Why do so many women want to get married?

[Barky]

All right now we're getting somewhere. Religion ameliorates the horror of death and meaninglessness in a vast, cold, inexplicable universe.

 

What does marriage, or the fantasy of marriage, do? Especially for women, but for a large percentage of men too. It must be primeval, IMHO. An instinctual urge.

[Neutrino]

All right now we're getting somewhere. Religion ameliorates the horror of death and meaninglessness in a vast, cold, inexplicable universe.

 

What does marriage, or the fantasy of marriage, do? Especially for women, but for a large percentage of men too. It must be primeval, IMHO. An instinctual urge.

 

I think the quote in my sig pretty much says it all - for those who cave - the price was too high....

 

Look at many other cases : the so called "global warming" hoax that the vast majority of the people bought right into, and many many many stereotypes and misconceptions people just keep parroting barely understanding what they mean....

 

And the list of examples can go on and on, but I think I made my point

Edited February 2, 2010 by Neutrino

[Barky]

the so called "global warming" hoax that the vast majority of the people bought right into

 

Well the jury's still out on that one. Pretty much impossible to prove either way, since you're talking about geologic time scales. But I get your point.

[Neutrino]

The jury is definitely out - and for now it's not coming back either !!

 

I have not yet seen a single serious research proving a high probability that my (very fast) car is responsible for the snow I almost drowned in this morning... LOL

 

The weather is a dynamic system - with or without us, this does not mean we should not clean our act - but that is a subject apart.

 

Anyway - back to your women before we get moved....

 

WTH ? where's my sig ?!?!?

It's supposed to say :

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[COLOR=#808080] [/COLOR]The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. If you try it, you will be lonely often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself. (Friedrich Nietzsche)

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Edited February 2, 2010 by Neutrino

[Neutrino]

No sig...????

[Barky]

yeah I was kinda wondering what you were talking about..

[OpenBook]

I do not personally know any women who have zero desire to be committed to someone they love as they enter the latter phases of their lives.

 

[OpenBook raises her hand] Well now you do.

 

We all desire companionship. To find that ONE person that you get to know more and more, everyday over the rest of your life is special. It's an emotional/spiritual and physical bond.

 

I actually recoiled shivering in horror when I first read this statement. Not because it's not a beautiful sentiment (it is)... but because there is no acknowledgment of the ugly side of living together with someone, day in and day out, for years and years. Picturing the reality of it is like a slow-moving nightmare to me.

 

You go through enough times where the love has died after around 5 years together... and you get a little gun-shy. This has been my experience. Every once in awhile (like when I read these threads, full of hope for lasting love), I wonder if I will be proven wrong within the remainder of my own lifetime. I kind of doubt it. I'm running out of time!

 

I read a book recently which in part examined this issue ("Committed" by Elizabeth Gilbert). The author herslef went through a very messy divorce so she was ambivalent about marriage but she asked her single friends why they wanted to get married.

 

The main answer seemed to be that the wanted to feel "chosen." That they were validated and that someone loved them enough to marry them.

 

I can totally understand that. I wanted to marry my husband because I loved him, I wanted the security of marriage (although logically I know it's not really secure). And as much as you can say "I don't give a rat's arse what society thinks" people do treat you diffrently as a married couple as opposed to just living together. There is a sense that you have made a serious, grown up committment rather than just a light "we'll see how it goes" committment.

 

BES

 

You nailed it Susan! On both counts. I completely agree. You DO feel "validated" by society when you get married. It's like you've passed a test or something. Fortunately, the older I get the less I worry about what "society" thinks of me anymore. It's incredibly liberating to feel that way. It means I can do and act the way I REALLY want to. I have more freedom to be my authentic self.

 

This is another thing about marriage - how many married people are really their authentic selves? I believe that marriage in most cases puts restrictive boundaries around that ability - for both the man and the woman.

 

So (swinging back around to being on-topic:D) I agree with the reasons given by other posters why most women want to get married - security, validation, a good environment for raising children, etc.

 

I'm just not convinced that marriage is a good thing over the long run.

[hopeful1980]

I can tell you why many women want to get married the first time... It's because little girls are conditioned constantly to have their white dress day. We start getting pushed toward it from the time we can talk. It's like a right of passage.

 

Me? I have done it once, and I don't care if I do it again.

 

I don't know about that so much anymore. While I do think this was once the norm, the economy has made the fairy tale wedding out of reach for most.

 

My husband and I went to the justice of the peace in our jeans and t-shirts on a Wednesday afternoon. I didn't buy into the hype.

[stillafool]

I too didn't give marriage much thought until the last few years. In my 20's I never wanted to marry and thought I had time. After all, most of my friends were single. Even in my early 30's most of my friends were single. Now though most are married including guys. I am a freak by still being single and it hurts.

 

 

Don't worry about what your friends do. I think a lot of women make the mistake of wanting to get married just because their friends are all getting married. So What! Marry because you have fallen in love with a person you want to spend the rest of your life with and they feel the same about you. Until you are with that person, marriage really shouldn't enter one's mind. There is nothing wrong with being single.

[Stung]

[OpenBook raises her hand] Well now you do.

 

 

 

Then nice to meet you, Open Book.

[Jersey Shortie]

I hope I can explain this in terms men might relate to.

 

For men, when it comes to sex, they want it all. They want to know that their partner is open to them. Men want to know that their partner will be willing to do certain things for them. That they will be willing to try new things, put themselves in new situations and make herself vulnerable with him. Men want the full circle when it comes to sex. They don’t want any holdbacks, any stipulations or signed disclosures.

 

There is no man here that would enjoy being told for the rest of his life he was only allowed to have bjs. Or that he could only have sex and no extras for the rest of his life. There is no man here that would enjoy being told that he should consider that good enough. After all, she does love him and she puts in *some* of the effort to please him even if it’s not the whole shebang. Most men would not liked to be told by their female partner that her desire not to give bjs or have sex shouldn't make him feel less loved or that he should just happily accept it because she is with him after all right? See where I am going with this?

 

Those kind of stipulations from either a man or a woman foster a bridge/gap in the relationship. Because one partner is drawing a clear line in the sand about how far they will or rather won't go. That right there is enough to understand how unattractive that is.

 

It's the same thing with women. We also want the full circle. Telling a woman she is good enough to have a relationship for but not marry is like a woman telling you that she is only good enough for you "up to a certain point". You are putting a rule, a stipulation on how far you will allow the relationship to go. Relationship wise, she's only getting bjs for the rest of her life and her partner is telling her she should be happy enough with that.

 

Both men and women want the other gender to open up to them and give themselves too them and not draw lines in the sand on how far they are willing to go for each other. We wonder why women want marriage when we live in a world that’s all about the novelty of the next new young woman in the lime light. We wonder why women want marriage when we see many commitment-phobic young men that rather run around in bars and have one night stands that be dedicated to one woman. Women instinctively know that when a man truly loves you, there is nothing he won’t do. When a man truly loves you, he will do what he can to keep her around and commit himself to her.

 

OP, it’s fine that you don’t want to get married. What is not fine is leading on women and giving them a false sense of hope and wasting their time and stopping them from getting what they want out of life while you continue to self fulfill what you want. Please be honest with these women. Let them go after what they want just as you wish to be free to go after what you want.

 

Market research and peneration? Are you in the ad business?

[greatgirlfriend]

Don't worry about what your friends do. I think a lot of women make the mistake of wanting to get married just because their friends are all getting married. So What! Marry because you have fallen in love with a person you want to spend the rest of your life with and they feel the same about you. Until you are with that person, marriage really shouldn't enter one's mind. There is nothing wrong with being single.

 

But according to society there IS something wrong with being single. Single people generally make less, and are the first to be fired, single people don't get the tax breaks married people get, and single people are treated as children. Single people are often forgotten once people get married. This is among other reasons, but no single people aren't treated well by society. There is something wrong with people who never marry because they aren't doing what society tells them to.

[Barky]

I hope I can explain this in terms men might relate to.

 

Nice explanation, but I think you were putting the cart before the horse. You assumed the institution of marriage, and then said women want it. You defined it in terms of what other institutions are NOT, rather than what it IS.

 

I understand how marriage differs from non-marriage. But what exactly is marriage? At least in womens' fantasies (because it rarely, rarely works out that way.)

 

I think it's back to the chocolate analogy for me. I LOVE chocolate, but a couple of the women I'm dating simply don't. They'll eat it, but if they have the choice between a fudgy chocolate dessert and, say, a cheesecake, they'll probably take the cheesecake. I can't understand why in the world they don't crave the chocolate, and they don't understand why it's the first thing on the dessert menu I look at.

 

I've never, ever had any desire to get married or have a "life partner" or any such thing. I'm beginning to realize that no amount of logical explanation is going to make me have the same feelings about it as (apparently a whole lot of) other people.

 

Which is ok by me, just wish I could "get" why it's such a big deal to others.

[greatgirlfriend]

I don't know about that so much anymore. While I do think this was once the norm, the economy has made the fairy tale wedding out of reach for most.

 

My husband and I went to the justice of the peace in our jeans and t-shirts on a Wednesday afternoon. I didn't buy into the hype.

 

I've never really liked big weddings. Most of those who had fairy tale weddings ended up getting divorced, whereas most of those who had simple weddings are still together. I suspect part of the reason for the divorces was because they were into the fantasy and when the bills came the fantasy was over. I actually like the idea of getting married in my parents backyard (they have a huge backyard). Knowing my mom, she'll want me to do the whole Catholic ceremony and then have the reception at a nice place. I'll worry about it if it comes up.

[Neutrino]

For my bigger half and myself a partner's contract seemed the best option, it allowed us to address our individual choices in term of commitment and with our properties, for example - only some of our property is shared - the rest remains with the original owner in case of a break-up.

 

The choice not to get married rests on 2 main reasons :

 

1. The marriage agreement itself makes me think of the one-size-suits-all (and actually nobody) concept.

 

2. Marriage is closely associated with religion - which we both fundamentally object to.

 

We are both well aware that anything can happen in the future, the best relationships can fail and this has nothing to do with whatever ceremony you had.... At least if that happens - everything was already decided and we will not end up fighting over property while the lawyers clean everything out at the end....

[hopeful1980]

I've never really liked big weddings. Most of those who had fairy tale weddings ended up getting divorced, whereas most of those who had simple weddings are still together. I suspect part of the reason for the divorces was because they were into the fantasy and when the bills came the fantasy was over. I actually like the idea of getting married in my parents backyard (they have a huge backyard). Knowing my mom, she'll want me to do the whole Catholic ceremony and then have the reception at a nice place. I'll worry about it if it comes up.

 

We thought about getting married in my in-laws backyard! But it was just too much hassle to be bothered with.

 

If I could go back, I would probably have the wedding for my family. I'm happy with the way things turned out, but my mom/dad/grandmother regretted that I didn't have a wedding. They felt slighted that they missed out on the "traditions".

 

I keep trying to remind myself and them that my marriage isn't about them, it's only about my husband and I. But still, I never tire of making my family happy and that would have made them happy.

[Jersey Shortie]

Barky, what cart am I putting before the horse? I have no clue what you’re referencing when you said I defined it in terms of what other institutions are NOT. You asked why women want marriage. I answered why women want marriage. My explanation was pretty darn clear and simple. I do not think I need to go into explaining it again do I?

 

Further, you seem to want to belittle a desire for marriage by calling it “women’s’ fantasies”. Are you not living in a world that is about #1 (you) first?

 

Women are not such simple minded creatures that think marriage is easy or all about fantasy. We know the realities. We see the realities or have grown up with the realities when faced with our own parents’ marriage. The issue with marriage is not because women desire it, or even because people can’t be married successfully. There are enough men out there that also desire to be married.

 

You don’t have a desire to get married. That is fine. That’s your choice. But by being on a dating site, an entity that more times then not is going to draw women that are eventually looking for marriage, and not being clear that you just want to have fun, is 100% unfair to these women. In essence, you are creating a dynamic where you can continue to self fulfill on your own desires and work around the desires of what you know most of these women want that you are already unwilling to give. Are there not dating sites that cater to people that don’t want to get married? I am sure there are.

 

And in all honesty, your chocolate analogy does not do the same justice to the situation that my explanation does. This isn’t about a man liking to go golfing on the weekend and the woman wanting to go shopping and both wanting them to do the other activity with them. Would you be happy with a woman that told you, you two could have fun together sexually but that it would only go as far as bjs? Would you stick around with that woman? Most likely not. Most likely you would want the whole picture, and not be regulated to a defined set of rules where she draws a clear line in the sand about how far she is willing or rather unwilling to go with you. Marriage to women is the same thing. When a man draws a clear line on how far he is willing to go with us, when he puts rules and stipulations and other negative things into practice, it’s a turn off and we see it for what it is. A man that is unwilling to look beyond himself and is content with doing what’s best for him first. We women also need to look out for ourselves too.

[greatgirlfriend]

We thought about getting married in my in-laws backyard! But it was just too much hassle to be bothered with.

 

If I could go back, I would probably have the wedding for my family. I'm happy with the way things turned out, but my mom/dad/grandmother regretted that I didn't have a wedding. They felt slighted that they missed out on the "traditions".

 

I keep trying to remind myself and them that my marriage isn't about them, it's only about my husband and I. But still, I never tire of making my family happy and that would have made them happy.

 

My neighbor's daughter got married in their backyard and it was beautiful. They got fake flowers and had tables set up under several tents. They catered but most everything else was made. To me it looked just as nice as traditional weddings. I know though my family would be disappointed if I did this. My mom often mentions that since I'm the only daughter (I have a brother) they'd be upset if it was anything even remotely casual because I'll only do it once (in her world divorce doesn't exist). I'd still like a big train and veil though (the one traditional thing I like). What kind of marriage did you have? I had a few cousins who got married at city hall, then had a small reception at their house (with about maybe 50 people). To me this is too small, but they saved a lot of money for the honeymoon instead. People often forget that it's not so much the wedding itself but the marriage.

[Nikki Sahagin]

I think for the majority of women its about a wedding day rather than a marriage.

 

I've personally always been against marriage until I met my ex and then I had the desire to one day marry him. I don't know if its a desire that love activates, because now that i'm single, I have no urge to be married. Before love I saw it as a stupid, pointless institution that takes all the excitment and risk out of a relationship. When I was in love I saw it as making him mine and making me his.

[stillafool]

But according to society there IS something wrong with being single.

 

Don't worry about making society happy make yourself happy.

 

Single people generally make less, and are the first to be fired, single people don't get the tax breaks married people get, and single people are treated as children.

 

Are these reasons to marry someone? BTW, Luckily, single people don't need as much money because all of their money goes to 1 person versus a family having to split things 3 or 4 ways in expenses.

 

Single people are often forgotten once people get married. This is among other reasons, but no single people aren't treated well by society.

 

I was single for a long time and I never found this to be the case. My married friends still invited me to everything and I was always treated well by others because I was single and happy.

 

 

There is something wrong with people who never marry because they aren't doing what society tells them to.

 

I disagree. I think there is something wrong with people who only talk of getting married because it is what society expects of them rather than because they have found the love of their life and want to spend the rest of your life with that person.

[greatgirlfriend]

 

 

Don't worry about making society happy make yourself happy.

 

 

 

Are these reasons to marry someone? BTW, Luckily, single people don't need as much money because all of their money goes to 1 person versus a family having to split things 3 or 4 ways in expenses.

 

 

 

I was single for a long time and I never found this to be the case. My married friends still invited me to everything and I was always treated well by others because I was single and happy.

 

 

 

 

I disagree. I think there is something wrong with people who only talk of getting married because it is what society expects of them rather than because they have found the love of their life and want to spend the rest of your life with that person.

 

Then you are very lucky, because in my experience single people are treated as trash. My family does look down on me because I am single and have said this. I keep hearing that there must be something wrong with me and state I must love the game old maid because it's my game (it's not and I don't consider myself a spinster yet). No, I wouldn't get married just to get married, but yes I want to be with someone who loves me enough to promise to be with me until one of us dies (even if it doesn't turn out that way).

[SimplyBeingLoved]

It's a rite of passage thing, and it's pounded into us from the very very beginning when we're little girls. Marriage is a form of social validation.

 

I really don't think true love is the primary reason why people get married. MOST people get married for social validation while they are still in the infatuation stage. And then once the infatuation wears off, well...

 

True love is possible but IMHO it takes really knowing yourself, and being past the point of needing to be with someone for the purpose of validation. As long as you marry because you are worried about what your mom thinks, or because your best friend from high school just tied the knot, you're not really free, so any commitment you make is going to be much more tenuous.

[Joe Normal]

I'm wondering what the allure is regarding marriage for women. I'm a guy and do a lot of online dating, been doing it for years, and one day almost a year ago I decided to mix things up so I put on my online profile something to the effect of: "love dating, not interested in marriage" and the number of responses dropped to essentially nothing. When I removed that from the profile, responses again rose to where they were before.

 

I could understand if, say, HALF of all women ages 25-35 really wanted to get married. But it seems like 99.9% of them do. In fact, I've dated a ton and I don't think I've ever, ever in my life run into a young woman who didn't want to eventually get married.

 

What a popular institution! What incredible market penetration! If a company could get that high a percentage of the female population interested in its product or service, that company would be rolling in dough.

 

So what's the allure of marriage, I don't get it, I've never wanted to be married.

 

Not sure about the last question, but the last 2 women I've dated didn't want to get married. One of them had already married and got divorced, the other had never married and didn't want to. So there are woman out there who feel the same way!

 

Personally I would rather get a 1% response rate from women who don't like marriage than a 100% response rate from women who do. There's nothing more irritating than being 6-12 months into a relationship and then she starts dropping the kids/marriage hints and you have no interest in either.

[Joe Normal]

 

Reasons why marriage is alluring to women:

1. financial benefits

 

Aha, the truth comes out!

[Joe Normal]

 

There is no man here that would enjoy being told for the rest of his life he was only allowed to have bjs. Or that he could only have sex and no extras for the rest of his life. There is no man here that would enjoy being told that he should consider that good enough. After all, she does love him and she puts in *some* of the effort to please him even if it’s not the whole shebang. Most men would not liked to be told by their female partner that her desire not to give bjs or have sex shouldn't make him feel less loved or that he should just happily accept it because she is with him after all right? See where I am going with this?

 

Those kind of stipulations from either a man or a woman foster a bridge/gap in the relationship. Because one partner is drawing a clear line in the sand about how far they will or rather won't go. That right there is enough to understand how unattractive that is.

 

It's the same thing with women. We also want the full circle. Telling a woman she is good enough to have a relationship for but not marry is like a woman telling you that she is only good enough for you "up to a certain point". You are putting a rule, a stipulation on how far you will allow the relationship to go. Relationship wise, she's only getting bjs for the rest of her life and her partner is telling her she should be happy enough with that.

 

Both men and women want the other gender to open up to them and give themselves too them and not draw lines in the sand on how far they are willing to go for each other. We wonder why women want marriage when we live in a world that’s all about the novelty of the next new young woman in the lime light. We wonder why women want marriage when we see many commitment-phobic young men that rather run around in bars and have one night stands that be dedicated to one woman. Women instinctively know that when a man truly loves you, there is nothing he won’t do. When a man truly loves you, he will do what he can to keep her around and commit himself to her.

 

Look, it's pretty simple. I would not expect a woman to indulge in extreme S&M sex or work as a household servant just for my benefit. Sure, I might like the idea of her cooking, cleaning and parading around in her underwear at all times while following my every order, but I realise it's unrealistic and rather degrading to expect that from anyone. I am happy if she just stays faithful, keeps nagging and drama out of my life, is good company and enjoys regular sex.

 

Equally, she should not expect me to indulge in extreme financial masochism (aka "marriage"), or make ridiculous promises (such as sticking by her for life even if she starts boning my next door neighbour, turns into a crack whore, or joins the communist party) just for her benefit. It should be enough that I stay faithful, am good company, don't whine at her or bring drama into her life, and enjoy regular sex & romance with her.

 

Limits exist and are essential in any relationship. I wouldn't jump off a cliff or other dumb/crazy things for any woman no matter how much I loved her, and no sane woman would do stuff like that for any man. Just as it's ridiculous for a guy to expect his woman to automatically love anal sex or facial "money shots", so it's ridiculous for a woman to expect her guy to want the financial equivalent of a frontal lobotomy.

 

Getting married is basically submitting to the wishes of complete strangers who have no clue about your relationship or mutual wants and desires. I would be ok with 2 people individually agreeing their own "marriage contract", but I am not ok with subscribing to a state-designed one, or one made up by a church. What does some divorce lawyer, family court judge, preacher or politician know about what I want out of a relationship? Or society in general? They don't know jack. So it would be totally insane to give their hypocritical and ignorant opinions any leverage over how my life is conducted.

 

Marriage is like submitting your future financial destiny to a bunch of people you have no control over. If your wife or husband gambles behind your back and runs up huge debts, you owe it. That's dumb and wrong. If your spouse sleeps with half the town, and you quite rightly divorce, you still get hosed financially in court if you are the richer one in the marriage. That's crazy. If your spouse suddenly takes on a huge life change, like converting to another religion, or adopting radically different political beliefs, you get hosed if you find that is not compatible with you. That's ridiculous.

 

Marriage is the ultimate roach motel.

Edited February 10, 2010 by Joe Normal