question for guys: porn and relationships

[A O]

And truth is, something none of you can admit to or dance around is that men today spend more time, more then ever, looking at porn. That says something right there. An issue that some of you want to admit to.

There's nothing to dance around and the issue is very insignificant, if an issue at all, to the overwhelming majority of people. We still form relationships despite all this, and very, very, very few relationships break-up because of porn use.

 

Name one thing in porn that is really for the betterment and health of people in society? Do not name the action of what *you* do personally while watching porn. Name one thing in porn that is truly healthy.

A lot of women have learnt how to give decent blow jobs through watching porn.

 

I rather a man live in reality then in fantasy. Too many men today life in fantasy.

One could argue that the entire cosmetics and fashion industries sell nothing but fantasy. But of course, in this case women are often portrayed as victims while men, well....

 

And I think it's something too many men understand and don't like but are too weak to overcome it or admit to it so they try to make themselves feel better when they find out Joe down the street does it too

Its amazing how upset some women get over the antics of "weak" men. Amazing! Thank goodness its only 'some' women.

 

If men really cared more about women's personalities then their looks women would spend more time working on their wonderful personalites.

An often overlooked dynamic- many men are satisfied by their own personality alone. They don't understand it, they don't even realize it but they have little need for another personality to make them happy. Same can't be said for 'some' women.

 

Men do not care about things like having a good heart and being sweet as much as they care about twins in porn. At least most men today that is.

People in general put looks or personality above how they're treated. Looks gets you noticed, personality gets you in the door but behavior - how you're treated and how you treat people - behavior will determine the quality of any given relationship.

 

 

.

[AAlike]

Since no women have answered, will reply to my own question:

 

Which is more troublesome, a man looking at porn to masturbate, or a man fantasizing about a real experience with his immediate ex while masturbating?

 

Answer: Most people would find the latter more disturbing, mooting the entire porn question raised in this thread, other than as pertains to addictive behavior.

 

Men and women both fantasize about their past experiences, it would be unreasonable for either party to try to restrict natural internal fantasizing in their partner. Because this is so, becoming upset over porn, a -less- personal fantasy than a real memory which, in fact, acts as a substitute for a real memory, is irrational.

 

The rational response would be to welcome porn use in a partner within limits, because if they are using porn as an impersonal fantasy tool, they are likely not using a real, more personal experience with an ex as a fantasy tool.

 

/thread

 

it is hilarious and very telling that none of the crusaders have even attempted to address this question, nor my question regarding phallic sex toys.

 

I'm assuming that their response would be that neither is permissable.

 

Great post by the way.

[rod_in_gtown]

BS Rod. There are many articles I've read on this topic and I've never heard one expert ever say a billion dollar, a multi-billion dollar industry, was small. Lets also remember the amount of free porn out there that doesn't need to be paid for that is viewed daily. Lets be realistic here. Porn is not a multi-billion dollar industry because men *only* view once-in-awhile.

 

He said she said blah blah blah. USE MATH! 3 billion men, even if we're talking 3 times a year that's 9 billion dollars.

 

I think alot of men reallly attempt to down play their use of porn out of their own insecurities. I think men fear that they are infact all too dependent on porn today but don't have the true strength to overcome it. I think men understand themselves enough to know that porn is a weakness. And not a pretty one. Why do so many men want to defend a media that doesn't even showcase men or women well? Even more so, why do so many men want to defend a media that brings out the ugly side of men? Not the good side that women would hold more respect for? Would men not find more satisfaction in doing the things that real woman would respect them for instead of pandering to their desires that make them more often weak and supplicating then strong and honorable? How many men here respect a woman more when she exercises self control within her self to either not eat that cookie, or not lay all her emotional feelings at his feet or any number of qualities men dislike in women and LIKE when a woman exercises self control?

 

These are signicant questions to ask yourself. I do not expect most men here to be so honest as to directly address any of them. I've asked them before and they are usually ignored. And I know they are ignored because I know people see the truth in the questions.

 

You assume everyone has your same core moral compass. get over yourself.

 

No, you were not trying to put things in perspective.

 

Yes I was. You put your own issues on it. And saw it only how it would serve your "anti-porn crusade"

 

Perhaps some men here would rather that women held low expectations of men in general and their ability to control their seuxality, so that men didn't ever really *have* to control their seuxality without any reprocussions and they could get the benefits of women thinking they are wonderful without men acutally having to put in the work to anything worth being wonderful for. So they would like to even turn a woman's opinion of her father into one that is pretty unflattering and equal to that of any old joe off the street that views porn.

 

What do you and the other guys here think you are going to get by taking MissJones personal relationship with her father and stepping inbetween what she has told you she knows about her father. How would you feel if a woman came on here and said some unflattering things about your mother? Then tried to justify it by crappy female behavior that "all women do"? I am really flabberghasted at what you think you are going to accomplish by trying to pit a woman agaisnt her own father and try to make her view him in a way that no daughter should view her father if she and he wants to maintain the respect for him. Is the justifcation of porn worth that much that you rather destroy the respect a woman should have for her father? That you would rather see her view her own father like every other joe on the street that view porn?

 

I think there is something in many men that makes them feel better in their unity for porn. I think that what many of you were trying to do is foster these comments about her father. You either what to lower her opinion of her own father or you want her to respect her father just as much even as a group of men are telling her that her own father lusted over other women other then her own mother. You aren't going to accomplish anything positive that way.

 

Again, you assume everyone is created in your image. God complex?

 

 

Now you are so worried about her disappointment in furture relationships? Maybe if most men were more concerned about this to begin with this wouldn't be such a point of contention.

 

Maybe you don't think you can personally measure up to an "ideal". Maybe most men don't believe they can. Maybe most men don't believe they can reach beyond their physical desires. But I think they can. I think men totally have the ability to be so much greater, stronger more respected then men today allow themselves to be. Truth is though, men aren't going to find that in porn. And they aren't going to be better men, lovers, fathers, husbands and partners because they relieve themselves with porn.

 

Most people are not like you. Not everyone has this phobia on their back like you do.

 

 

Lets not be so extreme to say that anything that makes us happy is okay. That pretty much is saying that child molesting is okay because the molestor is pursuing their happiness. Or that drug addiction is okay because they are pursing their happiness. Many people are abel to function in normal society and have heavy addictions. It does not mean that these addictions are infact not issues.

 

Oh yeah, I am completely well aware that most guys do not care how they hurt the woman in their lives with their porn use. Or do not feel the need to exercise a level of self control that is completely gone to the wayside in the modern world. That's why I get so disheartend and frustrated on this topic. I am totally well aware that most men do not care much about anything as long as they can continue to view porn.

 

Now there are a view men here, Green, Skydiveaddict, Scott..that do not seem to have the need to relay on porn to be happy. It's wonderful and refresing to see their honest and different male perspectives. It gives me a little hope.

 

Oh yawn... apples and oranges, porn is not drugs, is not sexual assault, is not murder. That's just a feeble attempt at trying to legitimize your stance. Nice try though, you even make it sound like you're not crazy.

 

 

I will restate.

There is such an ironic preening and pushing to make porn seem harmless when in this day and age, with the amount that is out there and the kind that is out there, it just isn't. More men and boys are spending more time with porn. That's a fact. More men and boys are spending time with porn that's become more hardcore. That's a fact.

 

 

 

But it's not just me. Men don't even respect the women in porn and they don't respect themselves more for using porn. Men are not embarressed by porn because their mothers taught them to be. Men are embarressed because they know it's a weakness. Most men wouldn't touch a woman from porn with a 10 foot pole. But they still choose to defend it to the woman in their lives. Most men wouldn't want a woman they cared for in porn because most men see the objecfication, the debasement and know how humilating most porn is towards women. But again, not something enough men carry about when it comes to what makes a man orgasm. That is ultimately what men care most about in this world.

 

Well, then, now that you re-posted your previous post, I have completely seen the light and changed my point of view. Porn is evil, and our general JS is our lord and savior. Thanks for making me see the light.

 

We aren't talking about simple sexual creativity. How many times have men used the argument that they got their ides from porn? There are things men have see in porn and are now asking as if it's normal. And it's not. Because they admit themselves that they never would have thought of these things if it wasn't for a medium that I think ALL of us can admit is degradign to women.

 

Again with the generalizations. I didn't know what ALL of us were thinking and agreed upon. Thanks but no thanks.

 

 

And men eat it up. And it is at the expense of women, not men, that those stereotypes happen. But again, that is not something men care about. And yet, men expect women to be super sexy, open sex kitten and feel so confident when the messages men give daily is that what she is isn't anything compared to what he can stupidly stare at on a computer.

 

 

Free will does not negate being objectified. Even when someone agrees to do something, they could very well be objectifying themselves and a general poplulation. Are you really goign to argue that women are not objectfied in porn? How am I objectfying anyone by coming to the logical conclusion that someone in a movie is being used? I am not judging her as a person. Heck, I bet my thoughts about her are 10x more kind then the men watching her.

 

Yeah, men are evil and women are poor helpless victims.

 

So you don't have facts to back up your comments. That's fine. This isn't about me not being educating on the subject. This about you not wanting to produce the facts to back up your comments.

 

What are you not getting about an opinion? it's like an editorial, I'm not here to quote a bunch of publications. This is not an essay or a research paper. IT'S MY OPINION. Do you even read what other people type or you just wait for your turn to regurgitate your tired propaganda? Methinks the latter.

 

 

I have no doubt that it doesn't affect you. However, for all the women that come on her frustrated, alone and tired and scared, it affects them. And in turn, it affects how they view the men in their lives and their relationships with them. Too many men are willing to let porn damange their real life relationships.

 

For a while I spent alot of time online trying to understand why men seemed to have this huge loyatly for porn. I thought if I read enough articles or talked enough about the subject I coudl come to some peace on this loyatly that men have for porn that they do not seem to have in equal amouns for real women. But I think it's just left me more confused and frustrated. I do undrestand that most men don't care if a woman is hurt by porn and most men don't want to let other opinions affect their never ending desire to feed off of porn. I even spent time looking at porn trying to understand the things men liked. And it left me more confused, sad, and disheartened by how little men really like about real women and how much men wanted to make women into something they aren't. It doesnt' seem like men really want to celebrate true female sexuality so much as they want their wome nto conform to a protrayl of sexuality in a movie.

 

Good for you. You should lobby congress to try to stop this crime of freedom of speech and press. We as a country are already losing our other freedoms so what's one more? Thanks to prudes like you. Go ahead, move to DC and make a difference.

 

 

Hmmm, no one had anything to say on my brilliant post. I done good.

 

I think if it was even 5 years ago...

 

 

I was going to reply to this as well but it's just more regurgitation of the same. So, I'll just say, yawn... again...

[AAlike]

 

Actually, I would rather he masturbate to a real life experiences with a real woman that he most likely didn't abuse and enjoyed the experience as much as he did then 18 year olds in porn being called four letter words while the men on screen pretend they are the best thing since sliced bread.

 

 

yeah right! this I would have to see!

[Jersey Shortie]

There's nothing to dance around and the issue is very insignificant, if an issue at all, to the overwhelming majority of people. We still form relationships despite all this, and very, very, very few relationships break-up because of porn use.

 

AO, you don't find the issue significant and that's fine. And even that is farfetched to believe because you often choose to respond to porn threads. When someone doesn't find something significant, they don't often respond to the threads in it.

 

Also not true that few relationships break up over porn. Pyschologists have seen a dirth in relationships that have broken up or have issues because of porn in the past few years that was never there before.

 

All these threads, not just here, but all over the interet about issues with porn and relationships are there FOR A REASON.

 

 

A lot of women have learnt how to give decent blow jobs through watching porn.

 

 

Women only give decent blow jobs because of porn? Oh pish posh. Utter BS.

 

That doesn't even come close to answering the intial question. Which was: Name one thing in porn that is really for the betterment and health of people in society?

 

Although you would be correct that porn has set a model about expectation sex that have come out of male fantasy and not true female sexuality or maybe even male sexuality since men are prescribing to a fantasy sold to them by people making money off of it.

 

Three, women only give decent blow jobs because of porn? Oh pish posh.

 

One could argue that the entire cosmetics and fashion industries sell nothing but fantasy. But of course, in this case women are often portrayed as victims while men, well....

 

Not sure what you were going to say about men but yes, cosmetics and fashion industry sell a fantasy. And yes, women buy into it. But if they didn't use things like cosmetics and fashion to up their appeal, men wouldn't look at them. Also, the fashion and comestic industry isn't about callign women four letter words and putting them into submissive and humilating positions for the personal satisfaction of men. While I do think there are majore issues with the cosmetics and fashion industry that affect women, I think there is something in porn, due to it's sexual nature, that is all the more vunerable for women and even more explotive. However, I do not rule out the false expectations the fashion industry protrays and women would do better to go agaisnt these ideals. Although, it's hard when the exact ideals you try to fight ar the exact ones your man/ or men in general, buy into.

 

Its amazing how upset some women get over the antics of "weak" men. Amazing! Thank goodness its only 'some' women.

 

yeah, I have no doubt that I am not a favorite here at LS with the men. Or that men rather be with women that are all about the porn and watching it with him maybe even while giving him bjs. However, those comments are born out of their own weakness as well.

 

An often overlooked dynamic- many men are satisfied by their own personality alone. They don't understand it, they don't even realize it but they have little need for another personality to make them happy. Same can't be said for 'some' women.

 

This makes no sense to me.

 

 

People in general put looks or personality above how they're treated. Looks gets you noticed, personality gets you in the door but behavior - how you're treated and how you treat people - behavior will determine the quality of any given relationship.

 

Again, I will say it. Most men don't seem to care about things like a good heart and sweet woman. They care about the hot babe with the perfect body. EVEN when they have a wonderful woman by their side they STILL seek out this hot babe even if just visualyl. that says ALOT by their behavior.

[Jersey Shortie]

it is hilarious and very telling that none of the crusaders have even attempted to address this question, nor my question regarding phallic sex toys.

 

I addressed his comments. I've addressed more comments then men have addressed or answered on mine.

 

What is your question regarding phallic sex toys? Truth be told, I would be AOKAY with a man using a fake vagina over looking at porn. I think a sex toy is not even on the same plane as porn. With its visual depictions on sex, men and women and relating.

[Jersey Shortie]

Yeah, men are evil and women are poor helpless victims.

 

Good for you. You should lobby congress to try to stop this crime of freedom of speech and press. We as a country are already losing our other freedoms so what's one more? Thanks to prudes like you. Go ahead, move to DC and make a difference.

 

I've been told I should have been a diplomat actually in real life.

 

A. I never said men were evil. That's your own insecurity.

 

B. I never said porn should be banned. It's prudes like you that think that any mention or disagreement with something automatically means the other group wants it banned.

[A O]

AO, you don't find the issue significant and that's fine. And even that is farfetched to believe because you often choose to respond to porn threads. When someone doesn't find something significant, they don't often respond to the threads in it.

I respond to you and your weapon of choice - porn - to beat up on men.

 

Also not true that few relationships break up over porn. Pyschologists have seen a dirth in relationships that have broken up or have issues because of porn in the past few years that was never there before.

It is true. Despite the apparent increase in porn use, we are not seeing an increase in relationship break-ups relative to increase in porn use or even simply because of porn use.

 

Relationship break-ups due to porn - insignificant in number.

 

All these threads, not just here, but all over the interet about issues with porn and relationships are there FOR A REASON.

Porn threads in the hands of others - understandable. Porn threads by you - an ideology.

 

Women only give decent blow jobs because of porn? Oh pish posh. Utter BS.

Silly of you to completely dismiss such a well known fact.

 

Not sure what you were going to say about men but yes, cosmetics and fashion industry sell a fantasy.

Point is - men are not the only one's living in a fantasy world. But whereas men are derided for their fantasies, women are seen as victims for having/wanting theirs.

 

But if they didn't use things like cosmetics and fashion to up their appeal, men wouldn't look at them.

Incorrect. How many women out there have partners who stop looking at them, stop thinking they're attractive when all the battle paint comes off? Few women would ever be without it if this were true.

 

Also, the fashion and comestic industry isn't about callign women four letter words and putting them into submissive and humilating positions for the personal satisfaction of men.

Get the feeling that sex would be a submissive and humiliating act in your eyes. The simple missionary position, designed to do little more than humiliate and debase women with absolutely no benefit whatsoever to them.

 

This makes no sense to me.

Men aren't reliant on personality as much as some women are because they have an identity, they are happy with themselves. They don't need someone else to give them identity, to make them happy.

 

Again, I will say it. Most men don't seem to care about things like a good heart and sweet woman.

You're describing the dumb men. They're the same as the dumb women who can't look past personality. Thankfully, there's more than enough intelligent people out there who both care and seek people who behave well.

 

.

Edited February 8, 2010 by A O

[soserious1]

Why does it always come down to looks with women? I swear if they spent half the time working on their personalities as they did their looks they would be much more tolerable.

 

What I meant is that when a marriage or a relationship is constant drama and arguments and the tiniest things become a war it is very comforting for a man to retreat into a fantasy world of porn. He is then in a place where he is not nagged, put down or told all his faults on a daily basis by a resentful wife. He can simply close his eyes and imagine he has the kind of relationship he finds almost impossible to find with modern women.

 

Why does it come down to looks? Quite frankly because he told me it did.. I was "too old" to arouse him physically, he felt I should continue to love and care for him, pay his bills and act happy and grateful to remain sleeping on the sofa, celibate for the rest of my life.

 

I didn't "nag" anybody and as far as being told one's faults on a daily basis I've been there done that and have the scars to prove it.

[Jersey Shortie]

I respond to you and your weapon of choice - porn - to beat up on men.

 

I love the attempt at turn about that a few of you guys try to ply off. Woe is me, I'm a man and some woman actually has the nerve to question some indeniable facts about the industry and male response to it. *She* is just beating up on men. Never mind all the men with loving wives and gfs that work hard to be a good partner, that bare his children and clean his home so that he can sit in his office looking at Hot Schoolgirls *Insert four letter word here* volume 10. Yeah, *I* am the one beating up on men. Never mind the things men do. Lets not address that with any level of logica or honesty.

 

 

It is true. Despite the apparent increase in porn use, we are not seeing an increase in relationship break-ups relative to increase in porn use or even simply because of porn use. Relationship break-ups due to porn - insignificant in number.

 

We are. It's become a more fundemental problem. It's littered all over the internet with women strugglign with these issues. To deny it is a little bit like having your head in the sand. We see more disatisifaction between couples rather then more.

 

 

Silly of you to completely dismiss such a well known fact.

 

Silly of you to make it seem like the all the women in the world learned how to give bjs from porn and that's such a huge positive that it should come at the expensive of degrading an entire gender for your personal benefit. Silly of you to make it seem like men wouldn't be getting good sex if not for porn. Truly silly.

 

Incorrect. How many women out there have partners who stop looking at them, stop thinking they're attractive when all the battle paint comes off? Few women would ever be without it if this were true.

 

Please. If women tried to meet men without make up, without the extras, they would have a much tougher time of it. Maybe once in an established relationship men understand that you can't always have make up, but men like make up. They like women to doll themselves up. If men didn't, there wouldn't be photoshopped women in all forms of male media or heavily make-uped ones.

 

 

Get the feeling that sex would be a submissive and humiliating act in your eyes.

 

This is where you confuse my opinion on sex with my opinion on porn. I never said anything of the kind that sex was a submissive or humilating act. However, I am honest in regards to the porn industry. And I think men are honest with themselves in the recesses of their mind and understand how dehumanizing the industry is to women. They just don't want to vocalize it because it would mean having to question their own practice in using it.

 

Men aren't reliant on personality as much as some women are because they have an identity, they are happy with themselves. They don't need someone else to give them identity, to make them happy.

 

Huh? Women don't have an indentity? *scraches head*. I have no clue what you are trying to talk about here.

 

 

You're describing the dumb men.

 

No I am not. I am describing what men show is true through their actions towards women and what they invest their time in. Men invest their time in porn. They don't invest their time in showing their appreciation of kind good hearted women. That's a fact. Unless you want to disprove me wrong and show me where men spend as much time and money in culivationg their love for a woman with a good heart that they do to the degree they do with porn.

[Bejita463]

There are a lot of citations needed in this thread.

[St. Nick]

The porn threads have gotten me curious.

 

1. When you're in a serious, committed relationship do you continue to regularly view porn assuming that you're being satisfied sexually by your partner?

 

2. Does the frequency with which you view or whether you view it at all correspond to how strongly you feel about your partner? In other words, do you still look at porn when you're completely head over heels for a woman and getting regular sex with her?

 

3. Do you imagine having sex with your SO when looking at the porn?

 

My boyfriend told me that he hasn't been able to get off to porn since we started dating and has lost all interest in other women. I thought this was sweet and interesting, but it wouldn't have bothered me had he continued to view porn. I'm wondering how applicable this is to guys in general when they feel very strongly about a woman.

1. Yes.

2. Yes, I still look at porn, irregardless of the sex.

3. No.

 

I honestly believe yer bf was telling the truth when he said he's lost all interest in other women. I've felt the exact same way with one of my ex-gfs. But here's the question: how long do you think this feeling is going to last? Do you really think he'll feel this way forever? Or even a whole year? I felt that same way about my ex, but as soon as we had a fight the spell was broken and I found myself desiring other women. I give yer bf one month max before he's back to normal and looking at other females.

[Jersey Shortie]

Why do you guys even have gfs or wives in the first place? Wouldn't you be happier just living your lives, banging random women, not committing and looking at all the porn in the world to your little hearts content? That sounds like a more ideal situation for men. Then we don't have to pretend like things like loyatly, true love and all those foolish things women are led to belive that men will want are true.

[sumdude]

The porn threads have gotten me curious.

 

1. When you're in a serious, committed relationship do you continue to regularly view porn assuming that you're being satisfied sexually by your partner?

 

2. Does the frequency with which you view or whether you view it at all correspond to how strongly you feel about your partner? In other words, do you still look at porn when you're completely head over heels for a woman and getting regular sex with her?

 

3. Do you imagine having sex with your SO when looking at the porn?

 

My boyfriend told me that he hasn't been able to get off to porn since we started dating and has lost all interest in other women. I thought this was sweet and interesting, but it wouldn't have bothered me had he continued to view porn. I'm wondering how applicable this is to guys in general when they feel very strongly about a woman.

 

It's been while but when I felt good about the relationship with my gf/ex-wife and was sexually satisfied I rarely if ever checked out porn.

 

Later in the relationship things changed. She was not as interested in sex at all. I was still very attracted to her and wanted her but I was feeling rejected by her sexually and turned to porn as a surrogate. I remained faithful to the end when she cheated and then walked out on me. I didn't want anyone else and didn't want to be unfaithful.

 

Porn was/is a surrogate for a healthy and satisfying sexual relationship. I have a high sex drive.

[St. Nick]

Why do you guys even have gfs or wives in the first place?

In the old days, pre-1920s Jazz age era, guys got married to have kids to pass on the legacy and so the kids could work the field, in addition to the fact that people were slaves to church theocracy, which preached marriage was the highest goal for a man and a woman. Believe it or not, for both the upper and lower class, people hardly married for love. It was more duty than romance. Marriage meant dowry and increasing wealth, not long-lasting love. True, there were some loving marriages, but in many (most?) cases it wasn't anything like the Cinderella story, or any Disney romance for that matter. That was the stuff of books.

 

It's only today, with new age sentimentality, is that kind of thinking taught to be horrible and immoral. But this new way of thinking has only been around for a little less than half a century.

[Mr White]

In the old days, pre-1920s Jazz age era, guys got married to have kids to pass on the legacy and so the kids could work the field, in addition to the fact that people were slaves to church theocracy, which preached marriage was the highest goal for a man and a woman. Believe it or not, for both the upper and lower class, people hardly married for love. It was more duty than romance. Marriage meant dowry and increasing wealth, not long-lasting love. True, there were some loving marriages, but in many (most?) cases it wasn't anything like the Cinderella story, or any Disney romance for that matter. That was the stuff of books.

 

It's only today, with new age sentimentality, is that kind of thinking taught to be horrible and immoral. But this new way of thinking has only been around for a little less than half a century.

 

 

I like the old style much better. I'd rather enter a business arrangement where we both know our rights and responsibilities and where we get on with our joint and independent lives in the most reasonable way possible, rather than the contemporary mess of a relationship where you're always waiting for the other shoe to drop (e.g. "i love you but i'm not in love with you":rolleyes:).

 

Women hate porn because they want to be in complete control of men's sexuality. Which is ironic, because if they could offer that much more than that, they wouldn't be concerned with occasional porn use. Any cool and collected woman knows that she's got way more value than a passing image on a screen

[Jersey Shortie]

Women hate porn because they want to be in complete control of men's sexuality. Which is ironic, because if they could offer that much more than that, they wouldn't be concerned with occasional porn use. Any cool and collected woman knows that she's got way more value than a passing image on a screen

 

If men felt validated, as men, in real life, if they were confident in their abilties as men in real life, they wouldn't turn so heavily to an industry to caters to every one of their inherent male insecurities. Porn is a bigger deficit of male insecurity then female. Men turn to porn because they need something to make them feel good outside their lives where they clearly do not feel like men anymore in the 21st century. Because today too many men define masculinity by their ability to sit infront of a computer and jack off then really engage with real women and discovering real life. Yeah real women are tougher. Boohoo. But men have self medicated themselves into docility killing any adverterious spirit and respect they have for themselves and that women have for them. Why are men so often mocked today? It's not *just* because of feminism. It's because we have new generations of men that are passive and unadvertous and make justifications for their weaknesses (porn) then they do for their strength in having the qualities women *really* respect.

 

You last sentence is nothing more then a very transparent attempt to shame women into being "cool" as you define it. And you don't define being "cool" as having her own mind. You define it by her ability to accept your porn use.

 

It's too bad that men do not see their own passing value. And they rather waste their time infront of their porn jacking off to women who wouldn't cry if he got hit by a bus tomorrow than engaging with the real woman that is with him day by day. Suffering his tedious, borish aristocratic attempts at intellgence.

[Star Gazer]

My boyfriend told me that he hasn't been able to get off to porn since we started dating and has lost all interest in other women.

 

That's probably because he was a virgin before you came along. Before you, porn was fascinating, and perhaps even an instructional tool. Now that sex is a reality for him rather than just a fantasy, he doesn't need it anymore.

[A O]

Woe is me, I'm a man and some woman actually has the nerve to question some indeniable facts about the industry and male response to it.

You can question it all you like - as you do, but you can't question without being extremely judgmental towards men - that's the point.

 

To deny it is a little bit like having your head in the sand. We see more disatisifaction between couples rather then more.

Not denying it - putting it in context. Anyone would think that relationships are forever doomed if one took your views truly to heart. Simple fact of the matter is that the amount of relationships breaking up due to porn are infinitesimal.

 

Context!

 

Please. If women tried to meet men without make up, without the extras, they would have a much tougher time of it. Maybe once in an established relationship men understand that you can't always have make up, but men like make up.

Make up isn't for men, make-up is for women.

 

This is where you confuse my opinion on sex with my opinion on porn. I never said anything of the kind that sex was a submissive or humilating act.

No confusion, not with such generalized views as yours.

 

Huh? Women don't have an indentity? *scraches head*. I have no clue what you are trying to talk about here.

That's OK, plenty do.

 

No I am not. I am describing what men show is true through their actions towards women and what they invest their time in.

You're blowing one aspect of people - porn use - all out of proportion. Thankfully, most people can see the full picture, can and do put things in proper context. People are still forming relationships despite how you see the world and few of these relationships are breaking-up solely due to porn use.

 

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[Malenfant]

Porn addiction = unhealthy

 

Watching porn sometimes = normal

 

Chocolate addiction = unhealthy

 

Eating chocolate sometimes = normal

 

Alchohol addiction = unhealthy

 

Drinking alchohol sometimes = normal

 

 

its not the substance or activity that is dangerous, but how a person chooses to indulge that is potentially harmfull.

[Malenfant]

Perfect, although you might want to add:

 

Endless obsession over something trivial = Detrimental

 

oh totally.

how ridiculous this thread became.

[Jersey Shortie]

You can question it all you like - as you do, but you can't question without being extremely judgmental towards men - that's the point.

 

I know myself to admit that I am verly judgmental towards men on this subject. I don't always like it but men in turn are apparently very judgemental towards women as well. Look at how many men have bashed me or said I must be a prude or that I don't like sex. All because I don't like an industry that built itself on the humilation of my gender.

 

No man here would like an industry that treated men like porn treats women. That's the hard truth that none of you want to discuss.

 

 

Not denying it - putting it in context. Anyone would think that relationships are forever doomed if one took your views truly to heart. Simple fact of the matter is that the amount of relationships breaking up due to porn are infinitesimal.

 

Context!

No it's really not. We can go around and around in circles but peopel break up over it and it's been a bigger theme in recent years then ever before.

 

Make up isn't for men, make-up is for women.

 

Get off it already. Men love women that doll themselves up. there is a rare man that actually likes a woman completely natural. Women do what attracts men. Period.

 

That's OK, plenty do.

 

Plenty do what? You choose to ingnore my question and add onto another ridiculous ambigous comment that holds no merit.

 

You're blowing one aspect of people - porn use - all out of proportion. Thankfully, most people can see the full picture, can and do put things in proper context.

 

No I'm not. i am going by what men do, not what they say. Men invest their time in porn today. that speaks volumes.

[Jersey Shortie]

Show me something real to invest my time in then.

 

Love the lack of male accountibilty to be incharge of yourself here.

 

Must be a phenomenon, now why would most men suddenly do this? Because there's not many options out there and we need a release just like you do.

 

Yeah yea..blah blah.. the wittle man can't control himself.

[A O]

I know myself to admit that I am verly judgmental towards men on this subject. I don't always like it but men in turn are apparently very judgemental towards women as well. Look at how many men have bashed me or said I must be a prude or that I don't like sex. All because I don't like an industry that built itself on the humilation of my gender.

How others behave is no excuse for your own actions. Plenty of folks can and do discus this topic without deriding or forever deriding in some cases, the opposite sex.

 

No man here would like an industry that treated men like porn treats women. That's the hard truth that none of you want to discuss.

The hard truth is highly subjective therefore far from the hard truth at all. Most porn is acting, its a job that women, funnily enough, get paid a lot more than men to do.

 

No it's really not. We can go around and around in circles but peopel break up over it and it's been a bigger theme in recent years then ever before.

Point is to give context! Do you have a percentage? A betcha is extremely low if you do manage to ever find one at all.

 

Get off it already. Men love women that doll themselves up.

Women use make-up to attract men, to set themselves apart from other women. Men do not have the power to dictate to women that they must wear make-up and fashionable clothes. We've never had that sort of power - thankfully.

 

Plenty do what? You choose to ingnore my question and add onto another ridiculous ambigous comment that holds no merit.

Plenty of women tie their identities to their man. Plenty of women, namely, the low self-esteem types, need men to boost their lack of identity and personality.

 

No I'm not. i am going by what men do, not what they say. Men invest their time in porn today. that speaks volumes.

Again, context. You only want to see one side of men. But most women see many sides and most men see the multi-layed side of women as evidenced by the amount of relationships still being formed or maintained.

 

 

 

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[Jersey Shortie]

How others behave is no excuse for your own actions. Plenty of folks can and do discus this topic without deriding or forever deriding in some cases, the opposite sex.

You're such a joke AO. I never even said how others behaved was excuse for what I did. Of coures I am going to be judgemental to a group that tells me I am all kind of things all because I don't like an industry that is dehumanzing to women and sets up unrealistic standards that men blindly eat up like kittens.

 

The hard truth is highly subjective therefore far from the hard truth at all. Most porn is acting, its a job that women, funnily enough, get paid a lot more than men to do.

 

What does women getting paid more to do porn prove? They HAVE to pay the women more because it takes MORE incentive for women to have random sex with men that don't give a crap about them. Most women in porn have deep issues. Healthy minded women don't do porn. And if they do, it's a lark, not a rule.

 

Point is to give context! Do you have a percentage? A betcha is extremely low if you do manage to ever find one at all.

 

Where are your percentages my dear?

 

Women use make-up to attract men, to set themselves apart from other women. Men do not have the power to dictate to women that they must wear make-up and fashionable clothes. We've never had that sort of power - thankfully

 

Yet another comment about how men have no accountiblity or responsibility. Men have TONS of power. And exert it all the time. yes. women wear make up to attract men and to set themselves apart. If you didn't, men wouldn't pay attention to you and then you would end up all alone while the man chased the other girl who infact DID put on the make up. That's a reality. You want to make it seem like men have no influence when it comes to ideals, standards or other things. Women don't get implants because they want to be confident. They do it because men LOVE it.

 

Plenty of women tie their identities to their man. Plenty of women, namely, the low self-esteem types, need men to boost their lack of identity and personality.

 

Men do the same thing. This is why men pat each other on the back for getting laid. And the hotter the woman, the more the man feels validated. This extend to porn. Porn takes every make insecurity and makes it seem like a none issue. And it takes very attractive women so beyond the norm that men feel like "kings" while watching it. It's all male insecurity and smoke and mirrors.