SteveMc Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 Hello everyone. I am not going to go into long drawn out details about my relationship here, I will just let you know where I am at with my ef-g/f. I have already posted what I am going to post here on a different message board, but I was hoping I could get some further opinions from you guys/girls. Basically, she decided to leave me on December 15th. After a couple weeks of me pleading and her not responding well to those pleas, I sent her a message not to contact me and that I will contact her when I am ready. After a month of NC, I met her for coffee a couple of days ago. Things were light and friendly initially, but then the convo turned to the relationship and it was clear that we both were still hurting about it. I wound up basically crying saying that I realized that "happiness is only real when you have someone to share it with." After that she said "after today there is no reason for us to ever speak again" and gave me back some of my books. The next day I sent a "moving on" email to her, and told her there were some things I needed to clear the air about. When you read my email it may seem like I am blaming her for the breakup, but my intention was to actually get her to realize that it was her choice to leave the relationship. Example: she has really low self esteem, so she says "I am breaking up with him, because he doesn't want to be with me anyway. So even though I am breaking up with him, it is he the is really choosing to end things." Make sense? Coincidentally, in her response she revealed more to me about her insecurities that she did during our entire relationship, and in a way I have never felt closer to her on an emotional level than I do after we have broken up! Since we exchanged the emails below, I have sent her an email apologizing for kind of being a dick, and I validated 90% of the feelings she was having. You will notice alot of the time she talks about me not responding to her enough, and I just have to quickly say in my defense that sometimes we would text each other 3 times in one day, on the third time if I didn't respond for 30 minutes she would get angry. So yeah, in situations like that I think she was a little unreasonable. Anyway I won't go on much further, below I have copy and pasted both emails (they are kind of long). Basically what I would like you guys to tell me is do you still think that I can get this girl to trust me one last time and to come back into my life? Does it seem like she has truly moved on and really no longer would like to be with me, even if I changed? I am clinging to any hope I can get here...Please be objective, and most of all, honest. Thanks so much. MY EMAIL TO HER: Hey, Thanks for meeting up with me yesterday, it was good to see you and catch up a little bit. When you told me yesterday that "after today you saw no reason for us ever to contact each other again," I had intense feelings, and had somewhat of a personal revelation within myself. I had noticed yesterday, and since our breakup in general that you have been harboring some resentment towards me, and in many ways you are recollecting our relationship differently than it actually took place; in a more negative light than it actually was. I now understand that you are doing this as a defense mechanism in order to both justify when you ended our relationship, and to protect yourself from the hurt you are experiencing since our breakup. I just want you to remember that regardless of how you are currently choosing to view our relationship, it was one of mutual respect, love, and concern for one another while we were together. Three weeks before you broke up with me, you sent me an email saying "that if anything came between us you would die inside," and that "you would support me in anything I do" and "it is my love for you that binds you to my heart, you are my knight in shining armor." This was followed by the breakup email stating that "we have been noticing blatant changes within one another over the last few months," a statement that flies directly in the face of the prior email that you sent to me. Saying things like "we are pursuing different careers, and have different value systems," are once again justifications you have constructed in your mind to justify breaking up. You and I both know deep down that these issues were never mentioned once during our time together. The truth is (her name), you decided to leave the relationship because I triggered fears of abandonment within you, plain and simple. I know that in my heart this breakup wasn't about you wanting to live college life single, or the fact that "we are in different places in our lives." How do I know? Because these issues were never mentioned once by either one of us during our relationship. You decided to dump me 4 days before the biggest exam of my college career, an exam which I subsequently failed and now am forced to do additional coursework in order to graduate. While this is hurtful to me, I still was willing to overlook them and work things out. In summary the reason that I am writing this letter, is because I need to clear the air for myself before I move forward with my life completely. Just remember, know matter how you choose to reconstruct our relationship in your mind now, ultimately you were the person who chose to walk away. This was not what I wanted in anyway. I was willing to do whatever it took to prove to you that I love you more than anything in this world, but at the end of the day your fears of abandonment and feelings of unworthiness on a deep level caused you to "discard me, before I could get a chance to discard you." Once again, I need to remind you this fear was only something in your head, it was not based in tangible reality. In reality, I never would have abandoned or discarded you for as long as I lived. So there it is, I have said my peace. I can look myself in the mirror knowing the truth, knowing that I did everything I could within my power to prove to you that I love you with all my heart. But I now realize, that I can try everything to prove it to you, but your fears of abandonment and feelings of insecurity will far outweigh any efforts I made, until the day when you are ultimately forced to work on them. Just remember, that regardless how you are choosing to view me now to protect yourself against the sense of loss you are feeling, that in reality I never was that way in our relationship; and deep inside you know it. Also know, that I never wanted to date "a more sophisticated woman, who could give me different things," as you put it. I always felt and told you how wonderful I think you are, and I never intentionally belittled you or said things to make you feel that you weren't good enough for me. All of the things that I have mentioned I know that deep down inside you too know, but you are in self-preservation mode and choosing right now to block out good memories of our relationship in order to make this easier for you. Now Amara, I am forced to move on. I have tried everything within my power to get you to see how much I love you, but you have chosen to discard all of that and deep down inside cannot believe that I love you as much as I do. I hope everything goes well in your life from this point forward, I really do. Everything I said above is the truth, and deep down inside you and I both know it. I wish you the best of luck on your journey. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- HER RESPONSE 4 HOURS LATER: Stephen, I have to tell you that your email was immobilizing, both emotionally and physically. I choked on air and felt this burst of anxiety that was so immense that I literally couldn’t move for a few minutes. After a year and a half, part of me is astounded that you would say that and the other part of me understands why you would express such feelings and appreciates your honesty. I’m not replying to your email to contradict or to attempt to disprove the validity of your feelings, rather, I am trying to clarify a few things. I loved you so much. As much as I hate myself, I still loved you. You’re right; I do hate myself on that deep level. I do have plaguing fears of being abandoned. I’m flawed to the extent that my soul is practically impure. I’m not going to lie and say I have come to accept that, but I know that; I’m aware. I’m aware, and have always been aware. Maybe my hopes clouded my ability to apply the awareness in my life. I said I wasn’t mad and only mentioned the negative aspects because I didn’t want to end things between us on a resentful note. You looked very nice yesterday. You looked put together and self assured. You carried yourself in a dignified fashion and spoke with authority. I was glad to see that you were happy. I, honest to god, never thought the day would come that things would end between us. I had always assumed that if things were to end, it would be you to do the breaking up. Maybe that’s abandonment fears, but nonetheless, I loved you and would have done anything for you. I understand that you may not believe that and I would be lying if I said I didn’t care. I do care that you harbor such an opinion of me. You swept me off of my feet. You were so intriguing and carried yourself with such allure. You were tall, dark eyed, handsome, mysterious, and so much more. You were everything that I had always wanted. You spoke with such sincerity and were so enthusiastic about life. I fell so hard for you. Above all of that, though, you brought out such good qualities in me. You made me strive for more than I had, and by listening to you, I realized that several of my dreams and my goals were tangible. You and I are so different. You are so light; nothing can hold you down, and when it does, it’s a heavy-weighted burden. I, on the other hand, am a weight, and the amount couldn’t keep up with your lightness. I would have done anything for you. If you added the tentative amount of those “anything’s” it wouldn’t amount to how much you meant to me. Even until the day of our break up, you were everything to me. You were my knight in shining armor. I loved you immeasurably. I remember. I think about how I was your angel and all of the good times. I recall last Valentine’s Day, when we had seen Rent together. I remember the first time you told me that you loved me. I remember everything. What sticks out the most, though, is how things had changed. When we had first started seeing each other, your phone was always on and you were available, both physically and emotionally. One day, you told me to call you and wake you up in the morning and your phone was on silent, with the alarm mode. After that day, it never went back on. Maybe I should have said something then, but I didn’t want to start petty arguments. I wasn’t the type of person who likes dramatic falling-outs. I still try to avoid that drama, but somehow, it inevitably finds me. I tried so hard to make things work. As time passed, things changed. Time passes, things change. Things always change. Put yourself in my place: I try to call you, but you don’t answer. I wait for a while, and then I text you, still no response. There was no response unless it was convenient for you. I can’t always wait until your convenience, and for a while, I could and I did. It stabbed my heart and provoked immense anxiety each time I hinted that I wanted to see you and you didn’t see through that attempt. You never wanted to make plans and you never made a sincere effort to make me a priority. I can’t go my whole life being “like a savings account.” It’s not fair that your words should be enough. I would have moved mountains for you. I tried so hard to become a priority. I tried everything so that you might develop the desire to see me more and to make me a greater priority on your own. All of my attempts led up to one thing: I was accepting behaviors from you that I wouldn’t accept from myself. I couldn’t put someone else on hold, or make someone else put his or her life on hold and not take responsibility. Each time I tried to bring something up, I felt shot down and belittled. After a while, I couldn’t talk to you because you “knew best.” Still, the feelings I had for you prevailed. I loved you and wanted to make things work. But after a while, “your terms” were limiting my terms. I needed some form of commitment, and although you spoke words, your actions didn’t match up. Say whatever you want, but telling someone she means the world to you and showing her are two different things. I can’t even find words to describe all of the hurt that I had felt. Even if I don’t like myself, I still cared for you; I still made scarifies and compromises for you. More than that, I experienced an insurmountable loyalty and love for you. We shared so many good times, so many close, intimate, passionate moments. You didn’t have time for a relationship. That’s it. You didn’t have time for a relationship, and you weren’t direct about it. I always talk about accountability. You couldn’t even admit that. There was always some reason behind things. How things appear and how they are usually contradicting one another. Intent doesn’t speak. I’m practical, but I’m not stupid. I understand that lateness will happen or that you won’t always pick up your phone. There’s a way to go about doing things, and I guess that’s what we disagreed upon. In the end, I couldn’t accept those things anymore. I loved you, but I felt so much pain. I was in this hopeless mind frame, experiencing so much anxiety that I lost perspective. If you must, resent me. Maybe I resent you. I resent myself, too, so we’re together on that. I was defensive yesterday because our relationship is over, Stephen. It had been over before one of us officially called it off. The tension had been building and we both weren’t compatible in finding ways to make it work. It tore me apart inside to end things between us. I waited my whole life for someone like you. I’m not disillusioned; I know things and people can’t be perfect. I was compromising parts of myself to keep you. I was becoming someone that I didn’t want to be anymore. People change, but people remember. I remember the chemistry between us. I remember the lightning. I remember sneaking out of my house to see you. I remember how fireworks went off in my mind every time we kissed. I remember that you were the person I waited my whole life for. Actions speak louder than words. Your actions and your words spoke different volumes. I understand that I didn’t bring things to light, but each time I did, the same thing happened. In the end, memory is subjective and based upon feelings. Here are some more of my feelings: I can’t feel ashamed of my circumstances. I can’t always be on edge and anxious to contact you because I didn’t know when you would get back to me. I can’t always be put off and then be expected to understand. I understood for a while, but I couldn’t keep going. You took me for granted. I provoked arguments. Things were said and things were done. In the end, we needed different things. I need different things. It’s not a matter of experiencing new things in college. I wasn’t happy that I waited for you, to be ready, to answer, to do something, to be there, more than you were actually available. I waited for too long. Maybe I wasn’t as expressive, but you weren’t as available. Like I said, actions speak louder than words, and intention becomes muted after a while. I didn’t want to break up with you. I wanted to love you. I just didn’t want to feel the way I was feeling anymore. So it amounts to this: my worst fears may or may not come true, I hate myself, but I tried and I loved you. Things change, but things are remembered. Good luck. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ So there it is everybody, if you have read all of that thank you very much I know it was long as hell. It looks to me like she has drawn the final line in the sand, and is officially letting me know that it is not repairable at this point. Is there anything I can do here to rectify this relationship?
LucreziaBorgia Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 Her email had the air of finality about it that suggests perhaps it is better if you just moved on.
selena_cat Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 she seems to hold resolute her feelings for ending the relationship and not budging
Ronni_W Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 Basically what I would like you guys to tell me is do you still think that I can get this girl to trust me one last time and to come back into my life? No, not at all. Not a snowball's chance in hell. Very highly unlikely. What is leading you to think it's that she does not "trust" you, so all you'd need do is "get her" to trust you again? I don't remember reading, in her email, anything about "trust" or lack of trust. Thing is. It gets exhausting to be with someone who does not listen well enough to hear what is actually being said. And pretty much impossible to stay with someone who does not even know what is the problem. One could assume that she came to sad realization that her actual concern(s) would never be addressed or get resolved...because you didn't, wouldn't or couldn't hear or acknowledge them.
WTRanger Posted February 8, 2010 Posted February 8, 2010 It looks to me that she wanted to reach out to you, but your door was always closed or you always built your wall one brick higher. It feels to me that her communication issue with you was far deeper that what you simply described with the texting. You tell her that you tried everything to prove to her that you loved her, yet she refutes those claims. It seems as if she's absolutely drawn a line and she won't let you cross it again. Learn what you can with this, and move on.
rand0m Posted February 8, 2010 Posted February 8, 2010 Sorry, but I agree with those above. From what I read, it's over. You have now gotten what you needed off your chest, and this should be great closure for you to move forward with your life. At the very least, you know that she loved, and loves you, but a relationship is not possible. Live, learn, and find love again. BTW: my ex has done the same thing regarding being focused on the negative aspects of our relationship, and not seeing all the good. It sucks because you just want to give her head a shake and take her back in time to when we shared so many wonderful experiences; to when the love, support, and companionship was there throughout any issue, argument, or low time in the relationship. I really hope that this email closed a lot off for you. Good luck and enjoy your life. There's tons of people in the world.
Joe Normal Posted February 10, 2010 Posted February 10, 2010 Hi Steve, sorry to hear about your breakup. Your email has some false assumptions, namely that there were no problems because she did not mention any. Just because something was not mentioned as an issue, does not mean that it wasn't an issue. People who do breakups often keep certain doubts inside while they work out whether or not it's big enough to end things over, or maybe they just hope they will be resolved and feel it's better not to undermine the trust they have from their partner by raising those issues. It's *very* common for people initiating a breakup to have felt for months that something was wrong, but never to have mentioned it. So, just because she didn't mention wanting to be single in college, or different value systems, or wanting different things, in no ways implies that she never considered these to be an issue. Often with breakups you get the truth *after* the breakup more than before it. So if someone says something to you afterwards, you should take it seriously. It may be a smokescreen, but equally it may be the brutal truth. You also don't know if your analysis is right. Maybe fear of abandonment is why she dumped you, but you can't know that. Most people might cause drama in a relationship due to insecurity, but is is rare for *insecurity alone* to lead someone to dump their partner. It's far more likely it's insecurity plus something else - like having met someone else; or wanting to be free to meet others in college; or feeling you have grown a long way apart etc. I also feel you're being patronizing by lecturing her on why she is leaving you, as if her own reasons don't matter, only the ones you think she has. Even if you're right, it will just come across as annoying to talk down to her like you are the know it all and her reasons are invalid on your say-so. (N.B. I made these comments before reading her emailed reply) ---- Her email is pretty clear. She feels you took her for granted - that's a fatal mistake for any woman who is in love with you, it's the surefire way to get her feelings to change. A more secure woman would have told you and given you an ultimatum. You were with an insecure woman so she kept quiet and waited until it was too late. She also says you didn't listen to her complaints, that you were dismissive and "always knew best". Since I also got that distinct impression from your first email, it is probably how you come across to people. Another probably valid reason she gave was you didn't make enough time for her. Basically this breakup seems due mostly to your own actions, it appears like she has perfectly valid reasons to dump you, I'm afraid to say. You did something she found painful, and proof that your feelings were no longer as strong as she wanted. It is wrong to tell her that it's her fault (insecurity), I can see several perfectly legitimate reasons that have nothing to do with her insecurities or any other flawed reasons on her part. The fact that you yourself can't see any valid reason she may have dumped you is also (ironically) further confirmation of this. If you were at least admitting you had been too rigid, too dismissive of her concerns, and unavailable/busy, then you would have a chance because you'd know your flaws (as she admits hers). But even now on this forum you seem oblivious to what you did, and that doesn't bode well. Personally I would say this relationship is doomed, because she had several valid reasons to break up with you, and even now you are not aware of their potential validity. In case you harbour any doubts, here she makes it clear: "I was defensive yesterday because our relationship is over, Stephen. It had been over before one of us officially called it off." That's pretty terminal. It classic dumper speak, it means she was negative about things for a LONG time and just kept it inside in the hope the problems would end. Once they didn't, eventually she gave up and then finally let you know by dumping you. Dumpers rarely change their minds if it happens this way. Sorry to be blunt & negative, but you did ask for objective assessment, and that's what I've tried to give.
Joe Normal Posted February 10, 2010 Posted February 10, 2010 (edited) P.S. the *only* shred of hope you have to get her back is to move on, and it's a very long shot even then. There's a thread on this site about how to win back someone - basically it can be summarized as "move on, leave her behind, and act as though you are happy to do so". Any attempts you make to win her back will not only fail, they will backfire and make her more determined to stay away for good. The way to keep an ex interested is to disappear, no contact or communication at all, don't reply to their attempts in the first few months, and even after that only reply sparingly. Eventually if they still harbour feelings and want to get back together, they will let you know. Personally I think you are not really ready for a serious relationship. Maybe you could benefit from some self-evaluation and understand your own "flaws" that led to this breakup, and then take some steps to avoid repeating the same mistakes again in future. Edited February 10, 2010 by Joe Normal
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