Spark1111 Posted April 5, 2010 Posted April 5, 2010 To hear a MM/MW is only staying in a loveless marriage for the sake of the children a) Makes me almost physically ill b) and has to be the best line in the world, as far excuses go, IMO. How noble! What a great guy to sacrifice romantic love for the sake of his familial obligations! What a wonderful way to make an empathetic woman stay strung along for months, no years, as they wait for him/her to decide their course of action because "we/he/her can't hurt the children." If my fWS's affair is any indication of how he stayed with me because he so loved his children, I want to barf! First off, he was so obssessed with his AP that he also emotionally distanced himself from them, and even started to resent the cost of raising them because then he had less to spend on his secret life. He grew quickly frustrated with them and used them at every opportunity to pick a fight with me! If a confidant mother is one of the keys to successful parenting, I never felt less confidant than the 1.5 years he had his affair! I knew something was wrong, but never guessed it could be an affair! My children SAW their mother's growing lonliness, depression and isolation. They also saw how hurtful he became towards me, and to a lesser extent, them! But to her, he was the greatest Dad since sliced bread! Give me a break. Any thoughts out there?
califnan Posted April 5, 2010 Posted April 5, 2010 To hear a MM/MW is only staying in a loveless marriage for the sake of the children a) Makes me almost physically ill b) and has to be the best line in the world, as far excuses go, IMO. How noble! What a great guy to sacrifice romantic love for the sake of his familial obligations! What a wonderful way to make an empathetic woman stay strung along for months, no years, as they wait for him/her to decide their course of action because "we/he/her can't hurt the children." If my fWS's affair is any indication of how he stayed with me because he so loved his children, I want to barf! First off, he was so obssessed with his AP that he also emotionally distanced himself from them, and even started to resent the cost of raising them because then he had less to spend on his secret life. He grew quickly frustrated with them and used them at every opportunity to pick a fight with me! If a confidant mother is one of the keys to successful parenting, I never felt less confidant than the 1.5 years he had his affair! I knew something was wrong, but never guessed it could be an affair! My children SAW their mother's growing lonliness, depression and isolation. They also saw how hurtful he became towards me, and to a lesser extent, them! But to her, he was the greatest Dad since sliced bread! Give me a break. Any thoughts out there? ----------------- Me too. The wife is the last to know, believe it or not - all .. When he was hiding behind his newspaper, I thought he was Reading it .. ha I have, in these two decades - come to realize that he did me a favor in leaving ... There is no greater lonliness or hurt than living with someone (your one flesh) who has become the enemy .. For what it is worth, it appears that those who reject others - do not reap happiness, just guilt. Our beautiful Loyal sons have to this day, suffered the most. Their father rejected them, even from his grave. Years after he died, my sons discovered that my exhusband kept his sons from an inheritance from their grandfather's estate, by disinheriting them and leaving all to her and even her children - months before he died. Even while not in remarriage, I am happy and peaceful - But the Children Suffer the Most with these divorces..
stillafool Posted April 5, 2010 Posted April 5, 2010 I certainly don't condone cheating but I have to agree. When a MM/MW says they are "just staying for the kids" I hear, "I don't want to give up my money, house and position in society". I feel if they really gave a damn about the kids they wouldn't be cheating in the first place. They would run home and spend that time with the kids.
ADF Posted April 5, 2010 Posted April 5, 2010 Thoughts? I think you're absolutely right. I don't answer posts from people married having affairs, because they don't deserve any help. They deserve as bad as they get, and most of them should get worse, frankly.
xxoo Posted April 5, 2010 Posted April 5, 2010 I feel if they really gave a damn about the kids they wouldn't be cheating in the first place. They would run home and spend that time with the kids. Yes, it seems if you are "staying for the children", then you should actually be staying (fully invested) for the children. Not staying legally and socially married, while spending time and money (precious resources for most parents) on an extramarital affair.
Author Spark1111 Posted April 5, 2010 Author Posted April 5, 2010 ----------------- Me too. The wife is the last to know, believe it or not - all .. When he was hiding behind his newspaper, I thought he was Reading it .. ha I have, in these two decades - come to realize that he did me a favor in leaving ... There is no greater lonliness or hurt than living with someone (your one flesh) who has become the enemy .. For what it is worth, it appears that those who reject others - do not reap happiness, just guilt. Our beautiful Loyal sons have to this day, suffered the most. Their father rejected them, even from his grave. Years after he died, my sons discovered that my exhusband kept his sons from an inheritance from their grandfather's estate, by disinheriting them and leaving all to her and even her children - months before he died. Even while not in remarriage, I am happy and peaceful - But the Children Suffer the Most with these divorces.. Califnan, God Bless you and your sons! To deny them an inheritance is just, IMO, the height of meanness. Some of these people are sooooo self-centered that they have to punsih their OWN children by withholding money. Whats a matter? He grew upset his sons became upset their father hurt their mother? They should be. It is what well-raised children do: feel their parents pain. Jeez!
Author Spark1111 Posted April 5, 2010 Author Posted April 5, 2010 Yes, it seems if you are "staying for the children", then you should actually be staying (fully invested) for the children. Not staying legally and socially married, while spending time and money (precious resources for most parents) on an extramarital affair. Thoughts? I think you're absolutely right. I don't answer posts from people married having affairs, because they don't deserve any help. They deserve as bad as they get, and most of them should get worse, frankly. I get the part of falling out of love with your spouse. I just do not get why every effort to repair the relationship, and I'm talking professional help here, is rarely attempted before the onset of an affair. Because raising children and loving the mother or father, is not exclusive of each other, IMO. The health of the marital relationship sets the tone of the household and is the key to successful parenting; it certainly is the key to successful communication. Your children are always watching and intuiting the emotions of their parents; it is not what you say, it is what you do and how you act that is the biggest teacher a child has in life. When you grow emotionally distant, as in an affair, who is parenting the children? If motherhood or fatherhood the delivery of meals or a paycheck, with your thoughts always obsessing back to your AP and the next tryst?
califnan Posted April 5, 2010 Posted April 5, 2010 Califnan, God Bless you and your sons! To deny them an inheritance is just, IMO, the height of meanness. Some of these people are sooooo self-centered that they have to punsih their OWN children by withholding money. Whats a matter? He grew upset his sons became upset their father hurt their mother? They should be. It is what well-raised children do: feel their parents pain. Jeez! -------------------- Thank's Spark. The discovery was made about four or five years ago - regarding my late exhusband's will offsetting my father in law's estate.. To this day, his family (brothers, cousins, sister-in-laws) are in shock that he would do that. I have tried to explain it that, before he died he felt so in bondage to his new wife - that he honored her wishes because of his declining state of health. A 1-1/2 page will made at her attorney's office denying his only children - and leaving everything to her and to even her children.. Spark, this is where sin leads to ... many are affected..
Author Spark1111 Posted April 5, 2010 Author Posted April 5, 2010 I certainly don't condone cheating but I have to agree. When a MM/MW says they are "just staying for the kids" I hear, "I don't want to give up my money, house and position in society". I feel if they really gave a damn about the kids they wouldn't be cheating in the first place. They would run home and spend that time with the kids. QUOTE] Yes, that is the line I do not buy at all. Hey, but she bought it hook, line and sinker, so I guess it worked for him. I make my own money, and while I couldn't support the home on one income, I would have willingly sold it and split the proceeds. I told him so. Our youngest was one year into in college, and if my fWS refused to help him financially, I would have helped our son secure loans. So bit by bit after DDay, you could see him dissemble because the lies he told himself were being pricked by my reality pin. The excuses he fed her, he had started to believe. He was shocked truly to be kicked out by me and told to go live with the love of your life. I do not want your money. I do not care about social status. I have earned the love and respect of my children and do not fear they won't support any decision I make, and it is the first time they ever saw me brought to my knees sobbing. Think they will ever forget that visual?
Spoiled Posted April 5, 2010 Posted April 5, 2010 To hear a MM/MW is only staying in a loveless marriage for the sake of the children a) Makes me almost physically ill b) and has to be the best line in the world, as far excuses go, IMO. How noble! What a great guy to sacrifice romantic love for the sake of his familial obligations! What a wonderful way to make an empathetic woman stay strung along for months, no years, as they wait for him/her to decide their course of action because "we/he/her can't hurt the children." If my fWS's affair is any indication of how he stayed with me because he so loved his children, I want to barf! First off, he was so obssessed with his AP that he also emotionally distanced himself from them, and even started to resent the cost of raising them because then he had less to spend on his secret life. He grew quickly frustrated with them and used them at every opportunity to pick a fight with me! If a confidant mother is one of the keys to successful parenting, I never felt less confidant than the 1.5 years he had his affair! I knew something was wrong, but never guessed it could be an affair! My children SAW their mother's growing lonliness, depression and isolation. They also saw how hurtful he became towards me, and to a lesser extent, them! But to her, he was the greatest Dad since sliced bread! Give me a break. Any thoughts out there? Strange, I am the WS, yet my H had some of the exact same traits as yours. As a MW with children, I totally understand when BS say they stay for the sake of the children. I cannot imagine spending Christmas without my children or their activities because it was my choice to leave. Hearing my daughter's statements of how wonderful her daddy is and how he is the most handsome man in the world kills me when I think of leaving. Your statement of loneliness and depression is exactly how I felt prior to my A. My children suffered greatly during that time, but my A, then, made me feel much better. Therefore, my children were happier. Unfortunately and to my embarrassment, I heard so many comments of "You are a great mom" from those who knew me and strangers. Expressed their wants to have a life like mine because they saw me so happy. It's sad, but true.
Dexter Morgan Posted April 5, 2010 Posted April 5, 2010 To hear a MM/MW is only staying in a loveless marriage for the sake of the children a) Makes me almost physically ill b) and has to be the best line in the world, as far excuses go, IMO. How noble! What a great guy to sacrifice romantic love for the sake of his familial obligations! Boom!! I love it!!! I sacrificed romantic love for my kids. But I wasn't the WS. Then I learned why my affections were for naught....then divorced her because life with a cheater is no life at all. And I wouldn't have been a happy father being miserable in a home with someone I despised. I think when someone says they are staying "for the kids", its a load of s##t. They stay because its cheaper to keep 'em. the don't want to lose THEIR lifestyle, familiar life, whatever. I think when someone says its for the kids, its really not.
share&care Posted April 6, 2010 Posted April 6, 2010 To hear a MM/MW is only staying in a loveless marriage for the sake of the children a) Makes me almost physically ill b) and has to be the best line in the world, as far excuses go, IMO. How noble! What a great guy to sacrifice romantic love for the sake of his familial obligations! What a wonderful way to make an empathetic woman stay strung along for months, no years, as they wait for him/her to decide their course of action because "we/he/her can't hurt the children." If my fWS's affair is any indication of how he stayed with me because he so loved his children, I want to barf! First off, he was so obssessed with his AP that he also emotionally distanced himself from them, and even started to resent the cost of raising them because then he had less to spend on his secret life. He grew quickly frustrated with them and used them at every opportunity to pick a fight with me! If a confidant mother is one of the keys to successful parenting, I never felt less confidant than the 1.5 years he had his affair! I knew something was wrong, but never guessed it could be an affair! My children SAW their mother's growing lonliness, depression and isolation. They also saw how hurtful he became towards me, and to a lesser extent, them! But to her, he was the greatest Dad since sliced bread! Give me a break. Any thoughts out there? They also see a father who acts all happy at home when he isn't. They might even discover the A and wonder why the heck he 'acts' so slap happy all the time. What do the children learn in this case? I think they learn to pretend at home and go out and get what they want on the side, that's waht. I have a friend who's dad was having an A, she found an email he sent to his OW. This friend of mine is in her 30s now and just can't settle down, doesn't trust men and pretty soon it will be to late to have kids. I really worry about her. Her dad acts happy all the time but he really isn't. She is learning to live in the same way I think...
White Flower Posted April 6, 2010 Posted April 6, 2010 Boom!! I love it!!! I sacrificed romantic love for my kids. But I wasn't the WS. Then I learned why my affections were for naught....then divorced her because life with a cheater is no life at all. And I wouldn't have been a happy father being miserable in a home with someone I despised. I think when someone says they are staying "for the kids", its a load of s##t. They stay because its cheaper to keep 'em. the don't want to lose THEIR lifestyle, familiar life, whatever. I think when someone says its for the kids, its really not. Unless the BS is really manipulative and makes it his/her goal in life to work the kids against the WS I agree with you DM. I have literally heard MM say, 'It's cheaper to keep her', but that was before I saw and knew the broken soul he had with regard to manipulation on the kids, friends, and family. I'm sure most BS are not like this but it does happen. But for the most part, I agree with you. I'm sure a lot of the time it is really selfishness that makes WS stay.
JoyDevine Posted April 6, 2010 Posted April 6, 2010 To hear a MM/MW is only staying in a loveless marriage for the sake of the children a) Makes me almost physically ill b) and has to be the best line in the world, as far excuses go, IMO. How noble! What a great guy to sacrifice romantic love for the sake of his familial obligations! What a wonderful way to make an empathetic woman stay strung along for months, no years, as they wait for him/her to decide their course of action because "we/he/her can't hurt the children." Are you still with this man? If so, why? I think that men stay and put up with a lot for the kids. I don't think it's an excuse, it's reality. If there is a divorce, he will not get the kids. Everything will change and he'll be a part time father. However, "for the kids" doesn't work when the "kids" are in college.
Spoiled Posted April 6, 2010 Posted April 6, 2010 Are you still with this man? If so, why? I think that men stay and put up with a lot for the kids. I don't think it's an excuse, it's reality. If there is a divorce, he will not get the kids. Everything will change and he'll be a part time father. However, "for the kids" doesn't work when the "kids" are in college. And women do too.....why do most BS stay????
Woggle Posted April 6, 2010 Posted April 6, 2010 If they really loved their kids they would not be cheating, Most men who cheat are in good marriages which is something I don't get. It's the men married to women who are not worth a damn that treat them like garbage that are hopelessly devoted and faithful.
fooled once Posted April 6, 2010 Posted April 6, 2010 I don't buy the excuse of staying for the kids either. The cheating person is NOT with their kids, they are too busy sneaking away to see the AP, or call them in secret. They aren't focusing on their children - they are more worried about the next call, the next text, the next roll in the hay with the AP. If they really were worried about their kids, they would ensure their kids had a good role model, that they were someone their kids could trust, could respect, could look up to. Also, they would treat the mother/father with respect by NOT disrespecting him/her by cheating on them. If they didn't love their partner anymore, they should see if counseling could help and if all efforts have been exhausted, then they divorce. Heck, some of these cheaters might even see their kids MORE if they did divorce because they would HAVE to see them if they took their visitation. They couldn't spend their visitation time running off to see the AP. They would need to focus on their kids. As much as I know my H hurt when he left the marital home after his divorce (and there was no cheating), he actually got to spend more QUALITY time with his kids in a home filled with love and not stress or tension. He got a chance to bond with his kids 1-1 and not rely on his ex to give a bath, do homework, etc. And no one wants to not have their child for a holiday, but those 'days' are just days (I will admit, I never had to share a holiday with my ex -- I was the custodial parent with sole custody and I didn't split holidays - I got them). But you can have Christmas on the 24th or the 26th...it doesn't HAVE to be on the 25th - same thing with birthdays and other holidays. Maybe if the cheater spent more time WITH his family, working on issues, then there wouldn't be a divorce OR cheating. Maybe if the cheater thought of others besides his/her self, there would be a different outcome instead of an affair or a divorce. But ultimately, the kids deserve parents they can look up to, respect and model their behavior after.
White Flower Posted April 6, 2010 Posted April 6, 2010 If they really loved their kids they would not be cheating, Most men who cheat are in good marriages which is something I don't get. It's the men married to women who are not worth a damn that treat them like garbage that are hopelessly devoted and faithful. Please refer back to your own thread. Get some counseling.
BlueeyedJonesy Posted April 6, 2010 Posted April 6, 2010 "The most important thing a father can do for his children is to love their mother." -- Theodore Hesburgh Spark, once again you hit the nail right on the head. I don't understand the statement "I'm staying for my kids" or "I don't want to set a bad example." IME..my son is happiest when mommy and daddy are happiest. I'll never forget, one night while my H and I were going through the "dark days" after dday my son came in our room after a very heated argument..he crawled in our bed and said "look" and pointed to a black and white 8x10 picture that hangs above our bed of my H kissing my forehead..its a beautiful picture and it was amazing that he just pointed it out for no reason:( it made me feel bad. He is 4 yrs old, and he knew that something was going on because we NEVER argue in front of him so there is no way he could hear us. Children feel things adults can't. I remember my mother and father...my dad was a cheater and I always thought "Its sad that my mommy loves daddy more than he loves her" then when they divorced it gave me hope that thats not how life is...marriage is a two way street..if you can't keep two hands on the wheel then you shouldn't be driving.
Author Spark1111 Posted April 6, 2010 Author Posted April 6, 2010 Strange, I am the WS, yet my H had some of the exact same traits as yours. As a MW with children, I totally understand when BS say they stay for the sake of the children. I cannot imagine spending Christmas without my children or their activities because it was my choice to leave. Hearing my daughter's statements of how wonderful her daddy is and how he is the most handsome man in the world kills me when I think of leaving. Your statement of loneliness and depression is exactly how I felt prior to my A. My children suffered greatly during that time, but my A, then, made me feel much better. Therefore, my children were happier. Unfortunately and to my embarrassment, I heard so many comments of "You are a great mom" from those who knew me and strangers. Expressed their wants to have a life like mine because they saw me so happy. It's sad, but true. THen your affair served to make you happier in the home. This is not always the case. Often the person having the affair is NOT happier in the home. They are just going through the motions until their next tryst with their AP. Curious....How was your husband's emotions towards his family during your affair?
bentnotbroken Posted April 6, 2010 Posted April 6, 2010 THen your affair served to make you happier in the home. This is not always the case. Often the person having the affair is NOT happier in the home. They are just going through the motions until their next tryst with their AP. Curious....How was your husband's emotions towards his family during your affair? I do believe Mr. Messy was happier during the A. BUT, I was miserable. I was being gas lighted and clinging desperately to my sanity. My children saw this. Hell my children suffered through this because of my actions toward them. I lashed out at everyone. Then came the decision to end it all...they felt that too, though they did not know why. My children still have both parents on holidays (if he chooses) and all special occasions. He was there for graduations, proms, homecomings, etc. He was there to celebrate the honors. By him getting dismissed, he gave us all peace, stability and room to heal. Staying would have been only for him and had the opposite affect.
Author Spark1111 Posted April 6, 2010 Author Posted April 6, 2010 Boom!! I love it!!! I sacrificed romantic love for my kids. But I wasn't the WS. Then I learned why my affections were for naught....then divorced her because life with a cheater is no life at all. And I wouldn't have been a happy father being miserable in a home with someone I despised. I think when someone says they are staying "for the kids", its a load of s##t. They stay because its cheaper to keep 'em. the don't want to lose THEIR lifestyle, familiar life, whatever. I think when someone says its for the kids, its really not. I agree! It is the WS who wants to maintain the status quo, the equity in the home, and the AP on the side. It is just.....easier and has nothing to do with what is in the best interests of the children, IMO.
Author Spark1111 Posted April 6, 2010 Author Posted April 6, 2010 They also see a father who acts all happy at home when he isn't. They might even discover the A and wonder why the heck he 'acts' so slap happy all the time. What do the children learn in this case? I think they learn to pretend at home and go out and get what they want on the side, that's waht. I have a friend who's dad was having an A, she found an email he sent to his OW. This friend of mine is in her 30s now and just can't settle down, doesn't trust men and pretty soon it will be to late to have kids. I really worry about her. Her dad acts happy all the time but he really isn't. She is learning to live in the same way I think... Yes, mommy and daddy teach their children all too well the dynamics of trust in a relationship. Or the lack thereof....It does not matter the age of the child. The discovery of a spousal betrayal is devastating to children and can have life long impact on their future relationships. It also makes them more likely to have affairs, unfortunately.
Author Spark1111 Posted April 6, 2010 Author Posted April 6, 2010 Are you still with this man? If so, why? I think that men stay and put up with a lot for the kids. I don't think it's an excuse, it's reality. If there is a divorce, he will not get the kids. Everything will change and he'll be a part time father. However, "for the kids" doesn't work when the "kids" are in college. Men "put up with a lot for the kids?" Love that line too. What about women who usually are the primary caretakers? What are they putting up with for the sake of the kids? As for divorce turning him into a part-time father, I'm asserting he already is one if he is in an affair, plus he is a non-existant, emotionally disconnected spouse. That alone is affecting the kids, the way Daddy no longer has any joy or shows any affection to Mommy. Hell, he doesn't even smile at her anymore. Why do so many MM equate fatherhood as a paycheck? Why do so many OW accept this as noble? You think the kids do not see this? Feel it to the marrow of their bones? It is just one more excuse, probably the best one, because it hooks so many women and men into remaining a long-term secret.
Author Spark1111 Posted April 6, 2010 Author Posted April 6, 2010 "The most important thing a father can do for his children is to love their mother." -- Theodore Hesburgh Spark, once again you hit the nail right on the head. I don't understand the statement "I'm staying for my kids" or "I don't want to set a bad example." IME..my son is happiest when mommy and daddy are happiest. And that is the bottom line for child rearing....If you cannot love the mother or father in a way that ignites joy in the child, then take the proper steps to divorce with grace and dignity and with as much respect for your child's parent as possible. Fooled Once is correct! You may actually have more quality time with your child because you will be forced to have visitation. Oh, wait a minute....that would interfere with your affair. Easier to have your spouse care for your child while you meet with your paramour than to have to find a babysitter. Seriously, how this primary relationship is conducted between mother and father is the blueprint for ALL FUTURE RELATIONSHIPS your child will have. Think about that for a minute or two.....
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