cum dumpster” when talking about a woman. I also never heard “ filthy walking dieses bag”.

 

Who are you to describe women that way anyway? You don't think we will undestand your point unless you throw in some througly hateful degrading commentary about the woman in question? The worse thing a man got called in this thread was "player". Alot of you sit around here bemoaning the choices of women who don't end up with good guys but you don't hold men to the same standard because you don't critize the man that is using the woman. You instead choose to fall back on calling the woman names. And then in addtion, some of you fall back on "women like to be treated like crap", so that you don't have to take any respsonibility for treating women with respect.

 

By the way TheBigQuestion, none of the woman here, not one woman here uttered any of those words you tossed out as names for men. While many men in this thread uttered the word “cum dumpster”. Enough said.

 

Stung:

However to jump in to the current language debate, and perhaps put an end to it: if you would never drop the N-bomb in any context recognizing that it is, simply, hate speech, you should never use the term "cum dumpster," which is also, simply, hate speech. In any context.

 

 

Exactly.

 

 

Yup, there are contexts in which usage of taboo words or slurs isn't hate speech or isn't intended to be offensive. I'm an academic and if I need to cite and discuss the N-word or any slur or swear word in a paper, lecture, or discussion, it's certainly not hate speech or offensive. It's linguistic analysis and is no more hate speech than an entry in the dictionary. Referring to the term and talking about it or how it's used isn't hate speech. You can't just pretend the words don't exist because they obviously do, and people obviously use them. And even though I'm willing to openly use slurs in analysis/discussions, I'd never ever dream of using them as a weapon to insult someone in conversation.

 

There was no academic reason why the word "cum dumpster" was used in this thread. People could have made their point without tossing that word around and then pretending they didn't use it themselves to describe women, choosing to place blame on the hypothetical "player" they kept references. And while the N-word is equally as vile, it's a part of our history which explains a piece of history we need to learn from. "Cum dumpster" isn't. I don't see any academic reason for using the word "cum dumpster". And while you can't pretend words don't exist, that's not an excuse to use them either. Infact, the more people use them, the more easy it becomes to say. And I think that is dangerous.

[Kamille]

I think this discussion of the use of the word is getting out of hand and I had hoped the discussion would end once AD and I acheived an understanding of what he meant.

 

Yet, I tried an interesting experiment. I went back to the post where the term was first used and replaced the term in discussion with the N-word by first simply replacing and then adding it as an adjective. Try it. I dare you to still find c.d. appropriate.

[sally4sara]

I doubt many will agree with me, but I doubt a man can really be empowered until he can discern whether a woman has the qualities he seeks or not, and no matter how hot she is, be able to walk away from sex with her when she does not have the non physical qualities he wants.

 

Till then, his will is weak; questionable and in doubt. What do I really believe he can accomplish unless he lives as a monk?

 

I feel the same way about women, but the pressure on men to sleep around is greater because they are lauded for the act.

 

Women get to feel like they call the shots because they meet so many men unable to tell them no. Perhaps this is part of the low self esteem women hold? We don't have to live up to much to get what we want in this arena?

Perhaps this is why I find so many low self esteem men - they know they have no standards and a weak will in the face of sexual gratification? How would one feel good about themselves when they behave like Bonobo monkeys on X?

 

See, there is no Conan. The odds of a man getting to be some Bond-like fella are slim. And really, most of us will never know a real struggle beyond the ones we have with ourselves (self created most often too). And the only place men still have to strut is with sex. Many would be nothing; HAVE NOTHING without living like an alley cat in an attempt to pretend to be some modern warrior.

[MrNate]

I doubt many will agree with me, but I doubt a man can really be empowered until he can discern whether a woman has the qualities he seeks or not, and no matter how hot she is, be able to walk away from sex with her when she does not have the non physical qualities he wants.

 

Till then, his will is weak; questionable and in doubt. What do I really believe he can accomplish unless he lives as a monk?

 

I feel the same way about women, but the pressure on men to sleep around is greater because they are lauded for the act.

 

Women get to feel like they call the shots because they meet so many men unable to tell them no. Perhaps this is part of the low self esteem women hold? We don't have to live up to much to get what we want in this arena?

Perhaps this is why I find so many low self esteem men - they know they have no standards and a weak will in the face of sexual gratification? How would one feel good about themselves when they behave like Bonobo monkeys on X?

 

See, there is no Conan. The odds of a man getting to be some Bond-like fella are slim. And really, most of us will never know a real struggle beyond the ones we have with ourselves (self created most often too). And the only place men still have to strut is with sex. Many would be nothing; HAVE NOTHING without living like an alley cat in an attempt to pretend to be some modern warrior.

 

Hm, I see where you're coming from.Testosterone is a very, very powerful hormone. And when you couple that with the fact that a man's sexual power doesn't even compare with that of a woman's, I think that's how so many men are produced with a 'take what they can get' mindset. Men simply don't have the power to be as selective as they would like. They have to work harder to get sex. They don't have the bargaining power women have, and it can be frustrating. That's how I view it anyway.

 

Is there no hope?

[sally4sara]

Hm, I see where you're coming from.Testosterone is a very, very powerful hormone. And when you couple that with the fact that a man's sexual power doesn't even compare with that of a woman's, I think that's how so many men are produced with a 'take what they can get' mindset. Men simply don't have the power to be as selective as they would like. They have to work harder to get sex. They don't have the bargaining power women have, and it can be frustrating. That's how I view it anyway.

 

Is there no hope?

 

Ah, but see, when you want to act all "I'm the powerful man" you have to be able to show something powerful. It isn't all about testosterone. We are the same species and we are one with the impulse to breed as a survival instinct. Thankfully, we were also give the ability to rise above it because we cannot rear as many offspring as we can make. Think about it. No means of BC is 100% so everyone you have sex with holds the potential of resulting in a child. Would you want kids with everyone you have sex with? No? This is where one can assert their will. If you can't, your will cannot be trusted. No more saber tooth tigers to battle, so is it wise for men to be their own worst enemy to find a replacement?

The "taking what they can get" is just an excuse to lower the bar of the expectations you set for yourself.

[MrNate]

Ah, but see, when you want to act all "I'm the powerful man" you have to be able to show something powerful. It isn't all about testosterone. We are the same species and we are one with the impulse to breed as a survival instinct. Thankfully, we were also give the ability to rise above it because we cannot rear as many offspring as we can make. Think about it. No means of BC is 100% so everyone you have sex with holds the potential of resulting in a child. Would you want kids with everyone you have sex with? No? This is where one can assert their will. If you can't, your will cannot be trusted. No more saber tooth tigers to battle, so is it wise for men to be their own worst enemy to find a replacement?

The "taking what they can get" is just an excuse to lower the bar of the expectations you set for yourself.

 

Well that's why I started this thread, for questions like this. Many men don't even act all 'I'm the powerful man' because now, it seems like we don't have anything powerful. And when you look at the challenges we face today, no doubt it makes you wonder: what does it mean to be a man? what role to we play in relationships? society? When you look at all the negative views on male, including the media, sometimes I can't help but think, "are we needed anymore? heck are we even respected?' This is solely speaking from a male perspective, I have no doubt that women indeed face their challenges. But it's almost scary at the amount of help/services offered for women as compared to a male. I know this is a new day and age, but I can't help but wonder, when I look around, what does it mean to be a man?

 

If don't assert my will, it can't be trusted? Sorry but that sounds a bit odd to me. But I think you are on to something with 'taking what you can get'. Is a man or woman more likely to adopt that mindset?

[sally4sara]

Well that's why I started this thread, for questions like this. Many men don't even act all 'I'm the powerful man' because now, it seems like we don't have anything powerful. And when you look at the challenges we face today, no doubt it makes you wonder: what does it mean to be a man? what role to we play in relationships? society? When you look at all the negative views on male, including the media, sometimes I can't help but think, "are we needed anymore? heck are we even respected?' This is solely speaking from a male perspective, I have no doubt that women indeed face their challenges. But it's almost scary at the amount of help/services offered for women as compared to a male. I know this is a new day and age, but I can't help but wonder, when I look around, what does it mean to be a man?

 

If don't assert my will, it can't be trusted? Sorry but that sounds a bit odd to me. But I think you are on to something with 'taking what you can get'. Is a man or woman more likely to adopt that mindset?

 

Well I don't buy into the whole man's role or woman's role business, so I don't think of it so much as a thing men or women are more likely to adopt. I think some people just have zero impulse control.

But if you're going to discuss how the media or society factors in, I'd say men are given a free pass to having no standards more often then women.

 

I do see that men are typically portrayed as either a predator or ineffectual in the media. Women too, but to a lesser degree. Or rather in a way men can't identify so easily as being so. You get the vampy homewrecker cold and calculating woman, or you get the long suffering, frumpy and helpless housewife. How many times is it so clear cut IRL though? Why not ignore the media's view, not just the one they hand you but the ones they hand everyone and captain your own ship? It really is the only way to find your power regardless of gender.

 

Read the "Hagakure". While we don't have Samurai anymore, the ideology can still be applied to today as a code of honor in any walk of life. Stop thinking of everything as a MAN VS WOMAN situation and find a struggle more befitting your development as a PERSON and you might find the kind of MAN you want to be. Are you needed as a person? Are you deserving of respect as a PERSON? Being a man is simply a matter of chromosomes. If you are not needed or respectable as a person, what does it matter if you are a man or a woman?

[sweetjasmine]

There was no academic reason why the word "cum dumpster" was used in this thread. People could have made their point without tossing that word around and then pretending they didn't use it themselves to describe women, choosing to place blame on the hypothetical "player" they kept references. And while the N-word is equally as vile, it's a part of our history which explains a piece of history we need to learn from. "Cum dumpster" isn't. I don't see any academic reason for using the word "cum dumpster". And while you can't pretend words don't exist, that's not an excuse to use them either. Infact, the more people use them, the more easy it becomes to say. And I think that is dangerous.

 

I was just pointing out that a word like that isn't offensive in EVERY context. How many times have you written it in this thread? Is it hate speech when you say, "I don't see any academic reason for using the word 'cum dumpster'"? After all, you just wrote it out.

 

That's all I'm saying.

 

I personally think the term is pretty gross, derogatory, and offensive, and I wouldn't use it outside of conversation/discussion about how gross it is. That doesn't mean it's hate speech for me to say, "I hate the term 'cum dumpster'."

[MrNate]

Well I don't buy into the whole man's role or woman's role business, so I don't think of it so much as a thing men or women are more likely to adopt. I think some people just have zero impulse control.

But if you're going to discuss how the media or society factors in, I'd say men are given a free pass to having no standards more often then women.

 

I do see that men are typically portrayed as either a predator or ineffectual in the media. Women too, but to a lesser degree. Or rather in a way men can't identify so easily as being so. You get the vampy homewrecker cold and calculating woman, or you get the long suffering, frumpy and helpless housewife. How many times is it so clear cut IRL though? Why not ignore the media's view, not just the one they hand you but the ones they hand everyone and captain your own ship? It really is the only way to find your power regardless of gender.

 

Read the "Hagakure". While we don't have Samurai anymore, the ideology can still be applied to today as a code of honor in any walk of life. Stop thinking of everything as a MAN VS WOMAN situation and find a struggle more befitting your development as a PERSON and you might find the kind of MAN you want to be. Are you needed as a person? Are you deserving of respect as a PERSON? Being a man is simply a matter of chromosomes. If you are not needed or respectable as a person, what does it matter if you are a man or a woman?

 

This is a great answer! Thanks for contributing to my thread. This certainly was a very insightful response.

[A O]

but I doubt a man can really be empowered until he can discern whether a woman has the qualities he seeks or not, and no matter how hot she is, be able to walk away from sex with her when she does not have the non physical qualities he wants.

Understanding what we want in a partner is an extremely important relationship skill, and that ties in with knowing ourselves which is thee most important relationship skill of all.

 

Till then, his will is weak; questionable and in doubt. What do I really believe he can accomplish unless he lives as a monk?

And what do you base this on in given that most people start out, and many never get to, a stage where they either know who they are and want they want?

 

Women get to feel like they call the shots because they meet so many men unable to tell them no. Perhaps this is part of the low self esteem women hold? We don't have to live up to much to get what we want in this arena?

There are men that are brought up to believe that 'niceness' is the way to a woman's heart, or that women are somehow, more good than men are, than they are. They're the ones in for a rude awakening and in all likelihood, prone to bitterness and the like once their false reality comes crashing down. As for self-esteem, I think you have a point. I think it ties in with my belief that apart from upbringing, society doesn't value the roles that women traditionally gravitate too.

 

Perhaps this is why I find so many low self esteem men - they know they have no standards and a weak will in the face of sexual gratification? How would one feel good about themselves when they behave like Bonobo monkeys on X?

Low self-esteem men aren't a lot different to their female counterparts, they aren't brought up with any great faith in themselves. They will take the crumbs in just about any given situation, sex being but one of them.

 

See, there is no Conan. The odds of a man getting to be some Bond-like fella are slim. And really, most of us will never know a real struggle beyond the ones we have with ourselves (self created most often too). And the only place men still have to strut is with sex. Many would be nothing; HAVE NOTHING without living like an alley cat in an attempt to pretend to be some modern warrior.

You do have a beautiful view of men I see, and yeah, we all know that you supposedly have a really cool husband and all, but all in all, you and Woggle are cut from very similar clothes.

 

Men simply don't have the power to be as selective as they would like. They have to work harder to get sex. They don't have the bargaining power women have, and it can be frustrating. That's how I view it anyway.

I think you have to look at the bigger picture. There are positives and negatives for both genders. A little harder to garner sex for men translates into a little harder to develop relationships for women. I think if you and others understood the relationship dance then y'all wouldn't be so down about everything.

 

Many men don't even act all 'I'm the powerful man' because now, it seems like we don't have anything powerful.

Few men act all powerful, lord knows where that idea sprung from. However Mr Nate, if you judge you value based on how others see you, then you're as weak as piss for sure. You've handed over your power! True power, self-esteem, comes from within.

 

 

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Well I don't buy into the whole man's role or woman's role business

I believe in them. They're a useful starting point that can be added too but should never be dismissed.

 

But if you're going to discuss how the media or society factors in, I'd say men are given a free pass to having no standards more often then women.

And what's this based on? What are the free passes that men get and women don't?

 

 

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