xxoo Posted April 17, 2010 Posted April 17, 2010 . Something is going on, and at this point it is probably fixable. Don't wait years. Quoting myself A big change like becoming parents always comes with renegotiation of the relationship. It is often the first big "test" of a marriage. Chores need to be rearranged, childcare negotiated, financial adjustments, work schedules change....there are an infinite number of negotiations and an equal number of opportunities for resentment to build. It takes a lot of communication, and sometimes the help of a counselor.
Author samohtmg Posted April 17, 2010 Author Posted April 17, 2010 But not in the way that some of you think. My wife cried a little then tried to examine herself in her response. Then I responded. Then she did. She never got the idea that I was sort of looking for permission for going elsewhere. Then she started to drop other issues onto it. We are communication now more than ever but she is not really grasping what I am getting at. Somewhat predictably she is just happy that I told her it is ok for us not to have that much sex. Here is the most noteworthy line from one of her e-mails: "It has nothing to do with you...it is biological, physiological, emotional.....the same with you....we are just built differently.....maybe I have a low testosterone level...and maybe also not enough estrogen either..who knows..." What do you do with that? To answer some questions: I am in the best shape of my life. I don't drink, don't smoke, and I dote on my kids. And I know this sounds a little conceded but I am a good looking guy. I could do a little bit more around the house but I am to a deadbeat cleaner. She is not much different than me in that regard. She probably cleans 60- 40 but I cart the kids around 80- 20. My e-mail was less direct to her than what I posited here. That's why it went above her head. But what would you do. She wants this to be worked out over several months to maybe more than a year. I don't have that kind of time.
giotto Posted April 17, 2010 Posted April 17, 2010 But not in the way that some of you think. My wife cried a little then tried to examine herself in her response. Then I responded. Then she did. She never got the idea that I was sort of looking for permission for going elsewhere. Then she started to drop other issues onto it. We are communication now more than ever but she is not really grasping what I am getting at. Somewhat predictably she is just happy that I told her it is ok for us not to have that much sex. Here is the most noteworthy line from one of her e-mails: "It has nothing to do with you...it is biological, physiological, emotional.....the same with you....we are just built differently.....maybe I have a low testosterone level...and maybe also not enough estrogen either..who knows..." What do you do with that? To answer some questions: I am in the best shape of my life. I don't drink, don't smoke, and I dote on my kids. And I know this sounds a little conceded but I am a good looking guy. I could do a little bit more around the house but I am to a deadbeat cleaner. She is not much different than me in that regard. She probably cleans 60- 40 but I cart the kids around 80- 20. My e-mail was less direct to her than what I posited here. That's why it went above her head. But what would you do. She wants this to be worked out over several months to maybe more than a year. I don't have that kind of time. looks like it's time to start drinking and taking drugs...
xxoo Posted April 17, 2010 Posted April 17, 2010 Here is the most noteworthy line from one of her e-mails: "It has nothing to do with you...it is biological, physiological, emotional.....the same with you....we are just built differently.....maybe I have a low testosterone level...and maybe also not enough estrogen either..who knows..." What do you do with that? Has she seen a dr? If she thinks it could be hormonal, why not? As to her not understanding your point, you need to make your point clearer. If you are planning to look elsewhere, tell her in no uncertain terms so she can make informed decisions about her life. You don't have a year to spend saving your marriage? You are only just now beginning to really communicate about your relationship issues. Yes, it will take time, but it is as much your fault as hers that so much time passed without working on the issues.
You Go Girl Posted April 17, 2010 Posted April 17, 2010 tnttim had it right again-- She straddled you. There's a sexual beast in there--but something is holding it back. That sexual person came out for a second--and then backed off, some kind of automated response that has built up over the years. It's not her hormone levels. It's more than likely that both of you--haven't been listening to each other's cues for ages...I mean, REALLY LISTENING. Learn how to seduce your wife. The road to that is learning to really love her again, appreciate her, LISTEN to what she is really saying. She probably doesn't know her sexuality at all anymore, but you dump her, and I can guarantee you she will find it again.
2sunny Posted April 17, 2010 Posted April 17, 2010 can you be honest with your W about having other partners? are you capable of NOT becoming emotionally attached to your new partners since you intend to stay married? the emotional bond that sex with others brings is what most people get tripped up on. can you stay emotionally connected to your W if you are having sex with others? more connected to the W than the others? these are important questions you need to ask yourself before you find yourself involved in this new "game". it could potentially mess with your head if you don't have a clear idea of where your boundary is and communicate that clearly to ALL involved BEFORE stepping in to this arena.
Luv2dance Posted April 17, 2010 Posted April 17, 2010 Has she seen a dr? If she thinks it could be hormonal, why not? As to her not understanding your point, you need to make your point clearer. If you are planning to look elsewhere, tell her in no uncertain terms so she can make informed decisions about her life. You don't have a year to spend saving your marriage? You are only just now beginning to really communicate about your relationship issues. Yes, it will take time, but it is as much your fault as hers that so much time passed without working on the issues. I agree, if it could be hormonal then see a dr. and you need to make her clearly aware of how serious this is to you w/o getting angry. It is NOT ok in a healthy marriage to just brush sex off as a side activity that may or may not happen. I would work a little harder before I would consider opening up your marriage...that can't be an easy thing to make work!
mem11363 Posted April 17, 2010 Posted April 17, 2010 I would be the first to agree it can be a difficult situation when there is a large difference in libido between spouses. However - a high drive (HD) spouse and a low drive (LD) spouse can live in harmony if they are both "givers" I know because that is how my marriage works: If they both see sex more as an exercise in "giving pleasure" than "receiving pleasure" than their initial question when sex is initiated is NOT self focused. "They don't ask how do I feel, am I in the mood". They think "ok the most important person in my life wants me - hmm - what can I do to please them?" This is absolutely critical for the LD spouse. Because the more a person sees sex as an exercise in (giving) pleasing their partner, the less impact loss of raw libido has on their sex life especially if they have a partner who makes the effort to please them in bed. A LD "giver" starts off feeling happy that they can please their partner. This type person doesn't start off feeling angry/put upon when their drive is low, they start to have foreplay with a focus on giving pleasure and along the way often end up aroused and then satisfied. And yes - this is predicated on their partner being a giver also - this whole deal becomes parasitic if you have a strong giver and a strong taker. Two givers - one with a high libido the other a low libido - can make it work well. This is not to imply the LD spouse gets used like a sex toy. That is wrong and will destroy any relationship. The HD spouse has to be a giver also. A few rules of engagement: - The LD spouse cannot engage in the game of "how little sex can this relationship survive" - this is abusive. The LD spouse needs to find a way to teach their HD partner what they need in/out of bed to enable a sexual frequency that is acceptable to the HD spouse. And this needs to be discussed and mutually agreed. - They BOTH have to be sensitive to the fact that their drive differences need to be handled with care. That means: a. When they DO have sex, the LD spouse needs to radiate the desire to please. Anything else prevents the emotional connection that normally comes from sex. b. When they DON'T have sex, the HD spouse needs to be every bit as nice as they are on the nights they do connect. And the HD spouse needs to not make the LD spouse feel guilty - as long as they are sticking to their agreement on frequency. c. There needs to either be a defined schedule - Tuesday and Saturday nights OR a protocol for initiation/acceptance/non accepting response. For instance if he asks and she doesn't want to - there is a giant difference between her saying "no" and her saying "in the next couple of days I promise I will come back to you and initiate - tonight isn't going to work" A sincere deferral with a promise of things to come shortly doesn't hurt anything like a flat rejection with no idea of what/when she WILL say yes. But the guy needs to be assertive or none of this means anything. But not in the way that some of you think. My wife cried a little then tried to examine herself in her response. Then I responded. Then she did. She never got the idea that I was sort of looking for permission for going elsewhere. Then she started to drop other issues onto it. We are communication now more than ever but she is not really grasping what I am getting at. Somewhat predictably she is just happy that I told her it is ok for us not to have that much sex. Here is the most noteworthy line from one of her e-mails: "It has nothing to do with you...it is biological, physiological, emotional.....the same with you....we are just built differently.....maybe I have a low testosterone level...and maybe also not enough estrogen either..who knows..." What do you do with that? To answer some questions: I am in the best shape of my life. I don't drink, don't smoke, and I dote on my kids. And I know this sounds a little conceded but I am a good looking guy. I could do a little bit more around the house but I am to a deadbeat cleaner. She is not much different than me in that regard. She probably cleans 60- 40 but I cart the kids around 80- 20. My e-mail was less direct to her than what I posited here. That's why it went above her head. But what would you do. She wants this to be worked out over several months to maybe more than a year. I don't have that kind of time.
stillafool Posted April 18, 2010 Posted April 18, 2010 She never got the idea that I was sort of looking for permission for going elsewhere. Why weren't you more clear about what you want which is an open marriage? Why didn't you tell your wife the truth?
stillafool Posted April 18, 2010 Posted April 18, 2010 Quoting myself A big change like becoming parents always comes with renegotiation of the relationship. It is often the first big "test" of a marriage. Chores need to be rearranged, childcare negotiated, financial adjustments, work schedules change....there are an infinite number of negotiations and an equal number of opportunities for resentment to build. It takes a lot of communication, and sometimes the help of a counselor. OMG, what is the point of it all?
giotto Posted April 18, 2010 Posted April 18, 2010 OMG, what is the point of it all? I seem to remember it's called love...
You Go Girl Posted April 18, 2010 Posted April 18, 2010 It's also called growing up. It's not just about you anymore.
You Go Girl Posted April 18, 2010 Posted April 18, 2010 Why weren't you more clear about what you want which is an open marriage? Why didn't you tell your wife the truth? Especially if you are usually this obtuse--that something as GLARING as that could be missed-- who knows what other ways you don't communicate well, and she's no mind reader, none of us are.
xxoo Posted April 18, 2010 Posted April 18, 2010 OMG, what is the point of it all? The rewards are enormous
tommyr Posted April 18, 2010 Posted April 18, 2010 A few rules of engagement: - The LD spouse cannot engage in the game of "how little sex can this relationship survive" - this is abusive. The LD spouse needs to find a way to teach their HD partner what they need in/out of bed to enable a sexual frequency that is acceptable to the HD spouse. And this needs to be discussed and mutually agreed. - They BOTH have to be sensitive to the fact that their drive differences need to be handled with care. That means: a. When they DO have sex, the LD spouse needs to radiate the desire to please. Anything else prevents the emotional connection that normally comes from sex. b. When they DON'T have sex, the HD spouse needs to be every bit as nice as they are on the nights they do connect. And the HD spouse needs to not make the LD spouse feel guilty - as long as they are sticking to their agreement on frequency. c. There needs to either be a defined schedule - Tuesday and Saturday nights OR a protocol for initiation/acceptance/non accepting response. For instance if he asks and she doesn't want to - there is a giant difference between her saying "no" and her saying "in the next couple of days I promise I will come back to you and initiate - tonight isn't going to work" A sincere deferral with a promise of things to come shortly doesn't hurt anything like a flat rejection with no idea of what/when she WILL say yes. But the guy needs to be assertive or none of this means anything. OP, listen to this advice above from mem11363. He speaketh the truth. Signed, a formerly sexless married husband who was once shopping for an outside solution like you are.
stillafool Posted April 18, 2010 Posted April 18, 2010 The rewards are enormous I imagine to some it is. I personally don't need that type of reward.
You Go Girl Posted April 18, 2010 Posted April 18, 2010 I imagine to some it is. I personally don't need that type of reward. Nobody ever misses what they don't know about to begin with.
2sunny Posted April 18, 2010 Posted April 18, 2010 the problem lies in you not being perfectly direct. even half truths aren't going to make this issue clear to your W. state it outright. W - i need sex. i would like that to be with you because i love you enormously. if you cannot participate with me i will need to find someone who will. will you participate, yes or no? clear, precise and leaves the decision and responsibility to her... ultimately leaves the end result of her decision to her as well. she either does - or does not...
xxoo Posted April 19, 2010 Posted April 19, 2010 I imagine to some it is. I personally don't need that type of reward. That's cool. Marriage and kids aren't for everyone. Problems arise when a person wants the spouse and kids, but doesn't want to do the work that comes with it (physical work of pitching in, and relational work of communicating).
tnttim Posted April 19, 2010 Posted April 19, 2010 Giving a women an orgasm has very little to do with your sexual technique. I will say it again, giving a women an orgasm has very little to do with your sexual technique. She needs the build up of sexual tension, and then an orgasm will happen, any kind of orgasm. Women are not like men, what turns us on does not turn them on. They want you to be able to turn them on, they even help us but we do not notice it because we are not looking for the right signs. I have no magic trick, or line that will make her want sex, I do know the states of mind she needs to be in though. I also know that you need sexual value, or worthiness. Build the tension: Do not be always ready to have sexIgnore her little attempts to feel sexyIf she asks if she is sexy, avoid the answer, or do not answerTell her she looks like someone, then call that someone a turn offMake her believe that you think everyone wants sex from youBe the bad guy once in a while, do not do everything she asksIgnore her sexual advances until she gives in and takes it from youFigure out her taboos and mimic themDo not be predictable, do not be predictable Your sexual value: React happily if she turns you downSex is no longer top of your listDo things you would expect sex from, and then do not have sexWait for her to initiate sex, but build the tension in the mean timeMake sure she knows other people respect you, and want to be your friendHave compassion, when she is hurting, help her healDo not do every little thing she asks you to do, say NO once in a whileKeep other females interested in youStop anti-seductive behaviors immediatelyFind out what shes proud of most and use it to prop her up when she needs itSex is not a god given right The biggest thing is to learn about your women, educate yourself about what makes her tick. We are all different, but we are made up of the same things. Somethings that are important to some, are less important to others. So find out what she wants, and needs and give it to her. Make sure before, during and after sex you mention what shes proud of. You want her to feel good during the whole process, again it has very little to do with performance. If she is smiling and in good spirits before, during, and after the better and easier it will be next time. Time is very important, give the above suggestions some time to sink in. You have been exhibiting anti-seductive for a lot longer than you think. She needs to adjust to the new you, and she still fears the old you will return. So be patient, do not rush, and pay attention to her. I can guarentee results.
Author samohtmg Posted April 21, 2010 Author Posted April 21, 2010 So my wife proceeded to go out and buy sexy bedtime clothes. Then we had some form of sex for 4 days straight. The first 3 days we both orgasmed. The third day she had 4 orgasms. The 4th day she didn't have any. She said she must be tired or something. But I did. Things are really good right now. But they have been before too. I am hoping, as I always do that this time it is going to stick. I also think that it is a good idea if I am super affectionate with no expectation of sex. Otherwise it seems like the two are tied totally together which sort of cheapens the affection. Anyway, like I said, if my wife wants to play tennis I am all for it. Now lets just hope it continues.
tnttim Posted April 22, 2010 Posted April 22, 2010 So my wife proceeded to go out and buy sexy bedtime clothes. Then we had some form of sex for 4 days straight. The first 3 days we both orgasmed. The third day she had 4 orgasms. The 4th day she didn't have any. She said she must be tired or something. But I did. Things are really good right now. But they have been before too. I am hoping, as I always do that this time it is going to stick. I also think that it is a good idea if I am super affectionate with no expectation of sex. Otherwise it seems like the two are tied totally together which sort of cheapens the affection. Anyway, like I said, if my wife wants to play tennis I am all for it. Now lets just hope it continues. That's awesome, no wonder you haven't posted in a while, you must be tired. If you want to help increase the chances of this marathon happening again, then I would try to picture the whole day before this happened. Answer some questions and you may be able to pin point her sexual trigger. The questions are based on what happened before sex happened. What did you do differentWhat did she do differentDid any particular event happen, ie: she had a major problem that you helped her overcome.Did any major emotional event happen to either of you My point is that something happened that caused your wife to be super sexual. If you can find out what that was, then you can mimic that and get her in the mood. Remember women don't get turned on the same way we do, it's based on feelings for her. You said that you didn't pressure her for sex, that is a huge part of why she will continue to persue you for it. Women hate pressure especially pressure for sex, it turns them into a sexual object, not a sexual person, huge difference. Plus you wanting sex all the time in her mind says she can't please you, and that leads to her saying why bother. You did an awesome job changing yourself to change her perception of you, and it obviously payed off for both you.
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