Let's talk about the children!

[Fight4Me]

THen your affair served to make you happier in the home. This is not always the case.

Often the person having the affair is NOT happier in the home. They are just going through the motions until their next tryst with their AP.

 

 

My FWH often talks about how close he came to destroying his own children's lives, along with mine. His A was relatively short compared to most (6 weeks), but of course he thought he was in love... blah blah blah. As he says now, if he had really found true love, it would have made him a better man, but in stark contrast, he literally became a snarling creature none of us recognized. I was at the height of suffering from a recently diagnosed chronic illness when "she" came along. I remember the nasty comments flung my way about how I was using it as an excuse to get out of responsibilities. Ummm, yeah, being stuck in bed was just soooo much fun. He presented himself as the saint who "took care of his ailing wife who didn't love him back", and the Father of the Year. In reality, he had called his mom to come take care of everything while he took all the credit.

 

At the time, I thought he was stressed about my illness. It was a frightening time for all of us, especially the children. When he sat me down to tell me what had really been going on, I was completely blindsided. If it weren't for the fact that he is a completely different man today than the one who allowed himself to surrender to temptation, he wouldn't have been given a second chance. He is now the father I always knew he could be, and a better husband than I ever could have ever hoped for.

 

The children knew that dad had really flipped out during that time, but they don't know why (I decided it was best that they not have to suffer with that knowledge), but now they constantly comment on how much their parents love each other. We even get a lot of "ewwwww's" when we kiss in front of them. We were always very affectionate before, but it's been particularly fun to discover new ways to gross out our teenagers. It's especially effective for clearing them out of a room when we want it all to ourselves.

[Spark1111]

I do believe Mr. Messy was happier during the A. BUT, I was miserable. I was being gas lighted and clinging desperately to my sanity. My children saw this. Hell my children suffered through this because of my actions toward them. I lashed out at everyone. Then came the decision to end it all...they felt that too, though they did not know why.

 

My children still have both parents on holidays (if he chooses) and all special occasions. He was there for graduations, proms, homecomings, etc. He was there to celebrate the honors. By him getting dismissed, he gave us all peace, stability and room to heal. Staying would have been only for him and had the opposite affect.

 

Bent, you are an example of someone who removes the misery from their life and becomes a stronger, better person and parent. You have honestly portrayed your past and present and I admire the courage you have to face some really hard times.

 

Your children must feel this strength about you. I, as always, appreciate your honesty.

[Spark1111]

My FWH often talks about how close he came to destroying his own children's lives, along with mine. His A was relatively short compared to most (6 weeks), but of course he thought he was in love... blah blah blah. As he says now, if he had really found true love, it would have made him a better man, but in stark contrast, he literally became a snarling creature none of us recognized.

 

Mine too! We chalked it up to job stress with a new highly pressurized position, which we had all been praying for!

 

To this day, I ask him, "If it made you so happy, why were you so miserable?" Turns out she was pretty miserable too and it became "two lonely people no one else wanted" which was the height of delusion.

 

I was at the height of suffering from a recently diagnosed chronic illness when "she" came along. I remember the nasty comments flung my way about how I was using it as an excuse to get out of responsibilities. Ummm, yeah, being stuck in bed was just soooo much fun. He presented himself as the saint who "took care of his ailing wife who didn't love him back", and the Father of the Year. In reality, he had called his mom to come take care of everything while he took all the credit.

 

Yes. I too experienced this. I could do nothing right, even though I was working 3 jobs and moving children in and out of college by myself because he was too busy...with her!

 

At the time, I thought he was stressed about my illness. It was a frightening time for all of us, especially the children. When he sat me down to tell me what had really been going on, I was completely blindsided. If it weren't for the fact that he is a completely different man today than the one who allowed himself to surrender to temptation, he wouldn't have been given a second chance. He is now the father I always knew he could be, and a better husband than I ever could have ever hoped for.

 

Our decision to reconcile was much more adversarial in that I wanted no part of him for a very long time. But he is once again, a wonderful husband and father. I tell him how wonderful it is to have him, the 'real' him back!

 

The children knew that dad had really flipped out during that time, but they don't know why (I decided it was best that they not have to suffer with that knowledge), but now they constantly comment on how much their parents love each other. We even get a lot of "ewwwww's" when we kiss in front of them. We were always very affectionate before, but it's been particularly fun to discover new ways to gross out our teenagers. It's especially effective for clearing them out of a room when we want it all to ourselves.

 

I had no intention of telling them, but my oldest daughter intuited it immediately, and I would not lie to her. We are all working to heal. My husband wrote his children a letter from the heart apologizing and offering ammends and discussions followed.

 

Yes, we do clear the room also. It is all good.

[PhoenixRise]

Spark it a passive aggressive way to avoid changing the status quo.

 

And it IS the perfect excuse, one that is hard to argue with. What woman could look at a man who is saying to her "I just can't bear to hurt my children" or "I have to keep my family together until the kids are adults" and say NO I want and expect you to leave them to be with me? Who wants to find themself in the position of asking a man to do something that he has said will make him less than an ideal father in his own eyes.

 

It sounds great. I serves to make WH look great in the eyes of OW because it looks like he is so dedicated to his kids.

 

It all sounds great until you objectively look at some WH's actual parenting and compare the reality of his parenting to what he says about his devotion to his kids to see if the declarations measure up.

 

When my H was in his affair, his attitude and demeanor changed much like you describe for your H Spark. We, my child and I lost time with him and attention from him when he was making time to talk to her (she was not local). There were times when my H would make up an excuse to leave early for business trips so that he could spend time with her. Part of my thinking when I separated from him was that I was not going to put the entirety of my time and energy into being a great parent (for real, hands on) and a great wife, to facilitate his oh so lovely funtime affair. Let HIM be a full time parent (for real, hands on) during his visitation while I have some funtime of my own.

[Spark1111]

Spark it a passive aggressive way to avoid changing the status quo.

 

And avoid making a choice for either the spouse or the OW/OM.

 

And it IS the perfect excuse, one that is hard to argue with. What woman could look at a man who is saying to her "I just can't bear to hurt my children" or "I have to keep my family together until the kids are adults" and say NO I want and expect you to leave them to be with me? Who wants to find themself in the position of asking a man to do something that he has said will make him less than an ideal father in his own eyes.

 

No one would ask that! Hence, it remains the perfect excuse.

 

It sounds great. I serves to make WH look great in the eyes of OW because it looks like he is so dedicated to his kids. How noble right? What a great guy!

 

It all sounds great until you objectively look at some WH's actual parenting and compare the reality of his parenting to what he says about his devotion to his kids to see if the declarations measure up.

 

THis is what the OW/OM can never know the truth of because they do not live in the home! All they know is what they are told through the perceptions of the AP.

 

When my H was in his affair, his attitude and demeanor changed much like you describe for your H Spark. We, my child and I lost time with him and attention from him when he was making time to talk to her (she was not local). There were times when my H would make up an excuse to leave early for business trips so that he could spend time with her. Same here! She was D and xH had visitation every other weekend, which coincided with my fWS business trips....with her!

 

Part of my thinking when I separated from him was that I was not going to put the entirety of my time and energy into being a great parent (for real, hands on) and a great wife, to facilitate his oh so lovely funtime affair. Let HIM be a full time parent (for real, hands on) during his visitation while I have some funtime of my own.

 

We have always had a full plate. Three kids and an aging parent who lives with us. If I had the luxury of NOT having my children every other weekend due to divorce, I, too would have been running around here naked in high heels!

[jennie-jennie]

We have always had a full plate. Three kids and an aging parent who lives with us. If I had the luxury of NOT having my children every other weekend due to divorce, I, too would have been running around here naked in high heels!

 

Just wanted to comment on this. There probably are a lot of OW who just like me are single moms raising their kids more or less entirely on their own with almost no backup of a father.

[bentnotbroken]

Bent, you are an example of someone who removes the misery from their life and becomes a stronger, better person and parent. You have honestly portrayed your past and present and I admire the courage you have to face some really hard times.

 

Your children must feel this strength about you. I, as always, appreciate your honesty.

 

 

 

Not sure about being an example, unless it is of what not to do:o. I pray they appreciate the honesty. I am grateful they gave me another opportunity at being a better parent. My past sucks because I collected misery like merit badges. Whoa to poor Bent....yeah right. The world doesn't stop to let me catch up and I can't get off without dying, so I had better adjust. But the future looks so bright....I got to wear shades.

[BlueeyedJonesy]

But the future looks so bright....I got to wear shades.

 

Looove it!

[bentnotbroken]

Looove it!

:bunny::bunny:That's me. Loving life:bunny::bunny:.............. Even when people p!ss me off to the n'th degree.

[Lizzie60]

I honestly think that many MMs stay for the sake of the kids..

 

I also think that some BS.. also stay with their cheating partner for the sake of the kids..

[silktricks]

I honestly think that many MMs stay for the sake of the kids..

 

I also think that some BS.. also stay with their cheating partner for the sake of the kids..

 

I honestly don't think so. I think they (both MM and BS) convince themselves they are staying for the kids - but it's not really about the kids, it's about themselves.

[jennie-jennie]

I honestly don't think so. I think they (both MM and BS) convince themselves they are staying for the kids - but it's not really about the kids, it's about themselves.

 

The kids are one factor among many, that is how I see it. Perhaps the one that breaks the camel's back.

[Spark1111]

Just wanted to comment on this. There probably are a lot of OW who just like me are single moms raising their kids more or less entirely on their own with almost no backup of a father.

 

Jennie, it is why I only had empathy in my heart for her when I discovered her existence!

 

But in retrospect, she had it pretty good and used the poor me card to elicit sympathy from not only my fWS, but everyone else too! Some people are like that, you know?

 

She was left a beautiful home in the divorce; has a very good professional job; one child who is gone every other weekend; supportive family in the neighborhood who babysit often....and still despises her xH and remains a poor me, I have nothing.

 

Hey! It works for her; lots of trips, gift, flowers, limos, dinners....get the picture?

 

I have nothing but respect for a single mom with no support and few opportunities. I was raised by one.

[Spark1111]

Not sure about being an example, unless it is of what not to do:o. I pray they appreciate the honesty. I am grateful they gave me another opportunity at being a better parent. My past sucks because I collected misery like merit badges. Whoa to poor Bent....yeah right. The world doesn't stop to let me catch up and I can't get off without dying, so I had better adjust. But the future looks so bright....I got to wear shades.

 

 

That anger can kill you! So glad you are getting a handle and living a better life...one so bright it requires shades! Kudos to you and your children!

[BlueeyedJonesy]

"staying for the kids" is something OW like to believe...if thats what helps you sleep at night.

 

My H knew when all of his skeletons came out that he was free to go..knowing he would still be a huge part of our children and there was a time where I was looking into apartments. BUT he is my H who I am very much in love with:love:..how could I sit by and let him fight his battle alone..I will stand by him reguardless if we have kids or not..

 

I don't care if its hard for anyone to swallow or not.

[Spark1111]

I honestly think that many MMs stay for the sake of the kids..

 

I also think that some BS.. also stay with their cheating partner for the sake of the kids..

 

Lizzie, I think less so today than in the past when women had fewer options outside the home than they do today. I would never judge a woman who stays with a cheating MM if she is raising young ones. She needs those babies to survive, so if they mutually USE each other to raise the clan....so be it!

 

But I have personally impressed on my daughters, through words and example, the importance of having your own money, career, etc., so you will never have to stay in a loveless relationship for the sake of the children. I hope they are listening and observing me.

[Spark1111]

I honestly don't think so. I think they (both MM and BS) convince themselves they are staying for the kids - but it's not really about the kids, it's about themselves.

 

Which brings me to silk. Yes, they convince themselves....and whether it is to avoid the consequences of an affair or raise the kiddies on HIS/HER paycheck, or retain the status quo.... a convincing definitely does occur.

[2sure]

Even though my H has put me through hell with his serial cheating, If I did not have my daughter...I might have tried staying longer. I love him.

 

But what broke me, really broke me...is that my daughter and I are a package. He has been like a father to her more that her real Dad. Already having come from a broken home...she became comfortable and happy in her new home.

 

And he **** all over us both, but for her....I will never ever forgive him.

Worse, some of my family and all of his do not know the circumstances of why I am divorcing him and they act like : idiot 2sure is leaving father of the year and hurting her poor daughter.

 

Stay for the kids? Get the F out you unreliable, unstable, selfish, emasculated piece of crap and take your checkbook with you. I could not bare the thought of her counting on him and being betrayed in some other way. A man capable of this kind of infidelity is capable of blowing her college fund or kicking her out if I'm not around. I mean, I have no reason to base this on...but I didnt think he would cheat either.

 

I would never forgive myself if I allowed my daughter to continue to count on and trust such an untrustworthy person and I thank God I found out before it really hurt her.

[Spark1111]

"staying for the kids" is something OW like to believe...if thats what helps you sleep at night.

 

My H knew when all of his skeletons came out that he was free to go..knowing he would still be a huge part of our children and there was a time where I was looking into apartments. BUT he is my H who I am very much in love with:love:..how could I sit by and let him fight his battle alone..I will stand by him reguardless if we have kids or not..

 

I don't care if its hard for anyone to swallow or not.

 

You know, this is another scenario where I had empathy for the OW.

After being told he had to reach his financial goals, to take care of us before he was free to leave us, (?) to be with her, is now given the opportunity by me to go be with her forever on DDAY.

 

I didn't want his money (make my own); I told him I would never interfere with his relationship with his children; told his children that if this woman is who your father decides to spend his life with, I expect you to treat her with respect because that is how I raised you; and while I am shocked and hurt by his secrecy, I will be fine eventually.

 

So he then......does a complete about face and is now crying at her kitchen table wanting to be with "his family."

 

Can you imagine her heartbreak? I did and still can.

[Lizzie60]

Lizzie, I think less so today than in the past when women had fewer options outside the home than they do today. I would never judge a woman who stays with a cheating MM if she is raising young ones. She needs those babies to survive, so if they mutually USE each other to raise the clan....so be it!

 

But I have personally impressed on my daughters, through words and example, the importance of having your own money, career, etc., so you will never have to stay in a loveless relationship for the sake of the children. I hope they are listening and observing me.

 

I understand what you're saying.. but if the children are young.. the MM might also want to stay for the sake of the kids..

 

I don't understand why most people think that ONLY the mother would sacrifice herself... I'm sure many fathers also sacrifice themselves for their kids..

 

and I agree... it is extremely important to raise independant, strong women...

[JoyDevine]

 

Why do so many MM equate fatherhood as a paycheck?

 

What do you mean by this?

 

I absolutely believe that men stay for the kids. And I also believe that the kids are the reason that you see a lot of cheating wives leave their husbands but you don't see cheating husbands leave their wives. The woman will get the kids. The man won't.

The man has way more to lose by leaving his wife for another woman.

[2sure]

I'm sure both MM and BS stay for the kids almost equally, but that doesnt make it the best choice for the kids, and I'm thinking most of them know that...so...

[Spark1111]

Even though my H has put me through hell with his serial cheating, If I did not have my daughter...I might have tried staying longer. I love him.

 

But what broke me, really broke me...is that my daughter and I are a package. He has been like a father to her more that her real Dad. Already having come from a broken home...she became comfortable and happy in her new home.

 

And he **** all over us both, but for her....I will never ever forgive him.

Worse, some of my family and all of his do not know the circumstances of why I am divorcing him and they act like : idiot 2sure is leaving father of the year and hurting her poor daughter.

 

Stay for the kids? Get the F out you unreliable, unstable, selfish, emasculated piece of crap and take your checkbook with you. I could not bare the thought of her counting on him and being betrayed in some other way. A man capable of this kind of infidelity is capable of blowing her college fund or kicking her out if I'm not around. I mean, I have no reason to base this on...but I didnt think he would cheat either.

 

I would never forgive myself if I allowed my daughter to continue to count on and trust such an untrustworthy person and I thank God I found out before it really hurt her.

 

Well, you always know where you stand with 2sure!

 

I agree. I can choose to forgive or not forgive transgressions in my significant relationship. It IS my choice.

 

Harder to forgive is the betrayal of our children to self-satisfy your selfish desires.

 

I have always stated it is NOT the feelings for another destroys trust; it is the lying and deceptions perpetrated to to act on those feelings that destroys trust.

 

Man up! Own your choices! tell us, spouse and kids, that you have developed feelings for another. We will separate; seek counseling; see if there is a marriage worth saving.

 

That is the grown-up thing to do. As much as that hurts, he still would have/could have retained the respect of his children! The ones he used to portray himself as father of the year with to HER; the ones, in reality, he ignored or resented during his affair. Of course they felt it!

 

Staying for the kids? His affair almost destroyed his children emotionally. He was not the daddy they always believed he was; he was a liar who had mistreated their mother.

 

And I will never understand all the milestones, special occasions in the life of his children he missed to be with her. I do not believe he will ever understand it either. He despises himself for that most of all.

 

If a woman truly loves a man, how could she ever allow or insist he be with her than to be with a child she knows he adored? Afraid he'll fall back in love with his spouse, his children to the detriment of their love, her children?

 

You have every right to be as cautious and angry as you are 2sure. Very, very wise.

 

Your daughter may be too young to speak to, and if she has enjoyed a great relationship with him, I certainly understand not wanting to taint that. But why be quiet around family? Why protect him still?

[Spark1111]

I understand what you're saying.. but if the children are young.. the MM might also want to stay for the sake of the kids..

 

I don't understand why most people think that ONLY the mother would sacrifice herself... I'm sure many fathers also sacrifice themselves for their kids..

 

and I agree... it is extremely important to raise independant, strong women...

 

I know both sexes can make sacrifies for the sake of the children! But maybe I am predjudiced in that when I think of a young mother who can barely find the time to go to the bathroom, never mind alone, I have a soft-spot in my heart for her if the guy is still providing but treats her like s***t.

 

But since this IS the infidelity forum, I have a harder time wrapping my head around a MM who tells his OW that he is staying for the sake of the children while having sex outside the marriage.

 

Not the same self-sacrifice in my book at all.

[Spark1111]

What do you mean by this?

 

I absolutely believe that men stay for the kids. And I also believe that the kids are the reason that you see a lot of cheating wives leave their husbands but you don't see cheating husbands leave their wives. The woman will get the kids. The man won't.

The man has way more to lose by leaving his wife for another woman.

 

If they are cheating, then I assert they are both NOT thinking what is in the best interests of the children, only themselves. In an affair, both men and woman have less invested emotionally in what is the right thing to do for the children.

 

And if the wife abandons the family, as with the husband, both can be sued successfully for sole custody of the children.

 

And the kids know it, sense it, intuit it, no matter what baloney gets tossed around verbally by the parents.

 

I still assert that someone staying for the sake of the kids, is one of the best lines to keep the affair secret that I know of.

 

Want to be a great parent? Invest solely in the relationship with your spouse. Can't do it? Amicably divorce and share visitation.

 

That is the best thing you can do for the sake of the children.

 

Research shows it is not marriage or divorce that effects children.

 

It is the amount of adversity in the marriage or divorce that impacts children negatively.

 

If you do not think an affair impacts a marital relationship negatively, you are sadly mistaken.