Fallen Angel Posted March 27, 2010 Posted March 27, 2010 No, he is not property, but he is a "stealable exclusive relationship" if you will. I respectfully disagree that if the marriage is strong, he is untemptable. There are many women who post here who have given their life blood and energy, and their men still want some "variety" on the side, and get tempted by this. I also have read studies where men have admitted that their wives are great, they just wanted some variety. It is in their genes and their jeans. I still must disagree with you on this. No one can "steal" someone away (unless at gunpoint or some such nonsense.) Wandering spouses are not stolen, they give themselves freely to their "other". In fact, I think you will find, in most cases they are the ones who do the persuing. (NOTE* I said in most cases.. there are some OW that do "target" MM.) But I stand my statement that the majority of these MM offer themselves up on a silver platter to their OW. There are no guns, knives, threats, or even spiderwebs used to "steal them away." They walk head first into their affairs, eyes open, with full knowledge of what they are doing.
Lizzie60 Posted March 27, 2010 Posted March 27, 2010 Yes, and that is exactly why they all bear watching. That is why I think it is so naive for some posters to berate a wife who snoops when she has well founded suspicions. She is trying to save what is hers and do a pre-emptive strike, because in my opinion, men have a weakness and are easily tempted. If I were suspicious I would give my husband a colonoscopy if I thought it would lead me to the truth. Car, emails, phone monitoring would go without saying... HAHA.! P.S. You must really be something. 57 and still all the hounds are hang dog around you. :lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao: what are you expecting to find there..
dazzle22 Posted March 27, 2010 Posted March 27, 2010 Just joking of course! As in, no stone unturned..haha:lmao:
califnan Posted March 27, 2010 Posted March 27, 2010 No, he is not property, but he is a "stealable exclusive relationship" if you will. I respectfully disagree that if the marriage is strong, he is untemptable. There are many women who post here who have given their life blood and energy, and their men still want some "variety" on the side, and get tempted by this. I also have read studies where men have admitted that their wives are great, they just wanted some variety. It is in their genes and their jeans. ----------------------- The odds are in your favor Dazzle.. I appears as if the MM just Uses the OW .. and without divorcing the wife most of the time? At any rate, if he does divorce the wife, the new marriage (out of adultery) isn't blessed, and he will tend to even compare the new marriage with the Original ... etc.
Woggle Posted March 27, 2010 Posted March 27, 2010 If the marriage is strong and the man is honorable he is untemptable. Men are not all helpless little creatures that think with our penises and lose all self control once an attractive woman comes along.
dazzle22 Posted March 28, 2010 Posted March 28, 2010 Hmm, I believe I recall a post from you Woggle, where you fantasized about being a player?...and enjoyed hanging out with your player friend? Perhaps things have changed. I think I read a later post where you indicated a change of thought.. At any rate, I have been on the receiving end of marital deceit and it is an extremely "ugly, ugly, hit in the gut, world crushing, wish you could disappear into the ground, why didn't my friends tell me feeling" that I hope to never have to feel again. Such experiences have left me a bit jaded, hypervigilant, and just a tad "agro"...
wheelwright Posted March 28, 2010 Posted March 28, 2010 The short answer is NO. But I will admit that the fact that he takes his obligation to his child so seriously is something that I admire in him. But I would admire it just as well if he were divorced and showing the same level of commitment to his role as parent. I agree the short answer is no. But I was a MOW in my A, and would not have considered a R with a single person as I knew there was the potential for them to fall in love with me and create a very unequal power inbalance. So in the initial stages it was a bonus he was M - he had the same to lose or gain. But tbh, I just fell in love with that man. But I probably could not have fallen in love with a man who by 45 had not put down some commitment roots. He would have been someone D or divorced in their M. And yes, the elements of him that made him a committed H appealed. But I meet people all the time - it certainly is nothing to do with marital status that means I will connect or not. This connection went deep - that's what it was.
White Flower Posted March 28, 2010 Posted March 28, 2010 Yes, and that is exactly why they all bear watching. That is why I think it is so naive for some posters to berate a wife who snoops when she has well founded suspicions. She is trying to save what is hers and do a pre-emptive strike, because in my opinion, men have a weakness and are easily tempted. If I were suspicious I would give my husband a colonoscopy if I thought it would lead me to the truth. Car, emails, phone monitoring would go without saying... HAHA.! P.S. You must really be something. 57 and still all the hounds are hang dog around you. FRT I don't see a problem with snooping if you have suspicions. Any spouse has a right to know what their other half is up to.
fooled once Posted March 28, 2010 Posted March 28, 2010 You make it sound like the husband is property, like a car, or a puppy.... If your marriage is strong, your foundation sound, and you are open, honest, and connected; then no woman could "tempt" your spouse enough. Men are only as "weak" as the marriage they are in. I agree with this - but many times, the wife has no idea the marriage is weak. Some men, no matter how great their marriage is, still cheat. In my view, it is just the lack of character and integrity in them. Divorce is still an option.
Woggle Posted March 28, 2010 Posted March 28, 2010 Hmm, I believe I recall a post from you Woggle, where you fantasized about being a player?...and enjoyed hanging out with your player friend? Perhaps things have changed. I think I read a later post where you indicated a change of thought.. At any rate, I have been on the receiving end of marital deceit and it is an extremely "ugly, ugly, hit in the gut, world crushing, wish you could disappear into the ground, why didn't my friends tell me feeling" that I hope to never have to feel again. Such experiences have left me a bit jaded, hypervigilant, and just a tad "agro"... I have never cheated and never will but in my bitter times I have had a certain admiration for players. That friend of mine tried to hit on my wife so he crossed the line is no longer a friend. I deon't want to be a player but I must admit that they have so much more success with women than sincere and honest men. It is a sad fact of today's dating world but I have a woman who actually likes the nice guy side of me and I am finally starting to appreciate that.
White Flower Posted March 28, 2010 Posted March 28, 2010 I have never cheated and never will but in my bitter times I have had a certain admiration for players. That friend of mine tried to hit on my wife so he crossed the line is no longer a friend. I deon't want to be a player but I must admit that they have so much more success with women than sincere and honest men. It is a sad fact of today's dating world but I have a woman who actually likes the nice guy side of me and I am finally starting to appreciate that. You are a rare gem Woggle.
Lovelybird Posted March 28, 2010 Posted March 28, 2010 (edited) I think OWs are more likely to be able to develop their talents and potential, since they're not stuck with a MP all day then why don't you get your own man rather than covet another woman 's husband? Speaking for myself, I've never ever yielded to any come on, ever - I choose who I want, I don't sit on some shelf waiting for some dude (M or S) to choose me. I get who I want. Yes, you get whoever YOU want, even that man already belonged to other woman What drives you do this? Love? I don't buy it, because it is NOT love by its nature Edited March 28, 2010 by Lovelybird
dazzle22 Posted March 28, 2010 Posted March 28, 2010 Good for you Woggle! Sounds like you have come out on the other side of your struggle in a very good way:)
White Flower Posted March 28, 2010 Posted March 28, 2010 then why don't you get your own man rather than covet another woman 's husband? Yes, you get whoever YOU want, even that man already belonged to other woman What drives you do this? Love? I don't buy it, because it is NOT love by its nature Love doesn't know any rules. Love just is. Love is nature. And THAT is what we should stand by because if we don't, we lose it forever.
califnan Posted March 28, 2010 Posted March 28, 2010 It is love - by the definition of the word. But superceded by coveting - which is taking something that isn't yours (even if the individual does have a "free will").
White Flower Posted March 28, 2010 Posted March 28, 2010 It is love - by the definition of the word. But superceded by coveting - which is taking something that isn't yours (even if the individual does have a "free will"). I don't believe we can take anybody away from anybody else. Free will means he gave himself freely to the one who received him. He wasn't lead on a leash.
Pyro Posted March 28, 2010 Posted March 28, 2010 If the marriage is strong and the man is honorable he is untemptable. Men are not all helpless little creatures that think with our penises and lose all self control once an attractive woman comes along. Never thought I'd say this but I agree with you Woggle. People are capable of self control and no one out there is Gods gift to men or women, so people can say no, regardless who it is.
califnan Posted March 28, 2010 Posted March 28, 2010 I don't believe we can take anybody away from anybody else. Free will means he gave himself freely to the one who received him. He wasn't lead on a leash. -------------------- The man belongs to the wife - the wife belongs to the husband.. Each has power of the other's body .. That is one reason why it is sin to covet (or lust) for the one who belongs to another ..
sally4sara Posted March 28, 2010 Posted March 28, 2010 :lmao: As if.... Have you actually MET any OWs IRL??? We're not the dogs you might imagine! Most of us have no trouble at all picking and choosing A-listers - but we CHOOSE who we want to swap body fluids with. Speaking for myself, I've never ever yielded to any come on, ever - I choose who I want, I don't sit on some shelf waiting for some dude (M or S) to choose me. I get who I want. I've met a few, but don't identify with their point of view and could not see myself ever being able to say "Janie would never do (whatever) because to me they lack impulse control and covet what others have. Not a good mix. I try to make friends with folks who have qualities I admire. And as I said before - my previous comment was not made with anyone on here in mind.
Got it Posted March 28, 2010 Posted March 28, 2010 I've met a few, but don't identify with their point of view and could not see myself ever being able to say "Janie would never do (whatever) because to me they lack impulse control and covet what others have. Not a good mix. I try to make friends with folks who have qualities I admire. And as I said before - my previous comment was not made with anyone on here in mind. First off, you would be surprised. You may know more than you think and just aren't aware of that aspect of their lives. You do understand that this is just a part of someone's life, right? This in no way defines someone like any other relationship. I too try and make friends with those I admire but I also know that this is just an aspect of them. Are there "OW" that I don't like? Sure. Are their "BS" that I like. Yep a few come to mind! And are there OP/BS that I like? Yep. For me, someone's romantic relationships may show traits that I have an opinion on but usually not. Just as there are many individuals that have relationships/marriages that show signs/aspects that I know I wouldn't agree with but that is just my opinion and no way means that is right for them. In other words, if someone's romantic relationships is the bar you use to judge them as a friend of your's you are selling them and yourself short. One does not necessarily translate into the other.
Got it Posted March 28, 2010 Posted March 28, 2010 -------------------- The man belongs to the wife - the wife belongs to the husband.. Each has power of the other's body .. That is one reason why it is sin to covet (or lust) for the one who belongs to another .. If you believe this religious belief. I know that my ex husband and I did not believe we "belonged" to the to other. There was no ownership/property rights involved.
Spark1111 Posted March 28, 2010 Posted March 28, 2010 I agree with this - but many times, the wife has no idea the marriage is weak. Some men, no matter how great their marriage is, still cheat. In my view, it is just the lack of character and integrity in them. Divorce is still an option. I so agree. The pages of LS are filled with with BSs who knew something was amiss, something was strained, but had no idea of the WS's cheating because the WS NEVER told them HOW unhappy they were! Yes, a lack of integrity, but maybe more importantly the character traits of conflict avoidance and poor communication skills are supposedly inherent in those who step outside of marital boundaries. When DDAY hits, how many OW/OM discover these traits in the MP firsthand? Too many to count. Now, you get a glimpse of what the BS has been dealing with for maybe years before they crashed into the OW/OM.
Got it Posted March 28, 2010 Posted March 28, 2010 Spark, I agree with this but to a point. On the flip side, there are the cases, mine being one, where it had been communicated numerous times but still when I left it was a bit of a surprise. The unhappy partner can communicate it but it doesn't necessarily mean that the other partner "hears" it especially if they have been saying it for years but not making any actions towards changing it themselves. I think we see that in many cases when where a wife leaves and the husband is shocked. She is at wit's end and she is done and for him that is the awakening. Why we see so many discussions about how a woman mourns the relationship while in it and a man mourns it afterwards. In my case I made sure I laid the foundation to say I did/asked/tried x, y, and z. I could not control him and his reaction but for my own peace of mind had to do what I needed to freely walk away. But this did not mean that HE saw it the same way and recognized the signs. But that wasn't something I could control. And trust me, poor communication skills and conflict avoidance is seen by the OP LONG before Dday!
califnan Posted March 28, 2010 Posted March 28, 2010 Spark, I agree with this but to a point. On the flip side, there are the cases, mine being one, where it had been communicated numerous times but still when I left it was a bit of a surprise. The unhappy partner can communicate it but it doesn't necessarily mean that the other partner "hears" it especially if they have been saying it for years but not making any actions towards changing it themselves. I think we see that in many cases when where a wife leaves and the husband is shocked. She is at wit's end and she is done and for him that is the awakening. Why we see so many discussions about how a woman mourns the relationship while in it and a man mourns it afterwards. In my case I made sure I laid the foundation to say I did/asked/tried x, y, and z. I could not control him and his reaction but for my own peace of mind had to do what I needed to freely walk away. But this did not mean that HE saw it the same way and recognized the signs. But that wasn't something I could control. And trust me, poor communication skills and conflict avoidance is seen by the OP LONG before Dday! ------------------------ A good read / reminder: On the "Infidelity" Board. Thread is "Individual Counseling" .. The post was that of "Troggleputty" 8:52 this morning. His post discusses reasons for leaving a marriage or LACK OF.
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