Author famtroubles Posted March 10, 2010 Author Posted March 10, 2010 Look, man up! Not everyone is going to be happy. If you want the relationship to heal between all of them then you have to communicate and say some things that may not make all of them happy. It's time to grow up. If you can't do that then visit your parents and sister alone. You do not have to include your wife if she doesn't want to be there but still see your family if you love them. I have told my parents. They response was of course, you're too blinded to see the truth. I do have to at some point ask them to apologize. There is not much to lose in trying. If I ask my wife whether she would accept an apology and she says she does not even want one (which I am thinking would be the response) do you think I should still ask my parents to apologize or give up on that front? I know it may not be possible for everyone to be happy. I would just so much prefer for everyone to just get along. This is very selfish of me but I really wish both sides would understand what I am going through and show their love for me by trying a bit harder. On the other hand my love for both sides is so great that I cannot let either go because they refuse to do so. I really can't help it since that's just the way I am.
Author famtroubles Posted March 10, 2010 Author Posted March 10, 2010 OP, you're an adult man. Make your choice and announce it. Your family bore you and raised you. That isn't a life sentence of penal labor. You owe them nothing, just as your children will owe you nothing. Anything else is just selfishness. Stand by your de-facto wife and insist on equitable and fair treatment for her, and/or disconnect those (anyone) who would disrespect her and your union. If you don't, she will leave you. Hope you like being alone I completely understand your sentiment and I really do agree. It is just harder said than done. I do not like being alone and if my wife left me then my resentment towards my parents would only grow so I would end up losing both. I know they don't owe me anything just for raising me, however it is hard to explain my entire life and I do admit that I may not be looking at the situation entirely objectively, but I feel that they really did go way above and beyond the call of duty as far as parenting goes. Both working multiple jobs, sleeping only a few hours a day and still finding time to help with homework and play with us, never buying anything for themselves unless they were sure we had everything we needed (and even just wanted), never taking a vacation, never going out on the town, just so they could save up enough for my sister and I. The family was truly in a rut after leaving everything behind in our country of origin and coming here with nothing but a $6k debt which they took out in order to pay for the trip here. I often wish that they had been much worse to me when I was growing up. Maybe then it would not be so hard to let them go.
carhill Posted March 10, 2010 Posted March 10, 2010 OP, my assertion is that you *don't owe them anything* because they raised you well. What you give is of your own accord, not because it is *expected*. They earn your respect because they respect you *and* your wife. If they disrespect your wife, they disrespect you. This is all part of being a man. As an only child with a domineering mother, trust me, I've walked this path. I've said the words; looked her in the eye. She knew I was a man of my word. What I see is you huddling in the center of a maelstrom with all this drama swirling around you. Being a man is standing up, grabbing folks by the neck and telling them that it is going to be *this* way for *you*. They can choose how to react or what to feel. Care less. Act more. Good luck
donnamaybe Posted March 10, 2010 Posted March 10, 2010 They had always refused to see the bad in me. When I got in trouble with my friends, it was my friends fault. When I started smoking, it was my friend that coerced me into it. When I stopped following their religion, there was somebody else to blame. It was always more my mother than my father (he always just fell in line). Maybe it was her messed up childhood, maybe something else. Oh, boy, does this ever sound like my ex mother-in-law. Her boys could never do anything wrong! Even when one time she called and could tell in my voice something was wrong and asked about it. I told her we had been fighting about her son's pot habit again. I'm not against it, per se, but you can't be spending $400 a month on something like that and not have it affect your finances or your motivation. Her response? "Well, you buy groceries!" This, in and of itself, may be part of the bigger picture creating much of the problem.
carhill Posted March 10, 2010 Posted March 10, 2010 Her boys could never do anything wrong! Yes, my mother was like this too. This is why it is imperative for the man to be proactive and assertive and make it clear to his family where his self-respect and loyalties lie. He is human; he is fallible; he does love his wife and his family will respect that union and that person if it kills them
Author famtroubles Posted March 10, 2010 Author Posted March 10, 2010 I do have leverage over my parents. I know they are not willing to lose me so I can tell them this is how I feel, you have to do this or risk losing me. I don't know if they will ever love my wife but all I want is for them to accept her and be nice to her. It is a little different with my wife. She doesn't seem to be willing to make peace. I cannot threaten leaving because for one, I am not willing to follow through with that, and for two I am positive she would say "I love you, but if you can't deal with this then we're not going to work out" which she has said before. Telling her how much the situation hurts me results in here telling me how much it hurts here so no progress (towards my goal) is ever made there.
donnamaybe Posted March 10, 2010 Posted March 10, 2010 I don't know if they will ever love my wife but all I want is for them to accept her and be nice to her. And if they do that, and she unbends a little and lets them get to know her, they will probably fall in love with her in spite of themselves. It is a little different with my wife. She doesn't seem to be willing to make peace. I cannot threaten leaving because for one, I am not willing to follow through with that, and for two I am positive she would say "I love you, but if you can't deal with this then we're not going to work out" which she has said before. Telling her how much the situation hurts me results in here telling me how much it hurts here so no progress (towards my goal) is ever made there. I'm sorry, but I either missed where you said how long ago this occurred or I forgot or you didn't mention it. Has it been long enough for her to have calmed down enough to be willing to do her part? It could be that it's still too fresh a hurt for her.
carhill Posted March 10, 2010 Posted March 10, 2010 OP, have you sent, in her presence, clear signals to your parents/family of your perspective? I would expect my wife, if hurt by their actions and/or words, to want clear and proactive indications from myself, evident to her in real time, that I stand with her. This is part of the price I pay as a man for her loyalty and her love. Clear and present communication
Author famtroubles Posted March 10, 2010 Author Posted March 10, 2010 And if they do that, and she unbends a little and lets them get to know her, they will probably fall in love with her in spite of themselves. I'm sorry, but I either missed where you said how long ago this occurred or I forgot or you didn't mention it. Has it been long enough for her to have calmed down enough to be willing to do her part? It could be that it's still too fresh a hurt for her. I'm not sure I ever specified. It's been close to 2 years now.
Author famtroubles Posted March 10, 2010 Author Posted March 10, 2010 OP, have you sent, in her presence, clear signals to your parents/family of your perspective? I would expect my wife, if hurt by their actions and/or words, to want clear and proactive indications from myself, evident to her in real time, that I stand with her. This is part of the price I pay as a man for her loyalty and her love. Clear and present communication My only communication with my family can be through the phone because of the distance. She does not want to be in the same room when I am on the phone with them.
Author famtroubles Posted March 10, 2010 Author Posted March 10, 2010 You all are wonderful. I really want to thank all of you for taking the time to listen, to give advice, and to try to help me. Thank you.
stillafool Posted March 10, 2010 Posted March 10, 2010 IIf I ask my wife whether she would accept an apology and she says she does not even want one (which I am thinking would be the response) do you think I should still ask my parents to apologize or give up on that front? If you ask your wife if it will make a difference if they apologize and she says no then there is no use in asking your parents to apologize.
blue.iris Posted March 10, 2010 Posted March 10, 2010 Well, if your family is willing to apologize, while your wife is not willing to be in the same room when you talk to them, then it's an impossible situation. Personally, while I understand your wife was treated unfairly, she should be willing to compromise at some point in the future (as long as your family maintains civility with her that is). She should understand that not all cultures are as liberal. Your parents will come around eventually because they obviously ultimately want you to be in their lives.
carhill Posted March 10, 2010 Posted March 10, 2010 Time for a visit, before grandchildren arrive. Trust me
sally4sara Posted March 11, 2010 Posted March 11, 2010 @sally4sara The public place would be a bit difficult as my parents and we are over a thousand miles apart. I'm not sure my girlfriend would go for such a meeting in either case. Then I'm not sure why this is a problem of the size you make out. If they will not be around to even eat at a restaurant, they won't be around to come over to the house either. All this just serves to making it cheaper to go visit them because you won't be bringing your GF/wife. So they don't approve of her and she dislikes their dislike of her. And from the sound of it, they don't speak the same language so there was no phone correspondence either....... Why not just let it die if they don't want to mix and will not have opportunity to mix even if they did get along? True hate isn't the norm so perhaps, if you stop pushing it, it will cool off on its own. If years from now you are still with this girl, your parents might just realize they raised you - you find something about the girl worthy of your time and love - so maybe she isn't who they thought. Your sis - needs to stay out of other people's relationships and keep her hands to herself.
donnamaybe Posted March 11, 2010 Posted March 11, 2010 I'm not sure I ever specified. It's been close to 2 years now. Since the last incident? Has your family tried to reach out to her personally in those two years? Or has this been festering for two years without any attempts on their part to mend the rift between them? If they have made honest attempts to apologize to her, and I don't mean half-hearted birthday wishes simply to make YOU happy, then she is being very rigid. Otherwise, if there hasn't been an honest attempt on the part of your family to mend the fences THEY tore down, then I don't blame her. The feeling of being not only unwanted but intensely disliked will only deepen over a two year time frame. I know they would for me. I would feel VERY uncomfortable around these people in those circumstances.
Author famtroubles Posted March 11, 2010 Author Posted March 11, 2010 Then I'm not sure why this is a problem of the size you make out. If they will not be around to even eat at a restaurant, they won't be around to come over to the house either. All this just serves to making it cheaper to go visit them because you won't be bringing your GF/wife. So they don't approve of her and she dislikes their dislike of her. And from the sound of it, they don't speak the same language so there was no phone correspondence either....... Why not just let it die if they don't want to mix and will not have opportunity to mix even if they did get along? True hate isn't the norm so perhaps, if you stop pushing it, it will cool off on its own. If years from now you are still with this girl, your parents might just realize they raised you - you find something about the girl worthy of your time and love - so maybe she isn't who they thought. Your sis - needs to stay out of other people's relationships and keep her hands to herself. Completely agree about my sister needing to mind her own business. The problem isn't very small. My parents want to visit but can't. There are events, like weddings, I have to go and would like my wife to accompany me to in the area where my parents live (my good friends still live back there). Another example is that recently my mother found out she had some serious health problems. This obviously worried me. My wife is the closest person to me that I can talk to. The inability to not share my concerns and have her be supportive about the issue is sort of depressing. I don't push the issue. It comes up very rarely but when it does it's pretty bad. I'm not worried about my parents accepting. As I mentioned if they want to keep their son they have no choice. I'm more worried about my wife forgiving, at least to a point. I do know that in order for forgiveness there should be an apology first. My parents don't speak the language natively but they can communicate.
Author famtroubles Posted March 11, 2010 Author Posted March 11, 2010 Since the last incident? Has your family tried to reach out to her personally in those two years? Or has this been festering for two years without any attempts on their part to mend the rift between them? If they have made honest attempts to apologize to her, and I don't mean half-hearted birthday wishes simply to make YOU happy, then she is being very rigid. Otherwise, if there hasn't been an honest attempt on the part of your family to mend the fences THEY tore down, then I don't blame her. The feeling of being not only unwanted but intensely disliked will only deepen over a two year time frame. I know they would for me. I would feel VERY uncomfortable around these people in those circumstances. It's been festering for 2 years As I said, I don't blame her at all either. My family has hurt her quite deeply while she really did nothing to instigate it. She was even picking up Polish books (oops I let it slip, my background is Polish) so she could learn the language and impress them. I am the one that hurt them by withholding the truth (and disappointed them by "living in sin" and "losing my faith"), but they decided to take it out on her instead.
donnamaybe Posted March 11, 2010 Posted March 11, 2010 It's been festering for 2 years As I said, I don't blame her at all either. My family has hurt her quite deeply while she really did nothing to instigate it. She was even picking up Polish books (oops I let it slip, my background is Polish) so she could learn the language and impress them. I am the one that hurt them by withholding the truth (and disappointed them by "living in sin" and "losing my faith"), but they decided to take it out on her instead. Have you told your family all this? If so, how long ago?
Author famtroubles Posted March 11, 2010 Author Posted March 11, 2010 Have you told your family all this? If so, how long ago? Yes, in the weeks after the incident with my sister. Maybe that was bad timing since everyone was still not thinking clearly. They just kept giving me excuses about how she's the one that doesn't like them, she wants to take me away from them, and how I'm blinded by her. My mother kept bringing up an occasion when she came with me when I visited home from college. She was not feeling well when we were supposed to attend a birthday party for a friend. She decided to stay at my parents, in bed while I went. She stayed in the room the whole time and for some reason my parents took that as a sign of her disliking them. My mother also cooks a lot and in typical European fashion is very pushy about everyone eating what she cooks. My wife is very picky about what she eats and she politely declined a few offers. Again, my mother listed that as a huge sine that my wife dislikes them. I'm not sure that they understand that in American culture it is perfectly acceptable to say "no thank you" and it is not a sign of disrespect. I can't stress enough how completely irrational my parents can be. In retrospect, my mother has always found a problem with every one of the girls I have ever dated, and really with every one of the friends I have ever had. This may be the worst because it is the most serious.
donnamaybe Posted March 11, 2010 Posted March 11, 2010 Oh, wow. I feel for ya, man. The only thing you can do is put your foot down with your family, and particularly your mom, it seems. You can, however, do it with love. Perhaps it would be best to write a letter to each of them. Sometimes people won't receive what we are trying to say to them because they are busy thinking of what they want to say in return because we are right there to hear it. If they are reading a letter from you - a heartfelt letter that tells them what they AND she means to you and what you will and will not tolerate as to their treatment of her, complete with the repercussions for not being respectful to your gal - they might actually HEAR what you have to say. Then urge them to write their thoughts down in return letters. When we write, we have time to think about how to word things so they come out sounding the way we want them to sound. What do you think?
D-Lish Posted March 12, 2010 Posted March 12, 2010 I cringed while reading your thread... I was once the wife in a parallel situation. My ex's family were Hungarian Catholic- and held the same views as your family. My in-laws were horrid to me- and by extension, they were horrible to their son. I was to blame for everything- him losing his faith, losing his way, I was the devil that led him astray. It was so ridiculous since he was a rigid atheist when I met him. I took their abuse for a while, but it got pretty bad. I never remember being in a room with my mother-in-law when she wasn't frowning at me. These people hated me, simply because he loved me, and that stole time away from them. I understand why your wife is reluctant to make any sort of amends. It is so beyond hurtful to have to defend yourself against this irrationality. The one good thing is that you stick up for your wife. My ex never did, he was terrified of his mother, and he used to ask me to just grin and fake my way through family gatherings. Asking that of me made me lose respect for him. The ball is in your parents court to make amends. Your wife was the one that encouraged you to be honest with them, she was open to a relationship with them in the beginning...They have always been the ones with the problem. If they can't apologize, you can't expect your wife to be less rigid in her approach to them. She's just beyond hurt at this point. My H's parents were a huge reason for the demise of our marriage. I just never forgave him for not being able to stand up for me, for not being able to stand up for us (let alone himself). We fought about it constantly. IMO, it's not up to your wife to make this right. I feel really bad for her.
Author famtroubles Posted March 12, 2010 Author Posted March 12, 2010 Oh, wow. I feel for ya, man. The only thing you can do is put your foot down with your family, and particularly your mom, it seems. You can, however, do it with love. Perhaps it would be best to write a letter to each of them. Sometimes people won't receive what we are trying to say to them because they are busy thinking of what they want to say in return because we are right there to hear it. If they are reading a letter from you - a heartfelt letter that tells them what they AND she means to you and what you will and will not tolerate as to their treatment of her, complete with the repercussions for not being respectful to your gal - they might actually HEAR what you have to say. Then urge them to write their thoughts down in return letters. When we write, we have time to think about how to word things so they come out sounding the way we want them to sound. What do you think? The letter sounds like a good idea. As you mentioned it would give them more of a chance to think about what I'm saying (as well as me to put things the way I want them to be said) instead of immediately dismissing my statements. Thanks for the suggestion.
Author famtroubles Posted March 12, 2010 Author Posted March 12, 2010 I cringed while reading your thread... I was once the wife in a parallel situation. My ex's family were Hungarian Catholic- and held the same views as your family. My in-laws were horrid to me- and by extension, they were horrible to their son. I was to blame for everything- him losing his faith, losing his way, I was the devil that led him astray. It was so ridiculous since he was a rigid atheist when I met him. I took their abuse for a while, but it got pretty bad. I never remember being in a room with my mother-in-law when she wasn't frowning at me. These people hated me, simply because he loved me, and that stole time away from them. I understand why your wife is reluctant to make any sort of amends. It is so beyond hurtful to have to defend yourself against this irrationality. The one good thing is that you stick up for your wife. My ex never did, he was terrified of his mother, and he used to ask me to just grin and fake my way through family gatherings. Asking that of me made me lose respect for him. The ball is in your parents court to make amends. Your wife was the one that encouraged you to be honest with them, she was open to a relationship with them in the beginning...They have always been the ones with the problem. If they can't apologize, you can't expect your wife to be less rigid in her approach to them. She's just beyond hurt at this point. My H's parents were a huge reason for the demise of our marriage. I just never forgave him for not being able to stand up for me, for not being able to stand up for us (let alone himself). We fought about it constantly. IMO, it's not up to your wife to make this right. I feel really bad for her. I'm sorry to hear about your situation and that it did not end well. I'm sorry that your ex did not stick up for you. He really should have. I really don't know what it is that makes so many people so intolerant and unable to refrain from shifting the blame. I agree that it really is up to my parents to apologize and based on what most of you are saying this has to happen before any progress can be made. You've made me realize that I shouldn't ask my wife to just grit her teeth and fake a smile. Thank you. My parents accuse me of being blinded by love, yet it is them (and in your situation the ex-in-laws) who are blinded by their beliefs and misguided teachings. A few posts claimed that "blood is thicker than water" yet if blood is really so thick why is it that something so normal as a difference in opinion can cut off circulation?
D-Lish Posted March 14, 2010 Posted March 14, 2010 I'm sorry to hear about your situation and that it did not end well. I'm sorry that your ex did not stick up for you. He really should have. I really don't know what it is that makes so many people so intolerant and unable to refrain from shifting the blame. I agree that it really is up to my parents to apologize and based on what most of you are saying this has to happen before any progress can be made. You've made me realize that I shouldn't ask my wife to just grit her teeth and fake a smile. Thank you. My parents accuse me of being blinded by love, yet it is them (and in your situation the ex-in-laws) who are blinded by their beliefs and misguided teachings. A few posts claimed that "blood is thicker than water" yet if blood is really so thick why is it that something so normal as a difference in opinion can cut off circulation? I don't believe that just because you are related to someone that they get a free pass for being unreasonable or cruel. I think my exH and you are different, thankfully. My ex MIL ruled her family through guilt, and my exH was terrified of her. The fact that he couldn't stand up for me ruined our relationship. I think asking your wife to grin and fake it negates her pain and minimizes the actions of your parents. That's how I felt when my husband used to ask the same of me. One thing I can tell you- if my in-laws had have made a sincere effort to apologize and make amends, I would have been so elated, so relieved, so "all about that". I imagine your wife has her defences up (rightly so) when she speaks of hating your family- but a sincere apology would most likely soften her. She really did make a lot of effort to try and sort things out in the beginning by pushing you to be open and honest about your living situation- so she obviously cares. I think she's just been pushed too far and is reacting accordingly. I feel bad for you as well, because I know you just want peace.
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