Mr White Posted March 31, 2010 Posted March 31, 2010 Always remember there are two sides to every story and trust me you are definitely not hearing the whole story or anything close to the truth. I think that if you did hear the whole TRUE story everyone would have a different view on this. Allright then, let's hear it .
JBelle Posted March 31, 2010 Posted March 31, 2010 No offense, but this makes me cringe... --> to refer to - and treat - an 17 year old as a child is absurd... I and most of my childhood friends have been working - and traveling alone - since the age of 14. (That's probably one of the reasons we turned more successful than most of our peers...) I'm not saying that a 17 year old is a fully functioning adult, but treating him like a child probably only exacerbates the existing immaturity. At the very least, a 17 year old is perfectly capable to handle himself or herself during a freaking flight, for crying out loud. I'm not surprised that so many people today move back home, with mommy and daddy, after 6 years in college. It's not about a 17 year old being unable to travel alone. It's about a 17 year old feeling like he's a total afterthought. Who planned the tickets with one seat in coach while everyone else had first class? Certainly not the teen. So what do you think the step-teen will feel when his mother goes off with her "happy" new little family and tosses him in the back because he's his mother's "baggage" that the new daddy purposely plans the tickets to ensure that he doesn't have to see anything but his intact little bio-family. This is the kind of thing that messes kids from divorced families up. If the father didn't want to sit alone, put everyone in coach. The teen has no say.
SarahRose Posted March 31, 2010 Posted March 31, 2010 I'm the man who found this forum and first posted this first post this morning "Am I controlling with our money? ". Many of you suggested counseling….we have tried that. Counselors try to lead couples to conclusions. However, when one person doesn’t seem to get it, a counselor will not say “you are wrong”. Example: I’m always put last….a few years ago on Christmas day I stayed on the phone for hours getting airline tickets with some mileage and mostly cash. We were divided up in the plane with one person in coach and her, our toddler and her teenage son a couple rows away in first class. . Sorry but this is rather poor thinking. If you couldn't get everyone in first class, why didn't you just get all the tickets in coach? Everyone sits together in coach. By making the teen sit by themselves in coach, you are making them the outsider.
Mr White Posted March 31, 2010 Posted March 31, 2010 It's not about a 17 year old being unable to travel alone. It's about a 17 year old feeling like he's a total afterthought. Who planned the tickets with one seat in coach while everyone else had first class? Certainly not the teen. So what do you think the step-teen will feel when his mother goes off with her "happy" new little family and tosses him in the back because he's his mother's "baggage" that the new daddy purposely plans the tickets to ensure that he doesn't have to see anything but his intact little bio-family. This is the kind of thing that messes kids from divorced families up. If the father didn't want to sit alone, put everyone in coach. The teen has no say. That's really overthinking it... It's just about proper boundaries. Are you also suggesting that the kids get served food before the adults or get to read the morning paper before the parents, or get to interrupt parents' conversation whenever they please? If the answer is "yes to all of the above", the product is almost certainly a spoiled brat, that can't cope with anything, but I guess that's the norm these days. It is one thing to work hard to provide for your family, so the kids have good opportunities, and quite another to be sent to the most uncomfortable corner *on top* of that. It's not like they'd sent him to the cargo compartment
Mr White Posted March 31, 2010 Posted March 31, 2010 Sorry but this is rather poor thinking. If you couldn't get everyone in first class, why didn't you just get all the tickets in coach? Everyone sits together in coach. By making the teen sit by themselves in coach, you are making them the outsider. That I agree with. Makes sense only if the issue was insufficient available seats in first class. Barring that, would be easier and saner to just get all couch.
JBelle Posted March 31, 2010 Posted March 31, 2010 (edited) That's really overthinking it... It's just about proper boundaries. Are you also suggesting that the kids get served food before the adults or get to read the morning paper before the parents, or get to interrupt parents' conversation whenever they please? If the answer is "yes to all of the above", the product is almost certainly a spoiled brat, that can't cope with anything, but I guess that's the norm these days. It is one thing to work hard to provide for your family, so the kids have good opportunities, and quite another to be sent to the most uncomfortable corner *on top* of that. It's not like they'd sent him to the cargo compartment Step-children are different from bio kids or kids adopted by the choice of both parents. Step-children have already been damaged by their parents not getting along then again by their parents splitting, forcing them to have to be shuttled back and forth between houses, to deal with their parents new honeys who may resent their existence as burdens, and to watch their mother/father raise new kids who are biologically the child of the parents under the same roof pushing the step-child further to an outsider position, especially when it comes to the non-custodial parent where the jealousy doubles due to the new child being raised daily by THEIR (the step-child's) parent, while they have to watch from the outside. Sorry; but it's already difficult trying to patch up the damage caused by their parents' split. Tossing in a resentful step-dad/mom and bio-kids for each of these new families; and you're lucky to come away with a kid that is normal. These are well-known facts. Frankly, reading your constant consternation over "spoiled" brats whether valid or not and the fact that you can't see beyond your own immediate needs to have empathy with someone's plight that does not impact your own gives me cause to say "someone doth protest too much". Edited March 31, 2010 by JBelle
JaneInVegas Posted March 31, 2010 Posted March 31, 2010 Always remember there are two sides to every story and trust me you are definitely not hearing the whole story or anything close to the truth. I think that if you did hear the whole TRUE story everyone would have a different view on this. Well Kelly, you're certainly not stepping up to the plate to explain yourself, both of your "2" posts have been on this thread ... you're the wife? Just guessing.
JaneInVegas Posted March 31, 2010 Posted March 31, 2010 No offense, but this makes me cringe... --> to refer to - and treat - an 17 year old as a child is absurd... I and most of my childhood friends have been working - and traveling alone - since the age of 14. (That's probably one of the reasons we turned more successful than most of our peers...) I'm not saying that a 17 year old is a fully functioning adult, but treating him like a child probably only exacerbates the existing immaturity. At the very least, a 17 year old is perfectly capable to handle himself or herself during a freaking flight, for crying out loud. I'm not surprised that so many people today move back home, with mommy and daddy, after 6 years in college. ummm ... my post said "kids", not "child". Rather inclusive of teens, I'd say. My SO's mother calls both of us "kids" and I don't freak out over it. Your free-travelling teen years worked out well for you, obviously, but this has little to do with the babysitting aspect to which you seem to be implying. Like others have mentioned here already, it's a self-esteem issue and making sure they feel included with the family unit. Maybe you're a tad defensive because you didn't feel included with your family unit while you were out buzzing the friendly skies at 14. Just a guess.
xxoo Posted March 31, 2010 Posted March 31, 2010 That's really overthinking it... It's just about proper boundaries. Are you also suggesting that the kids get served food before the adults or get to read the morning paper before the parents, or get to interrupt parents' conversation whenever they please? If the answer is "yes to all of the above", the product is almost certainly a spoiled brat, that can't cope with anything, but I guess that's the norm these days. It is one thing to work hard to provide for your family, so the kids have good opportunities, and quite another to be sent to the most uncomfortable corner *on top* of that. It's not like they'd sent him to the cargo compartment No, all that would be analogous to putting the whole family in coach and giving a single First class ticket to the teen. In that case, I'd STILL give the single ticket to a parent, and probably rotate the parent mid-flight. BUt in the case of 3 first class tickets and one coach--all arranged by the parents--putting the step-kid in coach sends a horrible message (unless he requested it, and I can see some kids that age preferring to sit alone in coach for the flight).
Mr White Posted March 31, 2010 Posted March 31, 2010 No, all that would be analogous to putting the whole family in coach and giving a single First class ticket to the teen. In that case, I'd STILL give the single ticket to a parent, and probably rotate the parent mid-flight. BUt in the case of 3 first class tickets and one coach--all arranged by the parents--putting the step-kid in coach sends a horrible message (unless he requested it, and I can see some kids that age preferring to sit alone in coach for the flight). Sure, the fact that the kid in question is a step-son probably complicates the issue, and I'm ranting more against princess treatment of kids (at the expense of parents) more generally rather than advocating treating step-children like dirt . So, I admit that treating a step-child in this situation is probably more involved - in general; but considering the OPs description of the actual dynamics in the particular relationship between the wife and her son, the preferential treatment in this case probably only amplifies the entitlement and irresponsibility he reports (assuming that the reporting is accurate...) both in wife and step-son.
JBelle Posted March 31, 2010 Posted March 31, 2010 Sure, the fact that the kid in question is a step-son probably complicates the issue, and I'm ranting more against princess treatment of kids (at the expense of parents) more generally rather than advocating treating step-children like dirt . So, I admit that treating a step-child in this situation is probably more involved - in general; but considering the OPs description of the actual dynamics in the particular relationship between the wife and her son, the preferential treatment in this case probably only amplifies the entitlement and irresponsibility he reports (assuming that the reporting is accurate...) both in wife and step-son. In this case, my guess is that the damage has already been done. The resentful step-dad doesn't help matters; but it doesn't sound like this is her second marriage...., or the dad has been married a while to a resentful step-mom. Now the mom is in guilt mode. She will have to nip this in the bud to an extent; but the resentful behavior from the step-dad is only serving to make her more defensive. This is why you don't marry a divorced woman or man with kids unless you are willing to take those children in as your own, period.
xxoo Posted March 31, 2010 Posted March 31, 2010 It seems like a chicken-and-egg situation. What came first--treating the step-kid like an outsider, or the mom demanding certain treatments for the step-kid? I'm sure each parent has a different answer to that question. I agree, though, that people should NEVER marry into a family with kids unless you are ready to consider them your own. The problem is, you don't always know how you would treat your "own" teen until you have your own teen.
FryFish Posted March 31, 2010 Posted March 31, 2010 The guy has bought his step kid more than a single car... He is hardly treating him like an outsider.
tigereyes1428 Posted March 31, 2010 Posted March 31, 2010 you sound a great step father but i can see why your patience is wearing thin - sitting in first class is a treat in my opinion - why did the mum not sit coach and allow the husband and step son to travel in first as a bonding experience - my guess is cos she is selfish and used to being able to buy what she likes and not have to worry about consequences as that is what your for - sorry to be blunt but she has zero respect for you and her child is learning from her - her behaviour is feeding the step sons he has never had to take responsibility for himself either as you and his mum keep bailing him out - time for him to be let loose and learn how to sink or swim and you have every right to be worried about your own child not being taught the morals that you seem to have - i could not live that way either - you seem to have a comfortable life with little need for material possessions her priorities differ from yours - she is like in a kid in a sweet shop wanting everything new - is she so unhappy that getting new things is the only thing that pleases her ? this is an issue that needs addressing i feel. keep me updated - good luck
JBelle Posted March 31, 2010 Posted March 31, 2010 It seems like a chicken-and-egg situation. What came first--treating the step-kid like an outsider, or the mom demanding certain treatments for the step-kid? I'm sure each parent has a different answer to that question. I'd say the fighting in the original marriage happened first. The divorce happened second. After this, it's still possible to have content, well-behaved children, albeit it will be much more difficult to bring about for a number of reasons ranging from the kids being angry about their life spiraling out of control and being unable to do anything about it, combined with some other complicated feelings of blaming themselves, to having two sets of rules for the two different houses, which will never converge into one due to warring parents. I won't rule out the mother babying her kids due to guilt about the divorce or simple weak will or a philosophy that money = love. However, given the ages of these kids (17 to 22), I'd wager a guess that there was a previous resentful step-parent in all of this, whether on the dad's side or the mom's side. So that pretty much sealed the deal in producing disturbed kids. And money seems to be the mother's band-aid for it all (Who knows about the dad's band-aid. Though, the lack of any mention of the bio-dad has me wondering where he is..... If he dumped the family, add another tick to the origins of disturbed children.); but that only serves to make it worse. Yes, the OP helped the kid buy a car, which the kid then wrecked; but that seems to be the only thing he did willingly (and the enthusiasm of that willingness is highly questionable). Granted, the kids were likely already this disturbed when he married the mother; but that's your warning sign to run! He would have never viewed these kids as his own. And, if you can't muster good feelings about her kids, you have no business marrying her. However....., the OP did mention that her kids lived with them, while his kids from his previous marriage did not. Makes me wonder just how long these kids have been under his roof? Anyway, spending money is not a proof of love, the attitude and actions of a loving parent are. Kids know when you are trying to buy them off so that you can spend time with mommy/daddy. I agree, though, that people should NEVER marry into a family with kids unless you are ready to consider them your own. The problem is, you don't always know how you would treat your "own" teen until you have your own teen. I don't have kids yet; but I know that there is no way that I would purposely buy tickets with one seat in a lower class for that teen to sit in, while the rest of us sit up front. Also, if, after a year of dating the mother/father, you look at the kids with horror at how bratty they are or even with anything less than happiness to see them, too, don't do it. If you meet the woman then learn she has kids and feel yourself wishing they would disappear after a few dates, don't continue. Those are not feelings you would have about your own kids; and, if you would feel that way about your kids....., you either don't plan on having any or maybe should consider getting sterilized. Either way, you shouldn't marry that man/woman.
kellyh66 Posted April 1, 2010 Posted April 1, 2010 The guy has bought his step kid more than a single car... He is hardly treating him like an outsider. You are sadly mistaken and misinformed. He has never bought him any cars. He has paid for all his own vehicles and his own insurance. You have never lived a day in our house to know the real truths.
mark982 Posted April 1, 2010 Posted April 1, 2010 alright kelly, as mr white said, lets her your side. no just bits and pieces. you got us glued to our seats.
FryFish Posted April 1, 2010 Posted April 1, 2010 You are sadly mistaken and misinformed. He has never bought him any cars. He has paid for all his own vehicles and his own insurance.Was the step dads money used to do this? You have never lived a day in our house to know the real truths. Do tell then.
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