You'reasian Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 Not always true. Maybe the woman never found the right guy. Maybe all she found were guys who hated career women (and she is one), maybe all she met were mentally deranged guys. In many cases it's their fault, but not always. Career should be a topic of conversation. Something like.."I'm very involved in my career and want to do the best I can, sometimes that's going to mean that I will not be available..." etc. what are your career goals? Discuss. Discuss. Discuss. Mentally deranged? What diagnosis?
greatgirlfriend Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 Except for a few chauvinist pigs I don't know any man that hates career women. For some men it might be a red flag which is a stereotype that can be blamed on feminists but a great personality and over desirability can easily soothe a man's fears about a woman with a successful career. On the other hand if she is a ballbuster who can't leave it behind at the office then most men want no part of her so in other words she is driving men away. I actually had a few male friends who insisted they'd never marry a woman with any job, not just those women you mention (I don't like those ball busters either). They were very religious guys who believed any working woman wasn't doing what she was meant to do. There are other guys who don't mind if a woman works, but expect her job to come second. This is fine if her job is just a job, but what if she makes more? Many other men don't care what she makes, but still expect her to do all the cooking and cleaning. There are many guys still like that out in the dating world.
paddington bear Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 PB, What's wrong with the dating scene or men in your opinion? I think the problem with the dating scene is that we are all confused right now, no one knows their place, there are no boundaries and there are no rules, so we all float around in chaos, each sex wanting to hook with with the other one and many of us failing miserably at it and having no idea how to actually do it, or having no idea how to respond when we are asked out or what we're looking for. If you have to work within a set frame of options, while limiting, it also is kind of a relief. When you've too many options you get overwhelmed. The old-fashioned 'If I want to sleep with her I have to marry her' rule for men meant that you'd want to choose wisely the right woman for you, you're forced to commit in order to make an honest woman of her. Likewise women knew that they would be getting some kind of commitment from a man in exchange for sex. I'm not saying we should go back to that, but now you've got women worried about sleeping with people too soon, guys liking the girl but then thinking she's a slut because she slept with the on the first date. You've got guys knowing that they can sow their wild oats for as long as they want without repercussions in terms of finding a woman later on. You've got women trying to get a career going/get educated and trying to figure out how to integrate kids and marriage into that equation without destroying their chances of being financially independent and so on and on. Modern life is generally fast-paced and packed full with other stuff to do and to focus on, which leaves us tired and time-poor. The media and freely available porn lead to unrealistic expectations of what men and women should look like and behave like. We are looks-obsessed to the exclusion of working on our personalities and other qualities and place far too much emphasis on looks and body types. I think too many young people are cocooned within the family until for far longer than they would have been in the past thus keeping us children and childish for way too long and we wise up and mature much later in our lives. I read somewhere that men who had continual contact with large groups of the opposite sex were more likely to have affairs - university professors was one example. But now we have social networking sites, dating sites and so on and well, why stick with one person when there's always going to be a vast choice of other potentials out there who could possibly be better? 1
greatgirlfriend Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 Career should be a topic of conversation. Something like.."I'm very involved in my career and want to do the best I can, sometimes that's going to mean that I will not be available..." etc. what are your career goals? Discuss. Discuss. Discuss. Mentally deranged? What diagnosis? But that scares guys as well especially if they aren't career orientated. The guy I currently like works in a factory and likely will make less than me when I find a new job. He said he doesn't care, but other guys feel intimidated. As for mentally deranged, many older guys have illnesses like schizophrenia or bipolar. That's why they are still out there. I could probably deal with the bipolar, but schizophrenia? No way, I had a friend with that and he wasn't fun to be with during his attacks.
You'reasian Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 I actually had a few male friends who insisted they'd never marry a woman with any job, not just those women you mention (I don't like those ball busters either). They were very religious guys who believed any working woman wasn't doing what she was meant to do. There are other guys who don't mind if a woman works, but expect her job to come second. This is fine if her job is just a job, but what if she makes more? Many other men don't care what she makes, but still expect her to do all the cooking and cleaning. There are many guys still like that out in the dating world. I cook and clean for myself, thank you. Apparently you're going for the wrong guy for you in terms of career involvement. Maybe you aren't managing your time with the guys who are otherwise intersted - not setting time aside for them or communicating your career demands. What else?
greatgirlfriend Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 I cook and clean for myself, thank you. Apparently you're going for the wrong guy for you in terms of career involvement. Maybe you aren't managing your time with these guys - not setting time aside for them or communicating your career demands. What else? I've stopped looking for a professional guy and have concentrated more on blue collar. The guy I currently likes isn't career obsessed and I'm not anymore. I manage my time for guys but many don't do the same for me.
Woggle Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 I actually had a few male friends who insisted they'd never marry a woman with any job, not just those women you mention (I don't like those ball busters either). They were very religious guys who believed any working woman wasn't doing what she was meant to do. There are other guys who don't mind if a woman works, but expect her job to come second. This is fine if her job is just a job, but what if she makes more? Many other men don't care what she makes, but still expect her to do all the cooking and cleaning. There are many guys still like that out in the dating world. I stay away from religious zealots of both genders because they don't live in reality. Don't most women want to come first in a man's life? They always say that and being a workaholic is a quick way for a man to end up in divorce court so this goes both ways. The whole Gloria Steniem women need a fish like a man needs a bicyle mentality really helped to give women with successful careers a bad name. Men like to feel needed or at least wanted just like women like to feel appreciated and protected but certain have been using the career angle to say to men or unwanted and not needed we are. We constantly get it rammed down our throats how we are useless now that women earn their own money and have independence and can go to a sperm bank and so on so we avoid women with successful career because we feel they have no need for us in their lives and we gravitate towards women we feel do need us.
You'reasian Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 But that scares guys as well especially if they aren't career orientated. The guy I currently like works in a factory and likely will make less than me when I find a new job. He said he doesn't care, but other guys feel intimidated. . He's probably industrious. You know what, guys who know how to work with their hands are becoming a dieing breed with manufacturing moving overseas. Show some appreciation - I bet it would earn some respect. As for mentally deranged, many older guys have illnesses like schizophrenia or bipolar. That's why they are still out there. I could probably deal with the bipolar, but schizophrenia? No way, I had a friend with that and he wasn't fun to be with during his attacks. And what of guys who aren't bipolar or schizophrenic?
You'reasian Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 I've stopped looking for a professional guy and have concentrated more on blue collar. The guy I currently likes isn't career obsessed and I'm not anymore. I manage my time for guys but many don't do the same for me. This is a conversation for the two of you. You're in a relationship with him; tell him that the two of you need to manage your time so you can be together.
greatgirlfriend Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 I stay away from religious zealots of both genders because they don't live in reality. Don't most women want to come first in a man's life? They always say that and being a workaholic is a quick way for a man to end up in divorce court so this goes both ways. The whole Gloria Steniem women need a fish like a man needs a bicyle mentality really helped to give women with successful careers a bad name. Men like to feel needed or at least wanted just like women like to feel appreciated and protected but certain have been using the career angle to say to men or unwanted and not needed we are. We constantly get it rammed down our throats how we are useless now that women earn their own money and have independence and can go to a sperm bank and so on so we avoid women with successful career because we feel they have no need for us in their lives and we gravitate towards women we feel do need us. I think that we've become such a career focused society (both male and female) that has hurt everyone. Not saying I want to go back to a women as housewives standard, but just want to go back to the idea that a job was 40 hours. We have people working more than 40 (many times 80+) for what? So from an early age everyone is pushed into careers and told to work hard we can do anything. The reality is this isn't always true. The recession has opened up eyes and shown that family is more important. That yes, women need men and men need women. Career can come and go but family will not.
Woggle Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 Thanks to the economic policies that have existed since the Reagan era people can no longer work 40 hours and still make it. I hope it changes soon but I doubt it.
greatgirlfriend Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 He's probably industrious. You know what' date=' guys who know how to work with their hands are becoming a dieing breed with manufacturing moving overseas. Show some appreciation - I bet it would earn some respect.[/quote'] He's a blue collar union guy who has a manual job and I am fine with that. I've told him I have no problem with this. And what of guys who aren't bipolar or schizophrenic? As for guys with mental illness, there's many with other issues. Anger for one.
greatgirlfriend Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 This is a conversation for the two of you. You're in a relationship with him; tell him that the two of you need to manage your time so you can be together. Next time I talk to him that's one of the things I'm going to talk to him about. It's something we need to fix now before the relationship goes further along.
You'reasian Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 Thanks to the economic policies that have existed since the Reagan era people can no longer work 40 hours and still make it. I hope it changes soon but I doubt it. Read "The Millionaire Next Door" Its not a get rich quick, motivational book. Its a study of folks whose net worth is between 1-10MM. Most have created their networth from having two earning partners, one partner taking time off to raise kids and who lived within their means.... not high-flying real estate gurus; just normal folks who worked both professional and technical jobs, loved their spouses enough to stay with them and managed their money.
Twenty-ten Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 I have to agree with some of the thins Woggle said in his first post. Paddington I am totally with you on your post. Check this: Lori Gottlieb is single at 40 and the closest she ever came to marrying a guy was in a 2 month relationship, :lmao::lmao: she calls it a relationship, we all know that 2months of seeing someone is not a relationship it is an insane attempt at letting your hormones make decisions for your. I couldn't take advice from someone like this seriously, sorry. The problem with self-help trash is that anyone who is neither qualified nor equip to write can do so. This is a classic case of do as I say but not as I do because I made big mistakes I regret and I want you to follow in the footsteps of what I think is right but I won't even buy into. It's a joke. http://www.jewishjournal.com/keepingthefaith/item/marry_him_settle_good_enough_i_dont_think_so_lori_gottlieb_20100205/ I do believe that it does get harder to meet exactly what we want as we get older, no doubt about that, but only because we become much more discerning in our selection process. Looking back however, in my 20's I had the exact same amount of opportunities with men as I have now that I am getting closer to 40 than to 30. In fact in my 20's it is not like I had a parade of men asking me out and yet I was quite attractive in my 20's. I had two opportunities to marry me in my 20's they were both long term relationships (more than 2yrs) and I was the one who didn't want it. I focused on career and other things that were of interest to me, looking back I have 0 regrets of not marrying I would not been happy marrying in my 20's. I was simply NOT ready to be a wife and a mom for me that is exactly what it boils down to. Then in my early 30's I met the man I loved the most but things didn't work out, we gave it a good go, but just didn't work out. I would have married him but even now looking back I would not have been happy married to him, he is still single and pretty much stuck in the same patterns that prevented us from marrying then: overworking, playing with the "big boys" and being an eternal bachelor. When he was with me he was very committed and a good partner he just didn't want the same things I did long term at that point so I had to leave him. So in conclusion I have no regrets of not marrying the men in my 20's I get asked out probably more now that I am closer to 40 than my 20's but I am more selective and unlike desperate Lori, no, I won't settle for whatever comes my way because some old maid who desperately wants a husband tells me to. Not a chance.
You'reasian Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 As for guys with mental illness, there's many with other issues. Anger for one. Anger management is a good thing - coping skills, dealing with stress - hobbies help. Lifting weights, reading, listening to music, communicating all help. What do you do to help your guy?
greatgirlfriend Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 Anger management is a good thing - coping skills' date=' dealing with stress - hobbies help. Lifting weights, reading, listening to music, communicating all help. What do you do to help your guy?[/quote'] He doesn't have anger issues, just mama issues (she pressures him to marry and since we haven't been dating long I never brought it up). I could never date a guy who fights people (yes knew a few like this).
greatgirlfriend Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 I have to agree with some of the thins Woggle said in his first post. Paddington I am totally with you on your post. Check this: Lori Gottlieb is single at 40 and the closest she ever came to marrying a guy was in a 2 month relationship, :lmao::lmao: she calls it a relationship, we all know that 2months of seeing someone is not a relationship it is an insane attempt at letting your hormones make decisions for your. I couldn't take advice from someone like this seriously, sorry. The problem with self-help trash is that anyone who is neither qualified nor equip to write can do so. This is a classic case of do as I say but not as I do because I made big mistakes I regret and I want you to follow in the footsteps of what I think is right but I won't even buy into. It's a joke. That puts a different angle on it. She's probably an ugly woman (either looks or personality) who's angry no one wanted her. I'm not taking advice from someone who's longest relationship was 2 months. At that stage it should still be in the dating casual, possibly falling for each other but taking it slow and not sleeping together (at least that's how I feel).
Woggle Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 Instead of taking advice from women who can't make it work themselves maybe women should observe women who have great marriages and relationships and see what they did to acheive it. This goes for men as well.
Twenty-ten Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 That puts a different angle on it. She's probably an ugly woman (either looks or personality) who's angry no one wanted her. I'm not taking advice from someone who's longest relationship was 2 months. At that stage it should still be in the dating casual, possibly falling for each other but taking it slow and not sleeping together (at least that's how I feel). Check out her picture on the link I provided, she looks old, not like a 40yr old woman. My mom looks younger than her and my mom is in her 60's.
You'reasian Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 (edited) He doesn't have anger issues, just mama issues (she pressures him to marry and since we haven't been dating long I never brought it up). I could never date a guy who fights people (yes knew a few like this). Your initial argument is that older men are bipolar and schizophrenic. Seems more of a generalization of men, not something you are dealing with. Next you mention that guys have anger issues, to which we discussed anger management techniques (exercise, communication, hobbies etc) but now that we're talking about your guy - he's got mama issues. The three of you should talk about this. Isn't it great to meet and converse with the parents of your SO? I for one enjoy this - but this is something that you should hope to discuss with them. Some moms are more laid back about letting their sons chose when and whom they should marry - that's too bad. Then you say you could never date a guy who fights people. Why? Edited February 7, 2010 by You'reasian
Woggle Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 She does give off a vibe of being a man's nightmare and now that she can no longer have men falling over themselves she will settle for anything she can get.
Twenty-ten Posted February 7, 2010 Posted February 7, 2010 (edited) Plus she is a single mom, she has a kid she had with an anonymous sperm donor (which I am totally for if a woman wants a child and she opts to do so) but the fact is that she is desperate to get love and she is pulling all these stunts out of desperation not necessity to be a mother or to write a book to help women. http://jezebel.com/354535/settle-for-mr-just-ok--while-your-marital-value-is-still-at-its-peak I looked at other pics of her online she has crazy eyes too. My thoughts are: I choose role models and words to live by, from sources that I can respect and admire. Everything else is fluff. Edit: and a recovering anorexic too! LOL Ok she is certifiable now... Edited February 7, 2010 by Twenty-ten
Chicago_Guy Posted February 8, 2010 Posted February 8, 2010 ... Lori Gottlieb is single at 40 and the closest she ever came to marrying a guy was in a 2 month relationship, :lmao::lmao: she calls it a relationship, we all know that 2months of seeing someone is not a relationship it is an insane attempt at letting your hormones make decisions for your. I couldn't take advice from someone like this seriously, sorry. ... Is that true that the author of that book has never had a relationship that lasted longer than two months? If that's true then she simply isn't marriage material because she is far too fickle to be in a relationship. Even if she had married someone when she was in her 20s, I bet she would have gotten bored and divorced the guy within a couple years. She must have been really self-absorbed until she hit her late 30s and realized that nobody wanted her anymore.
Woggle Posted February 8, 2010 Posted February 8, 2010 Is that true that the author of that book has never had a relationship that lasted longer than two months? If that's true then she simply isn't marriage material because she is far too fickle to be in a relationship. Even if she had married someone when she was in her 20s, I bet she would have gotten bored and divorced the guy within a couple years. She must have been really self-absorbed until she hit her late 30s and realized that nobody wanted her anymore. Also she had a fatherless kid and then realize that it isn't the glorious and independent life she imagined and now she wants some guy to settle for her.
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