So LS just opened a door for my marriage...

[Luv2dance]

My husband was clearly upset this morning and said he had a lot on his mind but we would talk about it later. Then I get this email...

 

Hey,

Not sure how to start this. I want to say I'm not spying on you, but I'm not sure if that makes a difference or not.

Last night I cranked up the laptop to check something real quick.

For some reason the history screen was up from Monday. On it was several links to loveshack.org

I had seen that link before when checking where (our child) had been and I had meant to talk to you about it, thinking she might be doing something she shouldn't.

Well, obviously it's not her.

 

With discussion topics of "how and when did you start to cheat", "i love my husband but I don't want to have sex with him." and such, I'm thinking it's you.

I guess I need to know where you want to go with this.

Counseling, separation, what?

 

I think I'm a pretty good father, but that is not the issue with you.

Apparently you are not attracted to me. I know there is a correlation with your drinking and us having sex. I'm not stupid and do pay attention.

I probably disappointed you by being sweaty from jogging last night.

I know I have not done what I need to, to make you feel attractive, so I'm not saying this is all you, by any stretch.

I'm willing to try. Honestly I am. But my efforts are going to be of no use if you are not happy.

 

Let me know what you want to do. I can get a counselors name from Cliff. He seemed mostly pleased with her.

 

Ok, the back story...I feel I married for the wrong reasons at a time when I was just beginning to get my life on track and looked to MH as someone to "save" me. I had been a party girl (always insecure but no one would have thought that) and he was a good guy (virgin). He is also 10 yrs older than I am, and I was 23 when we married. The feeling I remember from my wedding day is loneliness, and I hate to even admit that but it's true. Honeymoon was ok, sex ok but nothing earth shattering which I didn't expect seeing as how he had no experience.

 

Fast forward (so a few of you might read this, lol) we have a good marriage, 2 great children, but never any passion (at least from my end). He doesn't need/want sex very often and I do, I would say I have initiated 95% of it during our marriage. I get turned down even when I'm drunk & naked. Our communication when it comes to this and most areas of our marriage is not good, never has been so I know that has not helped. In the last few months things have changed b/c I have been more honest about being unhappy so he is trying. Although, even that is not sparking an attraction from my end...and it's almost like he is doing these things now b/c he thinks he HAS to not b/c he WANTS to...(whole threads on this I know )

 

Outside of the sexual differences we are also very different in our social personalities. He's the stay at home be in bed by 11pm & I'm the go out have fun type. I love to dance (obvious I guess) and he will/does not dance. He did not drink at all until after we were married, I did change that but he still thinks it's wrong to drink too much. This causes some problems when we are invited to parties, and he can't relate to anyone there b/c they like to drink and have fun. My friends have actually said he comes across as rude sometimes.

 

 

There's more but I know this is getting long and no one may read anyway. I am just completely torn b/c there are not really big problems, we don't fight (which actually may be a problem), he is a very involved father and is helpful around the house. He would be a dream husband for many women, but I am a passionate, sex loving woman who is not really sure I was ever in love with him.

 

Can you create passion and attraction if there never was any??

Edited March 10, 2010 by Luv2dance

[TaraMaiden]

I think at this point, you don't need to be asking us these questions.

I think you need to take your husband up on his suggestion, and see a counsellor with him.

 

Remember:

Counselling isn't necessarily about keeping people together.

it's about helping you both communicate on a level playing field, in a safe environment. It puts you both on the same page, and lets you both air your thoughts and opinions without an escalation to confrontation.

I think, instead of talking to us and asking us, you should at least give you and your H the chance to have counselling, and get this sorted.

One way or the other.

 

Good luck.

[Jeff1962]

I think at this point, you don't need to be asking us these questions.

I think you need to take your husband up on his suggestion, and see a counsellor with him.

 

Remember:

Counselling isn't necessarily about keeping people together.

it's about helping you both communicate on a level playing field, in a safe environment. It puts you both on the same page, and lets you both air your thoughts and opinions without an escalation to confrontation.

I think, instead of talking to us and asking us, you should at least give you and your H the chance to have counselling, and get this sorted.

One way or the other.

 

Good luck.

 

Can't add anything to this. Good advice.

[stillafool]

Yes I agree with the above too. I think you need to deal with your husband now. More than likely he is reading this also.

[Luv2dance]

Yes I agree with the above too. I think you need to deal with your husband now. More than likely he is reading this also.

 

Yes, I have thought of that!!! But, maybe that wouldn't be all bad b/c I apparently am scared to say some of this to his face.

 

I am all for the counseling and guess I was just coming here to see if anyone had been in this situation and reversed it...or just to type it out and see if it cleared up anything for me.

[Jeff1962]

Yes, I have thought of that!!! But, maybe that wouldn't be all bad b/c I apparently am scared to say some of this to his face.

 

I am all for the counseling and guess I was just coming here to see if anyone had been in this situation and reversed it...or just to type it out and see if it cleared up anything for me.

 

If you are not attracted to your husband, you cannot reverse this. Do the poor guy a favor and set him free so that he can find someone who really loves him.

[Luv2dance]

If you are not attracted to your husband, you cannot reverse this. Do the poor guy a favor and set him free so that he can find someone who really loves him.

 

Don't think I don't think this myself...but I also think that I owe it to both of us and our children to be VERY sure before turning our lives upside down.

 

I am sure I have unresolved issues from my past that I need to deal with so maybe it's really MY problem that needs to be fixed...

[Samantha0905]

My husband was clearly upset this morning and said he had a lot on his mind but we would talk about it later. Then I get this email...

 

Hey,

Not sure how to start this. I want to say I'm not spying on you, but I'm not sure if that makes a difference or not.

Last night I cranked up the laptop to check something real quick.

For some reason the history screen was up from Monday. On it was several links to loveshack.org

I had seen that link before when checking where (our child) had been and I had meant to talk to you about it, thinking she might be doing something she shouldn't.

Well, obviously it's not her.

 

With discussion topics of "how and when did you start to cheat", "i love my husband but I don't want to have sex with him." and such, I'm thinking it's you.

I guess I need to know where you want to go with this.

Counseling, separation, what?

 

I think I'm a pretty good father, but that is not the issue with you.

Apparently you are not attracted to me. I know there is a correlation with your drinking and us having sex. I'm not stupid and do pay attention.

I probably disappointed you by being sweaty from jogging last night.

I know I have not done what I need to, to make you feel attractive, so I'm not saying this is all you, by any stretch.

I'm willing to try. Honestly I am. But my efforts are going to be of no use if you are not happy.

 

Let me know what you want to do. I can get a counselors name from Cliff. He seemed mostly pleased with her.

 

Ok, the back story...I feel I married for the wrong reasons at a time when I was just beginning to get my life on track and looked to MH as someone to "save" me. I had been a party girl (always insecure but no one would have thought that) and he was a good guy (virgin). He is also 10 yrs older than I am, and I was 23 when we married. The feeling I remember from my wedding day is loneliness, and I hate to even admit that but it's true. Honeymoon was ok, sex ok but nothing earth shattering which I didn't expect seeing as how he had no experience.

 

Fast forward (so a few of you might read this, lol) we have a good marriage, 2 great children, but never any passion (at least from my end). He doesn't need/want sex very often and I do, I would say I have initiated 95% of it during our marriage. I get turned down even when I'm drunk & naked. Our communication when it comes to this and most areas of our marriage is not good, never has been so I know that has not helped. In the last few months things have changed b/c I have been more honest about being unhappy so he is trying. Although, even that is not sparking an attraction from my end...and it's almost like he is doing these things now b/c he thinks he HAS to not b/c he WANTS to...(whole threads on this I know )

 

Outside of the sexual differences we are also very different in our social personalities. He's the stay at home be in bed by 11pm & I'm the go out have fun type. I love to dance (obvious I guess) and he will/does not dance. He did not drink at all until after we were married, I did change that but he still thinks it's wrong to drink too much. This causes some problems when we are invited to parties, and he can't relate to anyone there b/c they like to drink and have fun. My friends have actually said he comes across as rude sometimes.

 

 

There's more but I know this is getting long and no one may read anyway. I am just completely torn b/c there are not really big problems, we don't fight (which actually may be a problem), he is a very involved father and is helpful around the house. He would be a dream husband for many women, but I am a passionate, sex loving woman who is not really sure I was ever in love with him.

 

Can you create passion and attraction if there never was any??

 

You're right -- our situations do have a lot in common.

 

I find it interesting he sent you an email. There's something definitely amiss if the two of you have been together as long as you have, along with having two children together, and he is communicating with you by email. As you know, I'm in the same boat except I didn't receive an email.

 

If your husband doesn't want sex often perhaps he is lacking in passion/attraction also? It definitely sounds like you are.

 

Do you WANT to have sex with your husband? At all? It makes me wonder since you said you initiate 95% of the time. If you know you're not attracted and don't feel passionate for him, I'm not sure it is something that can be created. Why do you initiate if you feel that way?

 

We don't argue either. It may go along with the lack of passion. It can't be normal to NEVER argue. I don't want to be in a fighting relationship, but surely there is something the two of you feel passionately about -- yet hold a differing opinion? It seems this would at least lend to a passionate discussion. Not judging -- that's not happening in my relationship either -- as you know.

 

If you are not attracted to your husband, you cannot reverse this. Do the poor guy a favor and set him free so that he can find someone who really loves him.

 

And someone who truly loves her. I think shared passion and intimacy is pretty important.

 

Don't think I don't think this myself...but I also think that I owe it to both of us and our children to be VERY sure before turning our lives upside down.

 

I am sure I have unresolved issues from my past that I need to deal with so maybe it's really MY problem that needs to be fixed...

 

Have you been to any IC? I can't remember if you mentioned that in my thread. I think it's helping me somewhat. I just want to fast forward it.

 

It is a huge decision to leave your marriage -- especially with children involved. I think you should be sure also. It's not a decision to be made lightly. Maybe IC, then MC? I need to ask my counselor the very question you've just asked. Can attraction and passion be produced if it wasn't really there in the first place? I'm thinking it's a chemistry thing -- but what a huge thing to do -- breaking up a marriage -- due to lack of chemistry. It's a confusing thing to ponder.

[whichwayisup]

Your H took a real chance and put it out there. He is being honest and sincere, so now it's time for you to give him that same respect and talk to him. So what if you're scared! You are an adult!!

 

Speak from your heart, be honest and have the conversation with your husband. Do counselling, together and apart, but make sure you use the same counsellor for both.

[Luv2dance]

I guess I don't see what's so wrong with not wanting to drink too much. I am not sure a drunk(why are you drinking enough to be drunk?) partner is someone I would want to have sex with at my age either. Should that define him as a good husband? Does the opinion of your friends matter all that much? You stated that you changed the fact that he didn't drink, is that what you have been doing, trying to change him instead of loving him for who he is? Are you trying to change him into someone you and your friends are more approving of?

 

The advice to give your H the respect of counseling is dead on. You need to know why he isn't enough for you the way he is. I think the problem is yours not his. You say he is a dream H....for someone else. That speaks volumes to me.

 

Sorry, it is very hard to tell the entire situation in a few paragraphs and you have definitely taken things the wrong way so let me try to explain better.

 

No, he did not drink before we got married, but I did not force him to change this behavior. The example I gave about being drunk & naked was just to say he is not sexually driven as most men (and yes it did make me feel rejected) I enjoy a margarita and fruity mixed drinks so he tried them and liked them. I do occasionally drink more than I should and get a good buzz and I have no issue with him not doing this (I always know I have a DD) it's more about his attitude. It's really not about the drinking as much as it is just another one of our differences I guess. I would like to have couple friends and that is hard for us since we are so different.

 

As far as him not being enough for me the way he is that goes back to the passion/attraction thing. I realize that this is not a huge deal for many people and that is the reason for my comment about being a dream husband. I know many women who would love to be married to a man not interested in much sex.

[Samantha0905]

.

 

As far as him not being enough for me the way he is that goes back to the passion/attraction thing. I realize that this is not a huge deal for many people and that is the reason for my comment about being a dream husband. I know many women who would love to be married to a man not interested in much sex.

 

Reminds me of what my sister said to me. She said she didn't get why I was so concerned with the sexual aspects of my marriage as it's something she could definitely live without. She then told me if I could just wait it out 10 more years, I wouldn't want the sex so much anyway.

[Luv2dance]

I find it interesting he sent you an email. There's something definitely amiss if the two of you have been together as long as you have, along with having two children together, and he is communicating with you by email. As you know, I'm in the same boat except I didn't receive an email.

 

I think he sent the email b/c he knew I would be worried about what was going on all day and yes it probably was easier for him to type it out. I was leaving for work when he said he hadn't slept last night and I asked why...

 

If your husband doesn't want sex often perhaps he is lacking in passion/attraction also? It definitely sounds like you are.

 

Do you WANT to have sex with your husband? At all? It makes me wonder since you said you initiate 95% of the time. If you know you're not attracted and don't feel passionate for him, I'm not sure it is something that can be created. Why do you initiate if you feel that way?

 

VERY good questions...Early in the marriage I was really trying to find the passion, thought it was just b/c he was inexperienced that things weren't exciting. I bought books, lingerie, would light candles, etc. but nothing seemed to change. I almost always am able to O, but he has performance issues, again not really dealt with by either of us. So for me I guess I kept hoping and I like sex so I do it I have spells when I just can't do it though and lately that has been more often. Even with me initiating we have never had frequent sex. That explain at all??

 

We don't argue either. It may go along with the lack of passion. It can't be normal to NEVER argue. I don't want to be in a fighting relationship, but surely there is something the two of you feel passionately about -- yet hold a differing opinion? It seems this would at least lend to a passionate discussion. Not judging -- that's not happening in my relationship either -- as you know.

 

One would think....

[Luv2dance]

Your H took a real chance and put it out there. He is being honest and sincere, so now it's time for you to give him that same respect and talk to him. So what if you're scared! You are an adult!!

 

Speak from your heart, be honest and have the conversation with your husband. Do counselling, together and apart, but make sure you use the same counsellor for both.

 

I totally agree...he is a great guy who is trying, and I feel like a serious beotch for even feeling like I do. But you know he said something the other night that smacked me in the face...it was about a couple on tv who were breaking up..."It doesn't matter how nice they are if you don't love them"

 

Sometimes I don't like being an adult...

[Luv2dance]

A little update...

 

We had a pretty good talk last night about a few issues and both agreed we needed counseling. It was very hard to tell him that I didn't think I really had ever been attracted to him. But, I tried to be as honest as possible b/c I know I need to be w/ him and myself. There were tears and hugs.

 

I know I don't need to throw away a good marriage to a good man for "feelings" but I also know if things continue the way they are I will end up resentful and very unhappy. I wish I was not the type to want the "soul mate" relationship but I am who I am I guess.

 

Thanks for "listening"

[Samantha0905]

VERY good questions...Early in the marriage I was really trying to find the passion, thought it was just b/c he was inexperienced that things weren't exciting. I bought books, lingerie, would light candles, etc. but nothing seemed to change. I almost always am able to O, but he has performance issues, again not really dealt with by either of us. So for me I guess I kept hoping and I like sex so I do it I have spells when I just can't do it though and lately that has been more often. Even with me initiating we have never had frequent sex. That explain at all??

 

My husband has performance issues also at this point. Well, by that -- I mean the last few years when we were having sex. As I've stated, we haven't in a while. I don't think he had performance issues so much when we were younger.

 

Out of curiosity, how long have you been married? I know you said he is 10 years older. If you don't mind answering -- how old are you? I suppose I'm just asking because I'm curious. Not sure where I was going with that.

 

It's so frustrating to feel that way about a partner when they are basically a good person.

 

A little update...

 

We had a pretty good talk last night about a few issues and both agreed we needed counseling. It was very hard to tell him that I didn't think I really had ever been attracted to him. But, I tried to be as honest as possible b/c I know I need to be w/ him and myself. There were tears and hugs.

 

I know I don't need to throw away a good marriage to a good man for "feelings" but I also know if things continue the way they are I will end up resentful and very unhappy. I wish I was not the type to want the "soul mate" relationship but I am who I am I guess.

 

Thanks for "listening"

 

Big step for the two of you! I want the soul mate relationship also. I think I almost feel averse to marriage counseling at this point. I'm tired of trying if the passion/intimacy aren't there. That can't be a good sign. I hope things go well for you.

 

He didn't ask you if you've had an affair? I would think that is where a man's head would go when you tell him you haven't been sexually attracted to him throughout the marriage.

[Luv2dance]

My husband has performance issues also at this point. Well, by that -- I mean the last few years when we were having sex. As I've stated, we haven't in a while. I don't think he had performance issues so much when we were younger.

 

Out of curiosity, how long have you been married? I know you said he is 10 years older. If you don't mind answering -- how old are you? I suppose I'm just asking because I'm curious. Not sure where I was going with that.

 

It's so frustrating to feel that way about a partner when they are basically a good person.

 

We have been married for almost 16 yrs. I will be 40 this year and he is 49. So, I know some of the reason I feel like it is really coming to a head now is my age, but I don't think it's all that b/c we have had similar discussions in the past.

 

 

 

Big step for the two of you! I want the soul mate relationship also. I think I almost feel averse to marriage counseling at this point. I'm tired of trying if the passion/intimacy aren't there. That can't be a good sign. I hope things go well for you.

 

He didn't ask you if you've had an affair? I would think that is where a man's head would go when you tell him you haven't been sexually attracted to him throughout the marriage.

 

He has questioned me as to whether or not there is someone else I am interested in esp. after finding out I was on this site. I am a little concerned that the counseling won't change things for me either, but I feel I have to at least try.

[Samantha0905]

My husband has performance issues also at this point. Well, by that -- I mean the last few years when we were having sex. As I've stated, we haven't in a while. I don't think he had performance issues so much when we were younger.

 

Out of curiosity, how long have you been married? I know you said he is 10 years older. If you don't mind answering -- how old are you? I suppose I'm just asking because I'm curious. Not sure where I was going with that.

 

It's so frustrating to feel that way about a partner when they are basically a good person.

 

We have been married for almost 16 yrs. I will be 40 this year and he is 49. So, I know some of the reason I feel like it is really coming to a head now is my age, but I don't think it's all that b/c we have had similar discussions in the past.

Oh. I was just trying to look at your issues from the correct length of marriage/age perspective I guess. I'm 48, but feel way younger for some reason. Both me and my husband are pretty fit.

 

I think sometimes for me it's an age thing. I feel like I'm getting older and am going to end up not finding anyone with whom I can feel intimacy/passion.

 

 

He has questioned me as to whether or not there is someone else I am interested in esp. after finding out I was on this site. I am a little concerned that the counseling won't change things for me either, but I feel I have to at least try.

Yes, I think trying will be a good thing for you.

[Luv2dance]

Oh. I was just trying to look at your issues from the correct length of marriage/age perspective I guess. I'm 48, but feel way younger for some reason. Both me and my husband are pretty fit.

 

I think sometimes for me it's an age thing. I feel like I'm getting older and am going to end up not finding anyone with whom I can feel intimacy/passion.

 

 

Yes, I think trying will be a good thing for you.

 

I also feel younger than my 40 yrs, well most days anyway. We have both stayed fairly fit also, not as much as I would like to be, but neither of us has gained that much weight since we got married. So I am sure that is not my attraction issue.

 

I have talked to several 40ish MW lately who seem to be having issues/doubts about their lives so I know that plays a role in the situation. I feel like if my kids were older I wouldn't be struggling this much with what to do, but obviously that might not be true!

 

I will add MH was spontaneous last night after we went to bed...

[onedayatatyme]

OP, your marriage and personalities mirror the ones in my marriage in many ways. You and your H almost sound like an amplified version of me and my W.

 

I am slightly older, was maybe a little less sexually adventurous. She is an extrovert, I am introverted. The red flag for me in your post is when you said your friends say your husband comes across as rude sometimes. Man does that sound like me. If I had to guess, your friends suspect that maybe he's judgmental as revealed by his silence and the fact that he doesn't smile alot when he's with your group of friends. Sound familiar?

 

As that guy, I can tell you that he's probably feeling some anxiety about what to say to people he has little in common with. It's not that he's not interested, he's probably wracking his brain trying to think of something to start a conversation about. I guarantee he's also worried about what they think of him which adds to his anxiety and difficulty connecting with your friends. This doesn't make him a bad guy. Just as you wanted him to be there to stabilize you early in your relationship, maybe you can help bring him out of his shell by engaging him in conversation with your friends.

 

If you think you have unresolved issues from earlier in life, I think it's critical that you go to counselling. It could be affecting your ability to communicate or relate to your husband in ways you aren't aware of and are sub-conscious. I speak from experience on this one too. When you picked your husband, were you hiding from something?

 

As for the sex... that one rings a bell too. My W always wanted it more than me until recently. Try to build a level of trust with H to talk about what you both need sexually. He may never be the "best" you've had but he seems really willing to work on improving. give him a shot.

[Luv2dance]

OP, your marriage and personalities mirror the ones in my marriage in many ways. You and your H almost sound like an amplified version of me and my W.

 

I am slightly older, was maybe a little less sexually adventurous. She is an extrovert, I am introverted. The red flag for me in your post is when you said your friends say your husband comes across as rude sometimes. Man does that sound like me. If I had to guess, your friends suspect that maybe he's judgmental as revealed by his silence and the fact that he doesn't smile alot when he's with your group of friends. Sound familiar?

 

As that guy, I can tell you that he's probably feeling some anxiety about what to say to people he has little in common with. It's not that he's not interested, he's probably wracking his brain trying to think of something to start a conversation about. I guarantee he's also worried about what they think of him which adds to his anxiety and difficulty connecting with your friends. This doesn't make him a bad guy. Just as you wanted him to be there to stabilize you early in your relationship, maybe you can help bring him out of his shell by engaging him in conversation with your friends.

 

If you think you have unresolved issues from earlier in life, I think it's critical that you go to counselling. It could be affecting your ability to communicate or relate to your husband in ways you aren't aware of and are sub-conscious. I speak from experience on this one too. When you picked your husband, were you hiding from something?

 

As for the sex... that one rings a bell too. My W always wanted it more than me until recently. Try to build a level of trust with H to talk about what you both need sexually. He may never be the "best" you've had but he seems really willing to work on improving. give him a shot.

 

Thanks so much for your comments!! I'd say you have a good understanding of what is going on with us. We have recently talked about his "behavior" at parties where he feels uncomfortable, and he agreed that he probably was putting up a wall as possibly a way of putting his foot down, so to speak. He did interact more (and yes b/c I stayed with him most of the time) at the last gathering so that was an improvement. I still have that desire for him to really enjoy himself rather than just be amusing me, but I guess that is the wrong attitude.

 

Hiding from something?? Not sure if that's it or not, but I was definitely ashamed of my past and had a trauma that I really never dealt with b/c at the time didn't seem like a huge deal. So I guess maybe I was hiding from those things...

 

I do know that communication about sex has been almost non-existent until the last yr when I really started getting frustrated. I know he is willing to try but not sure how willing he is to go sexually to improve things.

 

I am not giving up at this point, but I still go back to the attraction/desire issue and how to create that if it wasn't there in the beginning...he does have enough good qualities to fight for though!