Why is it accepted for women to be insecure and lack confidence but Men cant?

[carhill]

Despite that many women say they prefer the quiet thoughtful guy out, I have never seen it. Have been the quiet guy and the braying jackass, the ass does better every time IME.

 

Thanks. We don't generally go to clubs and nearly all my male friends are married, most over 20 years and are generally my age (50) or older, most around 60. I'm seeing someone right now so it isn't a big issue, but I'll pay attention more.

[Stung]

So if a guys slightly shy or quiet hes not a real Man and women cant be attracted to him?

 

He has to be loud and try to be the center of attention?

 

There is a world of difference between an obnoxious scene-stealing ham and a man with some self-assurance.

 

Also, quiet does not necessarily = shy...and there ARE women who like shy boys, they're just fewer and further between.

[D-Lish]

There is a world of difference between an obnoxious scene-stealing ham and a man with some self-assurance.

 

Also, quiet does not necessarily = shy...and there ARE women who like shy boys, they're just fewer and further between.

 

I maintain shy = insecure.

 

Quiet confidence is different.

[Jersey Shortie]

Because women evolved with a predisposition to nurture and caretake and men with a predisposition to protect and control; human mating preferences evolved to select for these attributes for females and males respectively. Shyness is not in conflict with a nurturing, caretaker role, and so isn't perceived as a strong negative in a woman.

 

Unfortunately, this has the effect of making shyness sort of like an X-chromosome genetic disease - it persists in the population because it doesn't negatively affect women, although it's terrible for men.

 

great response!

[counterman]

I tend to get quiet around other loudmouth males simply because I don't see healthy discourse as a shouting match. I'm quite confident in my intelligence and life experience and don't need to shout other people down to prove it. I generally just walk away and find other more suitable and interesting people to share with. The loudmouths won't miss me or anyone because their world is completely full of themselves. My stbx had some friends like that, husbands of friends mostly.

 

That's similar to me. There are a lot of loud mouth males, who happen to hang out together, that I see once in a while. My confidence shows but not in the way that I need to shout and bellow out. These guys are alpha-male wannabes. I think it is pretty sad.

[samsungxoxo]

Thats rare usaaally women gravitate towards the loudmouth because i guess it shows social proof or status to have peoples attention

Loudmouth going off endless it's a turn-off as well as the extreme.. super timid man that can't even say hi or look you in the eyes. Both extremes are turn-off.

Now if he's quiet and knows when to really shut up then it's alright.

 

Now strangely during most of my high school years, the guys would mainly hit on one of my friend... an outgoing girl who used to like partying, was a player at the same time (always looked for other men when she already had a boyfriend, flirting excessively) and smoked too. Then there was me... the shy one at the time who would hardly initiate a conversation with a man. Result: Almost all of them went for my friend and not me.. Ok something is wrong.... Don't guys in their high school years like shy, timid girls??

Edited February 11, 2010 by samsungxoxo

[txsilkysmoothe]

Everybody has insecurities. What is not attractive is when one allows insecurities, lack of confidence, and shyness to control their life. As long as a man is trying to overcome those things that hold him back, he is doing fine.

 

I like shy men. The first time I met my ex-boyfriend he was so nervous he had sweat pouring down his face. I thought it was cute and an indication of how important the evening was to him. He wasn't that way on subsequent dates -that would have been a turn-off.

 

The loudmouth guy is overcompensating. Most women see right through that.

[stillafool]

I tend to get quiet around other loudmouth males simply because I don't see healthy discourse as a shouting match. I'm quite confident in my intelligence and life experience and don't need to shout other people down to prove it. I generally just walk away and find other more suitable and interesting people to share with. The loudmouths won't miss me or anyone because their world is completely full of themselves. My stbx had some friends like that, husbands of friends mostly.

 

'

I love it when a man is quiet when all the other guys are screaming like fools. I like the strong, quiet type. That is far more masculine to me.

[carhill]

Meerkat does have a point though. These 'expressive' guys do gather a circle. I think part of it, beyond personality, is communicating in a way certain people are drawn to. Think of the preacher in church, shouting from the pulpit, rallying the faithful. I think there's style and attraction for everyone. It's just that those particular types of males and myself are incompatible. Also, FWIW, IME, nary a one of them (the 'preachers') has ever had my back, but, during my divorce, the quiet ones came out of the woodwork for support.

 

BTW, I had read prior about shy and nurturing qualities being more acceptable in women than in men. Society may disagree, but, personally, I don't connect shy and nurturing with being insecure. A person can be secure within themself but have difficulty relating in a healthy way to people they encounter. I was very secure as a young person but just related to women (girls) poorly. Perhaps, more precisely, they found the loud, boisterous, risk-taking boys to be more attractive. Me, I was quietly blowing up the school swimming pool

[stillafool]

I had two brothers. My oldest is the "alpha" male type (very outgoing) and my younger brother "beta" (extremely quiet). I dated a guy mujch older than me when I was a girl who was starting to get abusive. I told him that I was going to get my big brother to beat him up and he laughed and said "that's fine, just don't tell your little brother, he's the one I'm scared of."

[meerkat stew]

Want to qualify some things I posted earlier in the thread. "Jackass" was probably too strong a term for what I was trying to describe, and want to clarify that for people with any common sense and maturity, taking an assertive stance in interacting with people needn't be obnoxious. Knowing when to be "on" and when to ease back and enjoy others is the difference between being an attractive and assertive person, and being a fool who annoys.

 

Also, time and place are very important to the thread topic. When trying to attract people, there are times when hanging back is sure to be a mistake. Other times (much rarer though) when the environment is quiet enough that people will take notice of those who are quieter and more reserved. This sounds obvious, but sometimes we are too polarized in describing behavior. No one need be "the quiet and reserved type,"

nor the "life of the party" type exclusively, there is always a balanced position between the two.

[Els]

Oh c'mon, women are expected to be lots of things that men aren't.

 

Women are expected to not sleep around too much.

And dress nicely.

And not cuss and smoke.

And be gentle and caring.

And feminine.

 

Should I go on?

[carhill]

I don't know any women like this. Can you direct me?

[samsungxoxo]

I had two brothers. My oldest is the "alpha" male type (very outgoing) and my younger brother "beta" (extremely quiet). I dated a guy mujch older than me when I was a girl who was starting to get abusive. I told him that I was going to get my big brother to beat him up and he laughed and said "that's fine, just don't tell your little brother, he's the one I'm scared of."

Well silent waters can run deep... so you never know when the quiet, shy one snaps... LOL

[Els]

I don't know any women like this. Can you direct me?

 

Well, we're expected to, doesn't mean that we necessarily do all of that!

[carhill]

My life's work is screwing up people's expectations

[thegreatmoose]

I like shy men. The first time I met my ex-boyfriend he was so nervous he had sweat pouring down his face. I thought it was cute and an indication of how important the evening was to him. He wasn't that way on subsequent dates -that would have been a turn-off.

Most of the women I've dating seem to find nervousness on a first date a big negative. They want calm and cool which is not me and will never be me.

[samsungxoxo]

Most of the women I've dating seem to find nervousness on a first date a big negative. They want calm and cool which is not me and will never be me.

Maybe it depends on what level of nervousness. Moderate to natural nervous is ok but shy love to the point of never even having a job and seeking medications, plus depression issues nope.

[A O]

You always hear women say a Man needs tons of confidence and cant be insecure for them to be attracted and/or date them yet they themslves admit they worry about everything and have numerous insecurities,why is it accepted for women to be that way but Men must be robots?

I'll take a stab at this and suggest that it has something to do with our once clearly defined roles - nurturer (women) and provider (men). A confident man is an indicator of a good provider and vice versa the other way. But things are changing, the once clearly defined roles are no more and a lot more women are as confident if not moreso than men as a result. About the only thing that hasn't changed, as yet, is the need for men to be a lot more confident than women on the dating front. Nonetheless, confidence is an attractive trait regardless of gender.

 

 

Oh c'mon, women are expected to be lots of things that men aren't.

 

Women are expected to not sleep around too much.

And dress nicely.

And not cuss and smoke.

And be gentle and caring.

And feminine.

 

Should I go on?

Ironically, you could say that the opposite of all these are expectations of men. There's no shortage of expectation heaped on men either, both good and bad. Point is, this is a fruitless argument that doesn't do anything to address the OP's points.

 

 

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[Peter Attis]

Because men are the stronger sex and should act like it, duh.

 

Yeah, this must be a troll post.

[Nikki Sahagin]

I think generally opposites attract.

 

I know a guy with a very traumatic up-bringing; very good-looking but incredibly shy, barely speaks. And he's girlfriend is very chatty, outgoing and assertive. I think people usually search out partners who possess the qualities they do not.

[sumdude]

I prefer a secure woman. I get frustrated trying to keep the conversation going. Amongst other things they are usually more fun in bed.

 

I tend to be reserved at first, in the past I was somewhat bashful.. at first. Interestingly at this stage in life I find quiet confidence is an asset. I let my actions do the talking many times. I don't feel the need to compete with the more boisterous guys though at times in the right circumstance I'm pretty boisterous myself. I just see no reason doing it just to stand out. Once I get into a real one one conversation there is either chemistry or not.

[thegreatmoose]

Maybe it depends on what level of nervousness. Moderate to natural nervous is ok but shy love to the point of never even having a job and seeking medications, plus depression issues nope.

It's nothing like what you mentioned. It's more morderate in my case. I'm not so nervous where I'm sweating, but am nervous enough that sometimes a few words come out wrong or I make some faux pas.

[Els]

 

Ironically, you could say that the opposite of all these are expectations of men. There's no shortage of expectation heaped on men either, both good and bad. Point is, this is a fruitless argument that doesn't do anything to address the OP's points.

 

 

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Precisely. If we're agreed on that, then the OP's argument is void. The answer to his question would be 'because there are different things expected of women and men, duh'.

[A O]

^ ^ ^ ^ ^

You are right about expectations being different for men and women. Now, would you like to drill a little deeper - what is the reason(s) for the specific differences the OP refers too? That's what we're looking for here thank you.

 

 

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