Crazy Magnet Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 I think there is a fine line to be walked by both men and women in relationships, especially as we get older. I, as a woman, have learned to set clearer boundaries with the men who seem to want a place in my life. In my experience, no man has ever wanted only friendship with me...EVER. I see so many people, especially on LS, claiming that it's possible. But, in my 30 years. not one guy friend has ever actually wanted friendship in the end. Lesson learned on my end, I do not maintain any type of close relationship with men other than the guy I am dating. I have a few male acquaintances, but I tread very carefully and limit the time I spend talking, texting, or hanging out with them.
GroupFitness Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 I was going to ask what being an attention whore has to do with who her friends are, but then I remembered that one girl from that show "Fairy Odd Parents." I think her name is Chelsea. She surrounds herself with people that think [and tells her] she is pretty. She needs people to to dote on her. She has to be the center of attention. Is this what you mean?! I don't know any women that do that. You can tell a person who keeps friends, especially opposite sex friends, around because she genuinely likes them as friends or she just wants them to either dish out the compliments or hit on her. Some people get off on that, even if they won't date their admirers, they feed off the ego stroke. Women probably do it more than men. Surrounding themselves with 'helper monkeys' who supply them with constant attention.
Crazy Magnet Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 Oh, I missed being able to edit my post. Wanted to amend: However, my bf hangs out one night a week with a female friend, alone, in her apartment. I have no issue with this. Spidey sense says it's cool, therefore, it's cool in my book.
meerkat stew Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 Women for the most part don't keep men they are attracted to as friends. Correct, they just -call- them "friends" when what they really are is backburnered sources of attention supply. And as far as the rest of your rationalizing, my test is simple and fair. If 1. good treatment, favors and "acts of friendship" are running both ways in the relationship, and 2. She is open and willing to take steps to involve the guy in -our- relationship as a friend -of the relationship- and prospectively a friend of mine (something doesn't miraculously "come up" every time we are supposed to meet or he acts like a brooding child around me, etc.), and 3. There has been no indicia of sexual or romantic interest running either way for at least several years, then I have no problem at all as the friendship is most likely legitimate. If on the other hand, the guy has 1. rotated her tires, hung her pictures, kept her cat, etc. and she has never reciprocated with like favors, 2. She shows even the slightest hint of discomfort at my desire to meet and get to know him, and 3. He is an ex, FWB, ONS or even has asked her out in the last several years or expressed romantic interest... he has TO GO, and she is free to pick back up with him once we aren't dating. And I have no problems whatsoever terminating any relationships I may have with female acquaintances who are not real friendships, but just prospective romantic partners. Call me immature, insecure and controlling all you like (as the -bad- ones have done in the past when trying to bully me out of this very elementary and fair boundary), my relationship and dating life has improved significantly since I started setting more clear boundaries on the relationship. If she wants to keep a bevy of backburnered admirers, she is more than welcome to do so... while dating someone else.
carhill Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 Whats so fair about anything in life. Fairness and equity are very important in all aspects of living. Hope that message gets to you one day.
Author Green Posted January 25, 2010 Author Posted January 25, 2010 Oh, I missed being able to edit my post. Wanted to amend: However, my bf hangs out one night a week with a female friend, alone, in her apartment. I have no issue with this. Spidey sense says it's cool, therefore, it's cool in my book. This is the kind of thing I could never agree too.
Author Green Posted January 25, 2010 Author Posted January 25, 2010 Correct, they just -call- them "friends" when what they really are is backburnered sources of attention supply. And as far as the rest of your rationalizing, my test is simple and fair. If 1. good treatment, favors and "acts of friendship" are running both ways in the relationship, and 2. She is open and willing to take steps to involve the guy in -our- relationship as a friend -of the relationship- and prospectively a friend of mine (something doesn't miraculously "come up" every time we are supposed to meet or he acts like a brooding child around me, etc.), and 3. There has been no indicia of sexual or romantic interest running either way for at least several years, then I have no problem at all as the friendship is most likely legitimate. If on the other hand, the guy has 1. rotated her tires, hung her pictures, kept her cat, etc. and she has never reciprocated with like favors, 2. She shows even the slightest hint of discomfort at my desire to meet and get to know him, and 3. He is an ex, FWB, ONS or even has asked her out in the last several years or expressed romantic interest... he has TO GO, and she is free to pick back up with him once we aren't dating. And I have no problems whatsoever terminating any relationships I may have with female acquaintances who are not real friendships, but just prospective romantic partners. Call me immature, insecure and controlling all you like (as the -bad- ones have done in the past when trying to bully me out of this very elementary and fair boundary), my relationship and dating life has improved significantly since I started setting more clear boundaries on the relationship. If she wants to keep a bevy of backburnered admirers, she is more than welcome to do so... while dating someone else. darn your posts are pretty good!
meerkat stew Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 Women probably do it more than men. Surrounding themselves with 'helper monkeys' who supply them with constant attention. :lmao: "Helper monkeys" the PERFECT term for those squirrelly dudes who always seem to be around in the background.
Clep Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 One of my favorite tests when women say a guy is just a friend and justifies a continuing relationship that way is to ask her 1. when's the last time you did something nice for your male friend? a favor or treated him? 2. Cool, let's take him out with us next week, I can't wait to meet him, maybe he and I can be friends too!, and finally 3. Have you ever slept with him, dated him, kissed him, or has he ever shown romantic interest? 90% of female/male friendships FAIL this basic test miserably in my relationships. If they pass, I'm more than cool with her hanging out with him. If they fail, he's gotta go entirely while we are dating. No flexibility on this going forward at all, am tired of having wormy men in the background undermining my relationships because they can't get their own GF, and so are a "good friend" to her hoping he will have a shot one day. I couldn't agree with this more. That is the exact same process I go through in choosing my male friends. I had a male friend one time say he would not meet my boyfriend and he wanted to be just friends with me. That was a clear sign and he had to go. My boyfriend does not have to be in the position of testing me with these things...I do that on my own. I feel it is my responsibility to ensure I am not allowing some wormy person, male or female into my life. My relationship is the most important thing and it needs to be treated as such. If there is someone wanting a shot one day and just hanging around waiting their turn being dishonest with their intention in the process, that is the last type of person I want in my life. It really isn't hard to weed them out, especially using the process described. My bf should not have to remind or coax me to make us first. This may sound bad but many years ago I used to think all guys just wanted to be my friend. After many experiences that turned out to be me being naive. I have learned that a majority of men just want to sleep with me and finding the ones that want to be my friend are few and far between. I don't have many male friends but he ones I do have, are inviting and warm with my man and it is genuine.
BWLoca Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 Seriouse relatioships may be heading toward mariage better have the talk sooner then later. I agree completely and always state this before even entering a relationship. And I don't think it's controlling at all when both are in agreement on this.
Johnny M Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 i like how you peppered this post with "the same goes for men" but then you felt the need to follow up that superficial sentiment with the insinuation that women are more prone to this sort of behavior because they are "naive." ok then. Women are more emotional than men, that's a fact. And emotional people are more prone to act irrationally or do things "in the heat of the moment" without thinking - that is also a fact. It's not hard to put two and two together. When a man cheats, he does so with specific intent. In other words, he wants to cheat. When a woman cheats, she often does it because she becomes emotionally overwhelmed. That's why OP's point is a valid one. Even if you GF is generally trustworthy, there's always a chance she would cheat if she finds herself in a certain situation (i.e. alone time with another man that she feels attracted to).
Author Green Posted January 25, 2010 Author Posted January 25, 2010 I couldn't agree with this more. That is the exact same process I go through in choosing my male friends. I had a male friend one time say he would not meet my boyfriend and he wanted to be just friends with me. That was a clear sign and he had to go. My boyfriend does not have to be in the position of testing me with these things...I do that on my own. I feel it is my responsibility to ensure I am not allowing some wormy person, male or female into my life. My relationship is the most important thing and it needs to be treated as such. If there is someone wanting a shot one day and just hanging around waiting their turn being dishonest with their intention in the process, that is the last type of person I want in my life. It really isn't hard to weed them out, especially using the process described. My bf should not have to remind or coax me to make us first. This may sound bad but many years ago I used to think all guys just wanted to be my friend. After many experiences that turned out to be me being naive. I have learned that a majority of men just want to sleep with me and finding the ones that want to be my friend are few and far between. I don't have many male friends but he ones I do have, are inviting and warm with my man and it is genuine. A guy currently dating some one who doesn't want to hang out with you alone may want to be your friend. Other then that any single guy doesn't want to be your friend no matter what you think.
DiscoChick Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 I think there is a fine line to be walked by both men and women in relationships, especially as we get older. I, as a woman, have learned to set clearer boundaries with the men who seem to want a place in my life. In my experience, no man has ever wanted only friendship with me...EVER. I see so many people, especially on LS, claiming that it's possible. But, in my 30 years. not one guy friend has ever actually wanted friendship in the end. Lesson learned on my end, I do not maintain any type of close relationship with men other than the guy I am dating. I have a few male acquaintances, but I tread very carefully and limit the time I spend talking, texting, or hanging out with them. Admitted, most of my guy friends were rejected when asking for a date, but we are friends now. They go out on dates and get into relationships just as easy as I could...would. Whatever. I've known most of them almost all my life anyway. You can tell a person who keeps friends, especially opposite sex friends, around because she genuinely likes them as friends or she just wants them to either dish out the compliments or hit on her. Some people get off on that, even if they won't date their admirers, they feed off the ego stroke. Women probably do it more than men. Surrounding themselves with 'helper monkeys' who supply them with constant attention. LOL. Ohhhhhhhhhhhh. I DO know women like that. They are the ones I am constantly confused by. I don't see the point of this, and I may never. I guess my ego is so small that I never need to know the point of this. Green: I don't want alone time with my ex. I simply want to talk to him like I did before we tripped into a relationship. I don't miss being in a relationship with him. I miss talking to him. He helped me with my problems. Really. None of my other friends even try to go into the caves in my mind that he helped me clean out. I just need someone to talk to that doesn't think I'm a lunatic!
sally4sara Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 Took a freshly single female friend to a party on saturday. Everyone there were people my husband and I know and have known very well for a while now. When my husband wanted to leave, my female friend put her lower lip out because she was still having fun and someone she had not seen in a long time had just arrived. I told her I would stay. A few hours later, I was a little more tipsy than I intended and she had become attached at the hip with the old friend. I wanted to go home before the train stopped running. One of our guy friends walked the 4 blocks to the metro with me and saw me all the way home. YOU would rather your GF have walked herself than have a guy see her home? OR you would have insisted she "heel" and leave before she wanted to? OR stayed and scowled until everyone grew tired of your attitude and asked her to get you out of there? Gross! There was a married woman there who was not attending with her husband. She ended up flirting with my guy friend and kissed him. He would never even dream of trying that with me because he would catch the beat down of his life! Maybe you should try dating in the adult world, but I caution; adults don't like it when you treat them like children.
samspade Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 You should never let a girl you are dating hang out with men. If you are dating a girl seriously then you should ask her not to put herself in a situation where she is going to be alone with another man. I think it is fine for a girl to be friends with and have contact with men other then her bf. I just don't think she should be able to go out and do something alone with that person. I also don't think a girl should stay in contact with her ex boyfriends. The same applies for men. I just think women are often naive about thinking it would be olright for them to just go hang out with a guy and just be friends with him outside of school or work ect. I say keep it at work or school, or at some group event like a couples dinner or a party ect. Men and Women can't just be friends and I wouldn't want the stress of knowing that the person I date is out having a good time with a member of the oposite sex. as I said before I think this aplies to men as well, but women in my experience are often more naive to this fact. Good points. The key is not to be controlling. If you control the frame and she respects you, you shouldn't have to tell her any of this. If she wants to hang out one-on-one with another guy, she's more than welcome to - she just won't be your exclusive GF any more. It's not about letting her or allowing her to do anything. It's about you respecting yourself and knowing when to walk if she's not respecting you.
Mr White Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 I think there is a fine line to be walked by both men and women in relationships, especially as we get older. I, as a woman, have learned to set clearer boundaries with the men who seem to want a place in my life. In my experience, no man has ever wanted only friendship with me...EVER. I see so many people, especially on LS, claiming that it's possible. But, in my 30 years. not one guy friend has ever actually wanted friendship in the end. Lesson learned on my end, I do not maintain any type of close relationship with men other than the guy I am dating. I have a few male acquaintances, but I tread very carefully and limit the time I spend talking, texting, or hanging out with them. Quoted for telling it like it is. Similarly, as a guy, I will also acknowledge that I have NEVER had purely friendship intentions towards a woman. Sure, I have some female friends - or more precisely - acuintances - , but it is purely situational ==> I'm either not attracted to them (but if they're not too ugly would probably still make a pass at them in a parralel universe with no consequences), or we go waaaaaay back (e.g. highschool, college) so we actually are friends. Quite frankly, all this grand talk about actual male female friendships is hogwash and rationalizations. It happens often, but certainly not often enough to be the norm. As far as I'm concerned it is perfectly sensible to be alarmed/suspicious.
Clep Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 A guy currently dating some one who doesn't want to hang out with you alone may want to be your friend. Other then that any single guy doesn't want to be your friend no matter what you think. I disagree with that. I have a male friend that I met while we were both in relationships, we both split up with our so's within two months of each other. We each stayed single for about 6 - 8 months, never dated, never went there. We are still friends and he and my guy are friends now too. If my guy and I split he would remain friends with both of us. He is still friends with my ex and I am still friends with his.
Agoraphobianebula Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 I couldn't agree with this more. That is the exact same process I go through in choosing my male friends. I had a male friend one time say he would not meet my boyfriend and he wanted to be just friends with me. That was a clear sign and he had to go. My boyfriend does not have to be in the position of testing me with these things...I do that on my own. I feel it is my responsibility to ensure I am not allowing some wormy person, male or female into my life. My relationship is the most important thing and it needs to be treated as such. If there is someone wanting a shot one day and just hanging around waiting their turn being dishonest with their intention in the process, that is the last type of person I want in my life. It really isn't hard to weed them out, especially using the process described. My bf should not have to remind or coax me to make us first. This may sound bad but many years ago I used to think all guys just wanted to be my friend. After many experiences that turned out to be me being naive. I have learned that a majority of men just want to sleep with me and finding the ones that want to be my friend are few and far between. I don't have many male friends but he ones I do have, are inviting and warm with my man and it is genuine. Clep but YOU made the decision to cut wormy friends out of your life. YOU have enough good sense to set these boundaries so that it doesn't even become a bone of contention in your relationship to begin with. Good women do that, they take care of their own business without getting called out on it. You used your experience with sketchy male friends to weed out the fake ones, not put an absolute blanket around all male friendships, banishing them all to eternal damnation. For the dissenters, a good mate will not even give you a reason to question her friendships, opposite sexed or otherwise because her character and transparency will let you know that everything is on the up and up.
carhill Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 I'm talking about one on one alone time I remember counseling one particular single young lady about her education and future engineering career a number of times, one on one. Look, I've played all these roles. Fell in love with an attention whore years ago. Dealt with that. Dated many incompatible women. Married one. Still, it doesn't change my basic philosophy that we are free and autonomous beings who make choices and take responsibility for those choices and their consequences each minute of each day. If a woman having male friends or 'hanging out' with males is a deal-breaker for you, then it is. Communicate that to her and own it along with whatever consequences it brings. IMO, that's fair.
DiscoChick Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 Took a freshly single female friend to a party on saturday. Everyone there were people my husband and I know and have known very well for a while now. When my husband wanted to leave, my female friend put her lower lip out because she was still having fun and someone she had not seen in a long time had just arrived. I told her I would stay. A few hours later, I was a little more tipsy than I intended and she had become attached at the hip with the old friend. I wanted to go home before the train stopped running. One of our guy friends walked the 4 blocks to the metro with me and saw me all the way home. YOU would rather your GF have walked herself than have a guy see her home? OR you would have insisted she "heel" and leave before she wanted to? OR stayed and scowled until everyone grew tired of your attitude and asked her to get you out of there? Gross! There was a married woman there who was not attending with her husband. She ended up flirting with my guy friend and kissed him. He would never even dream of trying that with me because he would catch the beat down of his life! Maybe you should try dating in the adult world, but I caution; adults don't like it when you treat them like children. This is exactly what I mean. Men and women are able to be friends without that sex stigma floating in the air. I am alone at home with one of my male friends often. He comes over to use the computer or has me looking at some new gadget he just bought. [i would say boys and their toys, but I love new technology too.] He knows I am interested in things like that but he doesn't try to hit on me while we're having a conversation. I can go to the mall and they'll push me to talk to some guy that's been watching me. We are supportive like family. I know people have had bad experiences with women having male friends, but that just can't apply to all female/male friendships.
Crazy Magnet Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 Quite frankly, all this grand talk about actual male female friendships is hogwash and rationalizations. It happens often, but certainly not often enough to be the norm. As far as I'm concerned it is perfectly sensible to be alarmed/suspicious. It happens often to who exactly?!? Not me!
Awesome Username Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 If she has a career that is dominated by males, this is pretty much an impossible request. Also, why would you want a girl who would be better off with someone else in her mind anyway? Nothing would give me more pride than being able to tell guys what a wonderful example of a boyfriend my man was. This is why it's important to not rush into relationships. If you cannot communicate and she's not sure, there are problems that are deeper than her hanging out with other boys.
Crazy Magnet Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 . For the dissenters, a good mate will not even give you a reason to question her friendships, opposite sexed or otherwise because her character and transparency will let you know that everything is on the up and up. The same thing can be applied to men too. Green would benefit from seeing that as well. Any person truly worth your time and effort to date, male or female, will have no shadiness involved when it comes to opposite sex friends, acquaintances, or whatever you want to call them. Although I have learned my boundaries with male friends very well, I am not going to force any SO of mine to ditch all opposite sex friends just because I say so. What kind of whiny baby would that make me? If I sense something is off, or if spidey sense goes nuts, or if I'm uncomfortable with some particular female, I'm going to bring it up for sure. But eliminating friends for the sake of my own insecurities seems crazy IMO.
meerkat stew Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 This may sound bad but many years ago I used to think all guys just wanted to be my friend. After many experiences that turned out to be me being naive. I have learned that a majority of men just want to sleep with me and finding the ones that want to be my friend are few and far between. I don't have many male friends but he ones I do have, are inviting and warm with my man and it is genuine. Not bad at all, just shows that you have learned an enlightened view of men's motives and that you have a healthy relationship with getting attention in your life. Yes, there are few men out there who don't have ulterior motives when "befriending" a woman, and there are few women out there who share your clear-headed attitude about it. Many women continue to naively believe whatever allows them to continue to bask in the attention without feeling duplicitous with the guy they are dating. Your BF is a lucky man.
threebyfate Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 Green, I wouldn't have any problems with your thread, had you broached it as your views or preferences. The opening post makes it sound like it should be universally applied, that it's the only way to handle any relationship for anyone. Where we both agree is that if you don't trust your partner, it's time to get out of the relationship.
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