Expiry Date

[Leia]

I've been wondering about that and I don't quite know what it means.

 

Anyway, if it is what I think it is .. then perhaps, my relationship has an expiry date.

 

Bf and I are from different race although we are both in the same religion. I've never gave a crap about dating anyone from another religion, whatever works for both of us but after several traumatic experiences involving deaths of my relatives, I began to realize about life and religion.

 

I met bf a few months ago and it's been great. We really enjoy eachother's company and want to be together and all that jazz. One thing that I know for quite some time now is that we have to get his mother's approval. He comes from a conservative family and the Middle East although he isn't the typical Middle Eastern man ~ abusive and all that. He's Iraqi and seeing that I'm multiracial, he said his mother might have a problem with that.

 

Long story short, his brother is seeing someone from another country as well and recently told his family about the gf. His mother went ballistic and is very upset with bf's brother. Now his bro's gf is the conservative Muslim and has the same profession as his bro so we would think there will be no problem from his family side but no, the mother said no to her.

 

So bf says he knows for a fact that his mother will say no to me. I'm not the conservative Muslim, I pray ~ sometimes, I don't wear hijab [obviously] and I am really open-minded.

 

We had a talk yesterday and he came to a conclusion that there will be no marriage for us cos the last thing he wants to do is upset his mother like his younger bro did. Being the eldest he feels that he owes it to his family to do the right thing. The right thing would be to marry whomever his mother decides on.

 

He has a couple of years to go before he decides whether to go back to Iraq or stay here to work. He would love to stay, he says but is sure he has to go back to marry an Iraqi girl. I don't know how I feel about this. I'm suppose to feel sad, I'm sure but at the same time ... I already know of this and feel that I can be with him for the next two years. I cry sometimes when I am alone cos this is the guy that has been really good to me. We do a lot of things together and share chores, and a lot more that I didn't get in my past relationships and it sucks to know that at the end of the day we won't be together.

 

Am I stupid for wanting to be with him anyway, till he has to leave?

 

My mind is everywhere and I'm sorry if my post doesn't make sense

[skydiveaddict]

Your post made perfect sense Leia. From my time in Iraq I can tell you that their religion trumps EVERYTHING. I'm not the least bit surprised at this Especially if Sunni

 

I think you could talk him out of this, I hope you can

Edited March 29, 2010 by skydiveaddict

[CLC2008]

I've been wondering about that and I don't quite know what it means.

 

Anyway, if it is what I think it is .. then perhaps, my relationship has an expiry date.

 

Bf and I are from different race although we are both in the same religion. I've never gave a crap about dating anyone from another religion, whatever works for both of us but after several traumatic experiences involving deaths of my relatives, I began to realize about life and religion.

 

I met bf a few months ago and it's been great. We really enjoy eachother's company and want to be together and all that jazz. One thing that I know for quite some time now is that we have to get his mother's approval. He comes from a conservative family and the Middle East although he isn't the typical Middle Eastern man ~ abusive and all that. He's Iraqi and seeing that I'm multiracial, he said his mother might have a problem with that.

 

Long story short, his brother is seeing someone from another country as well and recently told his family about the gf. His mother went ballistic and is very upset with bf's brother. Now his bro's gf is the conservative Muslim and has the same profession as his bro so we would think there will be no problem from his family side but no, the mother said no to her.

 

So bf says he knows for a fact that his mother will say no to me. I'm not the conservative Muslim, I pray ~ sometimes, I don't wear hijab [obviously] and I am really open-minded.

 

We had a talk yesterday and he came to a conclusion that there will be no marriage for us cos the last thing he wants to do is upset his mother like his younger bro did. Being the eldest he feels that he owes it to his family to do the right thing. The right thing would be to marry whomever his mother decides on.

 

He has a couple of years to go before he decides whether to go back to Iraq or stay here to work. He would love to stay, he says but is sure he has to go back to marry an Iraqi girl. I don't know how I feel about this. I'm suppose to feel sad, I'm sure but at the same time ... I already know of this and feel that I can be with him for the next two years. I cry sometimes when I am alone cos this is the guy that has been really good to me. We do a lot of things together and share chores, and a lot more that I didn't get in my past relationships and it sucks to know that at the end of the day we won't be together.

 

Am I stupid for wanting to be with him anyway, till he has to leave?

 

My mind is everywhere and I'm sorry if my post doesn't make sense

 

My pops is from the Middle East, he moved to the US when he was in his early twenties. It took my Dad about 30 + years to adjust to Western culture, he was very strict and conservative too but his mother (my grandma) was the sweetest woman on the face of the earth. His sister on the other hand, tough lady, very protective, etc. and she gave my mom a lot of grief in the beginning.

 

But here's the thing, your bf already told you he would never be able to marry you because of his family, and that's a really hard thing for you to hear I am sure. It's like he's already made the decision about his future, so...where does that leave you?

[Leia]

I'm a Sunni too

 

Religions trumps it all, that is true. That is how it is suppose to be but not everyone practices that. The material world, as some of us put it, is only for the time being so we were taught to focus more on the being a good Muslim and stuff. I'm getting there but there is no way that I am going to change myself for anyone. Definitely not going to change abruptly. If I do want to get into being a good Muslim, I want it to come from heart and I will take my time.

 

That said, I don't know if I can change his mother's or his mind. She's visiting in August and he wants me to meet her. She's coming with his siblings too. So we will see. Some of my friends say that she could very well change her mind when she meets me. I'm pretty sure she will like me, he said so himself but that does not change the fact that I am not an Iraqi woman.

 

CLC2008, it was very hard and I was really sad when I heard it. It isn't like I want to marry him now, you know. When we were talking about marriage, he was telling me that it'll take us perhaps, 2 - 3 years cos he wants to establish himself first. Bla bla bla and now this. I guess I can handle it, not being with him in the end.

 

Right now, I don't know if I should go ahead and meet his family when they visit or just tell him to forget about introducing me to them.

 

He seems like he has made his mind and I feel that he made up his mind cos he knows his mother would not approve but what IF, somehow she approves of me? Would he change his mind then? What does that say about his character?

 

I'm so confused

[MalachiX]

Do me a favor? Please don't say the "typical" middle-eastern man is abusive. If you're Muslim it really would behoove you to NOT re-inforce such stereotypes (even if there are a lot of A-holes out there).

 

Anyway, I don't know the in's and outs of Islam since I'm only half-Arab and my family in Palestine is Christian. That said, I don't recall anything in Islam that requires men to marry the same race. The fact that you both are Muslim should be enough. It sounds like this is really a cultural issue that his family is calling a religious one.

 

That said, this guy has given you his answer. He's not willing to stand up to his parents and tell them he can marry whoever he wants. Maybe in 30 years, he'll be just as conservative as they are and insist his children marry fellow Iraqis because he had to. Do you really think it's worth your time to pine for a guy who can't be with you and who isn't willing to stop such a painful and emotionally destructive custom?

 

Especially since his little brother has already stood up for himself, it just seems like there's no point to continuing if this guy can't. My guess is that if all the younger generation told the older ones to mind their own damn business, and understanding would eventually be reached. After all, the older generation is going to wanna see their grand-kids some day. He has the power to potentially help change things in his family but instead he's deciding to ditch you in favor of their wishes. Once again, is this what you want?

 

I don't think there is anything wrong with a relationship on a time limit. It's OK to know you won't marry someone but to enjoy the time you have. The thing is, it doesn't sound like you are enjoying this now that you know there is NO chance of anything lasting. And personally, I'm OK with dating someone for a few months even if it won't go anywhere but I don't know if I'd wannt be with someone for years and know there was NO chance we'd ever be more than an extended fling.

[CLC2008]

I'm a Sunni too

 

Religions trumps it all, that is true. That is how it is suppose to be but not everyone practices that. The material world, as some of us put it, is only for the time being so we were taught to focus more on the being a good Muslim and stuff. I'm getting there but there is no way that I am going to change myself for anyone. Definitely not going to change abruptly. If I do want to get into being a good Muslim, I want it to come from heart and I will take my time.

 

That said, I don't know if I can change his mother's or his mind. She's visiting in August and he wants me to meet her. She's coming with his siblings too. So we will see. Some of my friends say that she could very well change her mind when she meets me. I'm pretty sure she will like me, he said so himself but that does not change the fact that I am not an Iraqi woman.

 

CLC2008, it was very hard and I was really sad when I heard it. It isn't like I want to marry him now, you know. When we were talking about marriage, he was telling me that it'll take us perhaps, 2 - 3 years cos he wants to establish himself first. Bla bla bla and now this. I guess I can handle it, not being with him in the end.

 

Right now, I don't know if I should go ahead and meet his family when they visit or just tell him to forget about introducing me to them.

 

He seems like he has made his mind and I feel that he made up his mind cos he knows his mother would not approve but what IF, somehow she approves of me? Would he change his mind then? What does that say about his character?

 

I'm so confused

 

Well I am not a believer that Religion trumps all and/or should, but that's just me. Ultimately, for those that do, their love and their life, is in the name of their religion. Your boyfriend's background, comes from that same mindset, it seems...and with his mother at the front line of it.

 

All you can do is try Leia, if you're serious about it, then perhaps it would be a good idea to spend time around him and his family before making any major decisions?

[JustJoe]

Leia, from my time in the Middle East (Iraq, afghanistan) I've had to deal with Islamic Law and have had several conversations about marriage. GI's wanting to marry local girls and the like. There is no law that says that the mother of the groom has veto power over a marriage. This is Iraqi custom, not Islamic Law. You must do what you feel is best, but you and your BF are free agents in this, if you want to be.

[JustJoe]

BTW from seeing your pictures , I'm really glad you don't wear Hijab.

[Leia]

It's not a religion thing, it's more cultural than anything else. I was just stating that we're both Muslims which should be enough for our religion, as stated in the Quran.

 

My parents would prefer I marry a Muslim rather than a Christian cos it's easier, as it's the man that leads the woman [religion-wise].

 

I'm good with knowing that it won't go any further but the thought that he'd follow his mother blindly, it's as if to say I'm not worth fighting for but then again, I know most Iraqis [like his friends and some of other Middle Eastern people I know] would follow what their mother/family want. He said he does not want to hurt his family cos his parents has done so many things for him since he was a baby and this is like him paying them back by marrying whoever they want him to marry.

[skydiveaddict]

Leia, from my time in the Middle East (Iraq, afghanistan) I've had to deal with Islamic Law and have had several conversations about marriage. GI's wanting to marry local girls and the like. There is no law that says that the mother of the groom has veto power over a marriage. This is Iraqi custom, not Islamic Law. You must do what you feel is best, but you and your BF are free agents in this, if you want to be.

 

 

I agree w/ joe here Leia. You and your bf should do whatever you wish

[Leia]

He's younger than I am by one year, not much difference but I don't think he is really THERE when it comes to love. Know what I mean?

 

Then again, I remember an Arab guy I dated. He's 30ish and he's saying that when he is ready to get married, perhaps he'll get his mother to find him a bride! So maybe it's just the way they deal with their family. At the end of the day, family comes first.

 

Out of curiosity, I read a few Islamic forums and almost everyone that sort of in the same situation as I am are being told that at the end of the day; parents will find a partner for their children and most are still doing the whole 'cousin marrying cousin' thing AND that most are told to marry within their own race.

[JustJoe]

While I try to respect all cultures, I really have a hard time with arranged marriages. I can respect his desire to be a dutiful son, but I also feel that depriving him of the woman he loves is cruel. I sincerely hope that you can overcome any objections his mother might have, and be able to stay together.

[skydiveaddict]

While I try to respect all cultures, I really have a hard time with arranged marriages. I can respect his desire to be a dutiful son, but I also feel that depriving him of the woman he loves is cruel. I sincerely hope that you can overcome any objections his mother might have, and be able to stay together.

 

 

word...............................

[CLC2008]

He's younger than I am by one year, not much difference but I don't think he is really THERE when it comes to love. Know what I mean?

 

Then again, I remember an Arab guy I dated. He's 30ish and he's saying that when he is ready to get married, perhaps he'll get his mother to find him a bride! So maybe it's just the way they deal with their family. At the end of the day, family comes first.

 

Out of curiosity, I read a few Islamic forums and almost everyone that sort of in the same situation as I am are being told that at the end of the day; parents will find a partner for their children and most are still doing the whole 'cousin marrying cousin' thing AND that most are told to marry within their own race.

 

Yes see, that's why I don't agree with the rigidness of it. It's control within a family, where others aren't allowed "in". That's not love to me. Family is family, but when/if you do marry, that will be your main family and everyone else is an extension to that. A family tree

[Leia]

All you can do is try Leia, if you're serious about it, then perhaps it would be a good idea to spend time around him and his family before making any major decisions?

 

I want to try, CLC2008, believe me I do but I feel like it would be a total waste of time and yet, I don't want to end it now cos I do enjoy his company and at the back of my mind I know that it isn't going anywhere.

 

August is quite a while away so I might change my mind about meeting his family. He wants me to go with them when he takes them on an island, not too sure if that's a good idea His mother might throw tantrums and asks me to go home!

 

He asked once, how I'd feel if we picked his mother up at the airport and she brought a bride with her!

 

You see, I know he loves me. I can see and feel it. I guess that is why I am confused as to what to do and if I decide on doing something about this, is it the right choice, ya know?

[JustJoe]

I was once told by a Mullah, that in certain circles, Racism is considered a form of Idolatry. Particularly in Egypt. IDK if this is true or not, but it seems that the racial issue is less important in the near east, than in Central Asia.

[skydiveaddict]

I was once told by a Mullah, that in certain circles, Racism is considered a form of Idolatry. Particularly in Egypt. IDK if this is true or not, but it seems that the racial issue is less important in the near east, than in Central Asia.

 

 

You must be a liason ofc. of some sort.

[JustJoe]

Leia, I'm a "newbie", here at LS, but I've read some of your other posts. You are a very accomplished and beautiful woman, and if his Mom brought another girl with her, she would pale by comparison.:)

[JustJoe]

Yep, SDA, I used to be a political Wallah. Not any more, I'm out in June.

[skydiveaddict]

Yep, SDA, I used to be a political Wallah. Not any more, I'm out in June.

 

I thought so. your grasp of these cultures is very impressive, & I'm not kidding

[JustJoe]

I think I've done OK, SDA. Where I've had trouble, has usually been my poor language skills, so I have had to rely on interpreters, some good, some bad. I've given some thought to staying in Asia, for a few years to improve.

[JustJoe]

Sorry for the brief t/j, Leia.BTW, what is your race, anyway? Aren't you Malay?

[Leia]

I was once told by a Mullah, that in certain circles, Racism is considered a form of Idolatry. Particularly in Egypt. IDK if this is true or not, but it seems that the racial issue is less important in the near east, than in Central Asia.

 

But they don't want to admit that it is racism ...

 

As for over here, SEA ~ we don't care about race although there are conservative Malays, Indians or Chinese that prefer to be married within their own race. It's sad.

 

I thought so. your grasp of these cultures is very impressive, & I'm not kidding

 

I agree

 

Sorry for the brief t/j, Leia.BTW, what is your race, anyway? Aren't you Malay?

 

I'm Malaysian-European.

[JustJoe]

You're drop-dead, is what you are:laugh: Race is beside the point. But I can very much understand your predicament. There are many Muslim South- east Asians, Indonesia, Malaysia, even as far west as the Phillipines , and Oriental Muslims are looked on as different. Just like African Muslims. It's really old-fashioned thinking, and many Muslims want to change these attitudes, but few want to be the first to do so.

[MalachiX]

 

I'm good with knowing that it won't go any further but the thought that he'd follow his mother blindly, it's as if to say I'm not worth fighting for

 

This isn't unique to Islam or Arabs either. It's an issue I've seen with a bunch of different cultures. A few years back, my EX girlfriend's roomate, who was asian, started dating a black guy. After a few months, she told him she didn't want to tell her parents or let him meet her parents because they wouldn't approve. She told him she didn't agree with her parents but didn't want to cause trouble He was understandable hurt and, after some talk, they broke up.

 

The bottom line is it's insulting to tell someone, "I don't like you enough to deal with my racist parents." Even if you don't know if the relationship will work, it's still a very hurtful thing to do to someone. As I said, there's nothing wrong with a time limit on a relationship but I think it's hard to be with someone who tells you that you'll never be worth it for them to deal with this situation.

 

He said he does not want to hurt his family cos his parents has done so many things for him since he was a baby and this is like him paying them back by marrying whoever they want him to marry.

 

Great logic. "We fullfilled our parental obligation so you are now obligated to pay us back with THE REST OF YOUR LIFE."

 

He asked once, how I'd feel if we picked his mother up at the airport and she brought a bride with her!

 

Was he serious? I mean, this seems so incredibly disrespectful to you (and the hypothetical bride).

 

You see, I know he loves me. I can see and feel it.

 

Maybe love is a choice as well as an emotion. Maybe you have to chose to love someone. I don't think you can say that you love someone when you've made the choice to ditch then whenever your mother tells you to. I don't think you'd drag someone you love to the airport to meet their replacement.